New Calvinism – Catching a Gullible Generation

new calvinismA new term has been coined for the youth, it’s called New Calvinism or Neo-Reformed.  It’s actually Old Calvinism repackaged for a more vibrant gullible generation.

Why is Calvinism spreading like wild fire in the times we living in?  Because they preach what appears to be a truthful gospel!  People are sick and tired of having to listen to the Benny Hinn’s of the world, with all it’s false teachings and lavish excesses.  So up popped the Calvinist preachers to save the day.

But the preachers of New Calvinism fail to tell their followers the whole truth and nothing but the truth regarding T.U.L.I.P.  They don’t tell you that Total Depravity and Unconditional Election are actually Gnostic teachings and they don’t tell you that the Calvinistic version of Salvation is completely unbiblical because according to them Jesus died for the Chosen only and not the entire world as the Bible states in 1 John 2:2.   When you read anything written by a Calvinist, try read it from the Calvinist’s ‘Elect perspective’, only then will realise just how terrible their doctrine is.  Old Calvinism and New Calvinism are both vile doctrines.

According to Marc Driscoll, New Calvinism is the following:

  1. Old Calvinism was fundamental or liberal and separated from or syncretized with culture. New Calvinism is missional and seeks to create and redeem culture.
  2. Old Calvinism fled from the cities. New Calvinism is flooding into cities.
  3. Old Calvinism was cessationistic and fearful of the presence and power of the Holy Spirit. New Calvinism is continuationist and joyful in the presence and power of the Holy Spirit.
  4. Old Calvinism was fearful and suspicious of other Christians and burned bridges. New Calvinism loves all Christians and builds bridges between them.

So what we have here is Emergent Calvinism – Calvinism going home to Rome.

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Albert Mohler, John Piper, Mark Driscoll and Louie Giglio have been instrumental in helping to coin the term New Calvinist to reel in the youth.  Albert Mohler you say? Albert Mohler served as chairman for the Billy Graham Crusades.  Albert Mohler signed the ecumenical Manhattan Declaration. Albert Mohler holds leading positions in two UN, NGO’s.   Albert Mohler is invited to speak at John MacArthur’s Grace to You church once a year.

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Please note the leaders of this, one of them being Al Mohler a leader in the Southern Baptist denomination, others are John Piper and Mark Driscoll. It is disturbing that there is an escalation in this heresy, but just another sign we are in the last days. New Calvinism?  What a joke!

Reformed Preachers Ponder the New Calvinism

Three Reformed preachers recently sat down together to talk about theNew Calvinism that has been sweeping the younger generation of Christians.

It’s a movement that has young believers going back to the roots namely, to Scripture and the sovereignty of God.

“You’ve got a generation of Christians who’ve grown up in an overwhelmingly secular culture and they’re not part of a churched culture,” said Dr. Albert Mohler, president of The Southern Baptist Theological Seminary, in an informal discussion hosted by The Gospel Coalition.

“They’re realizing that something has to explain how they came to faith in the Lord Jesus Christ. They have an absolute determination, you might say, to make clear that their first principle is the sovereignty of God, not the sovereignty of the self.”

The Rev. Kevin DeYoung, senior pastor of University Reformed Church in East Lansing, Mich., believes part of the appeal of the New Calvinism is that it’s “got some muscle to it” and is “robust doctrinally.”

There’s a renewed sense that “God’s sovereignty is biblical and massively important, that God loves us before we loved Him, that He’s the one who does the deciding work in our salvation,” the young pastor said.

In recent years, pastors have pondered the upsurge of interest in Reformed theology – which includes holding to the authority of Scripture, the sovereignty of God, and the sovereignty of grace – with some proposing that it is coming out of a restlessness and dissatisfaction with contemporary evangelicalism.

“Weary of churches that seek to entertain rather than teach, longing after the true meat of the Word, these young people are pursuing doctrine and are fast becoming new Calvinists,” states a post on the popular Christian blog Internet Monk.

Mohler has been identified as one of the evangelical theologians contributing to the resurgence. Others include Baptist theologian John Piper, C.J. Mahaney of Sovereign Grace churches, and Mark Driscoll of Mars Hill Church.

“What’s new is you have new people in a new time who are rediscovering the same kind of theological instincts and impulses that led to the Reformation and finding them in the same sources – Scripture,” Mohler explained.

