Torben Søndergaard – Last Reformation of Lies

Torben Søndergaard - Last ReformationThere is a Danish Pastor called Torben Søndergaard doing the rounds and I’ve been asked 3 times now what I think of him.  It’s time to do an article on this guy.

I received a comment from a Discerning the World reader who said:

“I have just found this page recently and I find it very interesting. It confuses me right now, but hopefully it will clear up later, when I read more. So I would like to ask you about a danish evangelist Torben Sondergaard.   Here is a link to his youtube page:  https://www.youtube.com/user/DanishEvangelist

What do you think is it Kundalini?”

So off I went to analyse the following video: Last Reformation

A Baptism unto Repentance

A few things really stick out for me in this video, but don’t run away after reading the below, stick around to the end of article for the best of this man’s doctrine.

  • In the video at 1:13 min they say you get baptised (in water) FOR THE REMISSION OF YOUR SINS – this is 100% not biblical.  Let’s see why:

(Acts 19:4)  “Then said Paul, John verily baptized with the baptism of repentance, saying unto the people, that they should believe on him which should come after him, that is, on Christ Jesus.”

John the Baptist’s baptism in water was a baptism of repentance, but when Jesus Came, you are to be spiritually baptised into the One and only Baptism of Jesus Christ.

“And Peter said to them, ‘Repent, and let each of you be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins; and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.’” (Acts 2:38).

When you are genuinely born again you prayed to Jesus Christ and you repented to Jesus Christ and ask Him for forgiveness of all your sins and because of this you are automatically spiritually baptized into the One and only Baptism of the Jesus Christ, there after the Holy Spirit will come to abide in you permanently.

  •  Baptism in water was for Jewish unbelievers. We are gentiles and we believe solely by faith and we do not need to be baptized in water.  It is very important for the Pentecostal/Charismatic/Apostolic and Prophetic/Hebrew Roots Movement to baptize people in water:
    • These pastors believe they are part of the Apostolic succession (the same as the Catholic Church) and today’s so called Christian church is supposed to be part of the false doctrine of the lost tribes of Israel and we apparently need to ‘realize’ this and be part of the Last Reformation that the Vatican is raising so as to enter and take over Jerusalem with their one world religion.
    • Baptizing you in water is a way of taking you back to the Hebrew way of doing things, and you push Jesus Christ completely out of the picture as the One who forgives you of your sin, instead the immersion in water is what forgives you instead.

(Matthew 3:11-12)  John the Baptist says: “I indeed baptize you with water unto repentance: but he that cometh after me is mightier than I, whose shoes I am not worthy to bear: he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost, and with fire: 12 Whose fan is in his hand, and he will throughly purge his floor, and gather his wheat into the garner; but he will burn up the chaff with unquenchable fire. ”

(John 1:33)  “And I knew him not: but he that sent me to baptize with water, the same said unto me, Upon whom thou shalt see the Spirit descending, and remaining on him, the same is he which baptizeth with the Holy Ghost.

What’s the point of us being baptised in water? When you are born again you are automatically SPIRITUALLY baptised by Jesus Christ onto the One and Only baptism there is, where after the Holy Spirit comes to live in you. Now you go and dunk yourself in a swimming pool, a bath tub? For what? As a work? To complete your salvation? For forgiveness of sin?  No.

I found another video of Torben Søndergaard:

A Torben Søndergaard hijack with a gospel of non repentance

Torben Søndergaard hijacks you on the spot, does a willy nilly prayer with you, lays hands on you in the street, or dunks you under water at a baptism, a demon manifests (but does not actually leave), and then he lays hands on you again and forces that Spirit of FIRE into you until you speak in tongues, which according to Torben Søndergaard proves you are now truly saved.  According to the doctrine of Pentecostalism, if you can’t speak in tongues, then you are not saved.   See here:  Pentecostalism

This “The Last Reformation” Torben speaks about is none other than the New Apostolic Reformation (NAR) / Latter Rain Movement.  It is actually part and parcel of the Hebrew Roots Movement as well, all bound together in a nice Roman Catholic purple ribbon.  All these false movements intertwine like a thorny bush.

