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The Biblical Holy Spirit vs.The False Unholy Spirit of Fire

The Biblical Holy Spirit vs.The False Unholy Spirit of Fire

The calling down of Fire from heaven over a congregation, or praying Fire over someone is the norm in the church today. It has come to  resemble the early heretic Gnostic churches. Religious ecstasy (or Kundalini) was to be found in the mystery religions of the first century A.D..  Back when the Corinth church seemed to be a hub of pagan Gnostic knowledge and ran rampant in unscriptural and immoral practices; the Greek mystery religions had prophets who babbled in unknown tongues which were caused by a Kundalini awakening.

Below is a table explaining the differences between The Biblical Holy Spirit compared to The Kundalini unholy spirit that masquerades as the Biblical Holy Spirit.  This table is exhaustive and contains everything you need to know:

Biblical Holy Spirit

Kundalini Unholy Spirit Fire

Who is the Holy Spirit?

Who is the Kundalini unholy spirit

  • The Holy Spirit is God, the third Person of the Trinity.  (Acts 5:3-4)
  • The Holy Spirit is a divine person, a being with a mind, emotions, and a will. (1 Corinthians 2:10; Ephesians 4:30; 1 Corinthians 12:7-11)
  • The Holy Spirit is also omnipresence (Psalm 139:7-8)
  • The Holy Spirit is omniscience (1 Corinthians 2:10-11)
  • The Holy Spirit intercedes for us when we can’t pray (Romans 8:26-27)
  • The Holy Spirit is Helper our Comforter and our Counsellor (John 14:16,26; 15:26)
  • The Holy Spirit will guide us and lead us into all Truth according to Biblical scripture. (John 16:12)
    • There is no extra-biblical revelation from the Holy Spirit.
  • A crucial part of the truth the Holy Spirit reveals is that Jesus is who He said He is (John 15:261 Corinthians 12:3)
    • The Holy Spirit convinces us of Jesus Christ’s deity and incarnation, that He is the Messiah, i.e.,
    • He gives glory to Christ in all things  (John 16:14)
  • The Holy Spirit’s role is that of gift-giver (Corinthians 12)
  • The Holy Spirit is also the fruit producer in our lives (Galatians 5:22-23)
  • An Esoteric description: Kundalini is a serpent goddess who lies asleep at the base of the human spine, coiled around the 1st Chakra, 3½ times.
  • The demons name is Kundalini Shakti, and ‘she’ represents the unfolding of the divine Shakti energy or Serpent Fire.
  • Kundaliniis supposedly the energizing potential of life itself, a living goddess who enlivens all things.
    • It is Kundalini who creates the universe and knows Its Self as Creator.
    • Kundalini has been called “the face of God.”
  • After being awakened, Kundalini will be able to remove the knots of the major chakras, cleanse, open and develop the chakras until they are in fully blooming lotus forms – this to attain Yoga*
    • *Yoga (Enlightenment) refers to the different spiritual paths that aim for Yoga (union with Divine) – Religious ecstasy.

How do we receive the Holy Spirit

How do we get this unholy spirit?

  • We receive the Holy Spirit the moment we receive Jesus Christ as our Saviour. (1 Corinthians 12:13)
  • We receive the Holy Spirit by simply receiving the Lord Jesus Christ as our Saviour (John 3:5-16)

 

** Through the false ‘Baptism of the Holy Spirit’.
** The calling down of Fire (Serpent Fire).
** Being filled with the Holy Ghost by Fire.
  • A Shaktipat is where one person’s kundalini is awakened by another who already has the experience.
  • Shaktipat only raises the kundalinitemporarily but the demonic transference has taken place.
    • This is what is going on in the churches;  Kundalini is being transferred from one person to another – by blowing on someone, through baptismal water, laying on of hands, even holding ones hand over someone, but not touching them can begin a Shaktipat, etc.
    • Kundalini can also awaken spontaneously, for no obvious reason or triggered by intense personal experiences such as accidents, near death experiences, childbirth, emotional trauma, extreme mental stress, and so on –this is solely dependent on that ‘doctrines of demons’ one has been dabbling in.

What does a genuine baptism look like?

  • ‘Baptize’ comes from the Greek word which means “to submerge in water.”
  • Regarding baptism and salvation, the Bible is clear that salvation is by grace through faith in Jesus Christ, not by works of any kind, including baptism. (Ephesians 2:8-9)
  • Baptism illustrates a believer’s identification with Christ’s death, burial, and resurrection. The action of being immersed in the water pictures dying and being buried with Christ. (Romans 6:3-4)
  • Baptism is a picture of our leaving our old life and becoming a new creation. (2 Corinthians 5:17)
  • Are there any signs and wonders at a genuine baptism?  No.
    • A baptism is only an act of obedience, a public proclamation of faith in Christ and identification with Him.

Are there any happenings that go with the filling of the Holy Spirit?

Are there any feelings or happenings that go with this filling of the unholy spirit?

  • No, the evidence of a genuine salvation is you are now not controlled by your sinful nature but by the Holy Spirit. (Romans 8:9)
  • Chastisement by the Holy Spirit when we sin to repent of our sin and not sin again. (Hebrews 12:6-7; Hebrews 12:8)
  • Evidence of being born again is:
    • Obeying scripture, God’s commandments.  (1 John 2:5)
    • Respecting God’s pronouncements as authoritative in your life. Jesus Christ is your Lord and Saviour. (1 John 1:8)
    • No more love for the world. (1 John 2:15)
    • Living in daily awareness that Jesus Christ will return for His own! (1 John 3:2-3)
    • You are sinning less now than when you first made a profession of faith in Christ. You hate sinning.  (1 John 3:9)
    • Love for other believers in Jesus Christ. (1 John 3:14)
    • Pray all the time and having prayers answered. (1 John 3:22)
    • Sharp Discernment as you find it easy to sort out the claims of various religions, etc. (1 John 4:1)
    • You have a conscious awareness that the Holy Spirit of God lives in you. He teaches you things from the Scriptures on a regular basis. (1 John 4:13)
  • You speak in tongues (gibberish).
  • Involuntary jerks, tremors, shaking, convulsing, crawling sensations.
  • Energy rushes like streams of fire or feelings of electricity circulating the body.
  • Moderate heat or Intense heat (sweating) or cold as ice, especially as energy is experienced passing through the chakras.
  • Visions seen or sounds heard, ESP – clairvoyance.
  • Trance-like and altered states of consciousness
  • Uncontrollable laughter or uncontrollable weeping.
  • Bliss, feelings of infinite love and universal connectivity, transcendent awareness.
  • Posture becomes fixed, you become paralyzed.
  • Utter sounds like those of animals, birds, frogs or of a lion or like those of jackals, dogs and tigers…
  • Intoxicated, your steps fall like one is drunk, speech is slurred as if drunk and and you are unable to do any other work.
  • You see Divine visions – angels of light, another ‘Jesus’
  • Future unfolds its secrets to you, you learn secrets supposedly from God.
  • The unholy spirit gives you unbiblical ‘hidden’ meaning of scriptures.
  • You see Divine visions – angels of light, another ‘Jesus’
  • Future unfolds its secrets to you,  you learn secrets supposedly from God.
  • The unholy spirit gives you unbiblical ‘hidden’ meaning of scriptures.

What does ‘Walking in the Spirit’ mean?.  What does being “Filled by the Holy Spirit’ mean?

What happens when we have opened our Third Eye? (6th Chakra)

  • The Filling of the Holy Spirit is an ongoing process in the Christian life as we grow in Holiness.  Also known as to “walk in the Spirit; It is to follow the Holy Spirit’s leading.
  • It is essentially to “walk with” the Holy Spirit, allowing Him to guide your steps and conform your mind. (Ephesians 4:1; Philippians 1:27)
  • The arousing of kundalini is said by some to be the one and only way of attaining Divine Wisdom. (Genesis 3:4-5)
    • Self-Realization is said to be equal to Divine Wisdom or Gnosis or what amounts to the same thing: self-knowledge-(knowing that ‘I am a god’).
  • New knowledge is brought into the church, as self proclaimed apostles and prophets pronounce, EXTRA unbiblical revelations and unbiblical prophetic utterances.

Evidence or Signs and Wonders:

Signs and Wonders:

  • Jesus Christ is the author and finisher of our faith (Hebrews 12:2)
  • If we need healing or deliverance we are to ask HIM DIRECTLY through prayer and He will heal us.
    • We do not need to go to men with so called ‘gifts of healing’ when we can approach Jesus Christ directly.
    • Yes we can have others pray for us (genuine Christians that is).
    • We pray in faith, but faith means that we are to trust God. We trust Him to do what is best and to know what is best. (Romans 8:28)
    • Suffering is part of life for both the unbeliever and the believer. For the believer it is often used by God in the development and maturing of our faith.  (Philippians 3:10)
    • Paul the apostle prayed to have his “thorn in the flesh” removed, but God said, “No” because He wanted Paul to understand that for in Paul’s weakness, God’s strength is made perfect. (2 Corinthians 12:7-10).
    • Don’t conclude that because you have not been healed that you have an absence or lack of faith or some secret sin that prevents your healing. You just might have God’s glory resting on you for a special purpose.
  • The Kundalini unholy spirit is a show and tell of signs and wonders as seen above.
  • Kundalini is a powerful healing forceand will in a ‘counterfeit’ way heal you from any ailments/diseases or deliver you from drugs/alcoholism, etc.
    • You will usually feel heat, electricity, or ice when the satanic healing takes place.
  • Can Satan heal?  Of course he can! See this article for full explanation:

This Kundalini spirit is found in all religions across the world just under different names.

  • The ancient Egyptians called kundalini power Ra, who is symbolized as the Sun because the Sun is the source of kundalini energy.
  • In Islam kundalini power is known as Salaat. Called the Swaying Zikr and Whirling Dervish.
  • The early Gnostics, like Pythagorus referred to the concept as ‘Pneuma’
  • Hippocrates was aware of it as well; he referred to it as ‘vis medicatrix naturae’.
  • Religious studies also note parallels in Quakerism and Shakerism.
  • The Hebrews of ruach causing the Judaic Shuckling or (torso-rocking prayer)
  • The quiverings of the Eastern Orthodox Hesychast.
  • The Chinese movements of Tai Chi or ki.
  • The ecstatic Shamanistic dance,
  • The Bushmen dance the Ntum trance dance.
  • The Tibetan Buddhist tummo heat as practised by Milarepa,
  • Japan‘s Aum Shinrikyo group
  • The Mexican Huichols call it kupuri,
  • The Dakota Indians speak of wakan;
  • The African Sotho of moya;
  • The Bantu of nzmbi;
  • The Australians of joja;
  • Indonesian know of petara;
  • The Eskimos of quaumaneq,

Slain by the Kundalini spirit

Kundalini Laughter

Kundalini Paralysis

Kundalinipassed onto Kids

PLEASE WATCH VIDEO 

PLEASE WATCH VIDEO 

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Montanism

Montanism was an early Gnostic so called Christian movement of the late 2nd century, later referred to by the name of its founder, Montanus, but originally known by its adherents as the New Prophecy (or ‘The Phyrgian Heresy’) . The heretical movement spread rapidly to other regions in the Roman Empire at a time before Christianity was generally tolerated or legal. It persisted in some isolated places into the 6th century.

It was a prophetic movement that called for a reliance on the spontaneity of the Holy Spirit and spoke extra biblical revelation.  Parallels have been made between Montanism and modern day movements such as the charismatic movement, and the New Apostolic Reformation (NAR). [1]

As the name “New Prophecy” implied, Montanism was a movement focused around prophecy, specifically those of the movement’s founders which were believed to contain the Holy Spirit’s revelation for the present age.[2] New Prophecy departed from Church tradition as described by Eusebius of Caesarea [3]: “And he [Montanus] became beside himself, and being suddenly in a sort of frenzy and ecstasy, he raved, and began to babble and utter strange things, prophesying in a manner contrary to the constant custom of the Church handed down by tradition from the beginning.”[4]

The Montanist prophets did not speak as messengers of God but were described as possessed by God while being unable to resist. Montanists believed that the new prophecies superseded and fulfilled the doctrines proclaimed by the Apostles.[5]  Thus, they were seen as false prophets because they acted irrationally and were not in control of their senses.[6]

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Roman Catholic spirit of FIRE

The church has gone so far with this unholy fire that it has literally ENGULFED the entire church. You need to be permanently on FIRE for God according to the powers that be (TBN, God TV, Angus Buchan, Rick Joyner, Ray McCauley, Deon Hockey, Kim Clement, Marc Bredenkamp, Harold Weitsz, et al.) as they spell out their incantation and throw FIRE, FIRE, and more FIRE in the congregations direction.  Those in the congregation who have experienced this religious ecstasy want more, and those who have not experienced it, want to experience it because they believe this is the Holy Spirit as work.

The ‘Heart of God is now on FIRE‘ and everyone is pushed in this direction by the church to get to know ‘God’s heart‘.  What they don’t tell you is that this ‘Heart of God’ is the Roman Catholic Sacred Heart of Jesus, and it is also the Immaculate Heart of Mary.

The church as it currently stands is being shoved towards pagan ROME at a rapid speed. But in order for Pentecostals and Charismatics to accept Roman Catholicism they would first have to accept the ‘spirit‘ by which it operates. Rome’s EVANGELIZATION of non-Catholics started decades ago, and their hard labour has paid off.  Just as the ancient Egyptians viewed Kundalini as being Ra‘ who is symbolized as the sun because the sun is the source of kundalini energy. So does the Roman Catholic Church who, worships the Sun god Mithra (incarnation of Ra).

This excellent article explains the history, characteristics and fruit of the Vatican Second Council New Evangelization initiative:  The New Evangelical – Evil fit for a New Dark Age.  See this article on the Roman Catholic godddess Mary:  Mary Queen of Heaven – Whore of Babylon

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A collage of images taken from the internet showing an explosion of demonic FIRE. Everything now involves this unholy FIRE;  from books, music, banners, posters, tattoos, t-shirts and background pictures for your pc.

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Notes:
[1] Robeck, Cecil M., Jr. (2010). “Montanism and Present Day ‘Prophets'”. Pneuma: the Journal of the Society for Pentecostal Studies 32: 413.
[2] Tabbernee, Prophets and Gravestones, p. 68.
[3]Tabbernee, Prophets and Gravestones, pp. 12, 37.
[4]Eusebius of Caesarea, Ecclesiastical History Book 5. Chapter 16. paragraph 7.
[5] a b c Chapman, John (1911). “Montanists”. The Catholic Encyclopedia. 10. Robert Appleton Company. Retrieved 27 June 2011.
[6] Epiphanius, Against Heresies, 48.3-4.
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156 comments to The Biblical Holy Spirit vs.The False Unholy Spirit of Fire

  • Michael

    The huge problem occured in understanding the message of the gospel is that we as human beings were born in a sinful state and because of this our methods of interpreting God’s will and existence has been contaminated by our own imperfect ability to understand Him. We relate to God through our own imperfection because some of us struggle with pride and do not accept our degenerated state…we must acknowledge our inability to save ourselves…that is why the great omnipotent God who loves us more than we can ever comprehend had to take on man’s form as a simple carpenter of Galilee in order to connect with all humanity. He chose the simplest of vocations…not a high position so that He could get to the lowest of humanity without any accolades so there was no vanity, boast or position of authority to give an uncontamanited and unprejudiced view of our lost state and our selfish and rebelliousness to follow a life that was the original plan of God. When so-called Christians misinterpret the message of the Cross and it’s meaning and victory, it is detrimental to the concept of new life (or born again). To be born again is not complicated…it merely begins with absolute honesty after conviction of the Comforter…the Helper or Holy Spirit. He convicts you…no man can do this. You become honest with your Maker. When pride or self-esteem in any form is involved you have huge problems. The old man must die and the new man must live on the food of God which is a strict diet of the Word of God and it’s total obedience to what’s been written in the bible.

    Please Christians who are sincere read the following….feelings, experiences and falsely misinterpreting the Holy Spirit are a result of immature Christians…we need a solid base…a rock…that is sure…needs discipline to follow and is not easy to follow if you still have not died to the old selfish man. We have to get rid of the old man,we cannot do this on our own but we can ask Him to help us…this He will do as He promised us because this type of prayer is always answered when it’s bonafide.

    Detecting God’s presence
    When trying to measure time or weight or temperature or speed or any of a hundred other things, we make a huge leap forward whenever we stop trusting our feelings or intuition and start relying on instrumentation. For instance, trying to tell the time by using our feelings, such as how hungry or tired we feel, and our senses, such as how light it seems, is crudely inaccurate compared to using an objective measure of a clock. Likewise, guessing from circumstances or whether we feel guilty or happy or peaceful or excited or lucky, is a most unreliable way of gauging spiritual reality.
    The more important a matter is, the more critical it is that we stop trusting our feelings or senses and start relying on an objective measure. What if an airline pilot ignored the plane’s instrumentation and decided to fly by his gut feeling? Spiritual matters are literally more important than life and death. All of eternity hinges on them. The stakes are far too high to dare rely on your feelings or circumstances to guess spiritual reality.

    Sensations like ‘feeling’ the presence of God are so vague as to be virtually useless as a spiritual gauge. I don’t know if I’ve ever ‘felt’ God. And whether or not I have is of little consequence. To base one’s faith on such feelings would be a disaster for anyone. One’s faith must be in the integrity of God.

    Do not rely on your own understanding, warns Scripture (Proverbs 3:5). There is a way that seems right but it leads to death, screams another verse (Proverbs 14:12). You need the precision of God’s Word. Each revelation of Scripture is like a dial in a pilot’s cockpit. Give more credence to your gut feeling than to one of them, and your spiritual life is on the line.

    The Bible affirms that a prophet can speak in the name of God and his prophecies be supernaturally accurate and yet if his message does not align with Scripture, it is merely a test that must be utterly rejected (Deuteronomy 13:1-4). If the great apostle Paul, who worked miracles in name of Christ, proclaimed a gospel different to that recorded in Scripture, his words must be rejected. The same, he insisted, applied to a message from an angel (Galatians 1:8). Even the most anti-God force in all creation can appear as an angel of light (2 Corinthians 11:14).

    The Deceiver could possibly give you a false spiritual experience, but he cannot change the Bible. ‘Heaven and earth will pass away,’ said Jesus, ‘but my word will never pass away’ (Matthew 24:35).

    God can give you feelings
    God could instantly give you feelings but in the long run it wouldn’t help. Your faith must be in the bedrock of the Word of God, not the shifting sands of feelings. Emotions fluctuate wildly. God’s word is solid. And the only way anyone can be a solid Christian is to ignore feelings and hold on to that word.

    It’s no use thinking, If God gave me some sort of sign or feeling it would strengthen my faith. You would be hoping to put your faith in the memory of the sign or feeling, rather than in the integrity of God. You are indicating that you regard what you see and feel are more dependable than Almighty God.

    Handling doubt
    It’s been rightly said, ‘Doubt your doubts and believe your beliefs.’

    Rather than become over-worried about your doubts, look to what you do believe, and draw strength from God. You will make it, not because of anything within you, but because God is powerful. Forget any deficiency you sense within you, and remember instead the sufficiency of Christ.

    When the disciples asked Jesus to increase their faith, he replied, ‘If you have faith as small as a mustard seed . . .’ The implication is that what we need is not so much great faith, as a great God – and you’ve got One! Often our problem is that we wrongly think our faith to be so insignificant that we don’t bother using it. To achieve great things in God, simply use the faith you already have. Take your eyes off the supposed inadequacy in your faith, and fix them on the adequacy of your God. He is all you need.

    When handed a million dollar check you can have many doubts and still end up rich. It doesn’t matter how much you suspect the check might bounce. It’s only if you doubt so much that you refuse to try to cash it that you could miss out.

    A man came to Jesus saying, ‘Lord, I believe; help my unbelief.’ He got his miracle!

    We cannot muster faith by ourselves. Jesus said even about himself, ‘I can of myself do nothing.’ How much more must that be true of us! So continually look to God to strengthen your faith.

    That won’t stop the Evil One putting doubts into your mind. He’s been using that ploy ever since Adam and Eve, when he insinuated that God did not have their best interest at heart and that the True God was lying when he warned that eating the forbidden fruit would harm them. The Deceiver even tried putting doubts in Jesus’ mind. God had audibly said, ‘This is my beloved Son in whom I am well pleased.’ Then along came Satan. ‘If you are the Son of God . . .’ he began two of his temptations. We must not let such accusations against God wander unchallenged through our minds. Reject the thoughts. Push the slimy intruders out of your mind. Displace them with the truths of God’s word. Hold out against the devil, and he will flee from you (James 4:7). Entertain that old snake’s thoughts no more than you would let a viper repeatedly bite you.

    No one has perfect faith. The Bible shows even the greatest people of faith wavering in their faith (startling example). You have faith – maybe not as strong as you would like, but you have it. And Jesus taught that as you use what you have, God will give you more. (Luke 16:10; Matthew 25:21)

    If we had to become perfect (whether you define that as having absolute faith, giving up every sin, being absolutely sincere, or whatever) no one could ever be saved. If it were necessary for us to get our act perfectly together in order for us to be saved, it would mean God is so pathetic that he needs our help to save ourselves.

    You are not asked to believe you are good or lovable or dependable. You just have to believe that God is good and lovable and dependable. Faith sufficient to receive God’s blessings is fully within your grasp.

    So we come back to our million dollars example. (Previous webpage) All that the Deceiver can do is try convincing you that you are just as spiritually poor as you were before you asked forgiveness through Jesus. He’ll try putting thoughts and doubts into your mind to get you to throw away as worthless, God’s ‘million dollar check.’ He’ll try to say that God is not true to his word – that although the unchanging Lord promised spiritual riches to all who come to him through the sacrificial death of Jesus, it’s a lie. The Evil One might be more subtle and try to persuade you that you are not calling God a liar, you simply think you are not good enough. But this is just his trickery because God guarantees that whoever (no exceptions) asks forgiveness through Jesus will be forgiven and inherit all of God’s riches. (John 3:16; 1 Timothy 1:15-16; Romans 5:10; 8:32; 1 John 4:10 etc) Either that includes you, or God is a liar.

    Easier for some?
    Some people have a bigger struggle in receiving assurance of God’s favor upon them and yet these are the very people who usually end up receiving a bigger than normal blessing. I guess you have heard of John Bunyan, who wrote Pilgrim’s Progress, one of the most published books of all time. John Bunyan’s spiritual torment was horrific. For years this poor man lived in inconsolable agony, convinced he was going to hell and he could find no way out of his spiritual dilemma. With a severity that few of us could even conceive, year after year he was repeatedly overwhelmed by sin, hopelessness and the seemingly certain prospect of an eternity in Hell. Not only did he finally get all he had been yearning for, it was largely this experience that formed the book that has touched and brought spiritual help to multiplied millions. No wonder Pilgrim’s Progress is such an outstandingly powerful book, impacting people over the centuries and around the world in a phenomenal way. Much of it was virtually autobiographical.

    Great men like George Whitefield and John and Charles Wesley also suffered enormously in their struggle to find salvation. Whitefield’s spiritual need was so all-consuming that his fastings almost killed him. John and Charles were inconsolable until at long last they found salvation. Spurgeon suffered so greatly in his quest for salvation that he wrote, ‘I had rather pass through seven years of the most languishing sickness, than I would ever again pass through the terrible discovery of the evil of sin.’ Not surprisingly, their subsequent ministries eclipsed that of almost all Christians who have been spared such anguish of soul.

    So I believe the greater your present struggle, the more likely it is that you are headed for an exceptional spiritual adventure.