And the desire for meaty answers to such questions as “how has God’s grace come to me” emerges “from young people trying to swim against the tide of secularism,” said the well-known evangelical.

Reformed theologian Ligon Duncan explained the phenomenon this way: “I think as the older confessional traditions jettison their fidelity to some of the great truths that all Protestants have valued because we found them in the Scriptures and see them at the very core of what Christian life and ministry is about, you’ve got a new generation of folks who are rummaging through our trashcans and saying ‘this is great, why didn’t somebody ever tell me about this?'”

As young people rediscover biblical truths, DeYoung believes it could “really reinvigorate evangelicalism.”

Meanwhile, for Mohler, the label – whether it’s the New Calvinism – doesn’t matter.

It all comes down to the Scriptures and being “committed to the Gospel, wanting to see the nations rejoice in the name of Christ, and wanting to see Gospel-built and committed churches,” Mohler indicated.

“If you’re going to dive deeply into the Scriptures, if you’re going to have to explain why the Scriptures have this authority … [and] how this gets worked out in life, frankly, I don’t care what you label it, you’re going to end up in a good place.”

Overall, the three theologians are excited.

“I think it is a wonderful and undiluted good thing that this younger generation is deeply biblical, deeply passionate, deeply convictional, increasingly confessional and ready to do something great for the name of the Lord Jesus Christ,” Mohler said.

Audrey Barrick | Christian Post Reporter

Source: http://www.christianpost.com/article/20101020/reformed-preachers-ponder-the-new-calvinism

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Deborah (Discerning the World)

African Man

Yes I have read the ENTIRE thing, and I DON’t scan looking for errors- the ERROR is PLAIN to see. You say you are not trying to be combative, but you ARE. And you almost lost your faith because of blogs like mine? Rubblish! You say you thank God for the Bible yet it’s clear you don’t read it other wise you would see the errors of Calvinism and run a mile from DARKNESS. You come and attack me instead – how cheap of you.

Burning Lamp

Zelda said in response to my comments about fermented wine:

Your belief about wine is not peculiar – I’ ve read a few good books on subject. It is blasphemy to compare the precious blood of Jesus Christ with a fermented substance . In the Bible fermentation signifies sin, as leven is also used to signify sin. But people will do anything to rationalize the use of wine. I beleieve that anything that impairs your ” contact” with the Holy Spirit, even if it means being only slightly tipsy from a glass of wine, is wrong and dangerous. Besides the fact that a journey starts with a step at a time and that is true for alcholism too.

Thank you for validating my stance on this issue – I have never had anyone agree with this and it is plain as day to me.

Zelda, you obviously have a heart for God. May He guide you into His truth and lead you in the ways of righteousness.

ol boy

I am somewhat new to Calvinism. No one had to teach me or lead me to it but even as I read the bible, I began to see certain truths about salvation that led me to accept reformed theology. That being said, true biblical Christianity is not some kind of mental acceptance to some doctrines (I am not ecumenical!!). When the scriptures speaks of believing just like (Abraham believed and it was counted to him as righteousness) it speaks of a belief that leads to action/obedience not that I mentally accept that Jesus died on the cross for me or i mentally accept some doctrine from my church. thats absolute nonsense. I came from a charismatic background and I have friends who although our theological viewpoints now differ are genuine believers whose lives have been transformed by the gospel of Christ and who are bearing much fruit. I am convinced that the issue is not what doctrines u may mentally cling to but rather whether a genuine work of salvation has been done in your heart resulting in practicing a lifestyle of obedience to Jesus and lifestyle of righteousness as the book of 1 john speaks of. (Calvinism, pentecostalism, arminianism, neocalvinism is not the issue, saving faith in Jesus Christ is and belkieve me in all denominations we have the lost and we have the true sheep of Christ)

Deborah (Discerning the World)

ol boy

>> I am convinced that the issue is not what doctrines u may mentally cling to but rather whether a genuine work of salvation has been done in your heart resulting in practicing a lifestyle of obedience to Jesus and lifestyle of righteousness as the book of 1 john speaks of…..(Calvinism, pentecostalism, arminianism, neocalvinism is not the issue, saving faith in Jesus Christ is and belkieve me in all denominations we have the lost and we have the true sheep of Christ)

In principle this sounds like it could work but due to the times we live in, the doctrines DARKER SIDES will come to the forefront and you will be FORCED to choose the truth or perish.