Steps to a ‘Torben salvation’:

  1. Ask to pray for a person, any person, hijack them in the street or a store if necessary, and lay your lands on them if possible.
  2. Torben Søndergaard prays in tongues over the person – one can only shudder as to what demonic entity he is communicating with.
  3. Person will mostly manifest a demon (Satan has to put on a show after all).
  4. Person screams, rolls around on the floor etc, and demon supposedly flees.  However the person is shocked at the manifestation and will genuinely believe they are free from any demonic affliction when in fact they are not.
  5. Torben Søndergaard now has to force his ‘false Holy Spirit of Fire’ onto the person to get them to RECEIVE the Spirit of Fire (another demonic entity).
  6. Spirit of FIRE enters person and they start to speak in tongues, convulse, jerk, have visions, etc.
  7. Person now worships God, praises Jesus, and is ‘Torben born again’ due to the fact that they can now speak in gibberish tongues.

The Full Gospel

The term ‘Full Gospel’ (Pentecostalism) does not mean ‘the full gospel of the bible’, but the full gospel of all so called Christian faiths mingled into one, including Calvinism – this is why it’s so easy for someone to fall from Pentecostalism into Calvinism (NG Kerk) and Calvinism back into Pentecostalism because the doctrine of ELECTION is present in both movements.  And ‘full gospel’ is exactly what you will see Torben’s Last Reformation is all about… as he takes bits and pieces from every so called Christian doctrine and mingles them together.

What does Torben Søndergaard believe?

Torben Søndergaard is part of the Oneness Pentecostal sect.  He believes he is a self appointed apostle with a “Last Reformation” belief system.  He claims that “about 90 percent of all the people, that he or others in his team pray for, are healed”.  [8]  Lack of healing is caused by a lack of faith which is Word of Faith doctrine to the core.

Søndergaard has created his own little belief system by “taking a little from some different” denomination,[16] for example, baptismal regeneration from the Catholics, speaking in tongues as the sign of baptism in the Holy Spirit from the Pentecostals, believer’s baptism as Baptists, and baptism to Jesus Christ not using the Trinitarian formula as Oneness Pentecostals.

Contrary to almost any other Christian denomination, he teaches that salvation for a Christian is completed through baptism in water not using the Trinitarian formula,[19] as well as through baptism in the Holy Spirit with the manifestation of speaking in tongues, often saying “dadadaadadadaa.”[20] [21][22][23][24] He also teaches that just as Jesus received the Holy Spirit through water baptism, it is through baptism that a Christian receives the Holy Spirit.  Søndergaard regards receiving the Holy Spirit as having substituted receiving Jesus.[25]

Torben has visions and receives a book from God

Søndergaard claims to receive visions of Heaven and Hell directly from God. According to Torben Søndergaard, God made him time travel back to before he was born as a confirmation[27].

After fasting for 40 days Torben Søndergaard also believes that God revealed a self-help book for him,[28] saying “I will give you one chapter each day”.[29]

Todd Bentley and Torben Søndergaard’s Last Reformation

In 2003, Torben Søndergaard invited the controversial tele-evangelist and faith healer Todd Bentley to Denmark[34]. According to people present, Todd Bentley said:

“In the Bible, in John 5 provides a healing outpouring – the Pool of Bethesda, which means an outpouring of grace. The Bible says that a quantity of sick, blind, lame and crippled came to this place, the pool of Bethesda… “[35][36]

In 2015, Torben Søndergaard quoted this as a prediction of Torben Søndergaard’s own work in Denmark:

“10 years ago, a man came from the US to Denmark with a prophetic word to us our country. The word was that Denmark would become known as the Pool of Bethesda. That is a place where the sick could experience salvation and healing. He said that it would not only be one or two places, but it would be all over the country. Yes, no matter where you came in Denmark, there would be people who would ask for one and set one free… Yes, I believe we are seeing the fulfilment of the word that sounded over Denmark.” [35][37]

You can read more about Torben here!

Torben Søndergaard tries to explain Speaking in Tongues the Torben way:

…and acknowledges the Catholic Church from 1:42 in the video.

Charismatic Catholics at Mass all Speaking in Tongues.

If Pentecostalism believes that speaking in tongues is evidence of salvation:

  • Are they saying that Roman Catholics who speak in tongues are born again as well?