    The positive side of doubt
    A woman who was plagued with doubts e-mailed my ministry partner. Helen Hall’s reply was so good that I must share it with you:

    When we are hit hard by life’s negative experiences – death, divorce, unemployment, rebellious children – we can all find ourselves questioning God’s existence, or mercy, or love, or ability or willingness to help.

    But you are approaching this in the right way – by bringing your doubts out into the open.

    Babies don’t ask questions. They just accept everything around them quite happily, unless they are uncomfortable. But 4 year olds are totally different! They ask endless questions. How? When? Where? Why? Who? They have become more mentally aware of the world around them, and they are trying to make sense of it all, and understand how it all fits together.

    If they ask “Why did you do that, Mommy?” it isn’t that they are doubting their mother’s love or wisdom. They are just trying to understand how her actions fit into the general scheme of things. They are on a steep learning curve.

    And, spiritually, you are on a steep learning curve.

    So were the disciples.

    Christ said to them at the Last Supper (John 16:12) “I still have many things to say to you, but you cannot bear them now.”

    It is possible that these doubts that arise in you from time to time are an indication that the Holy Spirit knows you are now ready to grow a little more.

    Currently you are experiencing ‘growing pains,’ but your faith will be all the stronger for it!

    Yesterday I was reading Matthew 9:18-26:

    (18) While He spoke these things to them, behold, a ruler came and worshiped Him, saying, “My daughter has just died, but come and lay Your hand on her and she will live.” (19) So Jesus arose and followed him, and so did His disciples. . . . (23) When Jesus came into the ruler’s house, and saw the flute players and the noisy crowd wailing, (24) He said to them, “Make room, for the girl is not dead, but sleeping.” And they ridiculed Him. (25) But when the crowd was put outside, He went in and took her by the hand, and the girl arose. (26) And the report of this went out into all that land.” My attention was particularly caught by “the noisy crowd wailing, . . . And they ridiculed Him. But when the crowd was put outside, He went in and took her by the hand, and the girl arose.” (NKJV)
    The crowd were right! They had to be right. They were official mourners. They could recognize death when they saw it! The girl was definitely beyond help. And so they ridiculed Christ’s words.

    They were never more wrong! This was certainly a case where “seeing is believing” didn’t work!

    And then I looked at, “But when the crowd was put outside.” What an odd way to put it! Why “was put outside,” not “had gone outside”? I examined the Greek word for “put outside.” It means to eject, cast out, expel! The Bible uses this same word when it talks about Jesus casting out evil spirits!

    So I now see my doubts as being like that noisy, clamorous crowd, who, trusting in the evidence of their own eyes, were so sure they were right – and were so seriously wrong!

    And now I grab my doubts by the scruff of the neck and throw them out.

    Should you believe your senses?

    * A scientist says earth hurls through space at great speed; to you it seems motionless.
    * A doctor says a mark on your body is cancer; to you it feels harmless.

    * An electrician says a wire is dangerously live; to you it looks dead.

    * A mechanic says your car needs oil immediately; you don’t think it’s necessary.

    * A soldier says an area is sown with land-mines; you can’t see any.

    Who should you believe: your senses, or the expert?

    * Jesus says ‘if anyone loves me . . . my Father will love him and we will make our home with him’ (John 14:23); you feel empty.
    * God says how often I would have gathered your children together, as a hen gathers her chicks under her wings (Matthew 23:37); you feel God is unfeeling.

    * God says nothing can separate you from the love of God (Romans 8:35-39); you feel something going wrong proves God no longer loves you.

    * God says rejoice in the Lord always (Philippians 4:4); you feel there’s nothing to rejoice in.

    * God says be not surprised at the painful trial you are suffering (1 Peter 4:12), we must go through many hardships to enter the kingdom (Acts 14:22); you feel surprised.

    * God says, he was bruised and wounded for you (Isaiah 53:5); you wonder if he loves you.

    * God says your sins will be wiped out (Acts 3:9) and he will remember them no more (Isaiah 43:25; Hebrews 8:12); you feel he is holding the past against you. (More such statements)

    Who do you believe: your senses, or the Expert?

    Climax
    If your spiritual enemy knows you will be thrown by what happens to you, he can twist you around his little finger just by giving you a hard time. You are inviting him to attack because he knows it will keep you from trusting the Lord, who alone can defeat Satan.

    For as long as you look to feelings and circumstances to verify spiritual truth, you will be a weak Christian. But you can be a powerful spiritual conqueror by stubbornly clinging to the fact that the God who cannot lie is steadfastly devoted to you. Refuse to entertain any other thought. By having that resolve you have defeated the devil. He knows it doesn’t matter what he hits you with, you will cling to God, your strength, so he has less incentive to bother.

    Faith – believing in the integrity of God despite what things seem – is the basis of the entire Christian life.

    Some people’s ‘greater’ faith might only be an illusion produced by them having had an easier life than mine. Nevertheless, I am sick of being immobilized by excuses. I don’t care how impossible things look, how many failures I have experienced, how spiritually dead I feel, how much the Lord appears to overlook me: God is still the God of the Bible. His Word affirms he is my God and he loves me, regardless of how abandoned, unloved and insignificant my wild imagination paints me as being. That makes spiritual success inevitable. All I need do is stop wallowing in doubt long enough to receive my rightful inheritance.

    So often God seems to deliberately overlook me. So often the Bible seems as dry as dust. So often I feel as if I have nothing to live for. My emotional pain seems endless. God constantly seems to favor others over me. But nothing – nothing – can change the constancy of the incomprehensible enormity of God’s love. Nothing can made God break his word.

    Suppose it were rumored that your marriage partner is being unfaithful. There are three things you need to know for peace of mind. Does your partner insist he or she loves you faithfully? Is your partner honest? Does he or she know what genuine love is? Once you are certain of these three things, you can dismiss all evidence to the contrary and believe in your partner’s love. God in his Word has declared his undying love for you. He’s put it in black and white for the whole world to see. Is God honest? Does he know what real love is? Then you can put aside any suggestions to the contrary and rest in his love.

    If salvation were by works we might have to hobble 100 miles on our knees, or some such thing, as certain misguided Indians do. To go even one mile on our knees, we would have to resist the pain and slog on with sheer determination, step after step after excruciating step. But since salvation is by faith, we should prayerfully look to Jesus and pour that degree of grit into ignoring agonizing doubts and press on relentlessly, month after month, year after year in sheer faith that God keeps his word. We long for some sort of sign or confirmation that God keeps his word. In his grace the Lord might one day give us confirmation in addition to his promise, but to refuse to believe without it is the height of impertinence because it means we think God could lie. Anyone with such a low view of God has no right to expect anything from God.

    We march forward not by signs or warm fuzzies but by faith; stubbornly holding on to scriptural truth even when everything within us screams against it. That’s the path to spiritual honor.

  • Michael

    Sorry correction…and do NOT accept our degenerated state

    [Edited by DTW: Fixed the typo in your comment]

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    Heya Michael!

    You are back! Glad to see you :O)

  • Jonathan

    Hi, I’m 16 years old.

    Baptism of Holy Spirit doesn’t happen when we accept Jesus. Read Book of Acts carefully. Tongues is from the Holy Spirit. Read 1 Cor 14. You can even sing in tongues to God, and I feel it’s heavenly and praising God. I know someone who spoke in tongues the moment she accepted Jesus. A great sphere of fire fell down and bounced between two walls, and it came into her belly, and she started speaking in tongues. ((( DUNAMIS – DYNAMITE )) God IS SPIRIT. He shows his power through Fire falling down etc. That woman was New Ager before she came to Jesus. Btw, only she could see the Sphere of Fire. Sometimes God makes us see with Our Spiritual Eyes. We have Spiritual eyes too.

    (2 Kings 6:17) And Elisha prayed, and said, LORD, I pray thee, open his eyes, that he may see. And the LORD opened the eyes of the young man; and he saw: and, behold, the mountain was full of horses and chariots of fire round about Elisha.

    “But you shall receive power (“dunamis”) – ability, efficiency and might – when the Holy Spirit has come upon you; and you shall be My witnesses in Jerusalem and all Judea and Samaria and to the ends – the very bounds – of the earth” (Acts 1:8, AMP.).

    “Now to Him Who is able to do immeasurably more than all we can ask or conceive, by the power (“dunamis”) which is at work among us . . .” (Ephesians 3:20, NEB).

    Holy Spirit is Fire too, because the bible tells us to NOT (( QUENCH )) THE HOLY SPIRIT. He sets us on Fire, he makes us Zealous for God. Fire – Zealous. On fire for God. Fire is purifying. Fire is Purging. Fire is powerful.

    The fire is Holy. God is a consuming fire. The Holy Ghost fire purifies us! He burns up all slag. At Pentecost fire fell down at them and they spoke in tongues. The Fire is of God. But Satan wants to pervert works of God, so don’t mix them together. You can read it in Acts 2.

    At Heidi Baker’s ministry, there’s a picture of Fire falling down at people. Based on Acts 2. She have served 300 ppl with food from one pot, so God is using her and that is God working, thus the Fire is from God.

    (Malachi 3:3) And he shall sit as a refiner and purifier of silver: and he shall purify the sons of Levi, and purge them as gold and silver, that they may offer unto the LORD an offering in righteousness.

    Feelings of Living water/energy or electricity in the body is from God, because it’s the anointing. The Holy Spirit can hug us, he’s a person. I’ve heard of people who have been hugged by Jesus, and it felt like electricity. The Holy Spirit Power is Dunamis (Dynamite). He’s rivers of living water. There’s huge power in Rivers of living water. He can definetly come with such sensations. Giving life to dry bones.. Fire in those bones. Ezekiel… The Holy Spirit can fill us up (this is biblical) and make our cups run over. He gives us Oil of Joy (Heb 1:9 and Psalm 23). That’s why we can get sensations like electricity and energy.

    “…washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;” -Titus 3:5.

    (Job 8:21) Till he fill thy mouth with laughing, and thy lips with rejoicing.

    (Romans 14:17) For the kingdom of God is not meat and drink; but righteousness, and peace, and joy in the Holy Ghost.

    Greek – Source of Joy ….Laughing is Source of Joy.

    I smell the Holy Spirit as New Wine lately, and it’s likened to him filling me up (vessel). It’s from God because I rejoice in God and praise him, and feel liberty. Worshipping him in Spirit & truth like I prayed. I was only focusing on God. The Holy Spirit fixes our eyes on God. God makes me laugh in joy sometimes, but not laughing as in laying on the floor laughing uncontrollably. God makes me laugh in joy, rejoicing like normal laughing. I had been very SAD/depressed Before, and DRY spiritually. I felt purity. I weep sometimes for no reason. It’s because fruit of the Holy Spirit is humility maybe. Sometimes we weep for our Sins uncontrollably. I’ve done that. It’s good to be crying out to God sometimes. Crying can come from God. “…but ye have received the Spirit of adoption, whereby we cry, Abba, Father.” – Rom 8:15.

    My mum got a call once from someone whose infant was dying. She got great distress and just cried uncontrollably and prayed to God. Then they called and the infant was healed.

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    Johanthan

    You have just described the unholy spirit by twisting biblical scripture to suit your purposes.

    Please read: Speaking in Tongues has CEASED and
    Please read: Are Prophets for Today or has Prophecy Ceased? and
    Please read: Yes, a Future Kingdom, but Not a Kingdom Now

  • BurningLamp

    Jonathan, so sorry someone so young like yourself has been drawn into this deception.

    You are wrapped up in the signs and wonders and not looking at what is behind them. Those signs and wonders preachers/teachers do not preach the truth of God’s Word. You probably won’t listen now, but hopefully at some point you will see through all these wiles of the enemy for what they are – lies.

  • Robbie

    Jonathan
    Paul also warns that even the devil is coming with great “dunamis” – to deceive…

  • Anon

    Hi There!

    I think young people should we warned about these two organizations (see bottom),run by the same man. I was a student and member there for a few years and when I walked out of there, I realized that I was scarred for life. It’s been about 12 years now, and only now am I starting to pick up the pieces of my life. Thanks to the content and the beautiful people that are involved here at discerningtheworld, I have found hope and the maps needed for restoration. I would like to post this anonymously because I still have friends involved there.

    Thank you for the opportunity.

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    Dear Anon

    I pray that because you are SEEKING the truth (that is Jesus Christ and His Word) through the guidance of the Holy Spirit, your eyes will be opened wide and the more you obey the Holy Spirit the more He leads you into ALL truth and remembrance of who Jesus Christ IS, and you become filled with joy as you recognize the Holy Spirit in your life. I pray that you find peace over what has happened to you, but realize that it was for a reason that it happened that way. For you to learn what’s REALLY going on out there and now you know the difference between false Christianity and what Genuine Christianity is all about. You will put this experience you have had to good use one day soon when you need to witness to someone and preach the true Gospel of Jesus Christ.

    Thank you for you kind words about this website, you nearly brought tears to my eyes. I always say, “This is Jesus’ website, I just do what He tells me to” :)

    Regarding those websites, they are New Apostolic Reformation through and through. I might even do an article on them seeing that they are so wide spread across the world even! I just wanna get some other articles out the way and then I will see what I can do about Our Fathers Home/ Creare Training Centre.

  • Burning Lamp

    Anon, I had never heard of the organizations you referred to. What a subtle deception! They say all the right things, “Great Commission”, “The Way, Truth & Life”, on and on. They seem to me to be a blend between emergent thought and dominionism with the prophetic garbage thrown in.

    I stressed on another thread the importance of discipling new converts and the appalling lack of it. But if one thinks about it, the state of apostasy of the Church today is like the blind leading the blind.

    Thank the Lord He brought you out of these lies and it shows the value of the ministry the Lord has entrusted to Deborah.

  • Anon

    Awesome! Thank you Deborah. Looking forward to those articles.

  • YourConscience

    Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you? 1 Corinthians 3:16

    In that day the deaf will hear the words of the scroll, and out of gloom and darkness the eyes of the blind will see. Isaiah 29:18

    John answered, saying unto them all, I indeed baptize you with water; but one mightier than I cometh, the latchet of whose shoes I am not worthy to unloose: he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost and with fire: Luke 3:16

    Now when all the people were baptized, it came to pass, that Jesus also being baptized, and praying, the heaven was opened, And the Holy Ghost descended in a bodily shape like a dove upon him, and a voice came from heaven, which said, Thou art my beloved Son; in thee I am well pleased. Luke 3:21-22

    You have Merely BlackListed YourSelf Dear One… The Kundalini and the Holy Spirit are the Same thing but Your Dualistic Mind of Satan has Blocked you from the Truth Yet again… Well Its not like I Didn’t Tell You…. Tarry On Then

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    YOUR Conscience (not mine)

    Thanks for proving my point.

  • Denise Smith

    This is a beautiful site you have here. It is the middle of the night and I must stop reading, but have enjoyed my visit here!I have bookmarked you, and plan to return to read everything else. Thank you so much. Denise

  • Martin Horan

    I’ve had all the “holy laughter” stuff myself. At first I thought it was from God. But I’m glad God’s Spirit kept pointing me back to His Word [John 16:13 & 17:17]. So, knowing the infalibility of God’s Word, I realized that my experiences were not from God.
    This spirit of fire stuff doesn’t tie up with Scripture so it’s not from God.
    I saw a televised Benny Hinn show–for show it was–where he was shouting “Fire!” at people and they were flying backwards.
    Of course this was from God because it’s often there in the Bible wjhen the prophets and apostles did this kind of thing!
    Okay, sarcasm’s maybe not the best kind of thing for a Christian to indulge in. I have to admit though, that I find it difficult not to be sarcastic when I come over characters like Hinn. If I wasn’t sarcastic with those folk, I hate to think what I could say about them.
    Thanks for another great expose, Deborah.

  • Cat

    I am amazed at this article. I am in total agreement how do you know the false prophets from the false ones?( on the Kim Clement site). I have had my sincere doubts about strange fire being in a church I have attended. I do not want to be fooled by the enemy. Because the ministers of satan probably do not even know they are ministers of satan. People who are are deceivers and who deceive, and even possible the elect, do not know they are deceivers. I pray quite frquently not to become one of these. Now I do not want to be fooled by one either. But in modern day Babylon we have this “You are judging them” That is not love, just pray for them”, and much more like that. So, what do you do today. the bible says to lead a quite life. That is exactly what I want to do. But I also want to love God with all I am and love other people. People think this is all you must do. God help us all who love Jesus christ and have been called by His Name, to walk as He did. Help us oh Father to be bold and courageous full of love and mercy but know when we have to shake the dust off of our feet. Help us not to compromise or be presumptuous Lord Jesus. help us to be alert, and be vigilant, be sober minded. Remove all that is false and help us to live in the truth and walk and abide in the true vine… Thank you my beloved Lord and Savior..Amein…

  • Burning Lamp

    Cat, this is the prayer of all sincere lovers of truth and sound doctrine. It is getting more and more difficult to stand for truth as so many have succumbed to the dark side. Satan rarely shows his true dark side and appears as an “angel of light” – presenting a message mixing truth and error to deceive the unwary. You are right, we must be vigilant and we must sound the warning to anyone who will listen. We are to mark and avoid false teachers which equates to saking off the dust and moving on if they refuse to listen.

  • Elaine

    I was going to Calvary Chapel. About a year ago one Sunday the pastor said to be there Wed night to get a baptism of the holy spirit and experince increased power in your life. At first I thought, “oh yeah! I want that!” I couldn’t make it but I got the CD of the service. The CD sat in my car for all this time. (I stopped going to this church about 6 months ago after realizing they are ecumenical and supportive of contemplative methods – I had a very interesting e-mail exchange with the pastor expressing my concerns and after he explained his beliefs I never went back.) And then recently I saw on a new age website how the kundalini awakening is the same as the ‘western belief of the baptism of the holy spirit’ and I remembered the CD in my car. I am so glad that I did not go to that Wed night service. On the CD, the pastor said that every Christian should strive for a baptism of the holy spirit – after he admitted that this is a very controversial subject. He explained that you may experience something right away or later and that it can be very intense, empowering, life changing! I thought of Matthew where Jesus said that an evil and adulterus generation looks for a sign. That seems to be what it’s all about any more.

    I believe we receive the Holy Spirit as soon as we accept Jesus as our savior. It’s up to us to be filled with the Holy Spirit. As we increase our walk with Jesus and read the Bible and pray and surrender, yield, to Him, the Holy Spirits guides us, comforts us, teaches us. If you don’t pray or read the Bible, I don’t think the Holy Spirit will be that active in your life. The discernment and strength of the Holy Spirit will not be there. We are not called to ask for a baptism of the Holy Spirit. I believe this is just another experienced based, signs and wonders deception that is going on the church. Right up there with contemplative prayer, breath prayers, lectio devina, etc.

    I read up on the new age/new thought/human potential movement as many of my friends are into this. I remember reading Shirley McLain’s Out on a Limb in the 80s, thinking that someday this stuff is going to be big – and I see now today it is. It’s incredible to see new age, pagan, occult practices not only widely accepted in our culture in movies, books, games, TV shows, but also accepted in church. I never thought I’d see the day.
    A friend of mine described a channeling session to meet her guardian angel where she saw bright flashes of light. I told her that is from demons. She said nothing bad comes from light! I told her that the Bible says that Satan presents himself as an angel of light. She told me that I am in fear!
    It was so surreal to be told in person the things that I had researched in books and online.
    And now we have evagelical leaders telling us that we must strive for baptism of the holy spirit, that we must learn spiritual formation (Frank Pastore show on KKLA a couple weeks ago). The spirit of the anti-christ is alive and well in our world.

    Thank you for a great website.

  • amanda

    Kundalini False Unholy Spirit of Fire is not the Biblical Holy Spirit. This unbiblical spirit came from unknown religions, we don`t know. The True Holy Spirit we have in the Holy Bible, is Jesus`s Divine nature. Christ in his Spirit form does not deceive people like Satan does. Kundalini is Satan masquerading as the False Holy Spirit, we must avoid the deceiving angel of light or we`ll be tricked again with untrue lies. The true Holy Spirit is very biblical, is the Spirit of holiness of God through Christ but Kundalini is not from God, remember to test all spirits if they`re of God or not. First, Kundalini False Unholy Spirit of Fire came from Choo Thomas`s Heaven is So Real, 2nd Kundalini then came from Mary K. Baxter`s Revelation of Hell and 3rd Kundalini also came from Don Piper`s 90 minutes of Heaven. Christians beware of Kundalini, do not be deceived by Satan. May God bless all true christians with the true Holy Spirit of the Holy Bible.

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    amanda

    Thanks for your comment.

    >> First, Kundalini False Unholy Spirit of Fire came from Choo Thomas`s Heaven is So Real, 2nd Kundalini then came from Mary K. Baxter`s Revelation of Hell and 3rd Kundalini also came from Don Piper`s 90 minutes of Heaven.

    Actually Kundilini came from Kathryn Kuhlman (not sure where she got it from), passed onto Benny Hinn, passed onto Rodney Howard-Browne et al and then passed onto the Azuza revival and Toronto Blessing, Holy Trinity Brompton in the UK, Pensacola Revival, and then the Lakeland revival was the latest mass transferrer of kundilini to people, even thousands across the internet… Choo Thomas most definitely displayed Kundilini as I show in my article: Choo Thomas’ “Heaven is so Real”

  • Your Conscience

    Does no one here seem to realize that the Word Kundalini is simply a Word to represent the same thing as the Holy Spirit just from another cultures view of it? How can people not see this, I’m sorry but I’m reading alot of responses and there is so much fear and unawareness of Truth amogst alot of people here… Please try and search within yourselves with The Bible KJV the Word in your hands and find the Truth. Somewhere alot of you are missing it and I really feel for you and hope and pray The Holy Spirit (The Christ WIthin) will show you what you don’t see.

    What do you think this means? Its plain as day, can’t you see it:

    I indeed baptize you with water unto repentance: but he that cometh after me is mightier than I, whose shoes I am not worthy to bear: he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost, and with Fire: Matthew 3:11

    Then Peter, turning about, seeth the disciple whom Jesus loved following; which also leaned on his breast at supper, and said, Lord, which is he that betrayeth thee? Peter seeing him saith to Jesus, Lord, and what shall this man do? Jesus saith unto him, If I will that he tarry till I come, what is that to thee? follow thou me. John 21:20-22

    For John truly baptized with water; but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost not many days hence. Acts 1:5

    Can you not see that the Third Eye is the Blind Ear…Please People think about it, its so simple yet it seems to evade you. What will it take…

    Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation;but is passed from death unto life. John 5:24

    How long will you continue to deny me? Youe Salvation is at stake here…Please Wake Up

    For where your treasure is, there will your heart be also. The light of the body is the eye: if therefore thine eye be single, thy whole body shall be full of light. But if thine eye be evil, thy whole body shall be full of darkness. If therefore the light that is in thee be darkness, how great is that darkness! No man can serve two masters: for either he will hate the one, and love the other; or else he will hold to the one, and despise the other. Ye cannot serve God and Mammon. Matthew 6:21-24

    In Great Hopes that Someone can See Clearly

    Love to You All

    The Sacred Heart

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    Your Conscience (Not mine, but YOUR Conscience)

    I am allowing your comment because I have never seen an occultist quote the bible quite like you have. Totally out of context.

    I can see that the Third Eye is the Blind ear all right.

    John 9:39-41

    39 And Jesus said, For judgment I am come into this world, that they which see not might see; and that they which see might be made blind.
    40 And some of the Pharisees which were with him heard these words, and said unto him, Are we blind also?
    41 Jesus said unto them, If ye were blind, ye should have no sin: but now ye say, We see; therefore your sin remaineth.

    You do not understand the verses of Matthew that you quoted. I have included verses 19 and 20 to understand it in CONTEXT.

