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Why Jonathan Cahn and His Revelations Must be Ignored

Why Jonathan Cahn and His Revelations Must be Ignored

Jonathan CahnWhy Jonathan Cahn, His Mysteries, Keys and Revelations Must be Ignored

Rabbi Jonathan Cahn has been bothering me with his The Harbinger and now The Mystery of the Shemitah ‘revelations’. Who is he exactly?  Is he a born again Christian or is far worse than just your plain run of the mill false teacher?

He calls himself a Rabbi yet the bible says:

Matthew 23:8  “8 But be not ye called Rabbi: for one is your Master, even Christ; and all ye are brethren.”

He has been labelled a modern day prophet as he brings a prophetic message with The Harbinger where he blatantly implies that America is treading the same path for judgment as ancient Israel and connects Isaiah 9:10 to America.  The Harbinger was published by FrontLine, an imprint of Charisma House which used to be known as Strang Communications run by Steve Strang who is part of the New Apostolic Reformation.

Israel and a New World…

The main problem with The Harbinger is that Jonathan Cahn equates America to be a replacement of Israel, a New Israel.  He says in his book:

The Prophet: “But there was one other—a civilization also conceived and dedicated to the will of God from its conception . . . America. In fact, those who laid its foundations . . .”

Noriel Kaplan: “The Founding Fathers.”

The Prophet: “No, long before the Founding Fathers. Those who laid America’s foundations saw it as the new Israel, an Israel of the New World. And as it was with ancient Israel, they saw it as in covenant with God.

This is unbiblical.  Jonathan Cahn is claiming that the Pilgrims (America’s founders who were Puritins – Calvinists) constituted America to be in a covenant relationship with God like Israel is in a covenant with God.  This is of course a lie, but they believed it never the less.  He claims that America replaces Israel as the new Israel for a New World…Order.   Israel is the only nation in a covenant relationship with God that was established through Abraham.

Here he says it again on Glen Becks show.  Glen Beck is a Mormon.  Why would a christian like Jonathan Cahn appear on a Mormon’s show?

2 Corinthians 6:14  Be ye not unequally yoked together with unbelievers: for what fellowship hath righteousness with unrighteousness? and what communion hath light with darkness?

Jonathan Cahn On Glenn Beck TV The Harbinger Part 1

Another country who also believes they are the New Israel is Britain, with the British Royal Family believing that they are descendants of King David.  This is of course a lie. But they believe it never the less. This is called British Israelism (also called Anglo-Israelism).

Freemasons, other occultists and unbelievers can’t stand the fact that Israel is God’s chosen nation and will do anything to replace Israel, literally and spiritually.

The King Solomon connection

Jonathan Cahn says in The Harbinger:

The Key to Solomons KeyKaplan: “Some link between this city and the ancient vow,” I said. “Somehow Isaiah 9:10  has to be connected to Washington DC.” (p.61)

 George Washington Freemason

George Washington – Freemason

The Prophet: “Solomon was the king of Israel. Washington was the first president of the United States. There was something in the linking of ancient Israel and America, as with all the other mysteries.”(p.109)

King Solomon was appointed by God Himself to be king.  George Washington was elected via vote to be President.  There is a big difference between the two. George Washington was also a Freemason. When George Washington spoke of God, he was referring to Lucifer, not the God of the bible.  Freemasons are besotted with claiming Israel for themselves. The Pilgrims who proclaimed a false covenant with God were most likely Freemasons as well hence they could come up with such nonsense as to claim America to be the New Israel.

Freemasons also worship King Solomon who they believed to be the greatest magus (sorcerer) of all time. Is that why Jonathan Cahn connects King Solomon to George Washington because it’s a satanic connection?

“The purpose of Masonry’s veneration of Solomon is not to advance an alternate view of history, but to present, however subtly, the archetype of the future human being — men and women who truly possess Solomon’s Key — the power to master our own demons and redirect their destructive energy to build the Temple of our own evolving soul.” Lon Milo DuQuette, The Key to King Solomons Keys – Is this the lost symbol of Masonry, Second Edition

So who is Jonathan Cahn then and what does he believe?

Well if you go to his website it says:

Jonathan Cahn“Jonathan Cahn is President of Hope of the World ministries, Senior Pastor and Messianic Rabbi of the the Jerusalem Center/ Beth Israel in Wayne, New Jersey. He is also the author of the best selling book ‘The Harbinger‘. His teachings are broadcast daily over hundreds of radio stations throughout the United States and the world and on television.  He ministers, as did the first Jewish messengers of the Gospel, sharing the message of Messiah to Jew and Gentile, Israel, and the nations.  He has ministered before mass gatherings in India, Nigeria, Cuba, Mizoram, Honduras, Haiti, & throughout the world.  His teachings are widely known for revealing the deep mysteries of God’s word and for the restoring of the new covenant message to its original biblically Jewish richness and power.”  [Emphasis added] http://www.bethisraelworshipcenter.org/aboutjonathan.htm

That is very interesting.  So Jonathan Cahn knows the deep mysteries of God’s Word that Christians don’t know? And only Jonathan Cahn can reveal these mysteries to us?  Jonathan Cahn’s plan is also to restore the message that Jesus Christ preaches to it’s original Jewish richness and power.  So until Jonathan Cahn came along all born again believers for the last 2000+ years that have been reading the Scriptures were reading a bible that had no value and no authority what-so-ever.  Isn’t that nice, that Jonathan Cahn came to save the day.

What does he mean by all ‘richness and power’?  Does he mean that we need to infuse the Bible with Kaballah mysticism in order to understand it properly?

Here is another version of his biography that was on his website but the link has now been removed:

“Jonathan Cahn is President of Hope of the World ministries….Descended of the line of Aaron, he has been asked to sound the Jubilee trumpet and minister among the nations, a prophetic ministry of and to the Jew and the Gentile in the last days. His teachings include the revealing of ancient mysteries, the depth and wonders of God’s Word, and the restoration of the Gospel message in its original Biblically Jewish context, richness, and power.”

Who asked him to sound the Jubilee trumpet? And what does that mean exactly?  Here he states that his ministry is a prophetic ministry.  As Christians we know that there is no such thing as a prophetic ministry.  People will only begin to prophesy again in the last days (during the Tribulation):

Acts 2:17-18 “And it shall come to pass in the last days, saith God, I will pour out of my Spirit upon all flesh: and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, and your young men shall see visions, and your old men shall dream dreams:” 18 And on my servants and on my handmaidens I will pour out in those days of my Spirit; and they shall prophesy:”  (Joel 2:28)

There is a movement called the  ‘Hebrew Roots Movement’ where they believe that you cannot understand the bible unless you go back to your Hebrew ways (become like the Jews) and read extra biblical sources such as the Midrash,  Zohar and the Talmud etc., to gain a higher enlightenment of the Scriptures.

The Berean Call says:

“The late Jewish scholar and researcher of first century life in Israel, David Flusser, said rightly; “Jesus was a Jew in every way” ( Jewish Sources in Early Christianity , Adama Books, New York, 1987, p.7). There is absolutely no denying that Jesus was born a Jew and lived an observant Jewish life. He did this to fulfill completely every demand of the law, He did it for us (Romans:8:1-4), and He continues to do it in us if we are true believers.

So if we want to be like Jesus, does that mean that we must become observant Jews, as some allege? Is that what being like Jesus really means? Should Gentile believers try to be Messianic Jews? Can they? Should Gentiles don a yarmulke, worship in a synagogue, blow a shofar, wear a prayer shawl, call Jesus Yeshua or Yeshu, keep the Old Testament feasts and dietary laws, and give their pastors the title of Rabbi, even though Matthew:23:8 says otherwise? Are Jewish ceremonies and practices efficacious?

Do we need to restore first century or later Jewish practices to really be good Christians? The Pharisees practiced all the ceremonies, but theirs is a cautionary tale since Jesus told them that they did these things in vain (Matthew:15:7-9, See also Matthew 23).

So, is Jewishness next to godliness? One very modern movement would answer the question with a loud—“yes, more or less!” This growing movement is called the Hebrew Roots Movement (HRM). Unfortunately, it lacks a shared, coherent, consistent theology, an internal mechanism of doctrinal control, and it is filled with mavericks who seem to be making it up as they go along in terms of attachment to Jewish accoutrements.”  Continue to read this article:  Bewitching Believers Through the Hebrew Roots Movement

Did the Zohar greatly shaped Jonathan Cahn’s writings?

I had no idea we needed to be taught new revelations from Gnostic books such as the Zohar (Kabbalah).  In this video below we see Jonathan Cahn preaching new revelations about the Bible from an exta-biblical source the Zohar.

Watch Jonathan Cahn: Zohar – Golgotha (1)

Jonathan Cahn’s response regarding his quoting the Zohar (Q&A from here):

Question:  It is stated that Jonathan Cahn “says that Zohar, an extrabiblical, mystical source from which the occultic and mystical Kabbalah is derived, greatly influenced his writing.”

Answer:  “Unfortunately this kind of statements represents some of the extreme and bizarre opposition to The Harbinger – It is an extreme false accusation.  No. I have never in my life said that the Zohar has greatly influenced my writing – nor has it ever.  What this accusation is taken from and twisted out of recognition from – Is that I have in some special teachings shared quotes found in the rabbinic writings which unwittingly bear witness of the truth of the Gospel – things that most Jewish people have no idea of – such as Isaiah 53 being about the Messiah, or God being Three in One, Messiah dying for our sins [Dave Mosher Note:  Isaiah 53 in our Bible clearly describes the suffering of Jesus Christ.  Why does Cahn need to appeal to occult, mystic Jewish documents like the Zohar/Kaballah  to get Jewish people to listen? Isn’t reading the Bible itself sufficient for Cahn?], or a connection made between the mercy of God and the word “Golgotha.”  These things can be used to share the Gospel.  This has been a standard method of apologetics and evangelism for ages.  Rabbinical writings, mystical or otherwise, have been quoted for ages, in Bible commentaries, apologetics, works such as The Life and Times of Jesus the Messiah, etc. To take this and then present it as if I or any Christian pastor or scholar is a secret follower of such things because they used a quote to bear witness of the Gospel is, as, one minister friend of mine would say – shameful at best. It should not have even appeared in print.

The apostle Paul actually quoted from a pagan hymn to Zeus in order to share the truth of the Gospel at Mars Hill.  [Dave Mosher: This argument has used by many heretics to justify their quoting Catholics, Buddhists, etc.] If we were to then to accuse him of being into Zeus worship, or that pagan writings were behind the epistles, or accuse of him of being secretly pagan – I would think we would need to repent.  It’s called bearing false witness.”

Sorry, for me the logic does not follow. If Cahn is the born again Christian that he claims, he should condemn the ungodly, occult Zohar/Kaballah. He should not quote it, except in condemnation of its passages.

Let’s look at it another way – would a born again, biblically sound Christian:

… quote from a Catholic document to evangelize Catholics because it seemed to contain some Christian thoughts?
… quote from a Mormon document to evangelize Mormons because it seemed to contain some Christian thoughts?
… quote from a Jehovah’s Witnesses document to evangelize Jehovah’s Witnesses because it seemed to contain some Christian thoughts?
… quote from a New Age document to evangelize New Agers because it seemed to contain some Christian thoughts?
… quote from a Wiccan document to evangelize Wiccans because it seemed to contain some Christian thoughts?
… quote from a Satanic document to evangelize Satanists because it seemed to contain some Christian thoughts?https://davemosher.wordpress.com/2013/02/05/heretical-harbinger-author-jonathan-cahn-who-is-he-and-what-does-he-really-believe/

The answer is no, a born again Christians does not use and does not need extra biblical sources to preach the gospel.

Is Jonathan Cahn possibly a Freemason?

Who do we as Christian know that delve into Gnostic teachings such as the Kabbalah etc?  Freemasons of course.  Is Jonathan Cahn a Freemason?  A picture is worth a thousand words:

Jonathan Cahn - Freemason

Do you need some more proof? The picture below shows Jonathan Cahn showing the Hebrew letter for Shin (ש) hand sign in Kabbalah, made popular by Dr Spok in Star Trek also known as the Vulcan salute.  See here as Nelson Mandela does the same Freemason hand sign.

 Jonathan Cahn - Freemason Hand Sign Shin V

The Hebrew letter ש Shin is the twenty-first letter of the Kabbalistic alphabet

The Shemitah 2015

The Berean Call says:

This imposed Shemitah judgment was very specific and involved  only the nation of Israel . Since no Gentile nations were ever obligated to keep the Shemitah, there is no scriptural basis for suggesting that any other nation would ever experience an imposed Shemitah judgment. Yet, this is precisely what Jonathan Cahn suggests that America has experienced.

Cahn also wrongly implies that the Shemitah is essentially a universal  principle  that is somehow integrated into the order of the universe. Cahn makes the following assertion in his book:

[KAPLAN] “Seven years—the biblical period of time that concerns a nation’s financial and economic realms.” [This and all quotes are taken from: Jonathan Cahn,  The Harbinger  (Lake Mary, FL: Frontline, Charisma Media/Charisma House Book Group, 2011)]

Although Israel was on a seven-year economic cycle, no biblical passages support Cahn’s idea that natural economic cycles of seven years exist for nations in general. Furthermore, financial experts have not identified any seven-year economic cycle. http://www.thebereancall.org/content/october-2014-extra-shemitah

If anything happens during The Shemitah (September 2015), it’s not because of God and a connection to Isaiah 9:10, it’s because the Freemasons who control this world are pushing the buttons and they are making things happen (in cycles of 7 as it’s a ‘magic’ number) for their own purposes to further the progress of a New World Order.

Here is Christine Lagarde from the IMF who tells us that the Illuminati are also very interested in the number 7 and cycles of 7.

Jonathan Cahn is using these Harbinger and Shemitah fables to catch millions of unsuspecting Christians into thinking that it’s God’s timing and God’s hand at work, when in fact it’s Satan’s timing, and Satan’s hand at work.