Burning Lamp

Ol boy, if you have come to believe in Reformed theology, you have abandoned the true Gospel of the Bible.

The true Gospel is that Jesus died for ALL – your new belief says that He only died for a few that God preselected.

The true Gospel calls for a decision on the part of those who listen to the Gospel message. The Bible is very clear on this. Reformed theology says that if God has placed His “brand” on someone that they WILL receive Him with no choose in the matter. Nothing could be further from Biblical truth.

There is much more, but I hope you will prayerfully read all the good biblically documented information that Deborah has put on this site about the false teaching of Calvinism/Reformed theology.

Pieter

Hi Guys been a while, cant believe another year is almost gone…:)

Ol boy do raise a very interesting point
ol boy wrote:

I am convinced that the issue is not what doctrines u may mentally cling to but rather whether a genuine work of salvation has been done in your heart resulting in practicing a lifestyle of obedience to Jesus and lifestyle of righteousness as the book of 1 john speaks of. (Calvinism, pentecostalism, arminianism, neocalvinism is not the issue, saving faith in Jesus Christ is and belkieve me in all denominations we have the lost and we have the true sheep of Christ)

Its been something that has bothered me for a long time. Just because we differ on some doctrinal points does not mean one is not saved by Jesus. Or does it? I mean does it really matter if i believe in say post milleniasm and some one else in a pre-trib rapture? What is the the basis of salvation? Believe in Jesus Christ Son of God that he died for our sins? (Excuse my spelling). Isn’t all these things we tend to fight about, issues that does not affect one’s salvation? On judgment day will we be judged which doctrinal point of view we took? (please note I mean this within the basis of true/orthodox Christianity) These things are so confusing.
Anyhow thanks for listening and keep up your good work!
God Bless
P

Deborah (Discerning the World)

Pieter

As I said, this type of thinking might have still been ok 20 years ago. Now it’s not ok, SIMPLY BECAUSE of the times we are living in. If you follow the wrong teaching you WILL end up on the wrong end of the track. Satan will make sure of that. People keep forgetting that we are in a WAR against principalities of evil who are hell bent in brining you to hell with them. And because this topic is about Calvinism and Calvinism blatantly destroys the message of HOW TO BE SAVED.

Pieter

Debs
I hear you
And believe me I am not defending Calvinism in the slightest. I know far to little about it to take a stance. My argument is and maybe it’s been covered somewhere on your site before, that there surely must be genuinely saved Christians which are Calvinists, or Lutheran or Anglican or any of these denominations? Even Catholic? (on that one I really am guessing)
But I will ask the question again? Will God judge us one-day on the denomination and doctrine we followed or whether we were saved by the Blood of Christ? Does it really matter whether you follow the believe in the TULIP? Or does it matter to have a personal relationship with Jesus? Can one have both?
AARRRGGGG I don’t know how you guys manage all these things everyday its enough to make one’s head spin twice around the world!
Anyhow enjoy your weekend.

Matt

Pieter,

If a person isM going to judgment day (the great white throne judgment), then that person is not saved. The whole point of Jesus’s salvation is to avoid that judgment (John 5:24).

So it does matter what a person believes. A person must believe that Jesus is God (this means Mormon and JW are not Christian, because they deny that Jesus is God), and a person must believe that salvation is by believing in Jesus without works (this means that catholic and orthodox are not Christian, because they demand works).

Burning Lamp

Great answer Debs!

Deborah (Discerning the World)

Pieter

Yes there are people stuck in the Calvinist denomination in the times we are living in who are saved, but I can tell you now that the Holy Spirit will WARN the person as to what Calvinism is all about and sooner rather than later the person will get out of there. Which means that there will be no Christians sitting in their congregation as they would have all left lol. No just kidding… Some people take a long time to wake up to the errors that are actually jumping out and biting them on their nose.

Let me use the WoF church as a good example. 50 years ago my grandfather attended WoF churches, he was indeed a saved man. He was a God fearing man who had the gift to preach unlike any other. Yet he was in a Word of Faith Church. But wait, 50 years ago the WoF church was still ok, their dark teachings had not really started to surface as yet. Before my grandfather died he left the WoF churches as he felt something terrible had gone wrong (that was 20 years ago). He found some good preachers books and started to read their stuff, I believe my grandfather died a saved man, because he was seeking the truth and I know for a FACT that the Holy Spirit showed him the truth. Now look at the WoF churches today, a nightmare.