Many Christians will fall into deception because of this ‘speaking in tongues’ phenomenon and the Spirit of Fire that accompanies speaking in tongues.  Many genuine Christians will think they are missing out on something special if they don’t speak in gibberish – that God favours those who speak in tongues more than those who don’t. I mean let’s get serious now, how many of you reading this article thought to yourself, “why do they get this gift and I don’t? I want to speak to God in an unknown language as well!”  It’s called jealously, wanting something that someone else has (all be it unbiblical and totally ungodly).  And this sin of ‘jealousy‘ among other sins such as wanting the ‘power‘ to speak to God in an unknown language that makes the believer feel that because he/she can now speak in tongues they are on another spiritual level or more powerful than those who can’t, and don’t tell me you have never thought of this!  Because you will be lying to yourself and worst of all God Himself.

Torben says himself at 6:44 into the ‘Speaking in Tongues video‘ above that speaking in tongues is an amazing gift that EVERYONE should have because if you are not baptised in the Holy Spirit well according to Torben you are not saved, and that speaking in tongues is an amazing tool God has given us to come into a strong prayer life and relationship with him

So if you don’t speak in tongues you are:

  1. Not saved.
  2. Not spiritual enough.
  3. Have a weak personal relationship with Jesus Christ, or don’t have a relationship with Jesus Christ at all.
  4. Your prayers in your native language are so weak Jesus Christ does not even hear them, that’s why God prefers you to speak to Him in a prayer language instead.
  5. Or worst, you are possibly even demon possessed according to Torben and this is what is blocking the ‘false Holy Spirit’ from entering you and baptising you in FIRE.

Torben Søndergaard even speaks about people being baptised multiple times;  two, three and even four times in the following video, and he quotes Acts 19 to back up this teaching. He says that people that were baptised by John the Baptist needed to be baptised again by the Holy Spirit.  Torben in that instance yes, because their baptism was a baptism unto repentance, now they had to be baptised by the Holy Spirit into believing in Christ Jesus.  Today believer’s are not baptised John the Baptist and there is no need to be re-baptised over and over and over again – they either believe by FAITH in Jesus Christ the Son of God or they don’t.   Let’s have a look at Acts 19 shall we to see what the Bible has to say, not what Torben has to say:

Acts 19:1-7 1 And it came to pass, that, while Apollos was at Corinth, Paul having passed through the upper coasts came to Ephesus: and finding certain disciples, 2 He said to them, Have you received the Holy Ghost since you believed? And they said to him, We have not so much as heard whether there be any Holy Ghost. 3 And he said to them, To what then were you baptized? And they said, To John’s baptism. 4 Then said Paul, John truly baptized with the baptism of repentance, saying to the people, that they should believe on him which should come after him, that is, on Christ Jesus. 5 When they heard this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus. 6 And when Paul had laid his hands on them, the Holy Ghost came on them; and they spoke with tongues, and prophesied. 7 And all the men were about twelve.

As we can see, being baptised by the Holy Spirit in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ doesn’t involve any laying on of hands, just BELIEVING.  Paul needed these disciples to preach in the area and therefore laid hands on them and the Holy Spirit came upon them and they spoke with tongues (earthly languages) and prophesied.  So TWO SEPERATE things happened here; 1) they were baptised by the Holy Spirit just by BELIEVING in Jesus Christ – no signs and wonders 2) Paul then needed them to go out and preach and he laid hands on them to speak in tongues (earthly languages) and prophecy.  After the time of the book of Acts came to an end, speaking in tongues and prophecy ceased.

1 Corinthians 13:8  “Charity never faileth: but whether there be prophecies, they shall fail; whether there be tongues, they shall cease; whether there be knowledge, it shall vanish away.”

The FIRE that is called down from heaven in the last days by the Antichrist and his ‘ministers of righteousness’ (2 Corinthians 11:15) will lead to the wild fire spread of speaking in tongues.

Rev 13:13  “13 And he doeth great wonders, so that he maketh fire come down from heaven on the earth in the sight of men”

The fire that is called down from heaven by the beast that being the Roman Catholic church is 1) spiritual/demonic which leads to a satanic awakening and 2) the Antichrist himself will call down actual fire from heaven in the sight of men.

CONCLUSION

Be careful, God will warn you many times that playing with FIRE is dangerous, and in the end will hand you over to the delusion you begged and pleaded for because you refuse to repent.

2 Thess 2:7-12   “7 For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way. 8 And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming: 9 Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders, 10 And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved. 11 And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie: 12 That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness.”

For all those caught up in this demonic mess and want to be set free please read this article:   Seeking Salvation or Deliverance?

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Deborah (Discerning the World)

Deborah Ellish is the author of the above article. Discerning the World is an internet Christian Ministry based in Johannesburg South Africa. Tom Lessing and Deborah Ellish both own Discerning the World. For more information see the About this Website page below the comments section.