Occult Teachings:

Title:  Jonathan Cahn on TBN:  God of all Nations  

Why would a Christian like Jonathan Cahn appear on the Vatican’s television channel called TBN?

God is not God of all nations, he is not God of this world.   Satan is god of this world.

2 Corinthians 4:4  “In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.”

Satan is the prince of this world:

John 12:31 “Now is the judgment of this world: now shall the prince of this world be cast out.”

We read that Satan influences the unsaved people of this world, he influences unbeliever’s hopes, dreams, ideals and opinions etc.

Ephesians 2:2 Wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience:

So then who is the God of all nations? None other than Satan of course.

2 Kings 17:29Howbeit every nation made gods of their own, and put them in the houses of the high places which the Samaritans had made, every nation in their cities wherein they dwelt.”

For Jonathan Cahn who claims to be a Christian to not know who the god of this world is, is shocking to say the least.  His god is Satan, and his god is ruling this world.

————-

I have chosen a couple of videos from this list on Jonathan Cahn’s website and found the corresponding video on Youtube where Jonathan teaches occult teachings:

Title: The Alpha Light

Message Number: 1932
Date: 2014-12-21
Summary:  From the beginning of creation to the incarnation and the resurrection – it all begins with light. And not just light, but the alpha light. It is the alpha light that has the power to change everything. Learn the secret of using the Alpha Light in every circumstance to change everything.  [Emphasis added]

So who is this Alpha light Jonathan Cahn is speaking about? The Bible says about God, “I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last.” (Revelation 22:13)  It does not say I am the Alpha light.  Cahn also  says “From the beginning of creation to the incarnation and the resurrection, it all begins with light”  This is a lie, it all began with the Word.  The bible says, “In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.” (John 1:1).

Alpha is the first letter of the Greek alphabet. Omega is the last letter of the Greek alphabet.  In modern usage it would mean “from A to Z”. By combining the two, Alpha and Omega it signifies completeness.  In reference to Jesus Christ it signifies His completeness and demonstrates Him to be the First and the Last, the Beginning and the End.  Jesus is complete. He was with God in the beginning and He will be with God in the end. Jesus is the beginning and the ending.

Who then is this Alpha light who was at the beginning according to Jonathan Cahn.  The bible refers to Satan as being an “angel of light” in 2 Corinthians 11:14-15.  Lucifer is a Latin word that means “light bearer”. It comes from the translation of Isaiah 14:12 where Satan is called הֵילֵל heylel (hay-lale’) in hebrew meaning “the morning-star” (in the sense of brightness) and it’s root word means “to shine”.  So as we can see Satan is seen as someone who gives light.    Satan tried to ursurp God’s throne, the bible says:

Isaiah 14:13-14  “13 For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God: I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north: 14 I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will be like the most High.”

Now we can see why Satan in Luciferianism refers to himself as the Alpha light because he is still trying to be higher than God.  Jonathan Cahn says, “Learn the secret of using the Alpha Light in every circumstance to change everything”.  What he is saying is this, learn to use Satan the Alpha light, instead of Jesus Christ – the way, the truth and the life.

Let’s hear what Freemasons have to say:

LUCIFER PRAISED AS THE LIGHT-BEARER OF FREEMASONRY

“Lucifer, the Light-bearer!  Strange and mysterious name to give to the Spirit of Darkness!  Lucifer, the Son of the Morning!  Is it he who bears the Light, and with its splendors intolerable, blinds feeble, sensual, or selfish souls?  Doubt it not!”  [Albert Pike, Morals and Dogma of the Ancient and Accepted Scottish Rite of Freemasonry, p. 321, 19th Degree of Grand Pontiff; Red Emphasis added]

What a revelation!  From the first degree, the first Initiation, the Mason is urged mightily to “seek the Light“!  The average Mason is continually saying that he is “seeking the Light”, and will spend his entire life “moving toward the Light”.  Almost every person in Western Civilization will assume that this “Light” is the revelation of the God of the Bible; indeed, this statement is held up continuously to try to convince us that Masonry is Christian.  Yet, here, Albert Pike is saying that Lucifer is the One who bears the Light of Freemasonry!  Lucifer is the Light-bearer of Freemasonry http://www.cuttingedge.org/free11.html

————–

Title: The State of Onement

Message Number: 1918
Date: 2014-10-05
Summary: The Mystery of Yom Kippur and the Bible itself is about becoming one with God. Most believers never enter it, but you can. How to live in the state of Onement.  [Emphasis added]

A state on onement?  Jonathan Cahn says: “…the bible itself is about becoming one with God. Most believers never enter it, but you can”  This is clearly a higher level of spirituality of some kind, because until now only some Christians have attained it. Jonathan Cahn will give you the secret on how you can enter into a state of becoming one with God.  Occultists like to take the word “atonement” and break it down to another word “at-one-ment”.A truly born again child of God does not need to become “at-one-ment” or figure out how to find the “state of onement” with God because Jesus said,

John 14:20   “In that day [His resurrection] you will know that I am in my Father, and you in me, and I in you.”

When you come born again, He made us one with Himself, His (our) Father and the Holy Spirit.   You don’t have to figure out how to become at-one with God and neither do you become a god because of this.

New Agers believe that “you are not separate from God; every person is born a piece of God.”  In order to be “at-one-ment” with God you need to meditate and believe that God is in everyone and everything including yourself.  A “state of oneness” means that you need to find the Christ within, and become a God.

Jonathan Cahn teaches that he will give you the keys on how to enter in becoming one with God after you are saved – those who teach that people need to become one with God are proclaiming another Gospel, another Jesus and another spirit.

Please read this article that explains more about At-one-ment or Oneness theory:  Guilt by Association

Conclusion

Jonathan Cahn is a Freemason leading million of Christians astray with his new revelations, keys and mysteries.  He appears on every false teachers TV show and tickles peoples ears with this false teachings.  People need to ignore this man and his teachings.  We are living in the last of the last days and I believe there are going to be more men like Jonathan Cahn (possibly from a messianic stand point) coming to the forefront however they will be even more charismatic and even more deceiving, so much so that if it were possible even the Elect would be deceived.  Please note, he does not believe in the Rapture and believes Christians are going to go through the Tribulation.

Matthew 24:24  “For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect.”

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135 comments to Why Jonathan Cahn and His Revelations Must be Ignored

  • RJ

    wow…. eyes opened big time!!!! THANK YOU for taking the time to write all this! I always held a “leeriness” in my spirit about Cahn, didn’t totally understand why! Now I do.

    Back to that “lonely path” (article you wrote) …. why is it only a very small number of Christians are aware of these things? All other Christians I know just “eat this stuff up”!! And act like you’re the paranoid fool if you don’t get on the bandwagon with them! (hypothetical question)

    That alpha light business = “scary stuff”!!!

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    RJ

    >> why is it only a very small number of Christians are aware of these things? All other Christians I know just “eat this stuff up”!!

    Just a note: Tom wrote the article :)

    The bible will answer this question, “Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.” (Matthew 7:14)
    There is only a very small amount of born again believers walking that narrow path, the rest choose the world and Satan – they think by calling themselves Christian it will make them a Christian in God’s eyes, but He says, “So then because thou art lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot, I will spue thee out of my mouth.” (Revelation 3:16)

  • RJ

    I looked for a byline to see which of you wrote it (to give proper credit due) — didn’t see one. You’re both excellent writers and mostly it’s noted & appreciated that you’re good Bereans of the Word!

    This will be a need to “re-read” as some of this stuff is just well….. like I say, “eye popping”.

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    Thanks RJ!!

  • David

    I don’t ascribe to a pre trib rapture but I do know that Cahn is not to be followed!~

  • angele

    beautiful comments. totally do agree. .

  • david Hornstein

    I think you did a poor job of verifying a lot of your accusations.
    For Example, what evidence do you have that Cahn is a freemason. Zero,
    Nada, no e yet by our try to destroy his character by repeating that and twisting a lot of what he has shared to fit your accusations.
    I don’t think I have ever heard him say the America is a “replacement” or substitute for the nation of Israel, on The contrary, we are more of a reflection of the nation of Israel. Which doesn’t diminish Israel’s role in these last days which we arenin, you seem to doubt that with some of your conjectures.
    A bad expose for many reasons. You have an ax to grind with Cahn, and I’m not sure why. Judgement is coming against out sin and depravity,
    Whether we like it or not……
    Time will bear out the truth of what he has been saying and my spirit does not feel the need to condemn him for anything I have heard him say or do at this point.

  • David wrote,

    I don’t ascribe to a pre trib rapture but I do know that Cahn is not to be followed!~

    Don’t worry, you don’t need to believe in a pre-trib rapture. You will be scooped up anyway if you are saved. Hopefully you won’t protest when it happens.

  • Betsy Jo

    I’ve been warning folks about the falseness of this guy with pretty much just my own discernment, good to have some more research on him. Why, oh why do sooo many have itchy ears?? I know the times!! ~Lord, please draw folks back to yourself, the the good ol’ gospel of Jesus~ Maranatha

  • Vanessa

    I would just like to make a comment about Hebrew Roots or the Messianic Movement. My husband and I were in the Christian church for over 30 years and Yahweh called us out of the church. At the time we couldn’t understand why, but over the past 10 years He has led us into His Torah. The Torah was Yahwehs instruction for man to live by. Yahshua (His Son) had to come to bring Salvation to man, but Yahshua in NO WAY did away with Torah. He kept it right up until His last supper with the disciples which was Passover, and He said He would not participate in this cup until He comes again…which means He will keep Torah on His return. The Christian church was established by pagans and founded on pagan doctrines. Don’t take my word for it, but search it out for yourself. When the Word says Yahshua came to fulfil the Torah does not mean He nailed it to the cross, but He fulfilled it and lived by it and then gave His life so that we could not only abide by Yahwehs Torah, but we could do so in the fulfilment of our Salvation through His Son Yahshua. We are to keep every Feast for Ever…these are Yahwehs Feasts not Jewish Feasts. The Sabbath is on the seventh day of the week being Saturday and not on Sunday as the pagans wanted it as a day for sun worship!! I am also sceptical of Jonathan Cahn, but really spend time in prayer about what the Father is doing in these last days with regards to the Messianic Movement. We are actually part of the 10 lost tribes of Israel whom Yahshua come back for the first time and will do so on the second coming as well. Read in Matthew where is says those not abiding in the Torah (law) will be cast into everlasting darkness.

  • Vanessa, are you a Seventh Day Adventist?

  • Loyd Keith Crawford

    WOW! Back to the books! I had only came across Jonathan Cahn and his teaching in the past few months. I have yet hear him to refer to these other resources……….RETHINKING and discerning. Thanks for the expose.
    II Thessalonians 2:6-12 And now ye know what withholdeth that he might be revealed in his time. For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way. And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming: Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders, And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved. And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie: That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness. KJV

  • catpat

    Why ignore Johnathan Cahn’s Revelation? WAIT… wait & see if it comes to pass. It may be from The Lord! This article is divisive & liberally slings slander… The TRUTH will come out in time! WAIT TO SEE!

  • tyree bruce

    I think this is very well written but I am concerned because I have seen him give the Gospel. I have seen him share his testimony as one who was an atheist. I don’t see him preaching anything about salvation other than Christ for forgiveness. What I do see is a rich teaching of the old Hebrew Customs, not as any part of being saved but in order to experience things in a way that Christians have never thought of. I mean, baptism, he believes in baptism as an outward sign of inward faith. I guess I am very confused as his message of Grace by Faith has spread where many would not have bothered in the past. His putting the USA in parallel with Israel is nothing short of uncanny. I am watching the At One Ment portion and I didn’t see anything wrong with what he said..he says we have to give God the very worst, all of it, we have to be willing to atone..not the good things but the very worst things.. You cannot deny the facts as he explains them. Now, if you are saying his revelations regarding judgement on the USA for denying our Christian foundation, and turning away from God are from Satan, I will have to scratch my head..it doesn’t seem as if that would be possible because he hasn’t twisted anything, he has put things out there in a very literal way..I guess I will keep on looking into this.you do have me wondering..

  • tyree bruce

    Jonathan Cahn is into Hebrew mysticism and the Kabbalah. The Jesus of the Bible is not a mystical Jesus (John 18:20). Cahn’s Jesus is not the Jesus of the Bible (2 Corinthians 11:4).

    Please read this article here.

  • catpat

    I think we should rather focus on God’s own Revelation (the last book in the Bible) than on Jonathan Cahn’s so-called revelation.

    Please read here and here.

  • Kim

    catpat wrote:

    Here he says it again on Glen Becks show.  Glen Beck is a Mormon.  Why would a christian like Jonathan Cahn appear on a Mormon’s show?

    I totally agree, I have watched Jonathon Cahn several times, and as a Christian , I think he is a very brilliant man, that knows a lot about Jewish history and I do believe he has been sent by God to write the Harbinger !!! NO MAN COULD HAVE PUT ALL THAT TOGETHER WITHOUT GODS HELP !!!!

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    david Hornstein

    >> A bad expose for many reasons. You have an ax to grind with Cahn, and I’m not sure why. Judgement is coming against out sin and depravity,

    You are the type of person who you can show the truth so that it jumps out and bites you and you will ignore it through and through. If you don’t want to see the truth, then follow Jonatha Cahn’s Alpha light ok and while you are at it you can try get into a state of oneness with God, ok? Good. now move on please and let people who care about the gospel of Jesus Christ pay attention to the truth.

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    Vanessa

    >> We are actually part of the 10 lost tribes of Israel whom Yahshua come back for the first time and will do so on the second coming as well.

    How do you know this? Are you just guessing or are you really Jewish? Because that is what it means to be part of the 10 tribes, it means you are actually Jewish.

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    catpat

    >> WAIT… wait & see if it comes to pass.

    My goodness did you not read the article? I said in the article, “If anything happens during The Shemitah (September 2015), it’s not because of God and a connection to Isaiah 9:10, it’s because the Freemasons who control this world are pushing the buttons and they are making things happen (in cycles of 7 as it’s a ‘magic’ number) for their own purposes to further the progress of a New World Order.”