    Matthew 6:19-21

    19 Lay not up for yourselves treasures upon earth, where moth and rust doth corrupt, and where thieves break through and steal: Prov 23:4; Heb 13:5; Jas 5:1;
    20 But lay up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where neither moth nor rust doth corrupt, and where thieves do not break through nor steal: Luke 12:33; 1Tim 6:19;
    21 For where your treasure is, there will your heart be also.
    22 The light of the body is the eye: if therefore thine eye be single, thy whole body shall be full of light. Luke 11:34;
    23 But if thine eye be evil, thy whole body shall be full of darkness. If therefore the light that is in thee be darkness, how great is that darkness!
    24 No man can serve two masters: for either he will hate the one, and love the other; or else he will hold to the one, and despise the other. Ye cannot serve God and mammon. Luke 16:13;

    A person who is genuinely guided by the ‘REAL’ Holy Spirit (not the false holy spirit) knows about our ETERNAL kingdom to come and will not hold onto earthly possessions. Wealth will leave everyone sooner rather than later and leave everyone wordly poor. But Christians who lay up Eternal HEAVENLY treasure with Jesus Christ are counted as the poor in this world, will in the end be rich, when life ends here.

    People are so inclined that their hearts will be set on that place where they their riches are laid up. Worldly sinners lay their riches on earth, Christians lay their riches in Heaven. The wordly person will gather everything here on earth and when they die and be poor for eternity.

    We need to set a single eye for the glory of God, an eye that will discern His will and obey His commandments as we walk with His Holy Spirit (genuine one, not the false holy spirit). If people turn AWAY to other paths of self, they will go into willful darkness and lose their way. Therefore we must make a choice between serving God or MAMMON (riches).

    You can’t serve both

    Now I have given you BIBLICAL explanation of what those verses mean and do you notice that, the treasure you speak of NOT the interpretation you give, and the ‘single eye’ mentioned in Matthew is NOT the All Seeing Eye of occultism.

    You think you know the truth, you do not. You believe a lie, fables! You take the bible and try twist it to suite your occult ideas – well it won’t work. GENUINE Christians are not stupid, we understand your false New Age occultism all to well and will not be fooled by satanic lies.

    2 Tim 4:3-4
    3 For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears;
    4 And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables.

  • Hanelie

    I’m sorry to show my ignorance like this.

    Third eye, blind ear? What is that about?

    Also, Your Conscience wrote:

    Does no one here seem to realize that the Word Kundalini is simply a Word to represent the same thing as the Holy Spirit just from another cultures view of it?

    Does this imply that you view all gods equal – that other cultures’ gods and Christ are the same? Or am I misunderstanding this completely?

  • Myfanwy Brown

    Debs,

    I have to say I like the new format! Very nice : )

    I also have to say that after reading the comment by YOUR CONSCIENCE, I sat here with my mouth open, if I had to say something…I was speechless!! It is incredibly sad how satan can fool people..I actually feel quite sick now…you are right, everything he/she said reeks of occult.

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    Myfanwy

    Thanks, I am still gonna do a bit more with the Keywords on the side to make it a bit easier to read.

    Yes the comment by Your Conscience is truly something, isn’t it. And to think they have the audacity to use the bible (nogal the KJV version) LOL to try and backup their occult teaching. *shakes head*

  • Your Conscience

    [delete]

  • Mary

    [deleted – you belong to a false religion]

  • jeremae

    now i just check this website and im very confused of everything im still searching for the right answer thats why im undergone searching in different explaination…Actually im a baby CHRISTIAN as a believer…my parents is not a believer nothing at all when im here working abroad i meet JESUS, i started to come this church every sunday,,before i end up one year attending of this ministry i baptised in water in unexpected i just decide on that moment that there is special baptism happen…then after 2 months and 21 days i baptised in SPIRIT in unexpected when im about going to sleep in the mid night and im praying then suddenly i filled up with spirit talking another language alone singing.laughing,,and worshiping GOD..although i already had idea in the church regarding filled up of spirit coz they are coverd up of hOLY spirit inside the church and you can fill it..i ask in the pastor and he said i filled up SPIRIT of fire.but i couldnt understand exactly…Although when i baptised in holy spirit my spiritual view change,,i couldnt stop talking about GOD,,and i always had answered prayer’s..and i always had the visions regarding church before the word of GOD will gonna be deleivered in the church it already revealed from by the holy spirit i already know what is it..yes..im still confused coz before imeet JESUS i’ve done many things and practising under evil schemes visions of peoples life..filled up demon to possed ive done all of that…
    But only thing i know right now GOD change my whole spirit and body coz i couldnt stop praying and worshiping him all the time and evangelising some of my unbeliever friend giving advice by GOD’d grace…how power full he is by only one year listening his world i already complete as a CHRISTIAN…

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    jeremae

    Please read this article: Speaking in Tongues has CEASED

    I am sorry to tell you but there is a false version of Christianity out there and it manifests itself in speaking in unknown gibberish called tongues, visions, and other strange things. Yes you appear to be worshiping God all the time, but that’s the catch of this false doctrine, it appears to look like genuine Christianity, but it is not. Genuine Christianity does not behave like this.

  • GraceAndPeace

    Hi. I hate to sound argumentative, but the comments from “YourConscience” sounded like legitimate arguments to me and they were not really addressed. I saw the conversation in general go into a discussion of worshipping money (which I realize was a comment to a scripture he put up there)… but that seems to be off topic in general. Obviously, every Christian knows that the LOVE of money is the root of all evil. I don’t think that needs to be addressed here, and I seriously doubt that everyone wants to get out their banking info to prove that they have less money than the other to prove their godliness. That would just be ridiculous.

    These are the specific scriptures that “YourConscience” cited that I feel still need to be addressed because they weren’t:

    I indeed baptize you with water unto repentance: but he that cometh after me is mightier than I, whose shoes I am not worthy to bear: he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost, and with Fire: Matthew 3:11 —- Question mainly, if fire is all from satan, what the fire that John is speaking of?

    For John truly baptized with water; but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost not many days hence. Acts 1:5 —- Again, this is showing a clear baptism with the Holy Ghost… and the disciples were told not to leave until they had received this. Also, Jesus told them that this would empower them.

    There is also this scripture that leads me to believe that the baptism of the Holy Spirit can definitely be a separate event:
    Acts 8:14-19
    When the apostles in Jerusalem heard that Samaria had “accepted the word of God,” they sent Peter and John to them. When they arrived, they prayed for them that they might receive the Holy Spirit, because the Holy Spirit had not yet come upon any of them; they had simply been baptized into the name of the Lord Jesus. Then Peter and John placed their hands on them, and they received the Holy Spirit. When Simon saw that the Spirit was given at the laying on of the apostles’ hands, he offered them money and said, “Give me also this ability so that everyone on whom I lay my hands may receive the Holy Spirit.”

    Acts 9:17-20
    Then Ananias went to the house and entered it. Placing his hands on Saul, he said, “Brother Saul, the Lord–Jesus, who appeared to you on the road as you were coming here–has sent me so that you may see again and be filled with the Holy Spirit.” Immediately, something like scales fell from Saul’s eyes, and he could see again. He got up and was baptized, and after taking some food, he regained his strength. Saul spent several days with the disciples in Damascus. At once he began to preach in the synagogues that Jesus is the Son of God.

    Acts 19:1-6
    While Apollos was at Corinth, Paul took the road through the interior and arrived at Ephesus. There he found some disciples and asked them, “Did you receive the Holy Spirit when you believed?” They answered, “No, we have not even heard that there is a Holy Spirit.” So Paul asked, “Then what baptism did you receive?” “John’s baptism,” they replied. Paul said, “John’s baptism was a baptism of repentance. He told the people to believe in the one coming after him, that is, in Jesus.” On hearing this, they were baptized into the name of the Lord Jesus. When Paul placed his hands on them, the Holy Spirit came “on them”, and they spoke in tongues and prophesied.

    Acts 11:16-17
    “Then I remembered the word of the Lord, how He said, “John indeed baptized with water, but you shall be baptized with the Holy Spirit.’ If therefore God gave them the same gift as He gave us when we believed on the Lord Jesus Christ, who was I that I could withstand God?”

    Mark 3:20-30

    New King James Version (NKJV)

    Also there is this scripture… warning us to be very careful upon critisizing the power of God. Thus, what makes me nervous to form too strong of an opinion against the ministries of others where God’s power is displayed… especially when the word says “these signs will follow those who believe.” If someone doesn’t have signs following them, it can only logically make one ask if they really believe… that was said by Jesus himself.
    A House Divided Cannot Stand
    20 Then the multitude came together again, so that they could not so much as eat bread. 21 But when His own people heard about this, they went out to lay hold of Him, for they said, “He is out of His mind.”

    22 And the scribes who came down from Jerusalem said, “He has Beelzebub,” and, “By the ruler of the demons He casts out demons.”

    23 So He called them to Himself and said to them in parables: “How can Satan cast out Satan? 24 If a kingdom is divided against itself, that kingdom cannot stand. 25 And if a house is divided against itself, that house cannot stand. 26 And if Satan has risen up against himself, and is divided, he cannot stand, but has an end. 27 No one can enter a strong man’s house and plunder his goods, unless he first binds the strong man. And then he will plunder his house.

    The Unpardonable Sin
    28 “Assuredly, I say to you, all sins will be forgiven the sons of men, and whatever blasphemies they may utter; 29 but he who blasphemes against the Holy Spirit never has forgiveness, but is subject to eternal condemnation”— 30 because they said, “He has an unclean spirit.”

    And my speech and my preaching were not with persuasive words of human wisdom, but in demonstration of the Spirit and of power, — 1 Corinthians 2:4

    This is not to unwittingly condemn anyone truly seeking the truth, but obviously there is something to the Holy Spirit. King David dances wildly, so much so that his undergarments are exposed. When his wife hates him because of his highly emotional behaviour towards the Lord, it is a shame on her, not David. Throughout the Bible there are examples nearly too numerous to type here of the supernatural power of God. It knocks men backwards, forwards, and makes them appear drunk to others. Read the books of the prophets, the taking up into the third heaven of the Apostle Paul, the heavenly experiences of John in the Revelation of Jesus Christ… these are just a few examples. God is the same yesterday, today, and forever and He is no respector of persons. He also requests that we earnestly seek and ask for all of the spiritual gifts listed to the Corinthian church. Should we not then seek for and enjoy them… God would not have said that if He doesn’t think we’ll need it. He gives good gifts to His children, and if we ask for bread, God will not give us a stone… He is a good Father.

    If you point out the roots of the people who have shaped your faith, I can probably trace them back to someone who believed very much in the supernatural performance of an Almight God who does not need our permission to act out in ways that we may think unconventional. Had I gone to an evangelist when I was sick and asked for healing and they told me to go dip myself in a river three times and be healed, I would have thought that nuts in my natural mind. However, that happened with the leper and Elijah.

    My point is, who are WE to tell the Almighty God what His methods should be. Some of the very things you preach against, God’s Word seems to promote. It was Hannah, the mother of Samuel (the one who anointed mighty kings) who prayed so emotionally in the temple that the priest thought she was drunk and nearly cast her out. Emotional is okay. People tore their clothes and fell to the ground in mourning all of the time in the Old Testament to honor God. Had they stood their stoically, scared of what others thought, and unmoved in their hearts, there is no indication that would have been pleasing to God. You can even study ancient worship in the Bible to see that the way God commands us to worship Him is very ecstatic and emotional. Check out the Hebrew words when praise and worship are described… some of them clearly match the definition “to appear insane.”

    I was saved in a baptist church, and now I am part of a non-denominational type of church… And I am free in Christ, to dance, to shout, to laugh, to cry, and to be quiet and still in His presence. He leads me in different ways at different times according to His good will. I have no idea what your worship life is like with God… so that may even be a mute point here with me assuming based on previous details of the writing.

    However, I do know that Jesus Himself said: “28 “Assuredly, I say to you, all sins will be forgiven the sons of men, and whatever blasphemies they may utter; 29 but he who blasphemes against the Holy Spirit never has forgiveness, but is subject to eternal condemnation”— 30 because they said, “He has an unclean spirit.” Wow, Jesus even says that people who speak again blasphemies will be forgiven… but not those who say that those with the Holy Spirit have an unclean Spirit.

    I say this from experience. I love my baptist church and the people where I was saved. However, when I started to notice things from different denominations that seemed to have more life than what I was seeing in my church, I didn’t understand it. At first, I was automatically discharging it because it looked strange to me. However, the Lord told me to be careful who I judge and to be sure to study to show myself approved before I critisize… and as I studied, I found that I was not as “right” as pride and fear told me that I was.

    I see that most people that disagree seem to just get deleted, and I’m not here to disagree so much as to point out some areas that are obviously neglected by your writings or that just went unanswered. Based on the peaceful attitude of the previous comments by “YourConscience” and the obviously defensive, yet inadequate, response I would guess that probably the deleted comments just had more questions that your doctrine doesn’t have answers for… though we can’t really be sure with them being deleted to have a truly biblical argument.

    I do know that the Word says many in the last days will have a form of godliness but deny its power. I, for one, do not accuse people of having unclean spirits (to heed the warnings of Jesus) unless I can biblically point out point per point from their own teachings that I am right and they are not. So far, this hasn’t been done on your site. If you’re going to accuse people of twisting scripture to fit themselves, you’ll have to more clearly point out where that was done. I see where you have not adequately done so by scripture.

    I would love to see serious doctrinal, scriptural facts (not just accusations, heresay, and opinions) refuting the people you have so vehemently spoke against and called evil though. I’m sure they would as well… as I really know only a few people who keep their beliefs when they KNOW they’re wrong.

    Seriously, the only reason for these topics to be deleted is out of inadequate preparation and wisdom to respond.

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    Grace&Peace

    >> indeed baptize you with water unto repentance: but he that cometh after me is mightier than I, whose shoes I am not worthy to bear: he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost, and with Fire: Matthew 3:11 —- Question mainly, if fire is all from satan, what the fire that John is speaking of?

    You quote half a verse and misunderstand the Bible completely.

    Matthew 3:11-12
    11 “I baptize you with water, for repentance, but the one coming after me is more powerful than I am – I am not worthy to carry his sandals. He will baptize you with the Holy Spirit and fire.
    12 His winnowing fork is in his hand, and he will clean out his threshing floor and will gather his wheat into the storehouse, but the chaff he will burn up with inextinguishable fire.”

    So what we have here is a verse to supposedly back up the anointing by fire that so many pastors and false Christians and now New Agers like to quote to catch the fire anointing.

    But let me show you something; this fire is seen in a bad way in the above verse. John says that Jesus will baptize you with the Holy Spirit (for believers) and fire (for non believers) NOT the Holy Spirit AND fire or the Holy Spirit IS fire. John carries on saying that Jesus will gather His wheat into the barn BUT BURN UP THE CHAFF with unquenchable fire, that would be in HELL. Fire is judgement!, Jesus saves those who accept Him (the real Jesus that is) and judges those who DON’T.

    You need to make sure which Jesus you are following! The only way is to SEARCH the Word of God for answers and believe me EVERY ANSWER you need is in there. If you seek you will find, if you want to know the truth you WILL find it.

    >> For John truly baptized with water; but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost not many days hence. Acts 1:5 —- Again, this is showing a clear baptism with the Holy Ghost… and the disciples were told not to leave until they had received this. Also, Jesus told them that this would empower them. and then you quote (Acts 8:14-19, Acts 9:17-20, Acts 19:1-6, Acts 11:16-17)

    Please read the following articles:
    Speaking in Tongues has CEASED to understand that all the miracles and powers given to the Apostles by Jesus Christ and passed on was a temporary solution until such time as the bible was written. Then these things ceased.
    Are Prophets for Today or has Prophecy Ceased?
    Important!! Understanding biblical prophecy Joel 2 and Acts 2: Your Sons and Your Daughters Will Prophesy, But Not Yet

    >> Seriously, the only reason for these topics to be deleted is out of inadequate preparation and wisdom to respond.

    LOL

  • Nuetral CItizen

    This is just a general statement to anyone concerned. Read the Bible for Yourself and Trust not the thoughts and opinions of others. As people we often try our best to understand these things and no person, preacher, or minister can be certain if they try and intepret the Word.

    The Word is to bring you to see the Truth for Yourself if you Read it. Some times Miracles and the Presence of the Holy Spirit is a hard thing to explain. There is no surprise over history God blessed certain Prophets with Miracles to show people and to reveal the existence of God to them. The rest is an individual journey and to each his own.

    One thing I do know is this very important aspects of scripture given to us:

    Judge not, that ye be not judged. For with what judgment ye judge, ye shall be judged: and with what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you again. Matthew 7:1-2

    Brethren, let every man, wherein he is called, therein abide with God. 1 Corinthians 7:24

    For every man shall bear his own burden. Galatians 6:5

    So then every one of us shall give account of himself to God. Romans 14:12

    And when one knows this they know what is true Baptism…

    In whom also ye are circumcised with the circumcision made without hands, in putting off the body of the sins of the flesh by the circumcision of Christ: Buried with him in baptism, wherein also ye are risen with him through the faith of the operation of God, who hath raised him from the dead. And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses; Colossians 2:11-13

    For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart. Hebrews 4:12

    For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither is that circumcision, which is outward in the flesh: But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God. Romans 2:28-29

  • kristee

    whoever this deb is……please loose your PRIDE and your judgement. They are not from God that much i am convinced of. I have not finish reading all comments yet but will. I am not sure any thing yet expect God’s WORD and the narrow path are my guides. I have much more to see before i discern, But when you said i will allow this comment. My spirit said ouch!!!! Yes spirit my spirit we all have one. GOD is our director not you!!!!!! MAYBE you wont publish this one but my purpose is not shame you but to gently correct you. I love you and so does GOD. Thank you for your efforts….as i have said am taking my time and will not convict one way or the other until i am without doubt. both sides are very convincing. I need to actually take these scriptures and see what beliefs were twisted according to the word. When i read my bible i have to read whatis before and after the verse quoted follow subject and object. This can take time.Deb can you please explain Mathew 3:11 to me.

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    Kristee

    Thanks for insulting me, much appreciated. Where did I insult you? eh? No where. Have you been baptized by the false holy spirit that you do not know the REAL Holy Spirit of the Bible?

    It’s not difficult to explain Mathew 3:11, I have an article on it…. when you read the Bible, read the whole passage and not just one verse to get understanding. Now don’t get all upset after reading my explanation ok? You asked for a Biblical explanation and you are getting one, put YOUR pride aside and pay attention to God’s Word.

    Fire of The Holy Spirit – Judgment or Anointing?

    Let’s have a look at this verse:

    Matthew 3:11-12

    “Indeed baptize you with water unto repentance, but He who is coming after me is mightier than I, whose sandals I am not worthy to carry. He will baptize you with the Holy Spirit and fire. His winnowing fan is in His hand, and He will thoroughly clean out His threshing floor, and gather His wheat into the barn; but He will burn up the chaff with unquenchable fire.”

    So what we have here is a verse to supposedly back up the anointing by fire that so many pastors (Binny Hinn, Todd Bentley, even Hillsong bands) like to throw out to their audience as they gleefully catch the fire anointing.

    But let me show you something; this fire is seen in a bad way in the above verse. John says that Jesus will baptise you with the Holy Spirit (for believers) and fire (for non believers) NOT the Holy Spirit AND fire or the Holy Spirit IS fire. John carries on saying that Jesus will gather His wheat into the barn BUT burn up the chaff with unquenchable fire. Fire is judgement people, Jesus saves those who accept Him (the real Jesus that is) and judges those who DON’T.

    You need to make sure which Jesus you are following! The only way is to SEARCH the Word of God for answers and believe me EVERY ANSWER you need is in there. If you seek you will find, if you want to know the truth you WILL find it.

    A warning about people preaching another Jesus, and come to you with another spirit and a different gospel and how we don’t seem bothered and accept it.

    2 Corinthians 11:3-4

    3 But I am afraid that, as the serpent deceived Eve by his craftiness, your minds will be led astray from the simplicity and purity of devotion to Christ. 4 For if one comes and preaches another Jesus whom we have not preached, or you receive a different spirit which you have not received, or a different gospel which you have not accepted, you bear this beautifully.

    If you don’t hold fast to the truth you WILL be led astray. How do you hold fast to the truth? You make sure everything you hear and see can be found in scripture (obviously in the correct context as well).

  • wondertome

    This is not an easy topic. I would suggest that the issue of the Baptism of the Holy Spirit as a second experience is debatable and am sometimes perplexed as to why the Lord allowed scriptural support for both points of view,(at least, by my reading). But rather than enter the debate or even share my point of view and experience, I’d like to offer a scriptural criterion for judging spiritual activity and prophets who are false; that is, as the Lord told us when warning of last days deceptions:
    “15 “Beware of false prophets, who come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly they are ravenous wolves. 16 YOU WILL KNOW THEM BY THEIR FRUITS. Do men gather grapes from thornbushes or figs from thistles? 17 Even so, every good tree bears good fruit, but a bad tree bears bad fruit. 18 A good tree cannot bear bad fruit, nor can a bad tree bear good fruit. 19 Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire. 20 Therefore by their fruits you will know them.”
    The fruit of the spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, gentleness, faithfulness, and self-control.” If these qualities are at the heart of a ministry which clearly represents the Deity of Christ, His atoning death and bodily resurrection,then it is likely that the Lord is at work there. I feel saddened by the intensity of this theological contention as I’m personally convinced that there are many serious and loving Christians on both sides of the debate. By way of conciliation I’d like to suggest a title for any interested in a discussion that is conducted in an attitude that conforms beautifully with the above mentioned spiritual fruit: THE BEAUTY OF SPIRITUAL LANGUAGE, by Jack Hayford; and close with a prayer that all the Lord’s people who truly love and are called by Him will be protected from every deception and wile of the enemy.

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    wondertome

    >> the Lord allowed scriptural support for both points of view,

    Um, no. God does not allow view points for Christianity and Paganism.

    >> The fruit of the spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, gentleness, faithfulness, and self-control.” If these qualities are at the heart of a ministry which clearly represents the Deity of Christ,

    You forget about sound doctrine. First you need to preach the Truth, then comes all these things. False doctrine also produces fruit (looks good on the outside but inside it’s rotten) they are lies and people are swept away by them.

    >> By way of conciliation I’d like to suggest a title for any interested in a discussion that is conducted in an attitude that conforms beautifully with the above mentioned spiritual fruit: THE BEAUTY OF SPIRITUAL LANGUAGE.

    What is ‘spiritual language?’ I do know that the ‘truth’ is? Do you? So, basically what you are saying in your comment is that you want us to agree with your view point. It does not work like that here. We are not Emergents.

  • Sharon

    I have to believe that you are a very young Christian and a very young woman/girl. Why do I believe this? First off your spelling is atrocious. We all type too fast sometimes but hon, it is not LOOSE your pride. It is lose your pride. Then you accuse “who ever this Deb is” of being judgmental. Every time when truth is presented those who don’t like it accuse the truth giver of judging. That argument is too, too old. What will you do with this verse Kristee? John7:24 Judge not according to the appearance, but judge righteous judgment. Those are the words of Jesus Christ so be careful what you say when He says judge righteous judgment. Then in these verses Jesus said, Matthew 7:16 Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles?
    Matthew 7:20 Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them. Want to guess what that means? When we look at fellow Christians what type of “fruit” are they producing. If I look upon an apple tree before I pick a apple I judge the fruit. Here is when we cannot judge. Romans 2:1 Therefore thou art inexcusable, O man, whosoever thou art that judgest: for wherein thou judgest another, thou condemnest thyself; for thou that judgest doest the same things. For example if I were to judge a fellow believer for coming to church drunk and said all sort of bad things about them but then I came to the church drunk too, then I would be inexcusable in my judgment.