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14 Comment authors
AndreiAnders ErichsenAnders H. ErichsenBeeJoy Gasser Recent comment authors
Tom (Discerning the World)
Admin

Hi Paul B

Yep! As you said in your other comment, we should avoid and also expose ALL false teachers. Was Paul a false teacher who said Jesus did not send him to baptize but to preach the gospel? You said in one of your posts,

Then explain how baptism in Romans says it’s symbolic of Christ’s death, burial, and resurrection if it’s baptism in the Holy Ghost?

It appears baptism was meant to be in water and the filling of the Holy Ghost accompanies it, just like Jesus’ baptism but unlike all the other baptisms performed by John.

Comparing scriptures gives a complete picture.

Where in Romans does it say that water baptism is symbolic of Christ’s death burial and resurrection? It was John the Baptist who instituted water baptism unto repentance. “Unto repentance” means that the Jews (there were no gentiles among those whom he baptized) needed to change their minds about their Messiah, Jesus Christ, and his gospel. The word “metanoia” used for repentance means to change your mind for the better, the better being faith in Jesus Christ. If, as you say, water baptism and the infilling of the Holy Spirit go hand in hand, then those whom John baptized must also have been filled with the Holy Spirit. Moreover, if your claim that water baptism and the infilling of the Holy Spirit accompany one another, then Paul who was not sent to baptize, must have deprived people of the Holy Ghost.

Yes, there were instances when Peter and Philippe baptized gentiles in water, but they were exceptions which I shall explain to you later when I have more time. By the way, did Ananias baptize Paul by immersion in water? Can you prove it to me from Scripture, seeing that you yourself said “Comparing scriptures gives a complete picture.” Is there any evidence in Scripture that the twelve apostles were baptized in water?

Deborah replied:

Acts 10:44-48 (KJV)
44 While Peter yet spake these words, the Holy Ghost fell on all them which heard the word. 45 And they of the circumcision which believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because that on the Gentiles also was poured out the gift of the Holy Ghost. 46 For they heard them speak with tongues, and magnify God. Then answered Peter, 47 Can any man forbid water, that these should not be baptized, which have received the Holy Ghost as well as we? 48 And he commanded them to be baptized in the name of the Lord. Then prayed they him to tarry certain days.

If we look at the all the above verses in its entirety it’s clear that Peter was travelling with Jews (those who were of the circumcision) who were against Gentiles being baptised. At the time of empowering believers with speaking in tongues etc, Peter tells the Jews, “who are we as Jews to deny Gentiles from being baptised to receive the gifts of the Holy Ghost to speak in tongues and be a witness to all the nations?” Notice the word “water’ (v47) above does not denote actual water, it was a spiritual baptism of laying of on hands to receive the Holy Spirit. Until such time as the canon was complete, the laying on of hands to receive the Holy Spirit to receive the gift of speaking in tongues, healing and prophecy would remain. After the Word of God was compete these gifts would cease.

Bro. Nick
Guest
Bro. Nick

I do thank you very much for this Biblically sound article of WARNING about the Danish “antichrist” evangelist Torben Sondergaard.
– And it is my Biblical understanding that the Biblical Prophetic WARNING written in 2 Corinthians 11:13-15 [AV] is very applicable to him – and about him and his ‘ministries’:
For such are FALSE APOSTLES, DECEITFUL WORKERS,
TRANSFORMING THEMSELVES INTO the apostles of Christ.
And no marvel;
FOR Satan HIMSELF IS TRANSFORMED INTO an angel of light.
Therefore it is no great thing if HIS MINISTERS ALSO BE TRANSFORMED AS the ministers of righteousness;
whose end shall be according to their works.
.
AND – “the Lord Jesus Christ” personally WARNED in Matthew 12:39 [AV] that: “An evil and adulterous generation SEEKETH AFTER A SIGN”
.
— The only point that I disagree with you is about ‘Water Baptism’
.
– 1) – ‘Water Baptism’ has NOTHING to do with – AND IS NOT necessary for ‘Biblical Salvation’
– For that occurred WHEN I did that which is written in Romans 10:9-11 [AV]:
That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus,
and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead,
thou shalt be saved.
For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness;
and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.
For the scripture saith, Whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed.
.
– For I had “received the Holy Ghost” when I was truly “saved”
– As “it is written” in Ephesians 4:5-6 [AV]:
One Lord, one faith, one baptism,
One God and Father of all, who is above all, and through all, and in you all.
.
So – ‘Water Baptism’ was ONLY my public acknowledgment that I am indeed – ONLY ‘By Grace Through Faith’ – a truly Biblically “saved” and “born again” “believeth” follower of “the Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ”
– For “it is written” in Romans 1:16-17 [AV]:
For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ:
for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth;
to the Jew first, and also to the Greek.
For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith:
as it is written, The just shall live by faith.
.
I would very much appreciate your comment(s) – for my ONLY desire is to Biblically correct – Acts 17:11 + 2 Timothy 2:15 + Philippians 2:12 [AV]
.
– NOTE CAPITALization of “the words of the Lord” are mine – for EMPHASIS – Bro. Nick