    So let’s repeat that: Satan will make it come to pass because it’s his timing and his hand at work. Not God. So if something happens in September you can not say it’s God and you can not say Jonathan Cahn is now a prophet of God either.

    Do you understand now? Please tell me you understand.

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    Dear tytee bruce

    >> have seen him give the Gospel.

    Yes I have also seen him preach the a version of the gospel that sounds pretty ok and then I have seen him tell HUGE satanic lies for eg, the Alpha light and State of oneness. Tell me, did the disciples, apostles and Jesus for that matter preach the truth and then preach satanic lies? No they did not, they preached the truth 100% of the time.

    That’s the catch Tytee, false teachers will preach the truth to a certain extent and then add in their false teaching – it’s called entrapment! He preaches the truth to hook people and because of this lures people into the dangers he will preach another time.

    >> it doesn’t seem as if that would be possible because he hasn’t twisted anything,

    You kidding right? Did you not read the Alpha light and state of oneness at the bottom of the article? If that is not scripture twisting then I give up.

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    Loyd

    Yes please go and review Jonathan Cahn under the microscope and you will get a shock. There are actually hundreds of other teachings from this list on Jonathan Cahn’s website

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    Kim

    Jonathan Cahn is VERY VERY clever, so clever that he is catching you out and you because you don’t want to go and investigate further are going to be caught out.

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    Thanks for the comment Betsy Jo :)

  • Hanya

    Seems to me this guy has many things askewed. Lucifer existed with God our Creator in the Heavens before the Earth & many things. Lucifer was a very high angel, I believe an archangel. He WAS obediant to God, but then became disobedient (self-righteous). I believe he was called the angel of light, a lot of responsibility there. God’s Word in Genisis often states ‘we’ or ‘let us’ in the creation, so perhaps he was the light guy (LOL), but at some point he got others to side with him & so God kicked him out, and about a third of others went with him worshipping him instead of God. So, be careful in reading the Book. You better know the right translation from Hebrew and old Greek, Latin, etc, & the small light from the higher case Light in reference to Lucifer or Jesus… and that goes for small g or higher case in god or God, because indeed, Lucifer is NEVER God, and God is over everything including this world. Yes, Lucifer is call the prince of darkness in this world, where Jesus is the Prince of Peace in this world. I don’t have time to correct ALL your misunderstandings & twistings, but if you look carefully at the Freemasons, you will also learn when they refer to him of small light & He of the Greater LIGHT OF THE WORLD.
    First impression to less informed might be that you are quite educated, but you have plenty to learn. I pray you get set ‘straight’.

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    Hanya

    >> God’s Word in Genisis often states ‘we’ or ‘let us’ in the creation, so perhaps he was the light guy (LOL),

    Genesis 1:26 And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.”

    The ‘us’ or ‘we’ or ‘let us’ in Genesis refers the other part of the Trinity that being JESUS CHRIST and THE HOLY SPIRIT not Satan.

    >> and God is over everything including this world.

    Satan is god of this world However God is in control of this world and gives Satan free reign to do whatever he wants up to a point.

    When Jesus was being tempted, the following happened:

      Matthew 4:8 “Again, the devil taketh him up into an exceeding high mountain, and sheweth him all the kingdoms of the world, and the glory of them; 9And saith unto him, All these things will I give thee, if thou wilt fall down and worship me.

    Satan was made god of this world by mankind, read:

    Luke 4:6 “And the devil said unto him, All this power will I give thee, and the glory of them: for that is delivered unto me; and to whomsoever I will I give it.”

    Satan is god of this world, so much so that he could offer Jesus all the kingdoms of the world if Jesus bowed down and worshiped him. The same applies to mankind, Satan is god of this world and if you bow down and worship him he will give you this world and all it’s riches because it’s his to give.

    And because of this John says that “the whole world lieth in wickedness” (1 Jn. 5:19) because

      Revelation 12:9 And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.

    >> First impression to less informed might be that you are quite educated, but you have plenty to learn. I pray you get set ‘straight’.

    Yes I pray you can one day distinguish between Satan and Jesus Christ.

  • Hanya

    [deleted by DTW]

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    Just a note: It’s even getting so bad that not only is Jonathan Cahn seen as a prophet but people are now saying he is ONE OF THE TWO END TIME WITNESSES FROM REVELATION 11!!!

    What a lie. People please do not believe this stuff.

  • catpat

    Dear Discerning Deborah ~ The Most High God is surely able to bring judgement on this earth according to Isaiah 9:10, as Cahn has claimed… Will He? According to scripture judgement comes to God’s people to edify & correct… Is He bringing it on a backsliding nation that ignores The God it has claimed from it’s founding, according to what Cahn says The Lord showed him? Don’t know… I say ~ WAIT ~ & while we wait ~ REPENT ~ Peace to you

  • Justin

    Well, we will see come this late summer/fall whether he heard God or made it up.

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    catput and Justin

    I have a feeling that something is going to happen in Sept because there is too much hype about it. But it’s not God’s timing and it’s not His hand. It’s all freemason planned.

  • Natasha Lowery

    I am going to pray about what you’ve said here. I did consider Mr. Cahn a prophet. I don’t believe that prophets are for only the last days. Just because the Bible says that men and women will prophesy in the last days does not preclude them doing so before the last days. Even still, as you yourself acknowledge we are in the last of the last days, he could be a prophet of God. He could be Luciferian. Unfortunately, I can see both sides of the coin, which is especially troubling. How easy it is for even those who read scripture, pray and even fast to be deceived! Lord, have mercy! The Bible does not support a pre-tribulation rapture. In Revelation, we are shown the tribulation and then it says and THEN Jesus will return. So, it is tribulation, Jesus’s return for his believers, and then the wrath of God poured out on the unbelievers who are left. We are not getting out of the tribulation. The Bible is clear about this. If fact, Jesus tells believers that we will suffer and be persecuted and hated and that following him will bring us great troubles. We follow him anyway out of obedience. The disciples were martyred for their belief. Christians have been persecuted throughout history (by even “Christians” in the form of Catholics….i.e., the Crusades). Why should the last days be any different? Even now, Christians are being persecuted around the world by muslims and even “peace-loving” hindus. Why would we escape the tribulation? As God is the same yesterday, today, and tomorrow, why would He all of a sudden decide that end times Christians should be spared if he never spared them before? Are you confusing tribulation with God’s wrath poured out? These are two different events. Please revisit Revelation and see the truth. Tribulation is satan’s wrath poured out on believers and the great and terrible day of the Lord is God’s wrath poured out on unbelievers. Thank you for giving us all something to consider so that we can be discerning about what we believe and who we follow after. We must follow after Jesus and beware of false teachers. Sometimes, it seems easier just to remain in pray and read scripture rather than listen to Youtube videos and preachers. Probably safer to do that as well. Peace to you. In Christ.

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    Dear Natasha Lowery

    ‘those days and ‘the last days’ in these bible verses mean the tribulation.

    Acts 2:17-18 “And it shall come to pass in the last days, saith God, I will pour out of my Spirit upon all flesh: and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, and your young men shall see visions, and your old men shall dream dreams:” 18 And on my servants and on my handmaidens I will pour out in those days of my Spirit; and they shall prophesy:
    (Joel 2:28)

    We are not in the tribulation…yet.

    >> The Bible does not support a pre-tribulation rapture. In Revelation, we are shown the tribulation and then it says and THEN Jesus will return.

    Read all our articles on the Rapture here:

    You confuse us being caught up in air with Jesus Christ second coming.

  • Natasha Lowery wrote,

    The Bible does not support a pre-tribulation rapture.

    Would you mind telling me what Jesus meant when He said the following?

    Let your loins be girded about, and your lights burning; And ye yourselves like unto men that wait for their lord, when he will return from the wedding; that when he cometh and knocketh, they may open unto him immediately. (Luke 12:35-36)

    To whom is He speaking?

    The trouble of which Jesus speaks is his wrath which He is going to pour out on the entire world and not his Bride.

    Because thou hast kept the word of my patience, I also will keep thee from the hour of temptation, which shall come upon all the world, to try them that dwell upon the earth. (Revelation 3:10)

  • RJ

    admit: I was too impatient to listen to the entire youtube er, uh “sermon” ~ but did get to the 2 minute point & heard him speak several times of the “at ONE ment”

    Agree with you that this is an occultic new age term AND BELIEF!! While surfing, not purposely looking for, but came across this article at LightHouse Trails & with your hopeful permission, will post it here:
    http://www.lighthousetrailsresearch.com/blog/?p=5095 This is more on the “at ONE ment” which I never even heard of before reading your article here!

    Real Christians let’s pray for each other! We’re in the battle zones!! I totally bottomed out (emotionally, spiritually, physically) over the last handful of days. I’m okay now, but I also realize every time I post something that the dark side (powers & principalities) sure like to come after me!

    Spiritual armor ON!!! We’re on the front lines here!

  • Santos Garcia Jr

    You have made a significant number of ‘loose connections’ with selective statements from the texts, without recognizing that the premise of his writing in the ‘Harbinger’ are valid and evident in America. I question whether you have actually read ‘The Mystery of the Shemitah’ since the evidence stands up under scrutiny. It’s as if you have an axe to grind; I’m fortunate to have read, studied, and confirmed to my satisfaction the reality of these cyclic Judgments that are now clearly evident in America, as I am certain the many millions who have likewise read and studied the implications more carefully than you have would agree.

    I reviewed both books on my blog with clear and compelling evidence that corroborates the reality of the 9 ‘Harbingers’ and the cyclic mystery that is ‘The Shemitah’. In the right panel search field on my blog linked- type the two keywords, and read the articles with author interview links that clearly show the validity of the Rabbi’s exegesis. If one has not read them (I’ve read both more than once- 4 & 2), that person had no validity according to the Bible- (check Proverbs). ‘zionsgate.wordpress.com’

    ps… Do you call your biological Father- Father?… then why are you splitting hairs when clearly we all call our fathers father, our school teachers- teachers, and Rabbinical scholars- Rabbis. Sad… really.

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    Santos

    >> I’m fortunate to have read, studied, and confirmed to my satisfaction the reality of these cyclic Judgments that are now clearly evident in America

    Have you read, studied and confirmed what the bible has to say?

    Clearly not because you are happy to call Jonathan Cahn a Rabbi after the BIBLE (God’s Word to you) tells you that you are not too.

    You also dismiss his teachings on the Alpha light and State of Onement which are occult teachings.

    I am sorry but I can’t take your ‘studies’ of The Mystery of the Shemitah seriously if you can’t and don’t want to understand what false teaching is when it’s presented to you on a silver platter. Now that is sad.

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    Is Jonathan Cahn pro Roman Catholic?

    Only one building was not harmed which was St. Paul’s Chapel, which was protected by a sycamore tree that is believed to have captured the blast.[7][8] Cahn points out that St. Paul’s Chapel was also the place that the government of the United States prayed on the day of the first inauguration of George Washington on April 30, 1789. The sycamore is known today as the 9/11 Sycamore and a memorial was built for it. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Harbinger_(novel)

    America’s “ground of consecration” was established in New York on April 30, 1789 on the occasion of the inauguration of our first president. The Nation’s first chief executive, George Washington, took his oath of office on April 30, 1789 on the balcony of the Senate Chamber at Federal Hall on Wall Street, NY. Washington’s first address to the American people included a prophetic warning: “… we ought to be no less persuaded that the propitious smiles of Heaven can never be expected on a nation that disregards the eternal rules of order and right which Heaven itself has ordained;”

    After the inauguration the new President, Congress and public walked from Federal Hall down the street to St. Paul’s Chapel to pray and commit the nation to God. That “ground of consecration” is now known as Ground Zero where the twin towers once stood. http://www.throneofgod.com/Harbinger/harbinger.html

    St Peters church is a Roman Catholic church that was saved from the blast because of the Sycamore tree. Cahn points out a connection, that it was the place where the government prayed back in 1789 and dedicated America to God. Wow, they prayed in a Roman Catholic church dedicated America to God in a Roman Catholic church. Really? Then God saved a Roman Catholic church to be used as a sign? I think not.

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    RJ wrote:

    admit: I was too impatient to listen to the entire youtube er, uh “sermon” ~ but did get to the 2 minute point & heard him speak several times of the “at ONE ment”

    Agree with you that this is an occultic new age term AND BELIEF!! While surfing, not purposely looking for, but came across this article at LightHouse Trails & with your hopeful permission, will post it here:
    http://www.lighthousetrailsresearch.com/blog/?p=5095 This is more on the “at ONE ment” which I never even heard of before reading your article here!

    Real Christians let’s pray for each other! We’re in the battle zones!! I totally bottomed out (emotionally, spiritually, physically) over the last handful of days. I’m okay now, but I also realize every time I post something that the dark side (powers & principalities) sure like to come after me!

    Spiritual armor ON!!! We’re on the front lines here!

    THANK YOU RJ FOR THIS :)

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    Thank you for commenting Bren!

  • Animalaura

    NEWSFLASH: Mormons, the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints, …ARE Christians!! Most people are aware of that fact.

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    Animalaura

    NEWSFLASH: Mormons, the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints, …ARE NOT Christians!! EVERYONE that is born again is aware of that fact.

  • JEREMIAH

    Deborah (Discerning the World) wrote:

    Animalaura

    NEWSFLASH: Mormons, the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints, …ARE NOT Christians!! EVERYONE that is born again is aware of that fact.

    That through this post, mormons would find a way to “pop up” amazes me. Mormons are not Christians even though they delude themselves they are. There is no mention of a new gospel, re John Smith’s Book of Mormon. On the contrary, Galatians 1 warns explicitly against such falsehood. Simple as A B C.
    As far as Jonathan Cahn is concerned, I choose to watch and pray.
    The emphasis on the Jewish elements does make me skeptical.
    “For I have resolved to know nothing else among you than Jesus Christ, and Him Crucified.” 1st Corinthians 2:2

    By Grace ALONE.