    I want to suggest to you that you buy yourself a very good dictionary and use it. Then a Matthew Henry Commentary. When you prepare to study your Bible I hope you have a very reliable version. But always pray before you read and ask the Holy Spirit to lead you into all truth. Never take just a couple of verses to base your whole belief system on. You will end up taking those verses out of context. This is how scripture must be taught: Isaiah 28:9 Whom shall he teach knowledge? and whom shall he make to understand doctrine? them that are weaned from the milk, and drawn from the breasts.
    Isaiah 28:10 For precept must be upon precept, precept upon precept; line upon line, line upon line; here a little, and there a little: I will not explain those two verses to you. Read and study them for yourself with a prayer to the Holy Spirit.

    If you are as young as I think you are you must learn that a young woman/young Christian must never rebuke an elder woman. 1Timothy 5:1 Rebuke not an elder, but intreat him as a father; and the younger men as brethren; 1Timothy 5:2 The elder women as mothers; the younger as sisters, with all purity.

    Grow in grace and knowledge of the Lord. Until you do, just read over the many articles on the web site. You just might learn truth…even if you don’t like it. Deborah’s teaching is very correct.

    kristee wrote:

    whoever this deb is……please loose your PRIDE and your judgement. They are not from God that much i am convinced of. I have not finish reading all comments yet but will. I am not sure any thing yet expect God’s WORD and the narrow path are my guides. I have much more to see before i discern, But when you said i will allow this comment. My spirit said ouch!!!! Yes spirit my spirit we all have one. GOD is our director not you!!!!!! MAYBE you wont publish this one but my purpose is not shame you but to gently correct you. I love you and so does GOD. Thank you for your efforts….as i have said am taking my time and will not convict one way or the other until i am without doubt. both sides are very convincing. I need to actually take these scriptures and see what beliefs were twisted according to the word. When i read my bible i have to read whatis before and after the verse quoted follow subject and object. This can take time.Deb can you please explain Mathew 3:11 to me.

  • Sharon

    Deborah, I knew of some women in Florida that called tongues their “angel talk” and they just couldn’t talk to the Lord in any language except their “heavenly prayer language.” Oh Good Grief! Most women can’t control the tongue in their mouths much less another one. If you took women out of the false tongues movement it would die a quick death. Every time tongues were spoken there were MALE JEWS PRESENT and it was languages with the sole purpose of winning people to Jesus Christ. You and I and all truth lovers know this my friend. But satan is running rampant and laughing at the false tongue churches.

    Deborah (Discerning the World) wrote:

    wondertome

    >> the Lord allowed scriptural support for both points of view,

    Um, no. God does not allow view points for Christianity and Paganism.

    >> The fruit of the spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, gentleness, faithfulness, and self-control.” If these qualities are at the heart of a ministry which clearly represents the Deity of Christ,

    You forget about sound doctrine. First you need to preach the Truth, then comes all these things. False doctrine also produces fruit (looks good on the outside but inside it’s rotten) they are lies and people are swept away by them.

    >> By way of conciliation I’d like to suggest a title for any interested in a discussion that is conducted in an attitude that conforms beautifully with the above mentioned spiritual fruit: THE BEAUTY OF SPIRITUAL LANGUAGE.

    What is ‘spiritual language?’ I do know that the ‘truth’ is? Do you? So, basically what you are saying in your comment is that you want us to agree with your view point. It does not work like that here. We are not Emergents.

  • Sharon

    Cat, I hope and pray that you are no longer in the church you mentioned. You should run as fast and as far away from that place. If you continue there you could very well end up being deceived. I too pray that I will never be deceived. Stay in the Word and ask the Holy Spirit himself to lead you into all truth. Make sure you have a very reliable version of scripture

    John 16:13 Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come.

    Cat wrote:

    I am amazed at this article. I am in total agreement how do you know the false prophets from the false ones?( on the Kim Clement site). I have had my sincere doubts about strange fire being in a church I have attended. I do not want to be fooled by the enemy. Because the ministers of satan probably do not even know they are ministers of satan. People who are are deceivers and who deceive, and even possible the elect, do not know they are deceivers. I pray quite frquently not to become one of these. Now I do not want to be fooled by one either. But in modern day Babylon we have this “You are judging them” That is not love, just pray for them”, and much more like that. So, what do you do today. the bible says to lead a quite life. That is exactly what I want to do. But I also want to love God with all I am and love other people. People think this is all you must do. God help us all who love Jesus christ and have been called by His Name, to walk as He did. Help us oh Father to be bold and courageous full of love and mercy but know when we have to shake the dust off of our feet. Help us not to compromise or be presumptuous Lord Jesus. help us to be alert, and be vigilant, be sober minded. Remove all that is false and help us to live in the truth and walk and abide in the true vine… Thank you my beloved Lord and Savior..Amein…

  • Sharon

    It is a easy topic if you know and love the Holy Spirit. The Baptism of the Holy Spirit is not a “second event.” Here is a verse of Scripture that proves truth.

    Romans 8:9 But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.

    Do you see that? If any man have not the Spirit of Christ (which is the Holy Spirit), he is none or not His. How can a person say or even worse teach, I just received Jesus as my Savior but the Holy Spirit will indwell me at another time. Not according to the above verse. Even Christians are susceptible to being deceived. That is why Jesus warned His Disciples Matthew 7:15 Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves.
    Mat 7:16 Ye shall know them by their fruits… Jesus didn’t warn the lost world about the wolves; He warned all of us who know and love Him. That tells me that it is possible for Christians to be deceived.

    Now, as far as a “Spiritual Language.” Where in scripture does it say something like, “And I shall give my followers a spiritual language so you can talk to me.” Where does it say “Heavenly Prayer Language? Here is what James, the half-brother of Jesus, said about the tongue. James 3:6 And the tongue is a fire, a world of iniquity: so is the tongue among our members, that it defileth the whole body, and setteth on fire the course of nature; and it is set on fire of hell.
    James 3:7 For every kind of beasts, and of birds, and of serpents, and of things in the sea, is tamed, and hath been tamed of mankind:
    Jamess 3:8 But the tongue can no man tame; it is an unruly evil, full of deadly poison.

    Last night I was reading in the book of Acts where Paul was standing before Agrippa and he was permitted to speak for himself. He related to Agrippa his salvation experience while on the road to Damascus. I noticed something very interesting in his oratory concerning him seeing and hearing Jesus.

    Acts 26:14 And when we were all fallen to the earth, I heard a voice speaking unto me, and saying in the Hebrew tongue, Saul, Saul, why persecutest thou me? it is hard for thee to kick against the pricks.

    God spoke to Paul in Hebrew. Paul knew other languages; but his “native tongue/language” was Hebrew. There was no “heavenly prayer language” imparted to Paul. God created (at Babel) and knows every language and dialect on this planet!

    Here is a verse of scripture that is sooooooo misunderstood by those that think they must speak in some gibberish when talking to God. Romans 8:26 Likewise the Spirit also helpeth our infirmities: for we know not what we should pray for as we ought: but the Spirit itself maketh intercession for us with groanings which cannot be uttered.

    There have been a few times in my life that I was under such stress, such physical, mental and emotional anguish that when I would try to pray the words just would not come out of my mouth. But I did groan and cry. It was then that the Holy Spirit himself interceded for me to my Father in heaven. I didn’t have some gibberish come out of my mouth. Nothing would come out of my mouth.

    Human nature is that man thinks he is smarter than God. Man wants to believe that we are in control of our human destiny and potential. (New Age garbage) All the way in the Garden of Eden satan made a statement to Eve that he is still saying today, “Yea hath God said?” Eve fell for it and so does the lost world and even some in the saved world think they know that God didn’t really mean what He said. Well yes, He did.

    It is also in our old nature, the flesh, to want to feel good. We desire new experiences thinking it will make us closer to God. Faith is not about feelings and experiences. When we received Jesus as Savior, the Holy Spirit came in to live in us. We then at that moment have all of God that we are going to get. But the real question is are we letting God have all of us? This is why we are, as True Christians, to grow in the grace and knowledge of our Lord. How do we do that…get into, dig into the Word of God. He has given us every thing that He wants us to know and experience for now and that is in His Word. There is no “New Revelation.” There is no new “Fresh Anointing.”

    Look here at what the Apostle John said, 1John 2:27 But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him. This anointing we received of Him and it abides in us.

    The Christian life is not about us. It is absolutely all about Jesus Christ. When we get to heaven every thing there that has been created will be for us. But until that day we press on in truth for the cause of Christ. Act 17:28 For in him we live, and move, and have our being; as certain also of your own poets have said, For we are also his offspring.

    Peace to you, His peace.

    wondertome wrote:

    This is not an easy topic. I would suggest that the issue of the Baptism of the Holy Spirit as a second experience is debatable and am sometimes perplexed as to why the Lord allowed scriptural support for both points of view,(at least, by my reading). But rather than enter the debate or even share my point of view and experience, I’d like to offer a scriptural criterion for judging spiritual activity and prophets who are false; that is, as the Lord told us when warning of last days deceptions:
    “15 “Beware of false prophets, who come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly they are ravenous wolves. 16 YOU WILL KNOW THEM BY THEIR FRUITS. Do men gather grapes from thornbushes or figs from thistles? 17 Even so, every good tree bears good fruit, but a bad tree bears bad fruit. 18 A good tree cannot bear bad fruit, nor can a bad tree bear good fruit. 19 Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire. 20 Therefore by their fruits you will know them.”
    The fruit of the spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, gentleness, faithfulness, and self-control.” If these qualities are at the heart of a ministry which clearly represents the Deity of Christ, His atoning death and bodily resurrection,then it is likely that the Lord is at work there. I feel saddened by the intensity of this theological contention as I’m personally convinced that there are many serious and loving Christians on both sides of the debate. By way of conciliation I’d like to suggest a title for any interested in a discussion that is conducted in an attitude that conforms beautifully with the above mentioned spiritual fruit: THE BEAUTY OF SPIRITUAL LANGUAGE, by Jack Hayford; and close with a prayer that all the Lord’s people who truly love and are called by Him will be protected from every deception and wile of the enemy.

  • Teddy

    I went to this church. I heard the music and thought wow! This is amazing stuff. I saw people behave in a very strange way. Barking, screaming, hooting laughter and body shakes. The preacher got up and proclaimed ‘ this is god’. I could feel sexual vibes. At first I liked it because it was kinky. Some of the woman said they would pray for me and a few days later I could feel their prayers. Deep in the heart of my being. I was having these sexual vibes gush out of my inner being. I deeply loved this experience as it was like or it was spiritual sex. The single woman who were both physically fit and beautiful were the best. As they could pray with more energy. Iwould know when they were praying for me as it felt like we were joined and I think they were enjoying it to because it went on for a long time. It was beautifully forefilling and completely spiritual. Spiritual sex pleasure beats the real thing. But there was something wrong. I didnt know why but it just started to hurt inside for no reason and the inner part that was feeling so zappo started to hurt and I started to get really confused. Hugs in church from the woman started to become more passionate and while I enjoyed the intimate touch, I wondered if they knew I could feel their parts. I knew this was wrong. But I wasn’t the one who was pressing my body against theirs.i was getting squeezed physically. I felt the right thing to do was to put out my hand for a hand shake greeting but even this type of touching became an act of sensuality. I felt it was strange that they would not let go of my hand but would continue holding me.being new to church I guess I didnt want to hurt their feelings..I would always be trying to look at Godd but was and I would be crying out inside and sayinv to God whg are you hurting me. I stopped going to church and I didnt let any of those people touch me. I started to get so angry at God. Their music was so beautiful but I was feeling so unclean inside. I felt so cheated anx robbed because I so .much wanted to believe that God was who he said he was. But I new deep inside my heart this was not God. I dont even know how I got to this pages. But when I read I thought hey I know about that stuff. Its happened tl me

  • Mary Smith

    I have been a prominant minister in the fire, anointing, for many many years. Featured on stage with all the big names. One day I got a book that was anointed. I suddenly realised that was the anointing I got in South Africa. It was the real Holy Spirit and I saw myself with a very dark black spirit in me. I have shut down the ministry. Went thru hell, my husband has left me. I have fasted till I cant I can not get this spirit out of me. I know I am under falsehood. Can people pray for me please, I am scared, unclean, unholy and have falsehood in and on me. Can I hook up wiowth people that know how to break this. AM DESPERATE

  • Mary Smith,

    Hi Mary, the first thing we need to do is for you to tell us what happened in South Africa when you received the so-called anointing and from whom. We also need to know the title and the author of the book which you said was anointed.

  • Leslie

    GraceAndPeace wrote:

    Matthew 3:11-12
    11 “I baptize you with water, for repentance, but the one coming after me is more powerful than I am – I am not worthy to carry his sandals. He will baptize you with the Holy Spirit and fire.
    12 His winnowing fork is in his hand, and he will clean out his threshing floor and will gather his wheat into the storehouse, but the chaff he will burn up with inextinguishable fire.”

    Is it possible that those who were living by the fruit of the spirit or that were living by the law of Moses were the one that Jesus was storing in the barns? And the He meant that those that were corrupt or living sinful lives or had no knowledge of God at all were the ones that He was going to burn up with inextinguishable fire? After all when Saul had his conversion it wasn’t until Ananias prayed for him, laying his hands on him that Saul received the Holy Spirit and became Paul who then was on fire for the Lord, wasn’t he? Everyone in Acts who came to believe and received the Holy Spirit and began fellowshipping and caring for one another, selling belongings, praising God, speaking in tongues and others understanding, etc… My point being and as a reminder I say this…Jesus did not go to the homes of the Holy and Righteous, no, He went to the homes and places where He was needed most. To the sick, the sinners, the Samaritan’s, the Gentiles, et.

    That’s all

    Thanks

  • No, Jesus did not only visit the sick, the sinners, the Samaritans, the Gentiles, etc. He came and died for everyone.

  • joe

    First of all, the bible is the only book that needs to be read, not man’s opinion as this is. You do receive the Holy Spirit when you accept Christ as your saviour. That is the Spirit within, acts is talking about the spirit upon, which comes upon you with power to do the works of God, which is also evident throughout the old testament, when the “spirit came upon them” to do the work of God, the holy spirit with in, will teach you and guide you. No need to read man’s opinion which this is. The Spirit upon is also known as the Holy Ghost which has been taken out of most translations of the word of God accept the KJV.

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    Mary Smith

    Are you still around? Please answer us.
    This book, do you still have it? If so please tear it up and throw it away. Along with every other book you have, pamphlet, workshop docs, CDs, DVDs, everything (excluding the bible of course) tear them up, break them and throw them away.
    Secondly, I want you to stop fasting, you are making your mind weaker and weaker that you can’t spiritually fight off this demonic force.
    Thirdly, I want you to make a list of every sin in your life, that includes your ministry that had a FALSE FIRE (demonic force) over it. List all the books you have read and every minister that has laid hands on you and transferred this so called ‘holy spirit’ over you. Please try remember them all. IF you can’t remember them all it’s ok, Jesus knows you have tried.

    Once you have made your list Mary I want you to pray”

    “Heavenly Father, Dear Lord Jesus Christ, I come before you and I acknowledged that I am a sinner. I believe Jesus Christ the only begotten Son of God was my substitute when He died on the cross for me. I believe Jesus Christ’s death, burial, and resurrection 3 days later were for me. I believe your shed blood Lord Jesus washes way my all my sins. You are my saviour Lord Jesus, only you, and I now receive you Lord Jesus Christ as my personal Saviour. Please forgive me of all my sins, I repent Heavenly father earnestly for every single one of them. I want to thank you for the forgiveness of my sins, and the glorious gift of salvation and everlasting life, because of your merciful grace……Here is a my list of sins that I want to mention to You one by one Lord Jesus that I need deliverance from, and I ask that you please removed all demonic affliction from me, and break all demonic chains over evil over my life. Thank you Lord Jesus…”

    Start listing your sin (books, personal life, ministry, people who laid hands on you, false baptism, speaking in tongues, everything) one my one and ask Jesus to remove ALL demons from you and break ALL chains of demonic force over your life. Mention that any sins that you did not mention because you forgot about them, Jesus must please deliver you from them and break all chains over you. Afterwards thank Jesus Christ for your deliverance and saving your life:

    If you need to say that following:

    “Jesus Christ demands all demonic spirits in my home to leave now!” “Satan, Jesus Christ rebukes you to get out of my life and house now!”

    Say this with confidence, as Jesus Christ has already won the battle and because you are now a child of God, that battle has been won for you and you have the authority to use Jesus’s name. Keep saying this until all demonic manifestations have left your home.

    Thank Jesus Christ from the bottom of your heart and worship him through thanking Him for what He has done for you – Start reading your bible (not other books)

  • John McMasters

    Some here make it sound like we should have no feelings of our senses concerning the Holy Spirit. I see the dangers of inviting demons and being deceived. Christ indeed Baptized with the Holy Spirit. I do not conform to the belief that the first sign of Baptism of the Holy Spirit is speaking in tongues. Actually the strange Fire was the first sign. That was an apostolistic sign and was done at the time the Holy Spirit was sent down to us this generation. so I can understand the position that this is not a sign to be repeated. But Spiritual gifts have not stopped with the apostles. I refer you to

    1 Corinthians 12 written by Paul. Here is the first few verses please read Chapter before and after and the whole of 12 for context.

    1 Now concerning spiritual gifts, brethren, I would not have you ignorant. 2Ye know that ye were Gentiles, carried away unto these dumb idols, even as ye were led. 3Wherefore I give you to understand, that no man speaking by the Spirit of God calleth Jesus accursed: and that no man can say that Jesus is the Lord, but by the Holy Ghost.

    4Now there are diversities of gifts, but the same Spirit. 5And there are differences of administrations, but the same Lord. 6And there are diversities of operations, but it is the same God which worketh all in all. 7But the manifestation of the Spirit is given to every man to profit withal. 8For to one is given by the Spirit the word of wisdom; to another the word of knowledge by the same Spirit; 9To another faith by the same Spirit; to another the gifts of healing by the same Spirit; 10To another the working of miracles; to another prophecy; to another discerning of spirits; to another divers kinds of tongues; to another the interpretation of tongues: 11But all these worketh that one and the selfsame Spirit, dividing to every man severally as he will.

  • robbie gareau

    was john g lake a false healer and false prophet, i have people when they prayed for me say i speak healing in jesus name, i did not fell any miraculous healing when they said that, they seem to think if they call things that are like healing it will manifest, is this biblical or false doctrine, i have also had people tell me martial arts from satan which i think they are full of crap, number one i took martial arts and we did not worship the kung fu school i trained at , we do not get power to break bricks from demons like some people believe, they develop the ability by hitting a striking post called a makiwara wrapped in rope or by hitting their hands aginst bags filled with beans, gravel, or steel shot, and over time your bones calcify and become denser and harder, look up the term murphy’s law on the internet and it explains this, we don’t practice witchcraft or black magic, i had people at benny ministries when i called their prayer line years accuse of witchcraft fro praying to god a girl i like start liking me as a boyfriend and people in the word of faith movement like benny hinn and kenneth copeland minstries call this “witchcraft prayers”,they are so full of crap, many of them operates in a spirit of witchcraft themselves when benny at his fake miracle crusades said ” i curse that man or wom that dare speak out against his ministry, they are speak out against him because he is a dam con artist in sheeps clothing, there are video on youtube on benny hinn saying this at one of his fake miracle crusades, and operates in a spirit of witchcraft when they manipulate the bible bible where it says in the bible don’t touch gods anionted and they misquote and take out of context that bible verse to instill fear in their followers and use and abuse ti to manipulate their followers, their is a woman who used to be a house keeper that wrote a book called “Mafia Ministry named cheryl brown i believe, who exposes benny hinn and his family and steve munsey, and she was spiritually abused by benny hinn and his family and ministry, go on google and type the name of the book “Mafia Ministry” and it will tell you where you can buy it, and my advice to people, go on background checks websites and do get a background check on all these word of faith preachers that scam people, one of them has a drug related offense on his criminal record, i also know that richard roberts, the son of oral roberts was arrested for drunk driving a couple of years ago and it showed a mug shot of him arrrestede for drunk driving, go on youtube and type rchard roberts arrested for drunk driving, and pastor randy white alseo arrested a couple of years ago for drunk driving, and don’t dare tell me this time don’t touch or qustion gods anointed richard roberts, may the lord rebuke these fake counterfeit anointed men of god who act like they are superstars and bigshots

  • John McMasters

    “and that no man can say that Jesus is the Lord, but by the Holy Ghost.”

    Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity. (Mat 7:21-23)

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    robbie gareau

    >> was john g lake a false healer and false prophet,

    Yes he is a false teacher, he formed the Apostolic Faith Mission here in South Africa.

    >> i have people when they prayed for me say i speak healing in jesus name, i did not fell any miraculous healing when they said that, they seem to think if they call things that are like healing it will manifest, is this biblical or false doctrine,

    It’s false, this is no where to be found in the bible.

    >> i have also had people tell me martial arts from satan which i think they are full of crap, number one i took martial arts and we did not worship the kung fu school i trained at , we do not get power to break bricks from demons like some people believe, they develop the ability by hitting a striking post called a makiwara wrapped in rope or by hitting their hands aginst bags filled with beans, gravel, or steel shot, and over time your bones calcify and become denser and harder, look up the term murphy’s law on the internet and it explains this, we don’t practice witchcraft or black magic,

    I’ve already answered this. If you don’t want to believe that there is a demonic force behind all martial arts then there is nothing anyone will do to change your mind. You have been told the truth about martial arts by many Christians and you don’t want to listen.

    >> i had people at benny ministries when i called their prayer line years accuse of witchcraft fro praying to god a girl i like start liking me as a boyfriend and people in the word of faith movement like benny hinn and kenneth copeland minstries call this “witchcraft prayers”,they are so full of crap,

    There is nothing wrong praying to God asking Him to help you find a wife, however praying to God to ask Him to make a girl like you is not right, you may as well go to a witchdoctor and get him to cast a spell for you over the girl you like that she returns the feelings. God wont make someone like you because you want them too like you. He will however sent the right girl to you that you need not want.

  • Bardi

    Michael wrote:

    No one has perfect faith. The Bible shows even the greatest people of faith wavering in their faith (startling example). You have faith – maybe not as strong as you would like, but you have it. And Jesus taught that as you use what you have, God will give you more. (Luke 16:10; Matthew 25:21)

    Well written … well worded ! Thanks ! Inspirational!

  • Bardi,

    Would you say that when Jesus said the following he was referring to a perfect faith?

    In the last day, that great day of the feast, Jesus stood and cried, saying, If any man thirst, let him come unto me, and drink. He that believeth on me, as the scripture hath said, out of his belly shall flow rivers of living water. (Joh 7:37-38)

  • Lorenzo

    Hi Can you explain what John the Baptist meant when He said this in Matthew 3:11 “I indeed baptize you with water unto repentance: but he that cometh after me is mightier than I, whose shoes I am not worthy to bear: he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost, and with fire”:

    And Can you please explain what Happened to the Apostles in the Upper room on the day of Pentacost?Acts 2:3 to 13.Can you please rerad this as its lenghty.

    I had Holy Spirit experiences.How do you know its real or not?

    You say baptism of Fire is unbiblical but there it is in the Bible.Bless you.

  • Lorenzo

    I would appreciate it if you could first explain what you mean by “I had a Holy Spirit experience” and then we can go from there. Were you slain in the spirit when you had this experience? Did you begin to speak in tongues. Give me a little more info, please.

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    Lorenzo

    Please read: Fire of The Holy Spirit – Judgment or Anointing?