Tom (Discerning the World)
Admin

Bro. Nick wrote:

“So – ‘Water Baptism’ was ONLY my public acknowledgment that I am indeed – ONLY ‘By Grace Through Faith’ – a truly Biblically “saved” and “born again” “believeth” follower of “the Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ.”

If water baptism (John the Baptist’s baptism) has no value whatsoever in salvation, what benefit does it have? You, like so many others, say that it was your way of publically confessing your faith in Jesus? What about Bro. Paul who was baptized in Ananias’ house? He only had one person present at his baptism and no public audience to bear witness to his new-found faith in Jesus. What about the martyrs in the book of Revelation where it says, “And they overcame him by the blood of the Lamb, and by their water baptism, and they loved not their lives unto the death.” (Revelation 12:11).

Ironically you refer to Romans 1:16-17 (AV) to substantiate water baptism as a public means to bear witness to your salvation. And yet the word “baptism” is nowhere to be seen in that passage. How many unbelievers do you think, who witnessed your public acknowledgment of your faith through water baptism, may have thought, “Oh, I too am baptized and can relate to Nick’s experience of salvation, because I believe water baptism saves.” I’ve had many people say to me when I ask them how they were saved, “I am baptized.” “Oh!” I would say then, “in how much water.” The same old answer is, “I was fully immersed in water.”

I know a woman who forced her husband to go to church with her and be baptized because she believes water baptism saves.

Joy Gasser
Guest
Joy Gasser

Good day, we came across your website and was at first very impressed but there are some very important things that we just cannot agree with. One of them is the importance of baptism (baptidzo – full immersion). We also do not agree with this article about Torben Sondergaard. We don’t think you are being fair at all, since you are not correct in what you say about what he believe. He does NOT say baptism saves you, but that you have to be born again and then you have to bury the old man in the water baptism. Paul spoke about the “water grave”. Jesus said in Joh.3 We have to be born from water and spirit. Any way not going to debate this with you. But if you really want to know what Torben stands for rather go and listen [REMOVED by DTW]. He does not agree at all with the Roman Catholic Church and he also warns against false holy spirit (kundalini etc.) [URL removed by DTW]

Bee
Guest
Bee

I think that maybe before discerning the world, maybe it will be interesting to learn to discern what is inside you.
I have seen a lot of anger, a lot of “I know better than you” which is pride, and if it is this the holy spirit, I don’t want it.
You seem to know a lot of things about the scriptures and it is fine but if you don’t know how to let it goes into your heart, it has no value.
I think that you should think twice before saying that others have kundaliny spirit because you don’t know how does God see you.
Be careful before insulting others.

Tom (Discerning the World)
Admin
Member

Bee,

Do you believe you are saved because you’d been completely immersed in lots of water?

Anders H. Erichsen
Guest
Anders H. Erichsen

How do you ever connect that to the Hebrew root movement….

Tom (Discerning the World)
Admin
Member

Hi Anders,

Here’s an eye-opener.

Anders Erichsen
Guest
Anders Erichsen

But the HRM is just people going back to the Torah and the Festivals, the Sabbath and food laws and the rest reading and studying the Scriptures – so I don’t know how you connect it with anything of that sort.

Rejecting the Pagan Traditions not found in the Bible turning to Biblical Feasts found in the Bible and the Sabbath and all the rest.

So, to just put some video out…. When the movement itself is big, and people trying to learn and return to Scripture is just unfair and wrong. Jesus was a Jew, he kept the Torah and there is nothing wrong to try to keep, guard and protect what our Master himself did – as Disciples of our Master we should become more like him as time goes.