  • I started reading the book and got a red light immediately. Started getting sick to my stomach. It’s called discernment!

  • anon

    Hello. I don’t know if my comment will post but I will try for truths sake. This Jonathan Cahn guy is a liar because he is a false prophet. All these people who believe they have connections to king David are false. If people would read the bible they will see that the true Jews are in the land of captivity not in Israel. Those that are in Israel are imposter called Kaysars just like this guy. The real jews are people of color. Brown people (so called blacks). We identify the people by the curses not the blessings. People read the bible. The last day prophecies surround the True Jews which Jonathan Cahn is clearly not. This is a lie to keep the truth hidden. Just wanted to clarify things. He is not a Jew, rabbi, or anything. If he doesn’t repent he will perish like the rest of these liars.

  • Dinah

    Deborah (Discerning the World) wrote:

    Is Jonathan Cahn pro Roman Catholic?
    Only one building was not harmed which was St. Paul’s Chapel, which was protected by a sycamore tree that is believed to have captured the blast.[7][8] Cahn points out that St. Paul’s Chapel was also the place that the government of the United States prayed on the day of the first inauguration of George Washington on April 30, 1789.

    St Peters church is a Roman Catholic church that was saved from the blast because of the Sycamore tree. Cahn points out a connection, that it was the place where the government prayed back in 1789 and dedicated America to God. Wow, they prayed in a Roman Catholic church dedicated America to God in a Roman Catholic church. Really? Then God saved a Roman Catholic church to be used as a sign? I think not.

    This is proving you are not getting your facts straight. It says right above that it was St. Paul’s Chapel and you changed it to St. Peters Roman Catholic. St. Paul’s is Episcopalian… I agree the spirit of anti-Christ is working through the Vatican and the RCC, and I don’t know much about Episcopalian, but if you want credibility for your statements you must get your facts straight. It seem you spend a lot of time slamming your fellow brothers and sisters in the faith, we are all just seeking the Truth here…praying for discernment. These are confusing times!

  • Dinah,

    And you should agree that Christians often do make mistakes.

  • Dinah

    I made a mistake. Sorry about that.

    Let’s look at St Paul’s Chapel designed by Freemasons, for Freemasons to worship a false God. Triangle roof with pillars – even has the checkered black and white tiled floor in the front of the church – this church is a Freemason lodge in disguise.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/St._Paul%27s_Chapel
    https://www.trinitywallstreet.org/about/stpaulschapel

    It might not be Roman Catholic, it might be Episcopalian with Anglican roots – but it’s certainly not Christian :)

  • Dinah

    Seeing as though when I tell something you think I am lying, (my only mistake was saying St Peter instead of St Paul) let’s look at what others say on the matter. Maybe you will believe them instead. Maybe you will believe wikipedia? Who knows.

    What is Episcopalian? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Episcopal_Church_(United_States)

    “The Episcopal Church (TEC), less commonly known by its other official title, the Protestant Episcopal Church in the United States of America[2] (PECUSA[3][4] or ECUSA[5][6][7]), is the United States-based member church of the worldwide Anglican Communion.”…

    “The Episcopal Church describes itself as being Reformed and “Protestant, Yet Catholic”.[8] …”

    “Until 1964, the only official name in use was “The Protestant Episcopal Church in the United States of America”. In the 19th century, High Church members advocated changing the name, which they felt did not acknowledge the church’s Catholic heritage.”…

    “In 1976, the General Convention adopted a new prayer book, which was a substantial revision and modernization of the previous 1928 edition. It incorporated many principles of the Roman Catholic Church’s liturgical movement, which had been discussed at Vatican II.”…

    “Varying styles and degrees of liturgical practice prevail within the church, including: traditional hymns and anthems, more modern religious music, Anglican chant, liturgical dance, charismatic prayer, and vested clergy. As varied as services can be, the central binding aspect is the Book of Common Prayer or supplemental liturgies. Most Episcopal services are similar in structure and liturgy to the Roman Catholic Church, as the Eucharist is the central focus of the service (often called mass), though Protestant theology in the Book of Common Prayer distinguishes Episcopal services from Roman Catholic ones.”…

    The list goes on.

    So I ask again…Is Jonathan Cahn pro Roman Catholic?

  • bradly

    JEREMIAH wrote:

    Deborah (Discerning the World) wrote:

    Animalaura

    NEWSFLASH: Mormons, the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints, …ARE NOT Christians!! EVERYONE that is born again is aware of that fact.

    That through this post, mormons would find a way to “pop up” amazes me. Mormons are not Christians even though they delude themselves they are. There is no mention of a new gospel, re John Smith’s Book of Mormon. On the contrary, Galatians 1 warns explicitly against such falsehood. Simple as A B C.
    As far as Jonathan Cahn is concerned, I choose to watch and pray.
    The emphasis on the Jewish elements does make me skeptical.
    “For I have resolved to know nothing else among you than Jesus Christ, and Him Crucified.” 1st Corinthians 2:2

    By Grace ALONE.

    Please be careful not to speak for other churches that are not of your congregation … not for my benefit, but out of principle, to not jump to conclusions without first studying it out and taking the matter to the Lord. I am a mormon, as some choose to call it, and I love Jesus Christ more than I can adequately express. I love the Bible, I feel the Spirit often when I read it, and know it to be the word of God. I also love the scriptural record of the descendents of Joseph (of Egypt) … which are known to the world today at The Book of Mormon or “stick of Ephraim”. You mentioned in your comment that there is no reference for such a record or gospel in the Bible … but I invite all to prayerfully read the following 2 passages:

    Ezekiel 37:15-23

    15 ¶The word of the LORD came again unto me, saying,
    16 Moreover, thou son of man, take thee one stick, and write upon it, For Judah, and for the children of Israel his companions: then take another stick, and write upon it, For Joseph, the stick of Ephraim, and for all the house of Israel his companions:
    17 And join them one to another into one stick; and they shall become one in thine hand.
    18 ¶And when the children of thy people shall speak unto thee, saying, Wilt thou not shew us what thou meanest by these?
    19 Say unto them, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Behold, I will take the stick of Joseph, which is in the hand of Ephraim, and the tribes of Israel his fellows, and will put them with him, even with the stick of Judah, and make them one stick, and they shall be one in mine hand.
    20 ¶And the sticks whereon thou writest shall be in thine hand before their eyes.
    21 And say unto them, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Behold, I will take the children of Israel from among the heathen, whither they be gone, and will gather them on every side, and bring them into their own land:
    22 And I will make them one nation in the land upon the mountains of Israel; and one king shall be king to them all: and they shall be no more two nations, neither shall they be divided into two kingdoms any more at all:
    23 Neither shall they defile themselves any more with their idols, nor with their detestable things, nor with any of their transgressions: but I will save them out of all their dwellingplaces, wherein they have sinned, and willcleanse them: so shall they be my people, and I will be their God.

    **In this, we receive insight that two copies of their history were to be maintained throughout the generations of Judah and Ephraim respectively. The copy that was maintained and added upon by the tribe of Judah (the Jews) was eventually compiled and brought forth to the world as the Holy Bible. The other copy that was to be maintained by the generations of Ephraim … to eventually serve as another testament of Jesus Christ and mark the gathering of Christ’s covenant followers … was compiled and brought forth as The Book of Mormon (named after one of their civilization’s last prophet-historians who abridged the massive record). The “stick of Ephraim” mentioned in Ezekiel, came into the possession of one of his descendants, Lehi, around the time of Jeremiah’s ministry. Prior to destroying Jerusalem in the the 6th century BC, the Lord led Lehi’s family (with the records) out of the land and eventually to occupy the continents of North and South America (the ancient ancestors of our Native Americans). As commanded and prophesied in the book of Ezekiel, these two books (or sticks) are today joined in one to testify to the world that Jesus is the Christ, the very Son of God …”that in the mouth of two or three witnesses every word may be established.” (Matt 18:16)

    One other scripture I would invite the readers to prayerfully consider …

    John 10:15-16

    15 As the Father knoweth me, even so know I the Father: and I lay down my life for the sheep.
    16 And other sheep I have, which are not of this fold: them also I must bring, and they shall hear my voice; and there shall be one fold, and one shepherd.

    ***Here, Jesus Christ himself hints to the people that He knows of and must proceed to gather other “sheep” that are not of that fold in the Holy Land, but are elsewhere in the world. This is also consistent with the before mentioned prophecy, wherein he says “I will take the children of Israel from among the heathen, whither they be gone, and I will gather them on every side”. When Christ speaks of “sheep”, He refers to covenant people of the Lord who follow him (see the parable of the sheep and goats in Matthew 25). But as is the case and design of Christ’s parables, not everyone understood what He meant by His statement.

    I realize people may scoff at this explanation, but I have spoken the truth and leave it for the reader to consider … not to take my word for it, heaven forbid, but to ask God for themselves. That’s the beautiful and sacred thing about prayer, to whomever is sincere, God will answer them plainly with distinct feelings and thoughts (James 1:5)

    One final note … I have studied and pondered The Book of Mormon dozens of times and I can honestly say it has enriched my love for the Bible. In areas where the Bible has had confusion (from translation errors or otherwise), the same teaching was clarified to another nation in such a way to adequately cover that teaching and confirm the truth. I testify that God is good, He sees the end from the beginning, and will always prepare a way for those who faithfully follow Him, and that it only through the mercies and merits of Jesus Christ that we are saved, after all we can give and do. Amen.

    Thank you for your time. Good day.

  • bradly wrote,

    Please be careful not to speak for other churches that are not of your congregation … not for my benefit, but out of principle, to not jump to conclusions without first studying it out and taking the matter to the Lord. I am a mormon, as some choose to call it, and I love Jesus Christ more than I can adequately express. I love the Bible, I feel the Spirit often when I read it, and know it to be the word of God. I also love the scriptural record of the descendents of Joseph (of Egypt) … which are known to the world today at The Book of Mormon or “stick of Ephraim”. You mentioned in your comment that there is no reference for such a record or gospel in the Bible … but I invite all to prayerfully read the following 2 passages:

    We are commanded to test all things. If whatever you believe does not harmonize with the Word of God we must reject it. And that’s precisely why Deborah said that Mormonism is not Christian and I agree with her.

    Ezekiel 37:15-23 has nothing to do with writing books – neither the Bible nor the book of Mormon. The prophet simply wrote the name “Judah” on one stick and the names “Ephraim and Joseph” on the other. Your assertion that the one is the Bible in the other the Book of Mormon completely ignores the clear interpretation in verses 18 to 28. After King Solomon’s death the nation was split into two in 931 BC. Judah was the Southern Kingdom. Israel was the Northern Kingdom, sometimes called Ephraim (Hosea 5:3, 5, 11–14). The uniting of the sticks is simply an allegory of God’s intention to restore and unite his people in the Land of Israel as a single nation at the Second Coming of Christ. (Hosea 1:11).

    You say you love Jesus. What Jesus are you talking about? There are many false Jesuses.

  • bradly

    Thank you for your comments, Tom. I apologize if it seemed I ignored those later verses. Those are also very relevant, both for that ancient time and as a type or shadow of our day in age … even this special era of gathering, leading up to the time when the greatest of all, the prince of David (Jesus Christ), will return to the earth as lord of lords and king of kings. And oh what a day! When, as he says in verse 26, “I will make a covenant of peace with them; it shall be an everlasting covenant with them: and I will place them, and multiply them, and will set my sanctuary in the midst of them for evermore.” I long for that great millennial day, as I’m sure you do.

    So, I didn’t ignore them … it was simply a deeper conversation than I thought would be tolerated in this particular instance. But I would love to discuss it more, if you are interested.

    To answer your question … I speak of Jesus of Nazareth who was born of Mary and consecrated for the holiest of missions. I speak reverently of this my Savior, who atoned for my sins and yours in the Garden of Gethsemane … he who came unto His own people as Messiah, and yet was rejected, mocked, scourged and crucified. I speak of Him, “the firstfruits of them that slept”, who rose from the grave on that third day. He lives! And because He lives, so will we. And I cannot thank Him enough for it. I can only give Him my heart, my hands to serve, and my allegiance … even my all.

    Thank you for the opportunity to share.

  • bradly

    Tom, I realized I didn’t address the original concerns about the “sticks” … sorry about that.

    Christian Bible scholars have explained it better than I can, so I’ll just reference them. To be perfectly honest, I don’t know much at all about Matthew Easton, A.R. Faussett, or William Smith … but it seemed better to reference them here, instead of an LDS resource that might come across as being biased.

    All three mention these “sticks” or “cylinders” in relation to books or scrolls in former days.

    Scroll in Easton’s Bible Dictionary
    – Roll

    The common form of ancient books. The Hebrew word rendered “roll” or “volume” is “meghillah”, found in Ezra 6:2; Ps. 40:7; Jer. 36:2, 6, 23, 28, 29; Ezek. 2:9; 3:1-3; Zech. 5:1, 2. “Rolls” (Chald. pl. of sephar, corresponding to Heb. sepher) in Ezra 6:1 is rendered in the Revised Version “archives.” In the New Testament the word “volume” (Heb. 10:7; R.V., “roll”) occurs as the rendering of the Greek kephalis, meaning the head or top of the stick or cylinder on which the manuscript was rolled, and hence the manuscript itself.
    http://www.bible-history.com/eastons/R/Roll/

    Scroll in Fausset’s Bible Dictionary
    – Roll

    Ancient writings were rolled round a cylinder or stick. Volume means so (Jeremiah 36:2; Psalm 40:7; compare Deuteronomy 31:26; Ezekiel 2:9-10, where the writing “within and without” was contrary to the usage of writing only on one side, implying the fullness of the prophecy of woe. The writing was in columns (delathot), literally, doors, on parchment or prepared skins.
    http://www.bible-history.com/faussets/R/Roll/

    Scroll in Smiths Bible Dictionary
    -Roll

    A book in ancient times consisted of a single long strip of paper or parchment, which was usually kept rolled upon a stick, and was unrolled when a person wished to read it. The roll was usually written on one side only, and hence the particular notice of one that was “written within and without.” Eze 2:10 The writing was arranged in columns.
    http://www.bible-history.com/smiths/R/Roll/

    Hopefully that helped.