  • Regina

    I know that Kudalini is a demonic spirit that has nothing to do with the Spirit of God. The enemy will always counterfeit the things of God to bring confusion or to have of put down and not operate according to how God has ordained his Body to.

    That being said I don’t understand how any Lover of Christ, Bible believing Christian can believe that the power of God does not operate today. That is the most ridiculous thing I have ever heard. God the same yesterday, today and forever. Just because we cannot wrap are little minds around the fact that God can use us and choose to manifest himself through us does not mean that His power is not in operation today. Some of you are just like the Pharisees calling what is of God ungodly. They did the same thing to Jesus when He operated in power by casting out demons, healing the sick, etc. They said He was operating under the influence of Satan. A religious spirit will always deny the existence and power of God. It is always those whose relationship is based totally on head knowledge that have a problem with tapping into the Spirit of God.

    I still have not seen you give an answer to scripture that was posted regarding the Baptism of the Holy Spirit. As usual when someone post those scriptures there is always the cry of you are misintepreting the scriptures or “twisting scriptures” or they post scriptures totally unrelated to what was being posted and try to get off topic instead of fully addressing what scripture says.

    May God open your eyes of understanding and help you see beyond the natural and see with spiritual eyesight.

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    Regina

    >> That being said I don’t understand how any Lover of Christ, Bible believing Christian can believe that the power of God does not operate today.

    That is a WOF lie, of course it operates, you go to Jesus Christ in prayer, you do not go to a faith healer. Do you have a problem with going directly to Jesus Christ in prayer?

    >> I still have not seen you give an answer to scripture that was posted regarding the Baptism of the Holy Spirit.

    What scripture? Please quote it.

  • Regina,

    You readily agree that the devil and his demonic spirits are able to counterfeit the Spirit of God but refuse to acknowledge that we must test the spirits? Really??? How does that work for you? By the way you have given yourself away when you said, “It is always those whose relationship is based totally on head knowledge that have a problem with tapping into the Spirit of God.” “Tapping into the Spirit” is totally, indubitably, unadulterated New Age teaching. The Bible does not say “Renew your ability to tap into the Spirit of God.” It says,

    And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may pove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God. (Romans 12:2)

    Your mind is your head knowledge which you glean from Scripture. Where did you learn this garbage – from Rodney Howard-Brown, Benny Hinn, Kenneth Copeland or another heretical teacher in the WOF Movement?

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    Nathan

    So what you are saying is this, things need to be said twice in order to make it valid?

    According to your logic let’s apply it to a few things…

    Anton Lavey wrote the Satanic Bible, but it does not mean anything because he should have written a Satanic Bible II to let people know he was serious in his first book.

    How about this one, when Eve at the fruit in the garden of Eden, she should have eaten a second fruit in order to let God know she was SERIOUS when she took a bite from the first fruit..

    Seriously? Really? L O L

    PS, I don’t believe what you are saying in your comment, please comment again to validate what you are saying.

  • Prophetess Selena Stubbs

    I PRAY SO INTENSELY TO YESHUA HA MESHIACH FOR YOUR UNDERSTANDING CONCERNING YOUR BIBLICAL INTERPRETATION OF SCRIPTURES. FAIRLY MY SISTER IN YESHUA WHAT YOU SHARE IS NOT ALL SKEWED YOU DO HAVE SOME UNDERSTANDING! THE CHILDREN OF JEHOVAH ARE BEING MISLEAD BY SOME OF YOUR EXPLANATIONS CONCERNING SCRIPTURES AND IT IS TOO LENGHTY TO GO INTO DETAIL HERE…… YOU DELETE (DAUGHTERS & SONS COMMENTS THAT OPPOSE YOUR BIBLICAL INTERPRETATION OF SCRIPTURE. WHAT ALL OF THIS COMMUNICATION WILL COME DOWN TO IS WHEN WE ALL STAND BEFORE THE GREAT WHITE THRONE JUDGMENT SEAT AND GIVE ACCOUNT FOR WHAT WE HAVE BEEN ENTRUSTED WITH AND THAT ISOUR LIFE AND HOW WE RIGHTLY DIVIDE THE WORD OF TRUTH (PARAPHRASING A LOT)WHICH EQUALS THE SPREADING OF THE GOSPEL OF YESHUA HA MESHIACH OUR LORD AND SAVIOR. IT IS OUR DUTY TO SPEAK AND TAIR DOWN SPIRITUAL WICKEDNESS IN HIGH PLACES….YOU ARE DOING THE WORK OF A DISCIPLE OF YESHUA AND I COMMEND YOU FOR THAT!!!!!! HOWEVER, WHEN YOU DEMEAN AND CONTRADICT ANY OTHER INTERPRETATION OF BIBILICAL ESCATOLOGY AND UNDERSTANDING from a (brother or sister)YOU SAY THEY ARE WRONG AND YOU ARE ALL RIGHT. THIS IS ATTITUDE/PRIDEFULLNESS….AND NOT CONVICTION!! LOVE OF GOD ONLY JEHOVAH AND YESHUA KNOW FOR SURE IF ANY OF US HAVE ALL THE RIGHT INTERPRETATION AND WHO IS (AS YOU SAY) THE TRUE BELIEVER OR NOT…..BECAUSE HE ALONE KNOWS THE HEART OF A MAN (PARAPHRASING A LOT) WE ALL CAN ASK FOR, SEEK AFTER THE DEEP AND HIDDEN THINGS OF JEHOVAH AND SHARE THEM IN CONVICTION, LOWLINESS AND POWER….GIVING ALL THE GLORY AND HONOR TO YESHUA HA MESHIACH ALONE….PLEASE HUMBLE YOURSELF AND SERVE WHAT JEHOVAH HAS GIVEN YOU AND WHEN OTHER SONS AND DAUGHTERS OF JEHOVAH SHARE WHAT THEY KNOW…..UNDERSTAND THAT THEY MAY NOT BE WRONG…..YOU NOR I KNOW ALL THAT JEHOVAH KNOWS!!!!!! HE IS THE ONLY WISE GOD….TREAD CAREFULLY AS AN AMBASSADOR/MESSENGER TO ANOTHER AMBASSADOR….YET CONTINUE TO SILENCE THE IGNORANCE OF WICKED MEN AND SHAKE AWAKE THE SONS AND DAUGHTERS THAT ARE SLEEPING….. THAT THEY MAY BE ALERTED INTO A CALL TO ACTION….AS WE SEE THE DAY OF YESHUA’S RETURN APPROACHING AGGRESSIVELY! STAY LOVING AND BLESSED WOMAN OF EXCELLENCE!

    Deborah (Discerning the World) wrote:

    Grace&Peace
    >> indeed baptize you with water unto repentance: but he that cometh after me is mightier than I, whose shoes I am not worthy to bear: he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost, and with Fire: Matthew 3:11 —- Question mainly, if fire is all from satan, what the fire that John is speaking of?
    You quote half a verse and misunderstand the Bible completely.
    Matthew 3:11-12
    11 “I baptize you with water, for repentance, but the one coming after me is more powerful than I am – I am not worthy to carry his sandals. He will baptize you with the Holy Spirit and fire.
    12 His winnowing fork is in his hand, and he will clean out his threshing floor and will gather his wheat into the storehouse, but the chaff he will burn up with inextinguishable fire.”
    So what we have here is a verse to supposedly back up the anointing by fire that so many pastors and false Christians and now New Agers like to quote to catch the fire anointing.
    But let me show you something; this fire is seen in a bad way in the above verse. John says that Jesus will baptize you with the Holy Spirit (for believers) and fire (for non believers) NOT the Holy Spirit AND fire or the Holy Spirit IS fire. John carries on saying that Jesus will gather His wheat into the barn BUT BURN UP THE CHAFF with unquenchable fire, that would be in HELL. Fire is judgement!, Jesus saves those who accept Him (the real Jesus that is) and judges those who DON’T.
    You need to make sure which Jesus you are following! The only way is to SEARCH the Word of God for answers and believe me EVERY ANSWER you need is in there. If you seek you will find, if you want to know the truth you WILL find it.
    >> For John truly baptized with water; but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost not many days hence. Acts 1:5 —- Again, this is showing a clear baptism with the Holy Ghost… and the disciples were told not to leave until they had received this. Also, Jesus told them that this would empower them. and then you quote (Acts 8:14-19, Acts 9:17-20, Acts 19:1-6, Acts 11:16-17)
    Please read the following articles:
    Speaking in Tongues has CEASED to understand that all the miracles and powers given to the Apostles by Jesus Christ and passed on was a temporary solution until such time as the bible was written. Then these things ceased.
    Are Prophets for Today or has Prophecy Ceased?
    Important!! Understanding biblical prophecy Joel 2 and Acts 2: Your Sons and Your Daughters Will Prophesy, But Not Yet
    >> Seriously, the only reason for these topics to be deleted is out of inadequate preparation and wisdom to respond.
    LOL

  • Selena Stubb wrote,

    WHEN YOU DEMEAN AND CONTRADICT ANY OTHER INTERPRETATION OF BIBILICAL ESCATOLOGY AND UNDERSTANDING from a (brother or sister)YOU SAY THEY ARE WRONG AND YOU ARE ALL RIGHT.

    First of all, shouting on this site is not permitted. Please turn your caps lock OFF the next time you write a comment. You are definitely not honoring and serving Jesus Christ when you follow false doctrine, In fact the Bible says,

    Whosoever transgresseth, and abideth not in the doctrine of Christ, hath not God. He that abideth in the doctrine of Christ, he hath both the Father and the Son. (2 Jonn 1:9)

    Secondly, God’s Word is right and you are wrong.

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    Prophetess?? Selena Stubbs

    >> BY SOME OF YOUR EXPLANATIONS CONCERNING SCRIPTURES AND IT IS TOO LENGHTY TO GO INTO DETAIL HERE……

    First, using all CAPS is SHOUTING. No one likes to be shouted at, so don’t do it again.

    >> BY SOME OF YOUR EXPLANATIONS CONCERNING SCRIPTURES AND IT IS TOO LENGHTY TO GO INTO DETAIL HERE……

    No please go into detail because I would like to hear what it is exactly you believe in.

    >> WE ALL CAN ASK FOR, SEEK AFTER THE DEEP AND HIDDEN THINGS OF JEHOVAH AND SHARE THEM IN CONVICTION,

    Everything we need to know is IN THE BIBLE, there is nothing new we need to know.

    2 Timothy 3:16-17 16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: 17That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works.

  • irene stockley

    i was told there was a baptism of the holy spirit but my church said its wrong well i read my bible every day and i know if its truth god will reveal it to me because he knows everything about me and he showed me about the deer thirsting after him and desiring him which i did prayed abouted thirsted for it and he showed me verse after verse on the holy spirit now i had been saved baptised in water and i believe its the truth jesus wants us to have what he had power to teach heal deviver gifts tongues and do do all these things in love and i have been a better person so i know god wanted me to recieve this baptism of the spirit so i asked some christian friends to pray with me and i recived it in such a gental loving way i felt god presence on me and all around me after that i was begining to praise god more with hands uplifted in praise he started opening up my eyes to understand his word and i was taking bile studies which i never could have done without the power of gods holy spirit christians noticed a diffrence in me and the love poured out of me for people and there was nothing evil about it god does not give us something from the devil and i hope that more and more christians will seek god on this pray and ask jesus seek his word im not saying take my word for it but i know god spoke to me amen

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    Dear Irene

    >> im not saying take my word for it

    You are right, we are not going to take your word for it. The article was very explanatory as to how the Holy Spirit operates and you have still rejected the genuine Holy Spirit and accepted a lying demonic spirit – Satan came to you like an angel of light and illuminated you to understand the bible HIS way, not God’s way. You are in trouble Irene. Reject this spirit now and be genuinely saved or face the consequences.

    >> god does not give us something from the devil

    Yes you are right Irene, but this is not from God, you asked God for this “baptism of the Spirit” which is not biblical, you insisted on it and God said NO your church told you NO you said so, “but my church said its wrong” and because of your disobedience Satan stepped in and gave you what you wanted.

    And what is is that you were after that God told you NO? Power, you want power, to be like Jesus Christ, like a god, you said it youself, “its the truth jesus wants us to have what he had power“. God will not give you power, but Satan will and you got your wish.

    You are in deep trouble Irene, reject this spirit. https://www.discerningtheworld.com/seeking-deliverance/

  • Athlea Todd

    [deleted by DTW]

  • irene stockley

    im sorry but you dont know me and have no right to judge me im in no danger it is biblical you are blind open your eyes and read the word any one else believe what this person says who else belives its biblical

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    Dear Irene

    I am not judging you, I care enough about you to warn you (this is called biblical love), you are in trouble, you have been fooled by a false spirit.

  • Dominic

    So your telling me there is an evil spirit that pretends to be the holy spirit . Delivers. People from drugs and alcohol. Cures diseases.and then praises and gives all the glory to Jesus Christ. Please humble yourself before God.ask for discernment. Jesus told you satan wouldnt go against his own kingdom. I dont like how you made me question the spirit inside of me. Its Jesus. Spirit and he loves me and cured me of my diseases and addictions. That is not of the devil! You blaspheme my savior. Please repent and also please humble yourself . Its like when i read your comments i can just tell your angry and rude and ill pray that angry religious spirit leaves you. In the mighty name of Jesus Christ. Also Jesus. Said lay hands on the sick and cast out devils. So we can go directly to him or go to a man or woman of great faith in Christ Jesus and they LAY hands . All to the glory of God.

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    Dominic

    >> So your telling me there is an evil spirit that pretends to be the holy spirit . Delivers. People from drugs and alcohol. Cures diseases.and then praises and gives all the glory to Jesus Christ.

    Yes this is what the bible says, that is the WORD OF GOD, God’s word to you:

    Matthew 24:24 For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect.

    So as you can see from the word of God, Satan can perform wonderful signs and wonders, to the point that possibly even Christians can be fooled into thinking they are from God.

    Yes this false spirit does all this, heals, deliverers etc but it does not give glory to Jesus Christ but to a false Christ. Because you disobey God you give glory to a false Christ, not Jesus Christ of the bible. Jesus Christ of the bible tells you that the Holy Spirit does not do the things you believe it does; it does not cause warmth and feelings of electricity or example and He does not slay people in the spirit.

    >> Its Jesus. Spirit and he loves me and cured me of my diseases and addictions.

    Jesus Christ does the healing, not the Holy Spirit, this false spirit in you is the one that healed you and what was the aim? To make you believe wholeheartedly in the doctrine of demons you are believing in and you will spiral downward into more false teaching to the point where you wont be able to get out.

    >> I dont like how you made me question the spirit inside of me.

    spirit or holy spirit? Satan will be upset if you question him (the spirit in you), the Holy Spirit points you to scripture :)

    Re-read this article again and tell me, why there are no verses in the bible that explain away the way the false spirit operates? For instance why does the bible not say that the Holy Spirit makes you feel warm? And it gives you feelings of electricity? And it makes you laugh? etc etc. Please go and search the bible find to find out if this is how the Holy Spirit operates – Satan will not want you to go look in the bible, the Holy Spirit will always point you to the bible.

  • Dominic

    Luke 11:13 – If ye then, being evil, know how to give good gifts unto your children: how much more shall [your] heavenly Father give the Holy Spirit to them that ask him?
    Thats what i asked for and recieved. I said nothing about electricity. His yoke is light. Blasts demons off me and gives me peace and joy. And yes sonetimes it makes me laugh. But thats good because if it didnt i wouldnt laugh. Because im serious about being holy. Hating evil and abstaining from it. And not fellowshipping with the world or laughing at what they laugh at. So i dont laugh much cept when the lord makes me smile or lAugh just have joy in my dark times.2 Corinthians 3:17 – Now the Lord is that Spirit: and where the Spirit of the Lord [is], there [is] liberty. Liberty is freedom. Thus Jesus. Spirit heals of of everything.
    Romans 15:13 – Now the God of hope fill you with all joy and peace in believing, that ye may abound in hope, through the power of the Holy Ghost. That verse allows me to smile and laugh.
    Isaiah 11:2 – And the spirit of the LORD shall rest upon him, the spirit of wisdom and understanding, the spirit of counsel and might, the spirit of knowledge and of the fear of the LORD; i fear and love Jesus Christ

    Acts 10:38. How God anointed Jesus of Nazareth with the Holy Ghost and with power: who went about doing good, and healing all that were oppressed of the devil; for God was with him. The holy spirit heals

  • Dominic,

    The mistake most Christians make is to believe that when they pray for the gift of the Holy Spirit that God gives them the Holy Spirit Himself. Believers of today should never ask or pray for the Holy Spirit to be given to them as a gift because the prayer of the disciples (for the Holy Spirit) was answered at Pentecost. As far as the gifts of the Holy Spirit is concerned, He (the Holy Spirit) gives his gifts as He wills and not as we want Him to give to us. The lesson in Luke 11:13 does not teach us that we can ask or pray for any gift and expect Him to give it to us because our own perception of those gifts is that they are good. For instance, we cannot ask God to give us the gift of prosperity (a lot of money) because we think it is a good gift. He knows better and may not give us the money we ask or pray for because in his estimate it is not a good gift because it may stifle our spiritual growth in Him. The Israelite prayed for food and, yes, God sent them the food but look what happened to them.

    They soon forgat his works; they waited not for his counsel: But lusted exceedingly in the wilderness, and tempted God in the desert. And he gave them their request; but sent leanness into their soul. (Psalm 106:13-15)

    The Amplified Bible says it thus,

    13 But they hastily forgot His works; they did not [earnestly] wait for His plans [to develop] regarding them,

    14 But lusted exceedingly in the wilderness and tempted and tried to restrain God [with their insistent desires] in the desert.

    15 And He gave them their request, but sent leanness into their souls and [thinned their numbers by] disease and death.

    We may even pray for the gift of healing but never receive it because God may have a more serene purpose for not giving it.

    “Man is also rebuked with pain on his bed and with continual strife in his bones, so that his life loathes bread, and his appetite the choicest food. His flesh is so wasted away that it cannot be seen, and his bones that were not seen stick out. His soul draws near the pit, and his life to those who bring death. (Job 33:19-22)

    God may allow his children to be very sick as a method to restrain them from sin and as a means to discipline them.

  • Dominic

    LUKE 11:13 clearly says what it says. How. Can u misinterpret that. It says evil ppl know how to give gifts. So how much more will our father in heaven give us the holy spirit when we ask for it. It clearly says ask for it. I dont know how u changed the meaning so much but i dont like when ppl change what God. Said. It clearly says what it means literally. Theres nothing to interpret. U ask an evil person for something u get it. U ask God. For the holy spirit he gives u. Jesus said ask and you shall receive. You wont.change my mind because God said it and i wont be shook. Dont waste your time please. In the amount of time of this whole page instead of arguing amongst believers how many souls. do u think could have bee. Saved? Guess some ppl just rather. Think they are right about everything. I pray your heart is softened. Later

  • Dominic

    No where in the bible does it say that pentecost was it for getting the holy spirit.i dont know what bible your reading. But sounds like theology to me. Like your making your own bible.your own word of God. I have heard this stuff before. Cant get tongues. Praying in tongues ceased along time ago. And all this man made stuff. Praying in tongues to the father uttering the things you dont have words for through the holy spirit to God is a weapon against the devil that he cant stop and is powerful praying. So he makes ppl like you think its evil so ppl dont use heavnly tongue prayer language. Ive never see where asking for the holy spirit ceased at pentecost or any of the spiritual gifts stopped. Its man made theology and its like pharisees stuff. No thx ill trust. God and his word. The devil doesnt scare me into not praying in tongues but ive had him try before. I know what God’s presence islike and its amazing and not evil. John g lake wasnt healing ppl with an evil spirit. Blasphemy. And why dont u look up joshua mills. He started laughing on the ground one day at a pentecost church. Now he plays the piano to worship Jesus and gold dust appears all over him. You can youtube they have taped him with the supernatural sign of Jesus. Remrmber revelations.i pray your hearts are softened .in YESHUA mighty name. Amen

  • irene stockley

    i read my bible today and there is only one holy spirit which i reciecved and it says theres load of things jesus did that can not be attained in the bible is there any one on here who has experienced this please talk to me and share what you experienced

  • irene stockley

    and i am born again

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    Dominic

    Can I ask how you got saved (can you explain in detail?) and have you ever been ‘slain in the spirit’?

  • Dominic,

    Why would you ask God for the Holy Spirit to be given to you when you had already received Him at your rebirth, provided of course that you are truly saved? Do you mind telling us how you were saved? Did you fall backward and lie on your back for some time? Did you speak in tongues?

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    Irene

    Can I ask how you got saved (can you explain in detail?) and have you ever been ‘slain in the spirit’?

  • Irene Stockley,

    You say you are born again. Do you mind telling us how you were born again?

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    Irene

    When you read your bible did you read this verse:

    1 John 4:1 Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try[test] the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world.

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    Dominic

    You asked previously “So your telling me there is an evil spirit that pretends to be the holy spirit .” The bible says yes

    Did you test this spirit that came over you?

    The bible says:

    1 John 4:1 Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try[test] the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world.

    >> I have heard this stuff before. Cant get tongues. Praying in tongues ceased along time ago. And all this man made stuff.

    The bible says:

    1 Corinthians 13:8 Charity never faileth: but whether there be prophecies, they shall fail; whether there be tongues, they shall cease; whether there be knowledge, it shall vanish away.

    This is not man made stuff Dominic, this is what GOD SAYS. And you don’t believe what He says.

    >> I know what God’s presence islike and its amazing and not evil.

    2 Corinthians 11:14-15 “No wonder, for even Satan disguises himself as an angel of light. Therefore it is not surprising if his servants also disguise themselves as servants of righteousness, whose end will be according to their deeds.”

    >> And why dont u look up joshua mills. He started laughing on the ground one day at a pentecost church. Now he plays the piano to worship Jesus and gold dust appears all over him.

    Please find me a verse that says the Holy Spirit causes you to laugh, also please find a verse that says the Holy Spirit makes gold dust fall on you? And what’s the point? A sign?

    The bible says:

    Matthew 16:4 A wicked and adulterous generation seeketh after a sign; and there shall no sign be given unto it, but the sign of the prophet Jonas. And he left them, and departed.

    God does not give signs and wonders to people, that’s Satan’s job. The only sign God gave you was the sign on Jona; death, burial and resurrection of Jesus Christ. Is that not enough for you? No, you want more signs and more signs. And Satan will give them to you.