So… I don’t get why you would attack a group that just try there best to become more like Jesus. If anything they are called Judaizers but as Jesus was a Jew and we his disciples I don’t see any issue with that – but I do see a problem people clinging to traditions and festivals of Rome.

Brother
Anders Erichsen

Anders Erichsen
Guest
Anders Erichsen

And regards of this guy in the video – this would not be anyone I would listen to. We go by the Bible and that’s the main thing by many people in the HRM, to try to get back to it and learn from the Scriptures. Like New2Torah has some great stuff, and you eat the meat and spit out the bones like everything else out there.
Like I don’t agree with man made traditions like Channakah or Purim – they are not found in the Torah so I don’t concern myself of learning them. But beside that – there is a ocean of information on the feasts found in the Torah, the festivals of Jehovah.
Again, eat the meat and spit out the Bones.

The same thing one would do with everything else, like the reformers, that had some good stuff but they also had things they got wrong. They where returning to scripture and had to begin relearning a lot of things and begin putting out the inherited leaven.

Brother
Anders Erichsen

Tom (Discerning the World)
Admin

Anders Erichsen

I suggest you stop chewing the meat and spitting out the bones and rather do what Jesus commanded you to do, that’s if you want to be like Him. He said through Paul: “A little leaven leaveneth the whole lump. (Gal 5:9)” You cannot remove the leaven that teaches water baptism saves lost sinners and still maintain the lump that allegedly remains untouched by the leaven. By the way, who decides what is the meat and what are the bones? If you believe that water baptism has salvific qualities then you are actually not eating meat and spitting out the bones; you are drinking the poison that oozes from the fangs of the snake, or is it DRAGON?

We all get things wrong sometimes. However, whosoever gets the doctrine of redemption/regeneration/salvation wrong cannot claim to be saved. Jesus plus something else, like water baptism, speaking in tongues to allegedly receive the Spirit is another Jesus who cannot save.

Tom (Discerning the World)
Admin

Anders Erichsen wrote:

Jesus was a Jew, he kept the Torah and there is nothing wrong to try to keep, guard and protect what our Master himself did – as Disciples of our Master we should become more like him as time goes.

No! that’s where you are wrong. Jesus did not keep the Law, guard it and try to protect it. He fulfilled it. (Matthew 5:17-20). Had He merely come to keep the Law, as you said, He would never have been able to save anyone. Now I can see why you are so confused.

You wrote:

So… I don’t get why you would attack a group that just try there best to become more like Jesus.

Once again, you are wrong. Jesus did not fulfill the Law so that we may try (put in some effort) to be like Him in keeping the Law. That’s called WORKS of the flesh that have no benefit whatsoever. Paul of Tarsus diligently tried to be like his Lord but failed dismally again and again because he realized there was nothing good in his flesh.

Anders Erichsen
Guest
Anders Erichsen

I have to disagree with a lot of what you say – so I’ll take my bed and walk, bye.

Tom (Discerning the World)
Admin
Member

Anders.

Do you agree that Jesus Christ fulfilled the Law?

Tom (Discerning the World)
Admin

To Deborah.

What you have said and described here is the mirror image, if you will, of what happened centuries ago in the time of the Roman Emperor Constantine, who called himself Vicarius Christi (The Vicar of Christ – “Pope”, “Papa”). When the persecution-wearied church under Nero and his predecessors suffered some of the most excruciating tortures imaginable, she was “salvaged” from persecution and immediately introduced to ecumenism by Constantine. He supposedly became a Christian in 313 A.D which afforded him the deadliest weapon ever to be wielded against the church – ecumenism, unity, and oneness, even with pagan religions. Whilst he became the Head of the Christian Church, he remained the head of the pagan religions in Rome.

Buddhism is deemed to be the most compassionate, peace-loving and helpful religion in the world. Not any more. That has changed. During Pope Francis’ August 27 2017 address in St. Peter’s Square, he condemned attacks against Myanmar’s largely Muslim Rohingya community.

“Sad news has come about the persecution of a religious minority, our Rohingya brothers,” said Francis. “I would like to express all my nearness to them. And let us all ask the Lord to save them and to raise up men and women of goodwill in their aid, who will give them their full rights.”

Note carefully, he called the Muslims his brothers. Like Constantine of old, he too resides over pagan religions as their great Saviour whilst he sits on the Vatican seat in Rome as the Vicar of Christ, and at the same time as the Great Saviour of Christendom. Of course, there is a great deal of persecution among true Christians but you hardly ever hear of it in the mainstream media. Whenever it does report, it is always persecution against Roman Catholics.