    Have a great weekend!

  • Daniel

    Other than his referencing the Zohar, I agree with nearly all of what Cahn says. His connection between the US and Israel is accurate. The Christian population of America is represented by Ephraim, one of the lost tribes. This is very clear is you study the Old Testament and the tribes. And the feasts are meant to be kept, as are the commandments. The Roman Church corrupted the faith with their pagan holidays, rituals, dogmas, Sunday worship, etc. And America will soon face judgment, just as he claims, the signs of this coming are everywhere. The only thing that I find interesting I also noticed the masonic and gestures he uses, which led me to this article. That’s a little worrying, I wonder what his true purpose is..

  • margie

    Deborah (Discerning the World) wrote:

    catpat
    >> WAIT… wait & see if it comes to pass.
    My goodness did you not read the article? I said in the article, “If anything happens during The Shemitah (September 2015), it’s not because of God and a connection to Isaiah 9:10, it’s because the Freemasons who control this world are pushing the buttons and they are making things happen (in cycles of 7 as it’s a ‘magic’ number) for their own purposes to further the progress of a New World Order.”
    So let’s repeat that: Satan will make it come to pass because it’s his timing and his hand at work. Not God. So if something happens in September you can not say it’s God and you can not say Jonathan Cahn is now a prophet of God either.
    Do you understand now? Please tell me you understand.

    God is in charge of everything. If something comes to pass, it isn’t because of the freemasons, it’s because God allowed them to do what they planned to do. Nothing happens without HIS approval.

  • badly

    Did you watch the video I posted?

  • bradly

    Hopefully you can see that there is a vast difference between a roll (scroll) and a stick. The word for roll is “megillâh” pronounced meg-il-law’ and the word for stick is “‛êts,” pronounced ates. You are trying to read into Scripture which is not there and that’s dangerous. It is called deception.

  • Daniel,

    You are a little worried about the masonic signs Jonathan Cahn makes but wholeheartedly believe that he is a prophet of God? How does that work for you? Masonic signs are from the devil and yet you believe he is a prophet of God who predicts things accurately? What is wrong with you?

    Woe unto them that call evil good, and good evil; that put darkness for light, and light for darkness; that put bitter for sweet, and sweet for bitter! (Isa 5:20)

  • bradly

    I’m a third of the way through it … it’s a little lengthy. :)

    With the various discussion items, already in the first 40 minutes or so, it would feel very narrow and unproductive to merely pick 1 or 2 to elaborate on. Also, some of the topics are very sacred in nature and probably shouldn’t be discussed loosely in an open forum.

    Overall, it seems like they had good intentions in making the video. I am a little disappointed by some of the context/framing of a handful of the quotes, but I can see that did the best they could with the information they had.

    Tom, you’ve been kind to interact with me. I am glad you are a god-fearing man, and I wish you the best.

    I affirm to everyone once more that I believe in Jesus Christ. I know that He is our Redeemer and the only name under heaven by which we can be saved. I do not pretend to know that, I am certain.

  • bradly wrote,

    I affirm to everyone once more that I believe in Jesus Christ. I know that He is our Redeemer and the only name under heaven by which we can be saved. I do not pretend to know that, I am certain.

    In that case you cannot remain in the Mormon church. You must leave it. It is either Mormonism or Jesus Christ. You cannot have both. Jesus said,

    Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that entereth not by the door into the sheepfold, but climbeth up some other way, the same is a thief and a robber. But he that entereth in by the door is the shepherd of the sheep. To him the porter openeth; and the sheep hear his voice: and he calleth his own sheep by name, and leadeth them out. And when he putteth forth his own sheep, he goeth before them, and the sheep follow him: for they know his voice. And a stranger will they not follow, but will flee from him: for they know not the voice of strangers. (John 10:1-5)

  • HinTom and Deb

    Thanks for posting this discission. I have a few friends swallowing this hook line and sinker, but won’t read the Word to see different.

    Regarding pre-trib as i see some of the posts, if i may address that part a bit more clearly.

    Rev 12 speaks of a man-child – not Jesus, but those born from a woman, the Body of Christ on Earth (hate saying “the Church “cuz some think it as RC), anyway the man-child was taken up right after birth.

    As well the woman who gave birth (not Mary) fled into the wilderness for 3.5 (times) where God has prepared a place for her and then wasnt seen after that but her seed was mentioned that the serpant was wroth with.

    That seed are those who i believed got saved or reminant of the Church left behind.
    To say all Christians will be raptured isnt biblical too. Story of the 10 virgins, 5 wise, 5 foolish dispells that notion.

  • Should be Hi Tom and Deb…dang ipad autocorrect

    How do you change the avitar? Dont like mine as looking angry :-b.

  • Bradly, if it helps my wife was a past Mormon and renounced and remover her name from their book of life – so she was serious about following Jesus.

    The verse that set her free was the 3rd from last verse of the Bible

    Rev 22:19 19 And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book.

    I would say Bradly is dig deeper into the Mormon teachings. They preach Jesus and Lucifer were brothers; we are becoming gods; baptize for the dead which ends up taking away man’s free will. Think of it, baptize for Hitler? Plus they deny the gifts of the Holy Spirit are not for today, but have ceased with the Apostles.

  • Hi Tom-the other one

    The church (all true believers) are never referred to as “a man child.” She is always referred to as the “Bride of Christ” or a “chaste virgin.” Revelation 12 clearly identifies the “man child” for us in these words, “And she brought forth a man child, who was to rule all nations with a rod of iron: and her child was caught up unto God, and to his throne. (Revelation 12:5). This clearly proves that the “man child” is Jesus Christ. In fact “who was to rule all nations with a rod of iron” is a quote from Psalm 2 which, you must agree, is a Messianic Psalm. “Ask of me, and I shall give thee the heathen for thine inheritance, and the uttermost parts of the earth for thy possession. Thou shalt break them with a rod of iron; thou shalt dash them in pieces like a potter’s vessel.” (Psalm 2:8-9). I’m sure you will agree that this section of the Psalm refers to the literal thousand years reign of Jesus Christ on the earth when He is going to ascend his father, David’s throne to rule the nations. (Luke 1:30-33).

    You are right in saying the woman in Revelation 12 is not Mary and neither is she the church. She is Israel. If the man child is Jesus Christ as we’ve seen from Psalm 2, then the church (Bride of Christ) cannot possibly be the woman because the Body of Christ (all the believers) could never have brought forth Christ Jesus, the man child. The church came forth from the man child and not the other way around. Indeed, Jesus Himself said “salvation is of the Jews.” (John 4:22). There are many other proofs that the woman in Revelation 12 is Israel which I can’t go into right now.

    The five wise and five foolish virgins have nothing to do with the Rapture. At the Rapture the Bride of Christ is caught up to meet the Lord in the air so as to be with Him for evermore. Matthew 25 follows Matthew 24 chronologically which Jesus described as the Great Tribulation. The five wise and five foolish virgins refer to believing Jews (who had enough oil and will be prepared to meet their King Messiah at his Second Coming right at the end of the Tribulation) and unbelieving Jews (who did not have oil and therefore will not be prepared) respectively.

    The Bride of Christ is one body and cannot be separated so that one part is raptured and another part is not. The entire Body of Christ (Bride of Christ) will be raptured. You cannot divide the Bride of Christ and have one part standing next to the Bride in heaven when their wedding is consummated and the rest still on earth being battered, persecuted and murdered on earth. Imagine Jesus saying to his Father, “Father, let us rejoice. Here is a part of my Bride. The rest are still on earth waiting to be raptured. I’m sorry but I could not rapture the entire Body of believers.”

  • Yeremyah,

    The following was taken from the Berean Call with whom I agree.

    Jun 1 1995

    Question: I’ve recently read documentation showing that the pretrib Rapture theory originated with a Jesuit priest, Emmanuel Lacunza, in the late 1700s, was picked up by an Edward Irving of Scotland (who translated Lacunza’s lengthy book from Spanish in 1826), and from Irving spread via a Margaret MacDonald to J. N. Darby and C. I. Scofield, who popularized it. Aren’t you embarrassed to teach a doctrine that originated with a Jesuit?

    Response: The alleged Lacunza-Irving-MacDonald connection to Darby and Scofield has not been proved. Moreover, such speculation by MacPherson and others is pointless. Who cares where Darby and Scofield first got the idea of a pretrib Rapture? All that matters is what the Bible has to say on this subject!

    I was taught a pretrib Rapture from childhood—not from the writings of Darby or Scofield, but from the Bible. As a Berean, I would not accept any belief were I not convinced that it was biblical. I hold to a pretrib Rapture because the Bible teaches it. I challenge you to check How Close Are We? against the Bible.

    Furthermore, the claim that the pretrib Rapture was unknown in the church prior to Lacunza and Darby is not true. A sermon of uncertain authorship dating to at least the sixth century clearly presents the pretrib position. Titles “On the Last Times, the Antichrist, and the End of the World,” it declares, “All the saints and elect of God are gathered together before the tribulation, which is to come, and are taken to the Lord, in order that they may not see at any time the confusion which overwhelms the world because of our sins.” For more information contact the Pre-Trib Research Center.

    You are using the same old argumenmts the anti Pre-Trib protagonists have been using along and they have been been proven to be false aggain and again.

  • Tom -the other one wrote:

    Should be Hi Tom and Deb…dang ipad autocorrect

    How do you change the avitar? Dont like mine as looking angry :-b.

    Hi tom the other one
    You can change your avatar by going to http://www.gravatar.com and adding the picture you want there and link it to your email address – the same address you used when you commented. Then this default picture will change to your picture.

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    anon

    >> If people would read the bible they will see that the true Jews are in the land of captivity not in Israel.

    where is this land of captivity? Africa? Ethiopia?

    You kidding right?

  • Thank you Jesus for being my way to salvation!

    Only one thing I found corrupt in this post.

    You cited from Isaiah 14:12, and you stated “where Satan is called הֵילֵל heylel (hay-lale’) in hebrew meaning “the morning-star” (in the sense of brightness) and it’s root word means “to shine”. So as we can see Satan is seen as someone who gives light.”
    First that verse does not include the word “heylel” don’t change the word of Christ. No need to say what the hebrew meaning is when the meaning is already there. You must be using the NIV version because it says “How you have fallen from heaven, MORNING STAR, son of the dawn! You have been
    cast down to the earth,”

    If you refer to both the NIV and the KJV. in Rev 22:16. “16 I Jesus have sent mine angel to testify unto you these things in the churches. I am the root and the offspring of David, and the bright and MORNING STAR.”

    What you just stated in Iseiah 14:12 from the NIV is the one that fell from Heaven was Jesus and not Lucifer. If you look in Isaiah 14:12 from within the KJV. It states “12 How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! how art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations!” TOTALY DIFFERENT.

    Here Lucifer is defined clearly, and not mistaken with Jesus. There are many different version of bibles out there, why do you think that is, why would you ever need such a big variety. The devil has always tried corrupting the word of Christ, this is one example. I’m not disagreeing with most of what you said concerning Jonathan Cahn, just be careful and pray for you have also been deceived by the devil! Don’t concentrate so heavenly in disproving people, that Is not your job as a believer. Instead get your faith and salvation straight first, and place your efforts on saving others.

  • Thank you Jesus for being my way to salvation! wrote:

    I’m not disagreeing with most of what you said concerning Jonathan Cahn, just be careful and pray for you have also been deceived by the devil! Don’t concentrate so heavenly in disproving people, that Is not your job as a believer. Instead get your faith and salvation straight first, and place your efforts on saving others.

    Like you, we also thank Jesus for our salvation which mneans that, like you, we already have our faith and salvation straight. Disproving people when they twist Scripture IS our job because we are commandeded to test all things and to warn others.

    Brethren, if any of you do err from the truth, and one convert him; Let him know, that he which converteth the sinner from the error of his way shall save a soul from death, and shall hide a multitude of sins. (Jas 5:19-20)

    So, now you’ve learned something. Go and do it.

  • Thank you Jesus for being my way to salvation! wrpte:

    “You cited from Isaiah 14:12, and you stated “where Satan is called הֵילֵל heylel (hay-lale’) in hebrew meaning “the morning-star” (in the sense of brightness) and it’s root word means “to shine”. So as we can see Satan is seen as someone who gives light.”

    First that verse does not include the word “heylel” don’t change the word of Christ.

    The word הֵילֵל heylel (hay-lale’) is used in both the NIV and KJV for Lucifer. The word “shachar” means “Morning star” or “day star.” Who is wrong now and chanigng (corrupting) the Word of Christ?

  • Thank you Jesus for being my way to salvation!

    [Deleted by DTW – stop spamming us with the same message over and over]

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    Thank you Jesus for being my way to salvation!

    Isaiah 14:12 KJV
    12 How art thou fallen H5307 from heaven H8064, O Lucifer H1966, son H1121 of the morning H7837 H3213! how art thou cut down H1438 to the ground H776, which didst weaken H2522 the nations H1471

    H1966 (Mickelson’s Enhanced Strong’s Greek and Hebrew Dictionaries)
    H1966 הֵילֵל heylel (hay-lale’) n-m.
    1. the morning-star
    [from H1984 (in the sense of brightness)]
    KJV: lucifer.
    Root(s): H1984
    H1984 הָלַל halal (haw-lal’) v.
    2. to shine

  • I would say that if you believe in the rapture when the Bible says “EVERY eye will see Him (when He returns)” and “The dead in Christ will rise FIRST”, then YOU are deceived and leading others astray. (If you have an open mind to the truth, then this comment will remain.)

    Daniel was protected IN the Lion’s den, he was not raptured away from it.