  • irene stockley

    hi yes ive been saved for 23 years now a vey lovely spirit filled lady come and spoke to me about salvation and showed me scriptures on been saved repent of all your sins and i read a prayer of salvation and i asked the lord into my life as my personal lord and saviour

  • irene stockley

    please explain to me then acts 19 and acts 2 god gave the deciples power to go out and heal deliver and joelchaper 2 v 28 t0 29

  • irene stockley

    what about andrew wommack he talks on the baptism of the holy spirit and he goes by the word of god and explains as he talks so is he a false teacher to with this un holy spirit

  • Dominic

    Luke 21:25. And there shall be signs in the sun, and in the moon, and in the stars; and upon the earth distress of nations, with perplexity; the sea and the waves roaring;

    And I will shew wonders in heaven above, and signs in the earth beneath; blood, and fire, and vapour of smoke:Acts 2:19. Signs on the earth semicolon. I dont need signs i believe. But if there is a person covered in God’s. Glory with gold who are you to judge who God. Choose. Dont be jealous go check it out glory to God. The spirit i have is the holy spirit and it causes me to live holy. Jesus saved me by his grace. People are still healed today in the name of Jesus. Christ. Why are you so conservative and against God doing miracles. No man comes to God,thr holy spirit draws them. So this thing that you think is some other spirit is actually the holy spirit drAwing ppl to Jesus? Yes i can pray in tongues. Its a self edifying build up your faith special prayer language you can do alone. Dont tell me its not of God. It surely is. I spent months with him a few months ago didnt work just stayed home and seeked him daily. I was attacked by many demons during my born again process and didnt sleep much a month. The holy spirit was with me i felt his peace and love likeJesus hugging me yea i used to believe i instantly had the holy spirit when i confessed Jesus is lord. But when you seek him,it. You get so much an overflow. U think im going to cry out to him for three months and hes going to give me an evil spirit? Excuse me but you dont know my Jesus. He loves me and wouldnt do that. The rapture is about to happen anyday. I cant be arguing with bretheren when there is souls to be saved and ppl to witness to. I hope u take that advice too. Godbless. See you in heaven. Atleast try to save one soul today instead if arguing with me. I know what me and God have is real its an intimate relationship. Thats why i feel him so strongly. And its biblical to lay hands on ppl and heal them and cast demons out of ppl. It was a commandment from Jesus. He wasnt asking. He said go do it. Be blessed. Later

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    Dear Irene and Dominic

    To understand scripture properly you need to know this, you can’t just read a verse and take it at face value, there is a story behind every verse and when you understand the story you will understand what that verse means in context of the bible as a whole.

    Regarding Acts and Joel please read the following: Your Sons and Your Daughters Will Prophesy, But Not Yet…

    Regarding Speaking in Tongues please read the following: https://www.discerningtheworld.com/2010/07/18/speaking-in-tongues/
    and then read this brilliant article: When Did the Gift of Tongues Cease?

    Regarding prophecy please read: Are Prophets for Today or has Prophecy Ceased?

  • irene stockley

    [Deleted by DTW] Irene you are wasting my time. You are not even willing to ‘think’ further than your nose.

    The bible says IT IS THE APOSTLES and DISCIPLES that were commissioned by Jesus Christ in person who will have power – this power you speak of, that you think you have – were you commissioned by Jesus Christ himself in person? NO you were not. But you want this power never the less, the power you want is satanic and not from God – because the bible CLEARLY SAYS these things have ceased. The word of God says in, Mark 16:18 “They shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them; they shall lay hands on the sick, and they shall recover.” Why do false teachers always leave out this verse eh? Because it suits them.

    Are we saying miracles have ceased? no, because for healing you go directly to Jesus Christ in prayer to be healed, not some fake middle man who thinks he has the gift of healing, and you don’t need tongues because GOD CAN SPEAK English and every other language there is, and the gift of tongues in the bible was not a heavenly languge it was an earthly language and prophecy (foretelling the future has ceased because WE HAVE THE BIBLE that is COMPLETE REVELATION). And of course you can be delivered from demons, you go directly to Jesus Christ in prayer and repent of your sin and ask Him to remove the bondage from you.

    But you, Irene, you want to have POWER. That is what this is all about, and God did NOT give you the power (you think you have) you are having delusions of grandeur, and your so called gift of tongues is either made up yourself or demonic. So you have two choices, you either repent of your power hungriness or get swallowed up by more and more false teaching.]

  • Dominic

    [deleted by DTW – read comment below to Irene, it applies to you too]

  • Emmanuel Peter

    This is like 1 Tomothy 5:1-10,Having a form of godliness but denying the POWER thereof’ listen to what Jonathan, among the early commentators are saying. You simple perverts the Bible to achieve your real mission of destroying the work of the HOLY SPIRIT.

  • Emmanuel Peter,

    You have a wrong perception of what “power” means.

    For the preaching of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the power of God. (1 Corinthians 1:18)

    The power of God is not to go around and act like a demonic clown slaying people to the floor and supposedly healing them from every conceivable sickness. Neither is the power of God to speak in strange languages, to laugh or cry your head off, to bark or howl like a dog, or to have your body shaken uncontrollably by the devil and his demons. Do you call that POWER. If you do, it is time for you to turn to the cross of Jesus Christ, God’s real POWER, so that you may be saved.

  • irene stockley,

    How dare you speak ill of God and call Him a liar? He warned us not to believe every spirit and the take heed that no one deceives us. You are doing the exact opposite. I can assure you that anyone who believes the lies of the father of all lies, the devil is not living a holy life. I asked you to please tell us how you were saved and to this day you haven;t responded to my question. I suppose you would have asked John the Baptist, if he had been alive today on earth, “Why are you so conservative and against God doing miracles.” You see, John the Baptist never [performed a single miracle and yet God called him the greatest prophet of all time.”

    Tell me, do you believe there are counterfeit miracles. Do you believe Satan can perform miracles? If you don’t then you should tear the following passages from your Bible.

    Then if any man shall say unto you, Lo, here is Christ, or there; believe it not. For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect. (Matthew 24:23-24)

    For false Christs and false prophets shall rise, and shall shew signs and wonders, to seduce, if it were possible, even the elect. (Mark 13:22)

    For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way. And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming: Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders, And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved. (2 Thessalonians 2:7-10)

    What you and Dominic are doing is exactly what Jesus Christ warns us against in Matthew 24. You are saying “Look, here is the Holy Spirit, or there” whilst nit is not the Holy Spirit but another foul spirit of Satan.

    But I fear, lest by any means, as the serpent beguiled Eve through his subtilty, so your minds should be corrupted from the simplicity that is in Christ. For if he that cometh preacheth another Jesus, whom we have not preached, or if ye receive another spirit, which ye have not received, or another gospel, which ye have not accepted, ye might well bear with him. (2 Corinthians 11:3-4)

    You are deceived and the best thing for you to do is to go to Jesus Christ in prayer and plead with Him to forgive you and to deliver you from your deception.

  • irene stockley

    Roman Catholics believe in the crucifixion, burial, bodily resurrection and ascension of Jesus Christ. Does that make you a Roman Catholic?

  • dominic

    Remember when Jesus said. Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me, the works that I do shall he do also; and greater works than these shall he do; because I go unto my Father. Please stop giving satan all the credit for the amazing things God does. I get that your saying satan trys to mimic God. But your basically saying its all satan. Jesus gets no glory. And that upsets me . As it should. Stop giving lucifer so much credit. Yes there are false prophets. But not every prophet is false. Geez unharden ur heart. U know its ok to be wrong once in a while. I am wondering. If you have the fear of the lord in you which is the beginning of true wisdom. When you talk down to people i really wonder. Bye

  • dominic wrote:

    Remember when Jesus said. Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me, the works that I do shall he do also; and greater works than these shall he do; because I go unto my Father. Please stop giving satan all the credit for the amazing things God does. I get that your saying satan trys to mimic God. But your basically saying its all satan. Jesus gets no glory. And that upsets me . As it should. Stop giving lucifer so much credit. Yes there are false prophets. But not every prophet is false. Geez unharden ur heart. U know its ok to be wrong once in a while. I am wondering. If you have the fear of the lord in you which is the beginning of true wisdom. When you talk down to people i really wonder. Bye

    What are the greater works to which Jesus referred? He healed the sick, gave sight to the blind, healed the deaf and dumb, exorcised demons and raised the dead. Have you ever raised a corpse from the dead? You have? Don’t be too excited about it because if you had, you would only have been doing the same works as Jesus and nothing greater. For instance, his disciples never fed 5000 people with five loaves of bread and two fishes, did they? Have you ever fed 5000 people with as little as that? You have? Well, don’t get too excited about it because if you had, you will only have been doing the very same and not a greater work than Jesus. However, in one single sermon, Peter led 3000 lost souls to Jesus. Why? because Jesus had gone to the Father and sent the Holy Spirit (not an unholy spirit). Show me a single instance in the Bible where 3000 or more sinners were saved when Jesus preached to sinners? So, hopefully you can see that the winning of souls to Jesus is much greater than the works He had done when He was still on earth.

    You say “stop giving Lucifer so much credit.” I am afraid that you are the one who is giving Satan credit because you are attributing to God that does not come from Him.

    Woe unto them that call evil good, and good evil; that put darkness for light, and light for darkness; that put bitter for sweet, and sweet for bitter! (Isaaiah 5:20)

    And please note carefully. The above passage is not talking down to people. It is a very serious warning because you are treading on very dangerous ground when you attribute something to God that does not come from Him but indeed from Satan. IN fact, you are disobeying Him because you are not testing the spirits as He says you must.

  • dominic

    Again your saying. Everything is from satan. And giving God. No credit just like i said. Stop beating around the bush. What has the holy spirit done through ppl? You just say not of it is from him and its all from satan. So God. Has done nothing lately only satan? You are the one treading on dangerous ground. Not to mention like almost everyone on this site is self righteous. Have fun explaining all this to God on judgement day. Ill keep going forward to work in the gifts of the spirit as paul and Jesus talked about. You can remain religious ,lukewarm,do nothing and say its all satan. And not save lost souls because you would rather argue with bretheren. I get so tired of self righteous ppl. Im probably doing more on my path,but i dont care ir boast AND YOU DO NOTHING SAVE NO SOULS AND COME WITH YOUR INFALLIBLE”””” DOCTRINE BLAH BLAH. I DONT CARE. ill keep seeking Jesus. And getting the most from this life. O we have to delete the comment theres caps lock, this doesnt agree with my theology i have to. delete it. Theres a reason ppl are different in the body of Christ not everyone thinks like you. Has your same gifts and has to do everything like you. This is why we have a dead church laidecean of the revelations book right now because everyone wants to be politically correct. so to speak. Wake up and step out in faith. Not everything. Is what u think the holy spirit guides us to do more than what the. bible says. We follow his word and the holy spirit aligned with his word. Urgh. Conversation over. Why dont you go spread the gospel And save a soul today because your not helping anyone here you are puting them back into religous bondage. Again.be blessed. Goodbye!

  • dominic wrote,

    Again your saying. Everything is from satan.

    None of us on this site ever said or even suggested that everything is of Satan. You are lying (John 8:44). We are trying to encourage you to test the spirits but you don’t seem to want to obey Jesus Christ. So please take your poison somewhere else and don’t comment here again. The following applies,

    For of this sort are they which creep into houses, and lead captive silly women laden with sins, led away with divers lusts, Ever learning, and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth. (2 Ti 3:6-7)

  • dominic

    Your a peice….of…..f*****……s**t. ok? [Edited by DTW]

    Luke 11:13.If ye then, being evil, know how to give good gifts unto your children: how much more shall your heavenly Father give the Holy Spirit to them that ask him? Jesus said that!!!!!!!!!!!!

    James 4:2-3. 2 You want what you don’t have, so you scheme and kill to get it. You are jealous of what others have, but you can’t get it, so you fight and wage war to take it away from them. Yet you don’t have what you want because you don’t ask God for it. 3 And even when you ask, you don’t get it because your motives are all wrong—you want only what will give you pleasure.

    Hebrews 12:29
    For our God is a consuming fire.

    Deuteronomy 4:24
    For the LORD thy God is a consuming fire, even a jealous God.
    Genesis 21:6
    And Sarah said, God hath made me to laugh, so that all that hear will laugh with me.

    2 Timothy 1:7
    For God hath not given us the spirit of fear; but of power, and of love, and of a sound mind.

  • Kevin

    Dear Discerning the World

    I have some questions on this topic maybe you could assist me with

    If someone has had a full kundalini awakening/rising and achieved this false enlightenment could they still come to know Christ and reverse the effects or is it a sealed deal and they are unforgivable (maybe a mark of the beast type thing)?

    Do you know anyone who has personally experienced the full kundalini and experienced the baptism of this false light?

    Thank you in advance for any insight God bless

  • goku

    6He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned. 17And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues; 18They shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them; they shall lay hands on the sick, and they shall recover. Jesus said that ok?? He that believes. Them that believe. That is us. Try reading the bible. Stop false teaching

  • Hi Kevin,

    Have you read Dave Hunt ‘s book “Death of a Guru The Personal Testimony of Rabi Maharaj.” It answers your question.

  • goku,

    Do you believe that the devil is capable of healing the sick, make people speak in tongues, take up serpents without being bitten?

    For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way. And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming: Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders, And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved. And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie: That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness.
    (2 Th 2:7-12)

    But he answered and said unto them, An evil and adulterous generation seeketh after a sign; and there shall no sign be given to it, but the sign of the prophet Jonas:
    (Mat 12:39)

    Indeed, God works miracles and so does Satan and that is why we must discern between the true and the false. The things they call miracles in most churches today is of the devil and not of God.

    Woe unto them that call evil good, and good evil; that put darkness for light, and light for darkness; that put bitter for sweet, and sweet for bitter!
    (Isa 5:20)

  • Kevin

    Thank you for the reply. I have not read it but I will look into it.

    Another question, if one obtained this satanic ‘godhood’ could they still come to know Christ and be forgiven or would they be eternally damned? I don’t know if this is the same thing but I am curious.

    Thanks for any help and thank you for the resources of this website God bless

  • Kevin,

    In Eastern mysticism it is not about obtaining or attaining godhood, it is about becoming aware that you are already a god. Awareness or enlightenment as it is also called, comes through the practice of Yoga, meditation, silence, solitude, contemplative spirituality etc. The WOF movement teaches the very same heresy. Although they do not practice the things I mentioned, they do something similar called slain-in-the-spirit. Benny Hinn says “I am a little Messiah.” Maurice Cerullo said, “You are not looking at Maurice Cerullo, you are looking at Jesus.” You may ask, “How does Eastern mystic practices, slain-in-the-spirit and hypnotism tie in with one another?” The Bible warns us to be sober-minded (1 Peter 5:8), always alert and never to surrender our own control over our mind. Sir John Eccles, a Nobel Prize laureate, once said, “The brain is a machine a ghost can operate” meaning that the brain itself is not the thing that makes us think. Our spirit and soul do the thinking. The brain is merely the instrument which enables us to act upon our innermost thoughts (in the spirit and soul) and to manifest it in the physical realm. That’s why the Bible says, “For as he thinketh in his heart, so is he: (Proverbs 23:7a). We are what we think. Christians are exhorted to think on the things which are above in heaven (Philippians 4:8). For Satan to make you think or become aware that you are a god, He must take control of your mind so that he and his demons can transmit their lies and doctrines into your mind (soul). (1 Tim 4:1). This is precisely where eastern mystical practices like Yoga, contemplative prayer, the WOF slain-in-the-spirt and hypnotism come in. Whoever participates in these things or allows others to manipulate their mind, lose control of their mind and open themselves to the influence of demons. And what do they say? “You are a god.” This is the same old lie Satan imprinted on Eve’s mind in the Garden of Eden – “And the serpent said unto the woman, Ye shall not surely die: For God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil.” (Gen 3:4-5).

    Now, to answer your question. ” if one obtained this satanic ‘godhood’ could they still come to know Christ and be forgiven or would they be eternally damned?” The short answer is “unless they repent and believe the Gospel (Mark 1:15) they will be damned. It is very interesting to note that the word “repent” is metanoia” which in Greek means to begin to think differently about yourself with an intent to change. Remember Proverbs 23:7a? Your thoughts which had been poisoned by Satan and his demons must do a 180 degree about turn. You must begin to think differently about God and yourself. The adage that you can only truly know yourself when you begin to know God is true (John 17 :3). It is in his light that we see the light. Sadly, most people prefer to remain in darkness (John 3:19). How do people who had been duped by Satan to believe they are gods have their minds changed so that they may be saved? Here is the answer:

    So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God. (Rom 10:17)

    And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free. (Joh 8:32)

    Hope that answers you question.

  • Kevin

    Okay thank you for the reply. This happened to me from taking psychoactive drugs and going into a trance state. I saw lots of light and infinity signs and felt an eternal state and thought I was a god. I want to change but I keep getting intrusive thoughts of old ways of thinking. I feel like I can’t stop it. Even when I read the bible I get intrusive blasphemous thoughts. Also I’m in a constant slight altered state all the time since that happened. Could this be the mark of the beast

  • Kevin

    Adding onto my previous comment, did this change my DNA as alchemists suggest? Making me no longer covered by the blood of Jesus? I appreciate any insight thank you

  • Kevin wrote,

    Adding onto my previous comment, did this change my DNA as alchemists suggest? Making me no longer covered by the blood of Jesus? I appreciate any insight thank you

    Your questions seem to suggest that you don’t know what it means to be saved. Are you? Paul says,

    Examine yourselves, whether ye be in the faith; prove your own selves. (2 Co 13:5)

    If you were truly saved you would not believe the rubbish that alchemists can change your DNA.

    Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new. (2 Co 5:17)

    The new man in Christ has the mind of Christ (1 Cor 2:16) and therefore thinks like Christ. His mind is renewed and will not believe strange things.

    Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that entereth not by the door into the sheepfold, but climbeth up some other way, the same is a thief and a robber. But he that entereth in by the door is the shepherd of the sheep. To him the porter openeth; and the sheep hear his voice: and he calleth his own sheep by name, and leadeth them out. And when he putteth forth his own sheep, he goeth before them, and the sheep follow him: for they know his voice. And a stranger will they not follow, but will flee from him: for they know not the voice of strangers. (John 10:1-5)

    If you listen to and follow the voice of strangers, you are not saved. Period!

  • Deborah (discerning the world)

    Dear Kevin

    Please read the article on salvation and deliverance. You need salvation my dear friend and deliverance by Jesus Christ.

    Here is the link: https://www.discerningtheworld.com/seeking-deliverance/

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    Hi Kevin

    >> If someone has had a full kundalini awakening/rising and achieved this false enlightenment could they still come to know Christ and reverse the effects or is it a sealed deal and they are unforgivable (maybe a mark of the beast type thing)?

    Satan actually has no hold over you, he lies and tells you that if you join him you are permanently his, this is a lie out of the pit of hell. If you decide that you want to follow Jesus Christ from now on till forever and you want to make Jesus Christ your Lord and Saviour and you believe with all your heart that Jesus Christ died on the cross for your sin, was buried and rose again and is seated at the right hand of our Heavenly Father then you will be saved and no more will Satan have a hold over you.

    >> Do you know anyone who has personally experienced the full kundalini and experienced the baptism of this false light?

    Yes, I do some people on this website have emailed me and told me their story and how Jesus Christ saved them. I also have a personal experience of being in the occult for many many years and Jesus Christ saved me and I was delivered from ALL satanic bondage in my life.

    Kevin, if you want out, do not procrastinate and call on Jesus Christ to save you. Jesus Christ is your only way out.

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    Kevin

    >> Another question, if one obtained this satanic ‘godhood’ could they still come to know Christ and be forgiven or would they be eternally damned? I don’t know if this is the same thing but I am curious.

    Again, you will be saved if you call out to Jesus Christ for salvation and repent of all your sin and Jesus Christ WILL forgive you immediately. As Tom mentioned, genuine repentance comes with a ‘changing of one’s ways’. You WILL WANT to change your ways and you will ask Jesus Christ to help you change your ways.

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    Kevin

    >> Could this be the mark of the beast

    Nope, the mark of the beast is something that takes place during the Tribulation period that last for 7 years. The antiChrist establishes this mark that people have to take and you wont be able to buy or sell without it.

    >> Even when I read the bible I get intrusive blasphemous thoughts.

    Kevin I think you need to be saved and delivered from all this demonic affliction. I have given you the link, but here is it again… https://www.discerningtheworld.com/seeking-deliverance/ it’s all up to you Kevin to make the first move. If you love Jesus Christ with all your heart and the Holy Spirit is showing you the truth as to the false teaching you have been caught up in, then you can and will be set free if you call out to Jesus Christ to be saved.

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    Kevin

    >> Adding onto my previous comment, did this change my DNA as alchemists suggest? Making me no longer covered by the blood of Jesus?

    No your DNA can not change – again that is a satanic lie. You must realise that all Satan can do it lie, so everything that is occult is a lie.

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    dominic

    You said:

    Your a peice….of…..f*****……s**t. ok? [Edited by DTW]

    Luke 11:13.If ye then, being evil, know how to give good gifts unto your children: how much more shall your heavenly Father give the Holy Spirit to them that ask him? Jesus said that!!!!!!!!!!!!

    James 4:2-3. 2 You want what you don’t have, so you scheme and kill to get it. You are jealous of what others have, but you can’t get it, so you fight and wage war to take it away from them. Yet you don’t have what you want because you don’t ask God for it. 3 And even when you ask, you don’t get it because your motives are all wrong—you want only what will give you pleasure.

    Hebrews 12:29
    For our God is a consuming fire.

    Deuteronomy 4:24
    For the LORD thy God is a consuming fire, even a jealous God.
    Genesis 21:6
    And Sarah said, God hath made me to laugh, so that all that hear will laugh with me.

    2 Timothy 1:7
    For God hath not given us the spirit of fear; but of power, and of love, and of a sound mind.

    Yes we can clearly see through your language what vile spirit lies in your heart. You swear at us in the most foul language and quote scripture at the same time. That sounds exactly like something Satan would do. I hope when people read your comment they will see that this ‘fire, kundilini, false holy spirit’ is nothing but pure evil.

    Matthew 15:10-11 “10And he called the multitude, and said unto them, Hear, and understand: 11Not that which goeth into the mouth defileth a man; but that which cometh out of the mouth, this defileth a man.”

    Luke 6:45 “A good man out of the good treasure of his heart bringeth forth that which is good; and an evil man out of the evil treasure of his heart bringeth forth that which is evil: for of the abundance of the heart his mouth speaketh.”

  • irene stockley

    hi deb have you been saved and what was you taught what church do you attend and what version bile do you read

  • Kevin

    Thank you for taking the time to reply to me Deborah. It means a lot and I will do as it says on the link posted when I get home from work. My central nervous system just feels super sensitive (I get tingles when I walk into the sun or hear certain noises or anything sometimes even when I pray I get tingles on my head) and my heart feels stonish/hard and empty it feels I have no soul. If someone happened to make fun of the trinity including the Holy Spirit before they believed would that be an unforgivable sin?

  • Josh

    Your site just causes division and is clearly an attempt to paint over a bad experience you must of had. May God have mercy on you.

  • Josh wrote,

    Your site just causes division and is clearly an attempt to paint over a bad experience you must of had. May God have mercy on you.

    I really think you should start to read your Bible.

    For first of all, when ye come together in the church, I hear that there be divisions among you; and I partly believe it. For there must be also heresies among you, that they which are approved may be made manifest among you. (1 Co 11:18-19)

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    irene

    Please read this website for all info you require, this is if you want to know the gospel truth. Telling you that I read the KJV and NKJV is not going to make any difference in your relationship with God.

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    Kevin

    The unforgivable sin is not making fun of the trinity of Holy Spirit, this is another lie the church like to burden their congregation with. The unforgivable sin was those who witnessed Jesus Christ (in the bible) perform wondrous miracles and they rejected Him and cursed His name after he gave them a sign that He was the Son of God – that was the unforgivable sin in the bible.

  • irene stockley

    i do know the gospel truth its you who dosent i think you are blinded to the truth you frae what might happen if you experience more of what the holy spirit wants to give you i dont want power its the holy spirit that gives the power to go out and witness to the world to see people been saved and sharing the love encouraged otheres in there walk with jesus which you dont talk about all you have done is criticesed people on here i think you need to read your bible and ask jesus if what otheres are saying about the baptism of the holy spirit is truth and weather its for all belivers and stop judging others walk with god ephesians 3 verses 14 to 19 this is a few verses god spoke to me romans 16 verses 17 to 20 thats from the living bible and thats exactly what you are doing this was given to me when i was a very young christian i will be praying for you your sister in christ

  • irene stockley

    Do you believe it is possible to be deceived, to believe that you have received the Holy Spirit when it is not the true Holy Spirit but another spirit or that you follow Jesus Christ when it is another Jesus? For instance, were you slain in the spirit? I can’t remember whether I asked you this before but please answer me? Did someone lay hands on you and did you fall backward to be slain in the spirit? I sincerely hope you hadn’t been slain because Romans 16:17-20 was written for those who have never been slain in the spirit to warn them against those who had been slain. If you had been slain, then you did not receive the Holy Spirit but another spirit who fills you with “fire” – the fire of hell.