Torben, one can see in the video, is really heartbroken and sincere about the persecution he suffered in Denmark. However, one can be sincere and yet sincerely wrong, as seen from his NAR meetings. Indeed, he is devastated by his experience but shouldn’t he be more concerned about his own “persecution” (deception) of children and grownups with his NAR false teachings? Jesus said, “An evil and adulterous generation seeketh after a sign; and there shall no sign be given to it, but the sign of the prophet Jonas.” {(Matthew 12:39). The New Reformation NAR movement with its so-called signs and wonders is evil, Jesus Himself said. Who knows, perhaps Jesus Christ is the one who is allowing Torben’s ministry to be destroyed so that he may find the truth and start to preach the unadulterated Word of God instead of a lot of NAR lies that are misleading people all over the world.

What is more dangerous – to be persecuted or to mislead and deceive millions of people through the NAR deception and lead them to a Christless eternity in hell?

Andrei
Guest
Andrei

Saying that water baptism is pointless and is not command for us to do after we have been born again is total heresy! But I expect nothing less from any one that professes that the KJV is the only translation that one must use, seeing that you must already have been mislead to believe that KJVO lie.
Your website must be the worst one yet when it comes to discernment ministries. Just remember you will give answer to God one day for teaching people that His word firstly bound to one archaic translation and 2ndly for teaching people that the bible is not being true when it tells us to be baptized.
Repent, be baptized and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit!Twist it how you want and add sources from outside the bible to it, but Gods word is His word, and its not the KJV AV 1611 revision 1 to 3 – no its the words spoken by our Heavenly Father! Be they in our hearts or in print etc.
It does not take long to realize you guys are either not saved or have bought into many lies. The most joyful day in my life was after I got baptized in water and filled with the Holy Spirit! It was amazing! And no I did not speak in tongues or roll on the floor as if I am possessed by the kundalini spirit.

Jesus Himself got baptized n water! and what did He do? It says Jesus was praying when He got baptized, and then what? Then The Holy Spirit came upon Him! and then what? then he began His ministry! Now Jesus is Jesus, and if He had to be baptized to receive the Holy Spirit, then I dont know what you are so afraid of when it comes to getting baptized in water or the Baptism of the Holy Spirit.

The word tells us, that God will give us His Holy Spirit if we ask! Jesus told us that. You can look it up in your KJV 1611 AV or any other translation as its in all of them.

Before I was baptized and filled with the Holy Spirit I was a king james onlyist, I was hard of heart, I followed many who were like minded, I was cold and dead and useless.

Only by the Spirit of God can we get set free from all this bondage and lies from the enemy!

I am against everything in the NAR, I dont believe in speaking in gibberish, etc. But I will not bow down to the ideas of men just because they dont want the promise of God.

You are a prime example of satan doing exactly what he wants by all this false Holy Spirit nonsense going on the Church today.

May you get set free by the power of the Holy Spirit.

Tom (Discerning the World)
Admin
Member

Andrei. There is no point in trying to convince you because I can see you will never understand. However, I would like to quote you and then refute your views.

You said:

Jesus Himself got baptized n water! and what did He do? It says Jesus was praying when He got baptized, and then what? Then The Holy Spirit came upon Him! and then what? then he began His ministry! Now Jesus is Jesus, and if He had to be baptized to receive the Holy Spirit, then I dont know what you are so afraid of when it comes to getting baptized in water or the Baptism of the Holy Spirit.

Perhaps you don’t know it but you are making a mockery of Jesus and disparaging his deity by saying He received the Holy Spirit when He was baptized. Your words suggest that John the Baptist was far greater than Jesus. Listen to this:

But the angel said unto him, Fear not, Zacharias: for thy prayer is heard; and thy wife Elisabeth shall bear thee a son, and thou shalt call his name John. And thou shalt have joy and gladness; and many shall rejoice at his birth. For he shall be great in the sight of the Lord, and shall drink neither wine nor strong drink; and he shall be filled with the Holy Ghost, even from his mother’s womb. (Luke 1:13-15)

Wow! Think about that. The Saviour of the world only received the Holy Spirit when He was baptized in water by a man who received the Holy Spirit as a fetus in his mother’s womb. I suggest that you first study the Word of God before you make horrendous mistakes like this again.