    Daniel’s friends were protected IN the furnace, they were not raptured away from it.

    Jesus endured the cross and said “If they persecuted me, they WILL persecute you ALSO”. Why would God rapture us from trials and not His beloved Son from trials?

    [urls removed by DTW]

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    Bart

    Are you a Calvinist?

    >> Daniel was protected IN the Lion’s den, he was not raptured away from it. Daniel’s friends were protected IN the furnace, they were not raptured away from it.

    Becausseeeeee….that was not the rapture, The rapture is where God protects the whole worlds Christians from the HOUR OF TEMPTATION.

    >> Why would God rapture us from trials and not His beloved Son from trials?

    You kidding right? When you die will it be for the sins of the world? What belief do you follow because you sure don’t sound like a born again Christian??

    >> Jesuits…

    This nonsense is getting really old, like so last season, can’t you come up with something new?

    Here is a question for you, you want God to protect you on earth during the tribulation, but you don’t want Him to take you way from earth before the tribulation starts? Or wait a second…don’t you want God to protect you during the tribulation? Am I missing something here?

  • Bart Sibrel,

    You are deceived to think God is going to protect you in the tribulation. God Himself says:

    And it was given unto him to make war with the saints, and to overcome them: and power was given him over all kindreds, and tongues, and nations. (Rev 13:7)

    So God is telling you pointblank that He is not going to protect you should you go through the tribulation. Antichrist is going to cut off your head. What kind of protection is that?

  • HJ Ross

    Messianic Jews are of a different order than Christians. Apostle Paul was a Israelite from the tribe of Benjamin, he was not a messianic Jew. Without the understanding of Jew and Gentile one will never understand the Bible. Gentile means “Nation” Gentiles mean “Nations”.

    Abraham seed became many “Gentiles”, NO! they became many “Nations” Gen 17:5b, for a father of many “nations” have I made thee. H#1471. gowy, go’ee;— Hey someone got it backward here, the jews say that everyone else are Go’ee.

    The understanding of Jew and Israel is the most critical part of the Bible, or else you will think that Jesus is or was a Jew.

    Jesus was an Israelite from the tribes of Judah and Levi, both the King and Priest, tribes. Leviticus by His mother physical seed and Priestly by his step Father legal marriage to His mother.

    On the other hand today’s Jews have no DNA back to ancient Israel. None whatsoever! They are traced back to the Khazar’s of the 7th century AD, but that’s the end of their lineage.

    The jews that Jesus Christ opposed were of the Canaanites and Esau, which are not nor never were, Israelite’s

    Christians following Jonathan Cahn is indeed a sad bunch..

  • HJ Ross wrote:

    The understanding of Jew and Israel is the most critical part of the Bible, or else you will think that Jesus is or was a Jew.

    Jesus was an Israelite from the tribes of Judah and Levi, both the King and Priest, tribes. Leviticus by His mother physical seed and Priestly by his step Father legal marriage to His mother.

    Rubbish! Was Jesus Christ lying when He said “. . . salvation is of the Jews.” (John 4:22)

    You wrote:

    On the other hand today’s Jews have no DNA back to ancient Israel. None whatsoever! They are traced back to the Khazar’s of the 7th century AD, but that’s the end of their lineage.

    The following comes from TBC (The Berean Call)

    May 1 1996

    Question: There seems to be an increasing belief among many Christians that the Jews in Israel and most of those around the world today are not real Jews descended from Abraham, Isaac and Jacob, but descendants of the Khazars who adopted the Jewish religion. Is this true? And also, didn’t most of Israel disappear when the ten tribes were lost, and weren’t the rest of the Jews lost through intermarriage?

    Response: No. It is true that the Khaganor ruler of the Khazars adopted Judaism for himself and his people in the eighth century, but these “Jews” by conversion were never confused with the ethnic Jews living among them. Furthermore, when the Khazar state was overthrown in 965, the Khazars fled and soon disappeared as a people through intermarriage. The last vestiges of the Khazars in the Crimea were wiped out in about 1016 by the Greeks and Russians. There is no evidence that the Khazars intermarried with the Jews to such an extent that Jews were lost as a people. Such a theory is unreasonable because only a small fraction of world Jewry was living among the Khazars.

    It is the Khazars who disappeared, and to suggest that all of the Jews all over the world were somehow absorbed by them or that they became known as Jews is neither logical nor supported by history. It is a myth that the Ashkenazim Jews of Russia and Europe are not real Jews but Khazars who migrated there when their country was overrun by invaders.

    As for the so-called “ten lost tribes,” that is another myth. They were not lost. We dealt with this question in the November 1992 newsletter . Both of these ideas are a form of anti-Semitism. Rather than putting the Jews in the ovens, they are exterminated by simply denying that those known as Jews are the descendants of Jacob.

    No historic research is needed to recognize that all theories are false which deny that the Jews in Israel and around the world are real Jews from all twelve tribes. The Bible promises that Israel shall not cease from being a nation forever (Jer:31:35-36) and that Israel’s scattered survivors will return to their promised land where the Messiah will reign over His chosen people from the throne of His father David. We have the choice of believing the promises in God’s Word or these anti-Semitic theories.

    Your argument is old hat and becoming rather monotonous. It is sickening.

  • GMan

    Hello I don’t post in these forums hardly ever. I’m more of a salvation guy verses theology. I must agree Jonathan Can and a host of other TV evangelist are pushing false doctrines. I’m not here to argue just share what I’ve uncovered since troubling times are upon us. I have done some research and agree secret societies (free masons, skull and bones, etc..)are behind all of what is occurring today spiritually. I was heart broken to find out Billy Graham was a 33rd degree mason. I grew up in a Baptist Church here in Md. It is my understanding that at that degree they Identify the Luciferan agenda. I’ve seen Binny Hinn and Joyce Meyers in person. I’ve watched John Hagee and thought man he is good. So I did a little test and viewed Jentezen Franklin on TV the other day and of course he was wanting money for something he was building and I must have counted 20+ free mason hand gestures. Then I think of Matt 7:13 the path is narrow and hard to follow and few will find it………THEN just recently I see Glenn Beck wearing a “seeing eye t-shirt” and come to find out he’s a member of skull and bones (The Bush’s favorite one) (Don’t believe me google it). There is so many sheep in wolves clothing. All TV pastors have sold there souls for money and fame. Like it says in Matt what is it to profit the whole world but to loose your soul. It seems like most of these guys are also Pre-tribers (rapture)and maybe there pushing that agenda so when there still here on earth and Satan appears as an angel of light, they will run to him ( I mean isn’t that the way Satan works through deception) that is when the great falling away will occur and because they listened to the TV preacher and didn’t study to show there self approved the will run to SATAN(the angel of light.
    So I said all that to say this….I believe we are living in the end times. I must admit the rapture thing is a little confusing (salvation guy)My question is wouldn’t God want to remove his people before Satan does his thing, like with Noah and Sodom and Gomorrah AND then some say there is a Rapture but its after the tribulation, which means all Christian who don’t take the mark of the beast will suffer. Again I am not here to argue but to understand my Lord and Savior so I’m better prepared and I can give others accurate information………….Sorry no time to proof ready………..

  • GMan wrote:

    So I said all that to say this….I believe we are living in the end times. I must admit the rapture thing is a little confusing (salvation guy)My question is wouldn’t God want to remove his people before Satan does his thing, like with Noah and Sodom and Gomorrah AND then some say there is a Rapture but its after the tribulation, which means all Christian who don’t take the mark of the beast will suffer. Again I am not here to argue but to understand my Lord and Savior so I’m better prepared and I can give others accurate information………….Sorry no time to proof ready………..

    If you are a salvation guy, as you say, then the Pre-Trib Rapture should be of the utmost importance to you because it concerns your ultimate salvation. There is a salvation from sin and eternal death and a salvation from the corruptible unto the incorruptible. The first relates to your conversion and the second to the Rapture when your corruptible body will be transformed into an incorruptible to meet the Lord in the air at the Rapture. That’s why the book of Hebrews says:

    Wherefore he is able also to save them to the uttermost that come unto God by him, seeing he ever liveth to make intercession for them. (Hebrews 7:25)

    To the uttermost refers to your transformation from this corruptible body to an incorruptible one when Jesus returns for his Bride at the Rapture.

    If the Rapture is after the tribulation, then very little saints will remain to be rraptured because Antichirst is going to kill (behead) most of them.

    And it was given unto him [by God] to make war with the saints, and to overcome them [kill them]: and power was given him over all kindreds, and tongues, and nations. (Revelation 13:7)

    At any rate Jesus promised to take his Bride out of the world when God’s wrath falls on the entire world during the seven year tribulatiion.

    Because thou hast kept the word of my patience, I also will keep thee from the hour of temptation, which shall come upon all the world, to try them that dwell upon the earth. (Revelation 3:10)

  • Kathy B.

    Has anyone else noticed that in the video of Jonathan Cahn on the Glenn Beck show, as Glenn is walking past the couch, there is a cushion on it with a skull and crossbones wearing a royal crown? Then there is another cushion like it on Glenn’s chair. Creepy! Why would someone who supposedly wants to honor and serve Jesus Christ have cushions that portray death as “royàlty”? Jesus is King of kings and Lord of Lords, and He defeated death at Calgary!

  • Kathy B.

    You made a very good onservation. I did not notice it. Thanks.

  • Kathy B.

    You’re welcome!

  • Robert Weiss

    Johnathon Cahn is a Messianic Jew Rabbi, not a christian. Our Jesus is not His Messiah.

  • Pete Howlett

    I thought the revolutionary message of Jesus Christ was ‘Love everyone”. I also thought that God was the judge, not Man and that it was His Church and not Man’s. I think I can pretty much identify from stuff like this who is lining up to cast the first stone. It was one of the Sanhedrin who said that there was nothing they could do if Jesus did prove to be the Messiah and boy, was he correct on that point.

  • Pete Howlett,

    Indeed, Jesus loves everyone and that is why He warned us against false prophets like Jonathan Cahn. (Matthew 24:4; Galatians 1:8-9).

    Indeed, God is the Supreme Judge but He also commanded us to judge all things. (1 Corinthians 2:15). If you don’t you are disobeying Him.

    Indeed, it is His church but He commanded us to feed and tend to the lambs and the sheep. You seem to want to feed them poison instead of good and wholesome food. If you refrain from warning them against wolves in sheeps clothing, you don’t love Him. (John 21:16-17).

    Indeed, Jesus is the Messiah but as He warned ther will me many false Messiah’s in the last days. Who are you following?

  • Sal

    First, God confirms the words of His prophets. If people are truly of God, there words will be confirmed. In this case, I believe this to be no different. Jonathan Cahn gave 2 warnings. His first caution stated that September may come and be rather uneventful. (This has been largely true). The fire in California may be the beginning of desolations “determined” as a result of judgment on America, but for the most part it has been largely “uneventful.” His second caution is that something destructive does come and we should be prepared. The point I want to make here is that God does confirm the word of His prophets. The fact that September has been largely “uneventful” has fulfilled the first part of Jonathan’s cautions. But if Jonathan is a true prophet of God, the second caution is still to come (destruction). One last point I will say is this. The abominations of gay marriage in all 50 states, the white house in rainbow colors, and the idol in lights on the empire state building certainly seems to me that America (Babylon and the Queen of Nations referred to in Revelation) will not escape the “desolations” that are determined as explained in Daniel chapter 9. Regarding a comment about someone’s previous comment about Jonathan Kahn possibly being one of the 2 witnesses of revelation. I believe this could be true. God tests all His prophets before He uses them for greater works. Perhaps this is a time of testing for Him. I don’t believe that Jonathan contrived the Harbinger or the Shemitah of his own imagination, as God is a revealer of mysteries. One last point. It’s biblically wise to “not to believe every spirit, but to test the spirits whether they are of God.” But I encourage every one to do this. If you really have a personal relationship with Jesus, ask Him if Jonathan Cahn is His true prophet, and if the message and warning of the Harbinger and Shemitah is a word for America. Jesus is the Good Shephard and He will tell you. But know this, that even people of Jesus day were divided about whom Jesus was. Some said “He is a good man. Others said, ‘no’ he deceives the people.” (see John 7:12) Just food for thought.

  • John novak

    I have know of this johnathan cahn and beth Israel for over 20 years and they have become more heretical since they moved to wayne nj location and they are very strange about being over security awareness when they were in garfield but now if you even try to talk to or approach johnathan cahn the has nazi like storm troopers for security that are ready to jump you if they think you are a threat the over security is insane and not needed. Johnathan cahn sits at a table signing books after service like he was a rock star figure people line up to meet him and buy his books it is very disgusting people believe every word that comes out of his mouth like he is a living prophet and dare you question him you are playing with judgement from God to doubt the words from god’s prophet

  • Ceil

    So, if this is saying he is a follower of satan, then why does he tell people to turn FROM their sin and turn TO God?

  • Ceil,

    The Roman Cahtolic Church also tells people to turn from sin and to turn to God. Are they saved? The damsel possessed with a spirit of divination followed Paul and cried out “These men are the servants of the most high God, which shew unto us the way of salvation.” (Acts 16:16). She was telling the truth but Paul had to rebuke the foul spirit in her. Telling people the truth and then adding lies, is more dangerous than Satan himself. Have you ever heard Jonathan Cahn telling people how to be saved?

  • Stephanie

    I wish I could have found this site earlier. Today’s date is September 28, 2015 and I have been depressed and worried now for months that we were going to be experiencing some great depression due to the judgment that Cahn has said is coming to the U.S. I have had a sense of dread since about May, 2015 with the knowledge of what was coming. I am so mad at myself for believing this nonsense and allowing Satan to steal my joy. I guess I am a pretty gullible person and Cahn was so convincing – because it does seem like our country is heading toward judgment (based on all of the “turning against God” that our country has been engaged in). I guess I’ve learned my lesson and will be more discerning next time I hear stuff like this.