  • irene stockley

    no i havent been slain of in the spirit ut i know plenty of true christians who have and second there is no other jesus and thirdly those verses in romans 16 verses 17 to 20 are talking about false teachers not been slain in the spirit i has them verses underlined in my bible years ago and its false teachers like you who are decieving people i read the living bible which is so explanitary a bible my first pastor recomend i use so im sorry but you cant judge me god will do the judging when he returns again to earth why do you think you have it right and eery one has it wrong your speaking froms mans point of view not gods

  • Kevin

    So the unforgivable sin is not thinking Jesus is evil either? I just don’t know see why they would put it in the bible or warn people of it if we couldn’t commit it in this day and age

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    Kevin

    I’ll find another source of info for you so you can see:

    In Matthew 12:31-32, Jesus says to the Pharisees,
    31Wherefore I say unto you, All manner of sin and blasphemy shall be forgiven unto men: but the blasphemy against the Holy Ghost shall not be forgiven unto men. 32And whosoever speaketh a word against the Son of man, it shall be forgiven him: but whosoever speaketh against the Holy Ghost, it shall not be forgiven him, neither in this world, neither in the world to come.

    What is the context of these statements, and what is the exact sin described?

    The Pharisees had long observed the sinless Jesus Christ. They observed him doing undeniable and powerful miracles that were, at the very least, clear evidence of power supplied by God. These impressive miracles were freely given in pure kindness and love to release people from obvious suffering and the oppression of horrible evil.

    However, the Pharisees had so firmly set their hearts against accepting Jesus as the Messiah that they rejected the obvious truth before them and perversely twisted it to influence the crowds. They publicly credited the most ultimately evil being in the universe with these precious, godly miracles. In other words, they called the precious and holy Spirit of God, the unclean spirit of Satan. In effect, they charged Jesus Christ with sorcery; one who is in league with Satan. These charges are not only appalling and extremely serious, but clearly absurd. http://christiananswers.net/q-eden/unpardonablesin.html

    So the unforgivable sin is rejecting Jesus Christ to such a degree that in that person’s heart there is no return and never will they accept Jesus Christ. The Pharisee’s were like that, totally stone cold evil.

    Kevin you are not stone cold evil (are you?), you are seeking Jesus Christ from what I can gather and want to be released from the evil that has you in it’s grip? The very fact that you are worried you have committed the unforgivable sin shows that you have not :) The Apostle Paul was a murderer, hated Christianity and Jesus Christ and he turned out to be the greatest preacher of all time and wrote most of the New Testament that was inspired by the Holy Spirit.

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    irene

    >> no i havent been slain of in the spirit

    – have you had hands laid on you?
    – have you been baptised in the Holy Spirit – is this the time you started to speak in tongues?
    – do you meditate?
    – have you been in a church where the pastor ‘throws fire’ and you willingly put your hands up to receive it?

    >> i read the living bible which is so explanitary a bible

    Why do you need an explanatory bible? When the bible says that it’s the Holy Spirit that will teach you and guide you into all truth. Now you read the explanations of some other person and have been indoctrinated by them.

    John 14:26 But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.

  • Maryann

    I have heard more than one preacher say the unforgivable sin is dying without having received Jesus as your Lord and Savior because after death there is no second chance. On another subject. Have you heard some people saying those that reject Jesus will not spend eternity in Hell but after awhile they will cease to exist. I do not believe this is true.

  • Maryann,

    “Man was made in the image of God” means that he is an eternal being. You are quite right. No one is going to cease to exist after death. Indeed, an eternity in hell is called “eternal death” but it will be a spiritual death in the sense that they will be completely cut off from the Living water (the Holy Spirit who gives life) for an eternity. I don’t believe hell fire will be a literal fire as we know it. It will be a “fire” that is far worse than normal fire (Matthew 3:11, 16). It will be an eternal thirst after the Holy Spirit that will never be satisfied. When the rich man in hell said, “Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus, that he may dip the tip of his finger in water, and cool my tongue; for I am tormented in this flame” (Luke 16:24), it could not have been for H2O he asked for because H2O cannot possibly quench the thirst of a spirit. A spirit does not have a tongue and neither can fire devour it. This kind of fire, as I said, will be far worse than a physical fire. It will be like the gnawing and gnawing and gnawing of worms that never die (Mark 9:44, 46 and 48).

    When the Pharisees committed the unpardonable sin by attributing to the Holy Spirit the works of the devil, they were still alive, not dead. Anyone who says the Holy Spirit is of the devil cannot be convicted of sin, righteousness and judgment in order to be saved. How can someone be convicted of their sin when they stubbornly and persistently believe that the Holy Spirit’s conviction is of the devil? That’s impossible. Let’s dramatize it a little. The Holy Spirit comes to someone and says, “You are lost and need to be saved by Jesus Christ” and the person says, “I can’t be lost because I am already righteous. You cannot be the Holy Spirit because He will never tell me I am lost. Therefore, you must be of the devil.” A person who persistently has this attitude toward the Holy Spirit until his/her death cannot be saved. People who commit the unpardonable sin do so during their life on earth. Jesus performed miracles in the power of the Holy Spirit to convince the Jews that He is their Messiah who had come to save them. The Pharisees who believed they were already righteous by keeping the Law, did not believe Him and stubbornly attributed his miracles (which He performed to prove that He was of God and indeed God incarnate) to the devil. How can the HG convict someone when they believe He is the devil? Impossible!

  • Mike Evans

    Hard on the heels of Rodney Howard Browne’s comeback in Washington DC (and his ensuing “awakening” meetings around the world, inc an upcoming one in Australia) is a “Catch the Fire” conference in Toronto in the same ‘church’ which hosted the ‘Toronto Curse–oops–Blessing’. Speakers include the Arnotts, Kenneth Copeland, Reinhard Bonnke, and Marcus Lamb. This link takes you to the website of the Arnott’s church/ministry (now called Catch the Fire, formerly the Toronto Airport Christian Fellowship). Notice how often ‘fire’ is mentioned in the promotional blurbs about the speakers/worship leaders at this (Kundalini)conference.
    http://ctfconference.com/ctf-2015-toronto
    Also this year a meeting took place in Jerusalem (Empowered21) involving NAR heavies Bill Johnson and Cindy Jacobs, Copeland and the head of the AOG in the States as an expected “new Pentecost” is being prepared for.

    I think the big (false) outpouring prophesied by many could be about to hit. If so, I predict a demonic tsunami of overwhelming proportions which may make Pensecola, Lakeland and the earlier Toronto debacles look like “trailers” in comparison to the “main feature”. To quote from an article title on this site: RUN FOR YOUR LIVES!

  • Thanks Mike for the info,

    I wrote the following comment on their YouTube video.

    Yeah! Want to know how these charlatans and false teachers catch the fire? Well, on their registration page they say “HE [GOD] WANTS US TO WANT MORE.” They have deliberately left out two words ‘”YOUR MONEY.” So what they’re actually saying is “GOD WANTS US TO WANT MORE OF YOUR MONEY.”

  • Joe

    Mike it is very interesting that they have called themselves ‘Empowered21’. In DTW’s recent article on the events happening in September you will notice the following;

    25 Sept 2015 – Pope Francis goes to UN and addresses the UN General Assembly of Word Leaders and Sustainable Development – Unification of the worlds laws.

    The particular name for the UN’s action plan of ‘Sustainable Development’ to which the the Pope will be speaking on at the UN General Assembly on the 25th September is ‘Agenda 21’.

    Cincidence? Empowered 21 and Agenda 21?

  • Mike Evans

    You’re welcome Tom. Your comment on YouTube is astute.
    The meetings are being put up on YouTube. Here’s a link to one:

    After the (so-called) worship muzak finishes, the same kundalini manifestations begin, especially through Carol Arnott. Bill Johnson is spoken of and there are some testimonies which fully display how totally deceived these people are. One British woman speaks of a ‘healing’ after great heat went through her body. A man in some kind of ministry compares a touch from the ‘Holy Spirit'(via Benny Hinn) to a telegraph pole being slammed into his stomach. It is both horrifying and fascinating to see where this farrago of Gnostic Christianity will ultimately lead to. It has never gone away and it appears to be making a very public comeback, uniting many heretical groups and ministries together.
    Hi Joe. Yes, very interesting. I think ’21’ stands for ’21st Century’, a century which appears to be marked by great apostasy and the fulfillment of last days prophecies.

  • MD

    Where in the bible does it say “just accept the Lord as your personal Savior and you are saved?” Where does it mention the word “trinity?” How about “God the Son” or “God the Holy Spirit,” I only find “God the Father” and “I and my Father are One”and that “the Lord your God is ONE”…not 3 and how can 3 persons be 1? God is a Spirit, not a person. God wrapped Himself in flesh to become humanlike so there could be the ultimate sacrifice when Christ died at calvary on the cross. Spirits have no blood and blood was a requirement for remission of sins. The bible says to work out your own salvation with fear and trembling. I pray you seek the answers to my questions and I pray the Lord leads and guides you into all truths. Please Search the Scriptures, they are your lifeline. I agree about reading the book of Acts closely and see how the first church did things, they modeled Jesus and we should do the same. Peter said in Acts 2:38 to repent, be baptized in Jesus name, and you shall receive the Holy Ghost. That was the great commission fulfillment as it was preformed by Peter. If it was not meant to be that way, then why didnt Jesus’ mother Mary tell Peter different, she was right there in the upper room? It was meant to be in Jesus’ name for baptism, it was His blood that was shed. The NAME (SINGULAR) of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit is JESUS. There is no other name to be saved by. Thank you.

  • MD

    Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble. (James 2:19)

    You should also tremble for believing the lies you proclaim.

  • J.D.

    I live in a small town in west Texas. The teachings of the NAR and WoF movement are just now making there way here. I left my church of over 20 year due to unbiblical practices that were taking place there. While talking to those who are following these teaching I have noticed something. They always refer to The Holy Spirit as just Holy Spirit. They would say things in this manner,”Just seek Holy Spirit for guidance” Does anyone know why they leave out the “The” I guess its not a huge issue but it bothers me.

  • sean

    Why is the Catholic Church part of the spirit of fire ?

    I was baptized into the Catholic church but unfortunately stopped going to mass when I was a child. As a result of not going to mass and not studying God’s word I allowed myself to be deceived by reiki and then other spiritual practices which unfortunately led to me experiencing kundalini. Through a prayer to God he lifted me out of the deception. It was only when I went back to Catholic church and renewed by baptism that things improved. I then went for confession and have said prayers of deliverance and also had other Catholics and a few priests pray for me. It is from them prayers and confessions that the kundalini stopped. There was still the odd lingering effect but with each month, the prayers have quelled it more and more and have freed me from so much. So it is the Catholic church which has freed me from the kundalini and demonic bonds which were influencing me. I now go to weekly mass and pray to God daily.

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    Dear Sean

    Here you have one false religion that being the Roman Catholic church that helped rid you of your other false Eastern religion which manifests itself as a kundlini manifestation. This is very interesting. Dear Sean the Roman Catholic church is actually Babylonianism as spoken of in the bible. The Jesus that hangs on the cross in the RCC is the Babylonian God Tammuz or the Egyptian God Horus, it’s not Jesus Christ the Son of God from the bible and the 25th December celebrated as Christmas day is not Jesus Christ’s birthday, but it is the birth of the Sun God (Nimrod or Mithra), this is the God of the Roman Catholic Church. Please see: F i r e & A s h e s—I r o n & C l a y Please go do research on who Jesus is actually in the RCC and who Mary is actually in the RCC. Also ask yourself why the RCC has statues that are venerated when the bible’s 10 commandments say that you should not make idols or images and worship them.

    Leviticus 26:1
    You shall make no idols nor graven images, neither raise you up a standing image, neither shall you set up any image of stone in your land, to bow down unto it: for I am the LORD your God.

  • Laura

    I had a person to pray(over the phone) for my healing and say a bunch weird things about not “claiming” the illness for myself(I thought that didn’t sound Biblical but I humored him ) He said that he “felt” things moving in the area.Do you feel a “warmth” in the area now? I said that I didn’t the “warmth” After saying I felt no pain that satisfied him(I wanted this ordeal to be over).I am so glad I didn’t feel the “warmth” after reading this.I’d rather be sick and serve God than have some kind of deceitful healing.

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    Dear Laura

    >> I’d rather be sick and serve God than have some kind of deceitful healing.

    Amen to that!

  • RJ

    Laura & Deborah ~ thanks for this important quote about preferring sickness in this life and serving God with what we can rather than receiving a deceitful healing. I wanted you to know this greatly impacted me, I went to bed thinking about it. So never belittle even taking time to write something on a site, as it can have a big impact.

    Something I’ve been wrestling with for the past several months and I appreciate your Biblical discernment. I’ve gone the route of medical doctors & after all the horrendous side effects from their prescribed drugs all but ruined my life (leaving me to the point of not being able to function very well), then I turned to alternative ways of healing. Now don’t let that word, “alternative” scare you as I don’t mean acupuncture or yoga (no way) or anything of the sort… sometimes alternative can mean simply getting away from medicine and eating the best foods you can afford. Enjoying the sunshine, resting, and praying for the Lord’s blessings to heal you if it be His will. {No, WOF people, it is not ALWAYS God’s will! The Apostle Paul had a PHYSICAL ailment…)

    At any rate, my question is would you accept medicine or healing if you KNEW the people providing it were FAKE Christians?? How would you feel about that?

    And what I’ve wrestled with is how is this any different than when a regular M.D. prescribes something … as for all we know, the prescription has been prayed over by wiccans or atheists or simply some money-grubbing “business men” who care little about how it’s going to negatively affect our bodies?

    ? ~ ? ~ ?

    I will seriously give careful thought to your answers as like I say I’ve struggled with this for the past several months.

    Thank you

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    Dear RJ

    I too am very ill, one illness started in 2008 and now I have 2 autoimmune diseases to top it off that started last year. The one autoimmune disease is so rare hardly anyone has heard of it. Drs look at me dumbfounded and tell me they don’t know what to do. So I prayed. Because Jesus is the the best Dr you can find. And through prayer I landed up at one of the best Rheumatologists in South Africa who was the one who diagnosed me correctly and she has given me medication. It’s awful medicine and makes me very sick but it’s all I have to take for now – a dear friend recently showed me another medicine that apparently works well with what I have, and I will show my Dr this soon and see what she has to say.

    Now we all know that medication is made at pharmaceutical companies who are occult run. So what do I do before I take my meds, (the same thing I do before I eat, I pray) I pray and ask Jesus to bless my medicine and remove any occult techniques/prayers used over the medicine from the pharmaceutical companies and then I hand my medication over to Jesus and ask Him to help make the medication work for me. And if it’s the wrong meds He needs to get me on the correct meds. Now I too have gone very healthy living, lots a veg, fresh fruit with good vitamins in, no fat, cooking with a little bit coconut oil instead of sunflower seed oil etc.

    And then to top it off you can ask Him to heal you if IT IS HIS WILL to heal you, and He will heal you in His appointed time, but for sure it’s in His will to look after you right up to you last breath and that I hold him too :) also and this is something I think about a lot – the bible reminds us that God can bring about good from any situation. (Romans 8:28)

    >> At any rate, my question is would you accept medicine or healing if you KNEW the people providing it were FAKE Christians?? How would you feel about that?

    Are you talking about them laying hands on you? You get Drs that are fake Christians and hand out meds like unsaved Drs who hand out meds – their qualifications are the same so I would take it and pray over it. I would not take ‘healing’ from anyone.

  • RJ

    Thank you, Deborah! And during the time we have remaining here on earth, I can pray for you, too. BTW, have you looked into the possible connection between gluten & rheumatoid arthritis? Years ago, that was truly something the Lord led me to ~~ as I would have been in a wheelchair for the past 20 years with R.A. had I not come to discover it was gluten that was giving me horrible, horrendous pain & killing me…. all praises & glory to the Lord for that.

    Oh NO WAY, I probably phrased that wrong as I was in a big hurry when I wrote it, but certainly not — I would never allow someone to “lay hands on me” for healing. (too “out there”, WOF’ish for me!)

    Though it is Biblically correct (James 5:4) to call for the elders of the church & for them to come, pray over the sick person & anoint him/her with oil.

    Again, thank you SO MUCH for your wisdom here! Really? Pharmaceutical companies are occult run? Well I wouldn’t be the least bit surprised the way they’re money grubbing, always trying to push everyone in the world to pop pills. Is that the same connotation of the word, “sorcery” in Revelation? Anyway, thank you again.

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    Hi RJ

    ROTFL @ “it was gluten that was giving me horrible, horrendous pain & killing me…. all praises & glory to the Lord for that.” Yes I can see why that came out the wrong way LOLOL.

    I’m gonna take this conversation offline and email you :)

  • mrnothing

    I don’t see how see how she can favor A.W. Tozer, or Christian and Missionary Alliance, when he believed in The Gifts as current and active, and even his own denomination considered him prophetic.I do not believe that Joyce Meyer, Todd Bentley, Benny Hinn, or Kenneth Copeland are saved, but “Masonic pre-trib white alien ufo Jesus witches”. God does NOT come into your stomach, but into your heart. Prophets are not witches. Witches are not prophets. She even calls Charles Spurgeon a “clairvoyant”. She is as nuts as Steven Anderson. They should battle each other, like prophets vs witches. This crappyblog is not preparing anybody for what is about to happen, other than helping SOME sucked into error. But don’t let bad experience create false doctrine, and listen to someone who is WRONGLY DIVIDING THE WORD OF TRUTH. I grew up around all these arguments. I used to be possessed with what she speaks of, in my stomach. Then, after being unpossessed, and shown the KJV Romans Road, and born from above by the REAL Holy Spirit, who lives in my heart, my life changed. Luke 24:32 is a literal reality. IT’s people like her that made me doubt my salvation and regeneration, after it had already happened, because I was so scared of being deceived again, that I was deceived again, into the pre-trib rapture and fireless life she is talking about. My life has been hell regarding this topic, like it did Christmas Evans. (url removed) —MY heart burns within me, and sometimes so do other parts, when I help others with deliverance or whatever. God used me to lead one of His sons to Himself through repentance and faith in Yahshua Messiah, and then cast out a demon that was making him think he was being abducted by “Aliens.” She is really of no use on the battlefront. She is making people doubt the REAL Holy Spirit, with false dispensational pre-trib doctrine learned second hand. The original pre-trib teachers were Masonic witches as well, and the original “charismatics.” It’s just like how the American media switched the conservatives from blue to red on the poll panels. That’s why satan set up the counterfeit. and cults. DUH! HELLO WAYNE! How blind are people? To deny the True. (url removed) Her exegesis is weak. Women are NOT to be exegeting Scripture, for they are more easily deceived. If she knew proper doctrine from The Puritans (John Bunyan, Christmas Evans, John Owen, Charles Spurgeon), she would see that John Macarthur is wrong. False doctrine that divides 1Cor 14, from 1 Cor 15 is straight from hell, and leads to powerless pre-trib rapture position, without weapons to stand against the Enemy in saucers preaching gay Islam during Great Tribulation. We are NOT called to “discern the world”, we are called to “discern the spirits”, which she cannot do very well, obviously. She is still following a false witchcraft doctrine. She could be a witch herself. How can we know? If all you see is the false, then do you really know what is true? Who is your focus? Yahshua Messiah, or “Jesus”?

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    Mrnothing

    Okaaaaayyyy then… O_O

    PS, stop spamming us with comments.

  • RJ

    ROTFL @ “it was gluten that was giving me horrible, horrendous pain & killing me…. all praises & glory to the Lord for that.” Yes I can see why that came out the wrong way LOLOL.

    oh my….. Deborah!! hahha!! Such a NUT I am!! Been a while since I’ve come back around — and didn’t even REALIZE till just now reading this — what exactly I had written!! LOL…. too funny!! At least the Lord knew my heart! (and thank you for understanding, too!)

    Note to self: might be wise to stop posting so early in the mornings when I still do not yet have the cobwebs outta’ my head! …… smile…..

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    Dear RJ

    I laughed out loud and giggled for the whole day, it was really funny :) Don’t worry Jesus does definitely know your heart :)

  • May

    I received the kundalini 10 years ago in a Pentecostal church. I can still speak it now. How do I remove it? Also can you please pray for healing of my bowel issues? Thanks.

  • Dear May

    You said “I received the kundalini 10 years ago in a Pentecostal church. I can still speak it now. How do I remove it? ”

    You need genuine salvation AND deliverance from this demonic entity. Please see here: https://www.discerningtheworld.com/seeking-deliverance/

    You said: “Also can you please pray for healing of my bowel issues? Thanks.”

    If it is God’s will He will heal you, if not pray that He looks after you. Everyone want’s healing but no one wants to rely on God during their time of illness.

  • Edward

    THIS MIGHT HELP SOME PEOPLE…

    Where to begin? When I was a young teen my family converted to Catholicism. It wasn’t too long after that I rejected Christ for intellectualism. In the same period I explored Buddhism. Immediately then I went on to EVERYTHING. This cocktail of religious and metaphysical conceptualizing led me to my Kundalini awakening. (No, it was not awakened in a church…)

    Yes, at the time I began referring to scriptures in the Bible. I swore this was the “true Holy Spirit” and began working through all the symptoms and such nonsense. Now, fortunately, I found a way out of this because I was clinging to pseudo-Hindu/Yogi groups. These people couldn’t quite figure out how to make it out of their Kundalini troubles (LOLOL)
    Yeah, well I started looking at symptoms of anxiety. The list is quite extensive. Anxiety symptoms and Kundalini are actually identical. Anxiety does cause electrical sensations.

    Hear this: REAL YOGIS (those who existed hundreds of years back) had a very different experience with Kundalini. This has been documented, compared by modern Yogic scholars. Why are your bodies getting hot and suffering from rashes!? You should simply feel a cold moisture and a moment of calm joy, not all the other baggage that modern westerners are being wrecked over. What’s going on?

    I’ll tell you what’s going on. The genuine spiritualists of the eastern paths (REAL Buddhism, Taoism, and Hinduism) have nothing in common with the modern Americanized versions. For instance, did you know that absolute celibacy was required for liberation of the soul? Even the Messiah Jesus Christ taught this (read Luke and Mark, about marriage). Also, you have to be ready and willing to forsake all family, friends, habits, and so forth in order to become a son/daughter of God. Why do modern Buddhists teach there is no God or God is irrelevant?

    Real tantra involved absolute denial of the sexual functions. Why do American teachers of Tantra have their students pay large sums of money to learn how to build up for a massive orgasm? You are not supposed to be having an orgasm to attain tantra but the opposite… NONE!

    Here’s another.

    Siddhartha Gautama (the Buddha) actually prophesied about Jesus Christ and told his adherents to abandon the path that he had established – that the man who would come into the world would bring you to the highest Heaven.

    Why are people not being told these things!? Hmm…

    Anyway, not to get out of touch with people who haven’t studied that kind of stuff. I hope the moderator here does post this. I have the following with which to consummate this:

    Jesus Christ (the one taught in the old basic Bible), yes, he was the Christ, the Messiah, the Lord, and the Savior. People come back to the stone that the builders rejected. HE is everything you need. He will teach you all truths. The Holy Spirit is real and is given to any who earnestly seek to purify their hearts and do God’s will. Humility is the key. But then comes continuous grace, love, self-control, and perseverance. God is not an overnight process but indeed a lifelong journey.