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    Dear Stephanie

    You are not alone, many people including I have had our minds ‘temporarily’ removed from the prize, that is Jesus Christ and been made to focus on other things instead, things that are nothing but lies of the devil. For a few days I felt really down, spiritually down in the dumps. But after much prayer Jesus Christ has made me realise the error and I am now focused on the what the Word of God says and not what some person on Youtube says. There is just too much dis-information and occult lies out there and we can’t get caught up in the stream of nonsense that is flowing around us. We need to stay focused on what the bible says.

  • Jane Doe

    I think it’s very clear that this website was created by principalities manipulating and putting doubt into people’s minds – creating division and double-mindedness in believers. It shakes the Christian faith because most of the information you put up are all dubious. Satan does not tell complete lies, just half truths and that’s exactly what you have done here. You try to take what little information you have of Jonathan and added in your own spices to make it believable enough to cast doubt into the believer’s mind. The spirit of deception is VERY strong here and he’s really established his stronghold here. You don’t know the bible very well either: you just pick and choose bible verses, mostly out of context because you have little biblical knowledge and just discredit every man of God who is telling the truth. You still can’t account of many of the miraculous things that have happened in Jonathan’s ministry. I’m not surprised but my dear, you have picked the wrong side of this war to fight on. You’re not going to win. When God is on our side, who can come up against us. It’s still not too late to repent and turn back to God. Stop slandering your Christian brothers and sisters, in Jesus Name.

  • Jane Doe,

    You are welcome to evaluate this site in the light of what God’s Word says. However, you are not bing a Berean but are making blanket statements that mean absolutely nothing. Show us from Scripturen where we are wrong and we will set it straight.

  • Joe

    Jane Doe you said, “You don’t know the bible very well either: you just pick and choose bible verses, mostly out of context because you have little biblical knowledge and just discredit every man of God who is telling the truth.”

    Will you be so kind to give us a couple of examples where the verses picked were taken out of context?

  • RJ

    RE: post by Jane Doe (is that your REAL name BTW, or are you LYING?) Time to check the fruit, when you so readily accuse others here of “SLANDERING”!!

    From all the various articles I’ve read at this site, I don’t see anyone slandering any “Christian” “brothers and sisters”!! Anyone who is of satan is ~NOT~ brother or sister to a real Christian. Amen!

    We are to TEST the spirits to see if they come from God, or did you not know that is in the Bible?

    1 John 4:1 ESV
    Beloved, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God, for many false prophets have gone out into the world.

    I do not care WHO it is — and how many tricks they’ve got up their sleeve or how many miracles they can pull out of a bag… did you know THEE false prophet of Revelation who reigns during the Tribulation (side- kick to the AntiChrist) will also work many miracles in front of people’s very eyes? (and deceive them, because the world will think he is such a “good guy”!)

    14 And no wonder! For Satan himself transforms himself into an angel of light. 15 Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also transform themselves into ministers of righteousness, whose end will be according to their works. 2 Cor 11:14-15

    Never thought of this before, but this man brings up an excellent point in that even Satan CLAIMS to be a Christian!! ‘s%20Corner/Doctrines/angel_of_light.htm

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    Sal

    Shemitah has come and gone and…. … … … what now? Are you going to look for another ‘profit’ to fill your head with nonsense?
    I tell you what, read your bible instead, in there it tells you what’s going to happen.

  • Paullette Bird

    I would like to suggest that all of the rhetoric is academic when you consider that many christians in the world do not have access to computers, extra readings let alone trying to process these matters on their own with limited intelligence, hence you are best to take God at his word and straighten your soul up with the word an prayer and Christ, salvation first, baptism and then walking your walk with prayer an grace through faith, that is probably why the bible is enough an these people who come through with new teachings much be carefully looked at, just thinking out loud at how overwhelming this subject would be to a new believer, Go Bless P

  • Cindy

    What proof do you have that he is a free mason? That’s a pretty big accusation.

    The thing is, Jonathan Cahn is right, the US is coming under judgement because of our sins. The economy will collapse. There will be food shortages. It’s all a matter of time. I don’t know much about his other teachings, but his message of repentance and judgement is in line with what other pastors are saying.

    So to say that his father is Satan is very risky.

  • Cindy,

    What’s so special about America that it should be the only country to come under God’s judgments? God is going to judge all the nations, not only America.

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    Cindy

    Do you think America is the only country in the world coming under God’s judgement? What is so special about America? Are you one of those who cheer everytime America wins it’s own own world cup in american football because no other country plays the sport? But by golly America is No.1, lol. Really? Think a bit please. There is an entire world out there besides America.

    Secondly, he is a freemason, he has been exposed on Youtube (over and above the photos in the article) giving his masonic brother Pat Robertson a masonic handshake. See video here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=spwBHCKAfcc

    Thirdly, if you bothered to read the article, he preaches gnostic teachings; Alpha light and at-one-ment. But you seem to ignore this. As long as he preaches ‘repentance and judgement’ in the Lords name then I guess he is godly according to you.

    Fourthly, he teaches from the Kaballah and admits that it’s a fantastic source of info to use in conjunction with biblical scripture.

    Fithly, he is a false prophet, he prophesied (because God told him) a world wide financial collapse on a specific date in September (because God told him). And guess what? It never came to pass. He is a false teacher. Yes tons of other stuff happened in September as it has in October and will in November, December, January etc to the last day, when Jesus returns. He got everyone rallied up about the Shemitah and applied a time period set by God for Israel to America and expected something to happen. It didn’t.

    He is a false teacher and it’s clear as daylight for all to see who love the gospel truth and are not swayed by false prophets and their satanic teachings.

  • anita

    I would like very much to connect to a few real christians
    If any of you are on facebook — thank you

    Deborah (Discerning the World) wrote:

    RJ

    >> why is it only a very small number of Christians are aware of these things? All other Christians I know just “eat this stuff up”!!

    Just a note: Tom wrote the article :)

    The bible will answer this question, “Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.” (Matthew 7:14)
    There is only a very small amount of born again believers walking that narrow path, the rest choose the world and Satan – they think by calling themselves Christian it will make them a Christian in God’s eyes, but He says, “So then because thou art lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot, I will spue thee out of my mouth.” (Revelation 3:16)

  • Dear Anita

    I am not on facebook, I am on Google+ but that does not mean the people on Google+ are Christian. Please read this article called “a very lonely path”: https://www.discerningtheworld.com/2015/05/25/a-very-lonely-path/

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    Here we have Johnathan Cahn lighting a 9 stick Menorah, the biblical Menorah is a 7 stick candle holder, the 9 stick is a false Menorah and reflects all paths leading to one God. For someone who is a Rabbi you would think he would know the difference between a biblical Menorah and a Universal Menorah. But he does not, because he follows the Kabbalah that teaches all paths lead to one God (Lucifer).

    See picture here: https://www.discerningtheworld.com/images/wpi/Jonathan-Cahn-by-ha-navi-gallery-ajmu.jpg

  • brother Zed

    Khan is a con. He has all kinds of revelations but does not accept the revelation already given us in the scriptures. Jesus said call no man Rabbi, Master, or Father. This is a revelation that many refuse to accept. This title is an elevation of a man to the status of Master that belongs only to God. He is like the money changers that Jesus threw out of the temple for peddling their wares. That is all he is a merchandizer of falsehoods for profit and that is why he is on all these false money grubbing preacher shows as they distribute the profits. It is shameful. To get greater insight to this problem google Jesse Duplantis False Preacher Forgotten Word Ministries and see the comments of brother Zed.

  • Deborah (Discerning the World) wrote:

    RJ
    >> why is it only a very small number of Christians are aware of these things? All other Christians I know just “eat this stuff up”!!
    Just a note: Tom wrote the article :)
    The bible will answer this question, “Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.” (Matthew 7:14)
    There is only a very small amount of born again believers walking that narrow path, the rest choose the world and Satan – they think by calling themselves Christian it will make them a Christian in God’s eyes, but He says, “So then because thou art lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot, I will spue thee out of my mouth.” (Revelation 3:16)

  • Deborah (Discerning the World) wrote:

    RJ
    >> why is it only a very small number of Christians are aware of these things? All other Christians I know just “eat this stuff up”!!
    Just a note: Tom wrote the article :)
    The bible will answer this question, “Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.” (Matthew 7:14)
    There is only a very small amount of born again believers walking that narrow path, the rest choose the world and Satan – they think by calling themselves Christian it will make them a Christian in God’s eyes, but He says, “So then because thou art lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot, I will spue thee out of my mouth.” (Revelation 3:16)

    Deborah:
    I so appreciate your question because it shows such an important observation. That is, that so few professing Christians ‘know these things’…that illustrate a refutation to popular doctrine, and that “so many ‘eat this stuff up’!

    So true.
    Jesus said, ‘take heed that no man deceive you’. ‘Be ware of the leaven’, false doctrine and hypocrisy. ‘Be ware of men’.
    But the majority of Church People do not heed the warnings and instructions of scripture, hence your observation is the result.

    Love the Lord.
    Hear Him.
    Do what He says.
    Walk in unity with the Lord.
    There be few that will.
    God bless you.
    Trevor Davis
    http://www.SoundingTheAlarm.com

  • KeithM

    THANK YOU for exposing J. Cahn. , i’ve watched some of his videos and my Spirit man could not “connect” to what i was hearing and seeing. You know when you get that feeling of uneasiness as prompted by The Holy Spirit, well… that is what i got from the moment I started watching his stuff, and now the uneasiness is even stronger. As for him being a freemason… i think you are spot on !! Amazing what lengths they (and Satan ) will go to in order to deceive Christians. He is obviously part of a well organised psychological operation aimed at deceiving Believers. If the world was coming to an end in April or in 2016, why is he still selling and promoting his book(s), something smells really fishy here!! Thank You once again.

  • Laura

    {For those who like a touch of allegory, here is something I ran into on the net. Enjoy.}

    SECOND COMING ITEMS FOR SALE !

    by Dave MacPherson

    In a recent dream of mine I saw things that even John Bunyan didn’t dream about in his “Pilgrim’s Progress.”

    I was walking down a remote dirt road and came by an old store with a sign that said “Second Coming Store – Established in 1830.”

    I opened the door and spotted the elderly owner standing next to shelves covered with many bottles filled with liquids.

    “What are you selling?” I asked.

    “Second Coming perfume,” he said.

    He quickly explained: “Our first and most popular perfume is called ‘Rapture.’ It doesn’t have much substance but smells better than our other perfumes.”

    “How was ‘Rapture’ invented?,” I asked.

    He responded: “Well, the ‘gather’ in Matt. 24:31 was ‘borrowed’ in 1830 and when it was quietly transferred to a pretrib setting it became much more fragrant and ‘Rapture’ became its new name.”

    I also noticed the other bottled perfumes.

    Evidently reading my mind, he explained that after “Rapture” came out in 1830, other perfumers realized they’d have to stretch forward other ingredients found in other parts of the Olivet Discourse in order to make “Rapture” even more acceptable.

    His other “Rapture”-supporting perfumes were in bottles labeled “Unknown Day & Hour,” “One Taken & the Other Left,” “Thief in the Night,” and “His Elect” (Olivet Discourse “elect” was originally “Church” but later changed to “Israel”).

    I wondered why the store owner didn’t have some other Olivet Discourse perfumes like “Sun & Moon Darkening,” “Falling Heavenly Stars,” “Sudden Destruction,” and “Jerusalem Touchdown” which could also be placed in a pretrib setting.

    He said: “I could never sell the four perfumes you just mentioned!”

    I asked: “Why not? They’re in the same Discourse.”

    He blushed and said: “Folks would smell a rat!”

    Well, I finally woke up from my dream. If you think my dream was just a dream, then you are dreaming!

  • Laura, you seem to agree with Dave McPherson. Allow me to add another perfume to your vanity box. It is called the “stay-behind-perfume.” You are welcome to use it and to stay behind with McPherson when all the believers are taken up to Jesus in the Rapture. You may also want to use the seven trumpets en seven vials perfume of which the fragrance (stench) is much stronger than the stay behind perfume.

    And by the way, the little story that the Rapture was invented in 1830 has been refuted many times. You are flogging a dead horse dead. Rather read and believe the Word of God.

  • savannah

    Jonathan Cahn is like a modern day Joseph Smith…he wrote a book, saying GOD told him, isn’t that like another young man that saw an angel and wrote a book. Jonathan wrote of impending doom, and to follow his recommendations to be spared from what is coming. Joseph S wrote a book that described a whole different church, a different message of happiness, and a way to everlasting life with forever families. Following rituals, works, and being sealed in temple rites-NONE of which are Biblical but pagan based. Joseph S had quite a following, and still has a worldwide ministry even though he has been proven to be a liar, a false teaching, a con man, there are many who still think he is a valuable source of truth. Still, after everything that has been revealed- people practice his religion, try to say it is “christian”. Sorry folks, scripture says follow GOD, not a prophet. It says test the prophesies to see if they are true. His didn’t measure up, no proof archaeologically. The doctrines keep changing with the laws of the land or the culture. It mimics aspects of christianity but in the end the mormon doctrine is NOT at all representational of scripture. But sadly most LDS think they are christians even though their doctrine is NOT in agreement with anything that Christianity practices. I fought this with a branch of my own family, they were GREAT people, lived clean lives but they were NOT following scripture, they followed a prophet’s false book, false teachings on doctrines, false sealings, false doctrines. You couldn’t REACH them because they were so deceived and twisted. I live in LDS country now and I pray and weep over how indoctrinated to falsehood they are. Jonathan’s prophesy didn’t materialize and yet he STILL has a huge following thinking he is representing Biblical truth. Nada. People will believe what they want or need to, and how tragic.

  • ilo

    Anyone who actively support Conman Cahn is immediately kicked out of the church. And so it should be if they fail to abide by Biblical teaching.

  • MissDebra

    “Anyone who actively support Conman Cahn is immediately kicked out of the church.” What does this mean?