    And enough of the Gnostic doctrines. The people who wrote those were not the true Christians that those big bad Catholics persecuted. I’ve read every Gnostic manuscript. Most of the authors were kooks who implemented Greek mythologies and centering their self-authored religions on the rumored Jesus (who was far more than a mere rumor).

    In the New Testament, John and Paul both go into perplexing detail warning not so much the recipients of their letters of those devising the Gnostic doctrines (other Jesus Christs) but a caution for THIS generation. Is it not a coincidence that as John described them, “They started with us but were not for us. For if they were for us, they would’ve continued with us…” AND, “Many false teachers have entered the world, which is how we know we’re in the last days…”

    The latter mind you; John was not saying his time qualified for the last days. He was speaking through the Holy Spirit for those of the real last days. Ah ha. Just as Peter in Acts referenced Joel’s prophecy regarding the coming and terrible Day of the Lord.

    Peter wasn’t saying Joel’s prophecy was fulfilled (“I will pour out my spirit o your sons and daughters…”) NO. He said, “THIS is THAT which Joel was speaking of…” Sadly, many people assume Peter was saying it was the final days then and that Joel was fulfilled. No, he was saying the Holy Spirit was what Joel was talking about, THAT THING. But the day was at least 2,000 years off :)

    Sorry if this deviates quite a bit from the norm. lol

    But seriously people, ask for Jesus Christ to be your Lord. I’m not saying this in bigotry. If you’ve studied so many things and think yourself too intelligent for the simplicity of Jesus Christ, just try it. You will NEVER have to walk in darkness again.

    Jesus was not wrong about anything. Nobody sat down at a table and conjured up a method to brainwash the human race. Get rid of all that senselessness. It’s an aspect of the end times, Satan’s conspiratorial weapon. The people who recorded Christ’s authentic teachings were butchered for their testimony. Think what you want about churches. “The churches committed atrocities… look at all the wars…” yeah okay, people do bad things. What do they have to do with Christ?

    Are you perfect that you never slander people, steal, lust, lie, and hate? Ah, but a lot of people condemn Christians when they’re hypocritical without realizing their own errors.

    Jesus told his disciples his words would never pass away. They never did. He told his disciples that the Jews would be dispersed throughout the world and that many would die in a siege (The Romans laid siege to Jerusalem in 70 AD, killing one million Jews). He said Israel would become a nation again (the fig tree, the fulfilling of the times of the gentiles), which was fulfilled obviously. And he told his disciples the Gospel would/must be published among all the nations.

    Then the end comes. The generation that sees this will not pass away until ALL these things be fulfilled (regarding the end).

    I don’t know about you, but I don’t think Jesus can be wrong…
    “And it shall come to pass that whoever calls upon the name of the Lord in those days shall be saved.”

    Personally I’ve known a lot of people in the last few years who were religious and convinced. Now God has no place in their lives. Contrarily, people who wanted nothing to do with God, people you could never fathom coming to the cross and requesting Jesus be their King have done so.

    I actually think that we’re fulfilling Joel’s prophecy (the people of this timeline). Many who had a righteous life might fall. Many who seemed impossible for salvation will be standing with the Lord on Mount Zion.

    You know? lol. Anyway, God bless all, and I’m serious about Jesus. Try him.

  • Edward

    Sorry for the seconding, I felt this was important to add though.

    When I say you never have to walk in darkness again and that there’s continuous grace, love, and humility, I’m not saying it’s an easy path. Indeed, it’s the hardest one I’ve known.

    FAITH and the adversary (Satan)… Satan is, unfortunately, the prince of this world and the spirit of the air (until Christ’s Return). When you dive into Christ and seek to pray and grow closer to God, you’ll either be sincere or bargaining. If you’re sincerely seeking the Kingdom via the Narrow Gate, then you should notice sins falling away. You should notice that it’s gets hard quite often to do simple duties such as prayer.

    If you’re following a false doctrine such as one taught by the prosperity teachers, then you’re trying to use Jesus as a bargain. If you tithe, perhaps, then God will give you fortune. Jesus never promised money, ladies and gentlemen. Abandon any teacher preaching the opposite of that.

    The second you let in the slightest bit of darkness, great calamity can follow. It’s not easy being holy in this world. In fact, it’s impossible. No one is holy. You can only exert yourself for the Kingdom, thereby receiving tenfold what you sacrificed (at the Resurrection). So don’t think the Path is filled with marvel and goodness. It’s not. If it’s comfortable and pleasant then you’re probably just being complacent and are in spiritual stagnation.

    If you can keep falling by humbling your perceptions and beliefs (Paul called it the constant renewal of the mind), and then humble yourself some more, you have attained the straight and narrow!

    It has been said that once you accept Jesus you’ve been saved. But I say to conform to this world is damnation. The core of your being should be seeking to escape all these things. Of course I’m not hinting toward death wishing. The more you’re willing to discard for the Kingdom, the less comfortable you are with the deceptions, weariness, dissatisfaction, and sinfulness of this world, the more you’ll be pushed (or pulled?) toward Christ.

    In fact, if the Holy Spirit grows strong in you, you’ll probably become lonelier regarding the common mentalities around you. You’ll realize more and more the nature of humanity, the truth of things, the darkness and whatnot, and your sins will be exposed. But you won’t be dwelling forever on the darkness.

    Recall the Sermon on the Mount. Blessed are the poor in spirit. Blessed are merciful. Blessed are they who thirst for righteousness… This is interesting. When Jesus mentioned who was/is blessed, reversing the order reveals WHY they are are blessed. Thus, the poor in spirit are blessed. Yes, they have the Holy Spirit (God’s spirit). That’s why.

    The more someone emulates these virtues of Christ, the less of this world they are and the more of the Kingdom they are. If someone is void of mercy, meekness, contrition, a desire for righteousness, purity of heart, and nonconformity/persecution then that person is very much a child of the Devil and the love of the Father is not in him/her.

    Can you relate? I say blessed are all those who do love Jesus (as Jesus himself). Even wishing that Jesus was/is the Messiah shows you have the love of God in you.

  • You are promoting a works-based gospel which is false and damning.

    You wrote:

    It has been said that once you accept Jesus you’ve been saved. But I say to conform to this world is damnation.

    Paul is not speaking to unbelievers in Romans 12. He is speaking to believers some of whom had taken a turn for the worst and had failed to present their bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable unto God, which is their reasonable service. Instead, they allowed themselves to be conformed to the dainties of the world. The very fact that you are promoting a works-based salvation makes you guilty of being conformed to the world.

    You wrote:

    If you can keep falling by humbling your perceptions and beliefs (Paul called it the constant renewal of the mind), and then humble yourself some more, you have attained the straight and narrow!

    The straight gate is Jesus Christ and refers to salvation which you believe you can attain by humbling yourself and by humbling your perceptions and beliefs. Here again, you are promoting a works-based salvation. You cannot attain salvation.

  • James

    Deborah (Discerning the World) wrote:

    Dear Laura
    >> I’d rather be sick and serve God than have some kind of deceitful healing.
    Amen to that!

    Amen I’ve been reading over the comments on this site it looks like you’ve guys got your work cut out for you here. It looks like you guys are trying to actually help people who have suffered some serious traumas from this false kundalini fire spirit . I was praying about a year ago and kind of clearing my mind in an unintentional way and think I was visited for lack of better terms by some type of spirit . I thought at first it was God or the Holy Spirit , but I don’t think so now . This was from doing an 11th step prayer from A.A. it says ” we sought through prayer and meditation to improve our conscience contact with God” . I left this program funny it’s called “program” I am a born again Christian and so many of these steps and books in that program after awhile seemed to fly in direct opposition to the bible, it literally had a form of godliness but denied it’s power being Jesus of course all for the sake of wanting to be sober so it sounded really “Good” like communism on paper lol. This “program” now looking back seems like some sort of new age philosophy the spirit put it on me heavy to run from that place it was full of pantheist, practicing pagans, witches, polytheist, it masqueraded as an angel of light at first ,it was like something out of a demonic horror movie .They called it the AA way , I called them out on this, there is no “new way” or “other way” there is only THE WAY the truth and the light , Jesus. I’ve seen now where people have been cured of alcoholism , drug addiction or whatever ails you but this false spirit is promising you this also strange huh , and at what cost your soul your sanity ?? Jesus said for my yoke is easy and my burden is light and I’d look at these people who’ve had this yoke removed only to have ten more different ones put on , that don’t seem easy and causes a huge burden .Back to this spirit though I talked about earlier , though it only lasted a few days it scared me badly!! Because I started to realize , by what it was asking of me didn’t line up scripturally what so ever and that what they (AA) were teaching me was WRONG!! Jesus has been good to me very kind and very patient , I believe I was meant to see something there , they have this other step I think step two became willing to believe that a power greater than myself could restore my sanity ,what power ? Whos power (it never says)??? They said I’m “powerless” ,but through Christ he strengthens me ,step 3 was turning my will and my life over to the care of god what god are they talking about ? Who’s god??? It never tells you and I’d ask them and the general reply was whatever one you want as long as it’s greater than you ….ok pick a god any god here use my god .When I read the literature it has all kinds of passages from the bible, but not ONE mention of Jesus in their “official” literature (well to be fair it said the word Jesus in the forward and even then it only said he was a fine moral example and that’s it …really that’s it) .NOTHING in that program leads you to Christ NOTHING. Any mention of Jesus is quickly dismissed as “your not being respectful of the people who haven’t chosen a God ” but I would have to listen to them on their god and their garbage and it was pure garbage .I’d mention Jesus and I was alienated from the group ,eyes would roll, they would say oh no he’s allowed you can talk about him ,except I totally couldn’t .Their reasoning – Because so and so had a bad experience at such and such place and that would be disrespectful , if I mentioned this they would say “you have a resentment” lol I’m like ya duh. I cant talk about the Lord and if I say something I’m shushed and if I disagree I have a resentment and if I drank its you didn’t give your whole self to “the program” and that’s why you drank not the fact that it has a 96% failure rate which was their quote from their “home office” something that was mentioned often in meetings as a supposed scare tactic (meaning you better get on board or this could fail for you) .For me it was one red flag of many , it was like the united nations in my mind with all those flags .Needless to say I haven’t been back in long time and of course they would say its because of “a resentment” and I would say I TOTTALY AGREE LOL .I rarely if EVER drink now , once in while I mess up but the Holy Spirit is finding ways for me to not be tempted and it works 100% of the time , when I have slipped up the spirit lets me know hey James you cant be doing this and I’m like ya your right , your right , thank you for guiding me into all truths, thank you Jesus . There’s something to be said about this kundilini fire baptism or this new age spirit infecting people I had a slight taste of it , no thank you it’s wrong!!! The Lord didn’t free me and US of bondage only to put me and US back into all types of bondage again. I think what you guys are trying to do here on this site is a really good thing and unfortunately there is some bad apple comments on here that could probably use and need your experience and just don’t know it yet is all. You guys are trying to help people who have been burdened with a heavy yoke and don’t even know it. That’s tough to do , I don’t think there is a lot of people doing this ,simply because I mean where do you begin ? If you guys can bring one person back to the Lord rightly it’s all worth it . My advice to people is to stay away from this new age meditation, yoga (which literally means YOKE btw) ,kundilini feel good FIRE Baptism wave that’s infecting America , stick with the bible folks the apostle’s really new what they were doing they were regular people like us at one time tax collector, a Doctor , one of them murdered people . They are warning us because its real and it could happen ,be sober and vigilant your enemy the Devil is like a roaring lion seeking whom he may devour ,the meant that when they wrote it !

  • Richard B.

    I was an Atheist, so you guys had better listen up to what I have to say.

    Raised in baptist church, it was boring and uneventful. Experienced the world and everything it had to offer. Money, women, power, all of it. Something was missing, and since I didn’t know what it was I figured I try to search out to see if God was real or not. Told myself, if He is real, I’ll find him, cause I never did find him in church. I got so desperate for my search that it nearly drove me mad. I finally came to a point, to where I repented of every sin by name out loud that I could think of, and then I forgave anyone and everyone who had ever wronged me…I was at the end of my rope from searching. I felt death creeping up on me, if you can imagine the feeling of death. I was weak, and bones dry…streached out prostrate in my bedroom floor. The only thought that came to my mind was that I needed a savior to save me right then. I remembered a nursery rhyme about Jesus. So with my last breath, and last ounce of energy I called out his name…BOOOOOM! The Son of Man explodes in my body, breaking death’s grip on my neck. Holy Spirit Fire comes out of no where to burn the sin off of me. It was awesome! Now I’m seeing things I’ve never seen. Feeling power I’ve never felt. Have a knowledge now that ALL THINGS are now possible because I’ve got the H.S. on me an within me. You will never ever mistake the real Holy Spirt for anything else, it brings all the evidence with him when He comes of who He is!!!!! He teaches you within about 5 minutes of everything that is TRUE and everything that is FALSE. Doctrines of devils is real…they use the pull pit..get it? There is a serious battle going on right now for Truth, and if you are in a church with no supernatural things happening, you are in the WRONG church. If you are in a church that thinks toungues have ceased YOU HAVE BEEN DECEIVED by doctrines of devils that Jesus warned us about. Run from that church and run fast! Here is another one for you. If you have not yet received the HS, you may have been talked in to saying the “sinner’s prayer”..lol The sinner’s prayer is straight from Satan, and it will not save you. Only a true, personal repentence of all known sin, and forgiving others, and then confessing and believing in your heart about Jesus will save you. When a man gets saved, it is a supernatural event!! I thank God everyday for the Lord Jesus and the precious Holy Spirit that brings the Fire that I love!

    PS. The Kingdom of God is here and in the NOW. All the benefits and powers are available here and now for this life on earth…you just have’t found them yet.

    PSS. There is a real “yoke” that is removed from your neck and shoulders…and then after about 2 seconds, a teeny tiny little yoke gets put back on your neck…just like Jesus said.

    Know thyself and the hidden will be revealed.

  • Richard B

    There are a few things you wrote that bothers me. You wrote:

    Holy Spirit Fire comes out of no where to burn the sin off of me. It was awesome!

    Where in Scripture do we find that it is the Holy Spirit that burns away sin? The Holy Spirit wasn’t crucified for our sins. A spirit cannot be crucified and neither can it shed blood. Jesus Christ shed his blood on the cross and it is his blood alone that cleanses sinners of their sins, and not the Holy Spirit who allegedly burns sins away.

    There is a serious battle going on right now for Truth, and if you are in a church with no supernatural things happening, you are in the WRONG church. If you are in a church that thinks toungues have ceased YOU HAVE BEEN DECEIVED by doctrines of devils that Jesus warned us about. Run from that church and run fast!

    Well, I think it’s just the other way around. If you are in a church where supernatural things happen, (miracles, speaking in tongues etc. etc.) I suggest t that you start runing from it as fast as you can. Why?

    A wicked and adulterous generation seeketh after a sign; and there shall no sign be given unto it, but the sign of the prophet Jonas. And he left them, and departed. And when his disciples were come to the other side, they had forgotten to take bread. (Mat 16:4-5)

    Wherefore tongues are for a sign, not to them that believe, but to them that believe not: but prophesying serveth not for them that believe not, but for them which believe.
    (1 Co 14:22)

    John the Baptist never performed a single miracle and never spoke in tongues. Yet, Jesus called him the greatest prophet who ever lived. (Matthew 11:11).

    I suggest that you leave your miracle seeking, tongues speaking church as soon as possible. You have been deceived.

  • […] to accept just about anything, thinking it comes from God, when it does not. See article:  The Biblical Holy Spirit vs.The False Unholy Spirit of Fire.   The lie in the charismatic church is that you need to be baptised in order to receive the gift […]

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The Biblical Holy Spirit vs.The False Unholy Spirit of Fire

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      4. Any content that discloses private details concerning any person, for eg., phone numbers that have not been made public, photos that are not in the public domain, residential address that is not public, ID numbers, Social Security numbers, email addresses that are not in the public domain, etc.;
      5. Any content that you know to be false, misleading, or fraudulent;
      6. Any use of profanity;
      7. Any content including advertisements or otherwise focused on the promotion of commercial events or businesses, or any request for or solicitation of money, goods, or services for private gain;
      8. Any content that contains software viruses or any other computer code, files or programs designed to interrupt, destroy or limit the functionality of any computer software or hardware or telecommunications equipment; or
      9. Any content directly or indirectly soliciting responses from minors (defined as anyone under 18 years of age).
  7. FAIR USE NOTICE:
    1. If any part of the “Comment” is not your original work, it is your responsibility to add the name of the third party, name the book with page number or a link (url) to the website where you obtained the information.
    2. Your “Comment” may contain Copyrighted material, the use of which has not always been specifically authorized by the copyright owner. You are however allowed to make such material available in your “Comment” in an effort to advance understanding of environmental, political, human rights, economic, democracy, scientific, and social justice issues, etc.  This constitutes a ‘fair use’ of any such copyrighted material as provided for in section 107 of the US Copyright Law. In accordance with Title 17 U.S.C. Section 107, the material on this Site is distributed without profit to those who have expressed a prior interest in receiving the included information for research and educational purposes. For more information go to:http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/17/107.shtml.
    3. If you wish to use copyrighted material from a website or any other medium for purposes to add to your “Comment” that go beyond ‘fair use’, you must obtain permission from the copyright owner. (Fair Use means you may quote from copyrighted sources, but you may not publish the whole article, book, etc., in your “Comment”.)
  8. You are solely responsible for the “Comment” you upload, post, transmit or otherwise make available to others using this Web Site. Under no circumstances will Discerning the World be liable in any way for any “Comment” posted on or made available through this Site by you or any third party.
  9. You understand that all “Comments” on this Site are pre-screened or moderated. That means that every “Comment” needs to be approved by Discerning the World before it appears in the “Comments” section.  This is not an automatic process.  Discerning the World does this for SPAM reasons.
  10. Discerning the World has the right (but not the obligation) in their sole unfettered discretion to remove any “Comment” that is posted on or available through the Site. Without limiting the foregoing, Discerning the World has the right to remove any “Comment” that violates these Terms or is otherwise deemed objectionable by Discerning the World in its sole discretion.
  11. You understand that Discerning the World in their sole unfettered discretion is not obligated and can not be forced in any manner, be it legal or otherwise to remove any “Comment” that is posted on or made available through the Site by you.
  12. When submitting a “Comment,” you will be asked to provide your name and your email address. While Discerning the World does not object to your use of a pseudonym instead of your actual name, Discerning the World reserves the right, but not the obligation, to reject, change, disallow, or discontinue at any time any submission name that, in Discerning the World’s sole unfettered discretion, is objectionable or inappropriate for any reason. Discerning the World requires the submission of your email address, but Discerning the World warrants that it will not publish your email address to an outside third party without your consent.
  13. Discerning the World does not sell or rent your personal information to third parties for their marketing purposes. From time to time, Discerning the World may contact you personally via email. Notwithstanding the foregoing, you acknowledge and understand that the “Comments” feature of the Site is designed to permit users to post information and commentary for public review and comment and thus you hereby waive any expectation of privacy you may have concerning any likeness or information provided to the Site by you.
  14. You are solely responsible for your interactions with other users of or visitors to the Site.
    1. Discerning the World shall have the right, but not the obligation, to monitor interactions utilizing the “Comments” facility of the Site, between you and other users of or visitors to the Site. You acknowledge and agree that Discerning the World, or any third party shall not be, and you shall not seek to hold them, responsible for any harm or damage whatsoever arising in connection with your interaction with other users of or visitors to the Site.
    2. Discerning the World does not verify any information posted to or communicated via the “Comments” sections of the Site by users and does not guarantee the proper use of such information by any party who may have access to the information. You acknowledge and agree that Discerning the World does not assume, and shall not have, any responsibility for the content of messages or other communications sent or received by users of the Site.
  15. The Site contains content created by or on behalf of Discerning the World as well as content provided by third parties.
    1. Discerning the World does not control, and makes no representations or warranties about, any third party content, including such content that may be accessible directly on the Site or through links from the Site to third party sites.
    2. You acknowledge that, by viewing the Site or communications transmitted through the Site, you may be exposed to third party content that is false, offensive or otherwise objectionable to you or others, and you agree that under no circumstances shall Discerning the World be liable in any way, under any theory, for any third party content.
    3. You acknowledge and agree that the Site, and the contents thereof, is proprietary to Discerning the World and is protected by copyright. You agree that you will not access or use the Site or any of the content thereof for any reason or purpose other than your personal, non-commercial use.
    4. You agree that you will not systematically retrieve data or other content from the Site by any means, and you will not compile a database or directory of information extracted from the Site.
    5. You agree that you will not reproduce, distribute or make derivative works of the Site or any of the contents thereof without the express consent of Discerning the World.
    6. You hereby agree to indemnify, defend and hold harmless Discerning the World, its affiliates and licensees, and all of their officers, directors, employees, agents and representatives from and against any and all liabilities, losses, claims, damages, and expenses (including attorneys’ fees) in connection with any claim arising out of your use of the Site or violation of any of these Terms.

DISCLAIMER OF WARRANTY/LIMITATION OF LIABILITY.

  • YOU EXPRESSLY AGREE THAT USE OF THE SITE IS AT YOUR SOLE RISK. NEITHER DISCERNING THE WORLD, ITS AFFILIATES, NOR ANY OF THEIR RESPECTIVE EMPLOYEES, AGENTS, OR LICENSORS WARRANT THAT THE SITE WILL BE UNINTERRUPTED, TIMELY, SECURE OR ERROR FREE.
  • THE SITE IS PROVIDED ON AN “AS IS” BASIS WITHOUT WARRANTIES OF ANY KIND, EITHER EXPRESS OR IMPLIED, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO WARRANTIES OF TITLE OR IMLPLIED WARRANTIES OF MERCHANTABILITY OR FITNESS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE.
  • THIS DISCLAIMER OF LIABILITY APPLIES TO ANY DAMAGES OR INJURY CAUSED BY ANY FAILURE OF PERFORMANCE, ERROR, OMISSION, INTERRUPTION, DELETION, DEFECT, DELAY, COMMUNICATION LINE FAILURE, THEFT OR DESTRUCTION OR UNAUTHORIZED ACCESS TO, ALTERATION OF OR USE, WHETHER FOR BREACH OF CONTRACT, TORTIOUS BEHAVIOR, NEGLIGENCE OR UNDER ANY OTHER CAUSE OF ACTION. YOU SPECIFICALLY ACKNOWLEDGE AND AGREE THAT DISCERNING THE WORLD SHALL NOT BE LIABLE FOR THE DEFAMATORY, OFFENSIVE OR ILLEGAL CONDUCT OF USERS OF THE SITE OR THIRD PARTIES, AND THAT THE RISK OF INJURY FROM THE FOREGOING RESTS ENTIRELY WITH THE YOU THE COMMENTER.
  • IN NO EVENT WILL DISCERNING THE WORLD, ITS AFFILIATES OR ANY OF THEIR RESPECTIVE EMPLOYEES, AGENTS OR LICENSORS BE LIABLE FOR ANY DAMAGES, INCLUDING WITHOUT LIMITATION DIRECT, INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL, CONSEQUENTIAL OR PUNITIVE DAMAGES, EVEN IF THEY HAVE BEEN ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OF SUCH DAMAGES, ARISING FROM, RELATING TO OR CONNECTED WITH THE USE OR INABILITY TO USE THE SITE OR ANY OTHER MATTER ARISING FROM, RELATING TO OR CONNECTED WITH THE SITE OR THESE TERMS.

16. These Terms constitute the entire agreement between Discerning the World and you with respect to the subject matter hereof, and supersede any previous oral or written agreement between us with respect to such subject matter.

Thank you!