    I want to thank you you for your informative blog Tom and Deborah. I always wondered why Johathan Cahn called himself Rabbi. That seems to be such a direct form of disrespecting what Jesus said. However, the Harbinger thing seemed plausible, you know, that tree still standing, Washington and that little church, etc. Jonathan is welcomed in political circles where he is actually insulting the listeners, like at Obama’s prayer breakfast. That always seemed odd to me. And his affiliation with TBN which I have long ago stopped watching. I believe you have given some valuable information to make me think twice about him. I actually found your blog googling “Is Jonathan Cahn John the Baptist”, the John the Baptist that is supposed to come before Jesus returns.

  • Dear MissDebra

    Two things:

    You said: However, the Harbinger thing seemed plausible, you know, that tree still standing, Washington and that little church, etc.

    The Harbinger seems plausible because Satan is the one who is planning this all. He is using the bible to make his own satanic prophecies that are coming to pass.

    You said: I actually found your blog googling “Is Jonathan Cahn John the Baptist”, the John the Baptist that is supposed to come before Jesus returns.

    It’s the two witnesses (Moses and Elijah) that comes DURING THE GREAT TRIBULATION before Jesus Christ returns to set up millennial kingdom. You as a born again Christian should be taken up in the rapture before the Trib starts. You will not be here to witness this.

    Revelation 11:3 And I will give power unto my two witnesses, and they shall prophesy a thousand two hundred and threescore days, clothed in sackcloth.

  • MissDebra

    I think it is Enoch and Elijah. Moses has already died but Enoch was taken to heaven alive. I don’t know why so many people want to believe it is Moses. Let the poor man rest, didn’t he have enough trouble for forty years in the desert? lol Why resurrect him when there is Enoch ready to go and he has never died. It is appointed unto men once to die and after that the judgement. Yes we won’t die when raptured, but prior to Jesus death and resurrection, that was the plan for all men. Hello! Does anyone not realize that Enoch has never died? Plus, he has never gone through the hassles Moses had to go through, so he is ready to do some serious damage to the forces of darkness in the tribulation!

    As far as John the Baptist returning before Jesus does, thank you for correcting me, I did make a mistake. It is Elijah who yes, I believe will be one of the great two witnesses.

    Another reason I think Enoch will be the other witness is that it is generally believed that Enoch was black. The two most persecuted peoples in the world have been the blacks and the Jews. I believe the blacks represent the righteous during the time of the tower of Bable, and they were not changed into other nationalities. However, not long after, they too fell into disobedience to God, and became hypocritical, just like the Jews have done, and have reaped much persecution as a people because of this. So Enoch represents the original people God created and of course Elijah represents the Jews. Enoch and Elijah are the best candidates to rain judgement down on the evil that has persecuted mankind. This is what I think.

  • MissDebra

    It might very well be Moses as Moses and Elijah appeared with Jesus at his Transfiguration. Matthew 17:1-9. I personally don’t believe it will be Enoch because the Jews are waiting for Elijah that would re-appear before the Messiah came and they also mentioned Jeremiah (Mat 16:14) why Jeremiah? Many suppose that this reference to Jeremiah is in fact reference to a prediction of Moses (Deuteronomy 18:15.)

  • MissDebra, here’s a question for you. When John the Baptist was asked whether he was Elias (Elijah), he said “I am not” (John 1:21). Yet this passage seems to say something different.

    And his disciples asked him, saying, Why then say the scribes that Elias must first come? And Jesus answered and said unto them, Elias truly shall first come, and restore all things. But I say unto you, That Elias is come already, and they knew him not, but have done unto him whatsoever they listed. Likewise shall also the Son of man suffer of them. Then the disciples understood that he spake unto them of John the Baptist. (Mat 17:10-13)

    Now the question: Who was lying – John the Baptist or Jesus?

  • MissDebra

    Lying is a strong term. I don’t believe either one was lying. John probably was not told “Thou art Elijah returned,” but Jesus knew in the spirit that John had the calling, of Elijah.

  • MisDebra,

    John knew his calling. In fact, his parents must have told him that he was empowered by the Holy Ghost even from his mother’s womb (Luke 1:15). I can’t see why lying is such a strong term. Are you trying to be politically correct by not answering the question? Both Jesus and John the Baptist were correct. Jesus never meant that John was Elijah returned or resurrected from the dead with a new name called John the Baptist. What Jesus meant was that John came in the spirit and power of Elijah to return the hearts of the fathers to the sons and vice versa. And neither will Elijah or Moses or Enoch return in person during the tribulation. It simply means that another person, like John the Baptist, is going to return in the spirit and power of the prophet Elijah (Elias).

  • MissDebra

    You said: John probably was not told “Thou art Elijah returned,”

    John the Baptist knew he was Elijah returned “in spirit and in power” not in person, see Luke 1:17 :)
    And Jesus knew he was Elijah in spirit and power, not in person :)

    Thanks Tom for that excellent comment.

  • MissDebra

    A quick question, seeing as though you were speaking about Enoch, what is your belief about the Nephilim?

  • MissDebra

    You said: “Another reason I think Enoch will be the other witness is that it is generally believed that Enoch was black. The two most persecuted peoples in the world have been the blacks and the Jews. I believe the blacks represent the righteous during the time of the tower of Bable, and they were not changed into other nationalities. However, not long after, they too fell into disobedience to God, and became hypocritical, just like the Jews have done, and have reaped much persecution as a people because of this. So Enoch represents the original people God created and of course Elijah represents the Jews. Enoch and Elijah are the best candidates to rain judgement down on the evil that has persecuted mankind. This is what I think.”

    Three questions:
    1 Mind telling us from biblical scripture where you got this idea from?
    2 Or did you get this info from the Book of Enoch?
    3 Do you believe that black people are God’s chosen people as well along with the Jews?

  • MissDebra

    Just wondering, do you Tom or you Deborah believe that you can learn from anyone else in the body of Christ, or do you think you have all the answers? I find your responses to be somewhat confrontational and argumentative. Actually, I am not disagreeing on some of what you say, but we should all be open to other’s opinions as to who the two witnesses will be. Walking in love and not strife should be our goal, not trying to be right, especially on issues that are left up to our imaginations, such as who are the two prophets.

    Also, I have never been known to try to be politically correct. Not sure what that means anyway, because the politics keep changing. I try to go by the Bible, but everything is not spelled out there, so I do the best I can to hear from the Holy Ghost and obey Him. That should be our goal, correct? That’s my form of correctness, listening to the Holy Ghost and doing my best to obey Him.

    Love is gentle. When we help educate someone else, or share our views with a fellow Christian, a mark of maturity is the ability to be gentle and kind in our delivery, not caustic and debating.

  • Oh dear. Miss Debra I didn’t realise asking you questions was such a terrible thing. No where have we been nasty to you or been hateful or insulted you. But you insult us. That’s nice. Don’t worry we forgive you :)

    Please by all means leave this website before you have to think any further than your nose. And you know what, don’t answer those questions, I already know your answer that is why I asked them.

    But before you go, please read this:

    You think the book of Enoch is biblical yet it goes against every grain that the bible stands for. Read this comment where it says in the book of Enoch that an angel called Phanuel is your mediator between man and God. Is this biblical? Answer this question and give your answer to Jesus Christ the Son of God, now us. ok?

    Am I being nasty by asking this question? No, far from it. Telling someone the truth is Love, if I left you alone, that would be hateful.

    In chapter 40 and verses 9 we read of the Book of Enoch…

    “and the fourth, who is set over the repentance unto hope of those who inherit eternal life, is named Phanuel.’

    The book of Enoch was not included in the bible for a reason MissDebra, because it’s not written by Enoch, it’s satanic.

  • HI MisDebra,

    There are only two options to take when dealing with spiritual matters – the one is truth and the other lies. And as you know, Satan is the father of lies (John 8:44). So why do I need to take your or anyone else’s opinions as Gospel truth when it is not? Have you never read this before?

    A faithful witness will not lie: but a false witness will utter lies. (Pro 14:5)

    Faithful are the wounds of a friend; but the kisses of an enemy are deceitful. (Pro 27:6)

    So stop feeling sorry for yourself and receive rebuke with open arms when it is said in the spirit of Proverbs 27:6.

  • MissDebra wrote:

    Love is gentle. When we help educate someone else, or share our views with a fellow Christian, a mark of maturity is the ability to be gentle and kind in our delivery, not caustic and debating.

    No, my dear, this is the mark of maturity.

    1 Corinthians 2:15 Amplified Bible, Classic Edition (AMPC)

    15 But the spiritual man tries all things [he [a]examines, investigates, inquires into, questions, and discerns all things], yet is himself to be put on trial and judged by no one [he can read the meaning of everything, but no one can properly discern or appraise or get an insight into him].

    Would you say Paul’s indictment is full of love, gentle and kind?

    But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed. As we said before, so say I now again, If any man preach any other gospel unto you than that ye have received, let him be accursed. (Gal 1:8-9)

  • MissDebra

    Who will be the two witnesses during the tribulation is not doctrine. It is conjecture. Let’s not confuse answering heresy with mere conjecture. No matter how you approach it, we are to speak to the brethren, and I am not talking about heretics, with love. Even heretics should be approached with love and if they don’t change after being corrected, then stronger methods must be employed. However, we should not start out hitting our brethren over the head with overly strong delivery. That is what I am saying. Yes, Jesus called the hypocrites White Washed Tombs, but they were hypocrites. He did not treat everyone this way. Tom you and Deborah do not know everything, so a spirit of humility while you “minister” and not “brow beat” the body of Christ would be wise. When it is all said and done, you will have to answer to God in the end for your attitudes, not just your correct or incorrect words. We know how Jesus deals with those who beat the brethren, so fear of the Lord and gentleness in your communications is to your best advantage.

  • MissDebra wrote:

    However, we should not start out hitting our brethren over the head with overly strong delivery. That is what I am saying. Yes, Jesus called the hypocrites White Washed Tombs, but they were hypocrites. He did not treat everyone this way.

    Well, Jesus said to one of his closest disciples “Get thee behind me Satan.” What does that tell you? It shows that whenever those whom He did not always treat as hypocrites were also prone to be called hypocrites and devils whenever they did not walk according to the Gospel.

    You wrote:

    Tom you and Deborah do not know everything, so a spirit of humility while you “minister” and not “brow beat” the body of Christ would be wise. When it is all said and done, you will have to answer to God in the end for your attitudes, not just your correct or incorrect words. We know how Jesus deals with those who beat the brethren, so fear of the Lord and gentleness in your communications is to your best advantage.

    You are doing precisely what you are accusing Deborah and myself of – beating us instead of correcting us. Correcting means to show us from Scripture – like Jesus did with his disciple Peter – that we are on the wrong track and need to be corrected in love. What do you do? Instead of correcting us, you judge us by saying “Jesus is going to deal harshly with you. He is going to send you to hell.” Why do I say this? Let ‘s look at that passage which you used to tell us that we are beating the brethren over the head.

    But and if that evil servant shall say in his heart, My lord delayeth his coming; And shall begin to smite his fellow-servants, and to eat and drink with the drunken; The lord of that servant shall come in a day when he looketh not for him, and in an hour that he is not aware of, And shall cut him asunder, and appoint him his portion with the hypocrites: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth. (Mat 24:48-51)

    Matthew 24:48-51 Amplified Bible (AMP)

    48 But if that servant is evil and says in his heart, ‘My master is taking his time [he will not return for a long while],’ 49 and begins to beat his fellow servants and to eat and drink with drunkards; 50 the master of that servant will come on a day when he does not expect him and at an hour of which he is not aware, 51 and will cut him in two and put him with the hypocrites; in that place there will be weeping [over sorrow and pain] and grinding of teeth [over distress and anger].

    You are accusing us of:

    1) unbelief in the return of our Lord Jesus Christ.
    2) Drunkenness

    and saying that Jesus is going to:

    1) cut us asunder.
    2) appoint us with the hypocrites and worst of all,
    3) send us to hell.

    Now, my dear, if that is not judging us and sending us to hell, I don’t know what is. You need to repent, Debra, before it’s too late for you.

    Believe me. Contending for the faith is not equal to beating the brethren over the head. It is to bring them to their senses so that they may be saved from error.

    James 5:20 Amplified Bible (AMP)

    20 let the [latter] one know that the one who has turned a sinner from the error of his way will save that one’s soul from death and cover a multitude of sins [that is, obtain the pardon of the many sins committed by the one who has been restored].

  • MLE

    Today is July 31,2016 and I have just found this site. I can’t emphasize my deep gratitude enough for moderators who seem to breathe Acts 17:11, and the expositions that have removed my loyalty to more than one teacher.

  • Jodi

    Please stop coming against God’s chosen people. Johnathan Cahn share’s the Word of God in his messages, and your reading way too much into what he says. He is a good man out there preaching, teaching and educating people on Jewish tradition, and how events unfold by the Jewish calendar and not the Gentile calendar. He is highly respected and inspirational to many people, myself included. God is using Johnathan in a mighty way, to His glory. And personally speaking, maybe you need to focus on sharing Christ with others and the messages He gives you, and quit tearing down a brother in Christ.

  • Jodi

    How sure are you that Jonathan Cahn is preaching to you the Jesus of the Bible and not another Jesus?

    Read here.

  • Hugh Beaumont

    Basically, all of his arguments will lead in one direction – toward support of the Jews. We should leave Jews alone, whatever they do in society, and support Israel as “the apple of God’s eye”. This is baloney. Judaism has been dead for almost 2,000 years. Without a temple, without a priesthood, there are no sacrifices, and thus no covenant. What is today called Judaism (basically Rabbis arguing with Rabbis) is younger than Christianity. Israel is the Church, and there are found the children of Moses. There’s only one question: Is he a huckster, or does he actually believe the bull he’s chucking?

  • Hugh Beaumont

    Anti-semites cannot claim to believe in the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob because they are anti the Jewish God. Jesus himself was a Jew.

    http://www.thebereancall.org/content/november-2013-classic-2

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Why Jonathan Cahn and His Revelations Must be Ignored

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