It’s like someone going to an Angus Buchan conference (this is like the worst example I can use) and the person gets saved! But hang on, God was no where near working through Angus at those conferences. The person got saved because THEY THEMSELVES were looking for Jesus Christ and their lives were changed that day. What will happen next? I can tell you (and I will lay my head on a block) the Holy Spirit will immediately warn that person that Angus Buchan is false and to get away from him.

>> Does it really matter whether you follow the believe in the TULIP? Or does it matter to have a personal relationship with Jesus? Can one have both?

You can’t have DOCTRINES OF DEMONS and what you then think is a personal relationship with Jesus Christ. Jesus is the WORD, and the Holy Spirit will ALWAYS point you on the right path as to what is correct WORD. Darkness and Light do not mix together.

Burning Lamp

Pieter, it sounds like you don’t have a clear grasp of the true biblical message of salvation upon which all belief systems have to be measured by. This is a prime target of the enemy – the bedrock of the faith. There can be differences beyond this, but the matter of salvation is in granite the anchor.

Pieter, just concentrate on that first and foremost and forget about all the other things. Then you will be able to sort out the rest from a firm foundation.

One point of clarification – can one believe in the TULIP and be saved? Can one believe in baptismal regeneration and be saved? Only God knows the heart, but it is our job to determine correct doctrine from false and to contend for the faith and the truth.

Burning Lamp

Debs, you gave a great answer to Pieter – I didn’t read it until after I had posted my comments. You gave the better explanation.

Pieter

Thank you everyone!

Your explanations are fully understandable.

Have a wonderful blessed week
P

ol boy

Burning Lamp, thanks 4 the concern for my salvation but i do believe in the true biblical gospel, reformed theology is simply the method through which i understand/interpret it. i do not view reformed theology or any other viewpoint as the gospel

>>> “to come to God one must simply repent and believe on the Christ and his finished work on the cross and resurrection for our sins..this belief is then evidenced by fruit or works as the book of James clarifies” all reformed theology states is that all those who end up repenting and believing were chosen before the foundation of the world (predestined to be conformed to his image)regardless of denomination>>>

(The idea of election seems so strange to people yet the old testament clearly shows that Yahweh made Israel his bride and literally turned his back on the rest of the world. He gave them over to their idolatry deut 32:8-9/rom 1..Abraham from a pagan background was chosen by God for no reason other than Gods electing grace) i understand everyone’s concern for good doctrine especially since Paul asks timothy to watch his life and doctrine but i also find solace in Paul’s statement that “we know in part”..i don’t believe any denomination has a full grasp on all truth of scripture so in a sense we all may have some error, if perfect doctrine is necessary for salvation does that not become a work in itself??>> There are “other gospels” but in the context of Galatians i believe that Paul refers to gospels that attempt to bring individuals back under the law of Moses while detaching them from the sufficiency of Christ’s work on the cross, and i doubt that reformed theology or any other orthodox method of understanding salvation falls under that category..

Deborah (Discerning the World)

ol boy

>> The idea of election seems so strange to people yet the old testament clearly shows that Yahweh made Israel his bride and literally turned his back on the rest of the world.

We have already discussed this. Please read all the comments above. Starting at the top, down. Thanks. Your interpretation of scripture is incorrect regarding Israel and so called election.

Burning Lamp

Ol Boy, if you believe in TULIP and reformed theology you do NOT believe in the biblical Gospel. TULIP guts and negates the Gospel. Do you actually know what TULIP means? For example the “L”? Do you actually believe that Christ only died for a select group of people and that others are headed to hell from birth? Think about it sir – that is NOT what the Bible says! In fact, that is an insult to the sacrifice of Christ – I say that respectfully because I do not believe that if you examine these beliefs that you will continue to believe in them.

Pieter

Hi Guys
Old me again… I had the flue the last day or so…yep in summer can you believe it. In between sniffles, coughs and feeling sorry for myself I re-read al your comments.
Again I am not defending Calvinism in the slightest. I am going to use a big earthly word, one which clash with any religion. *drum roll*
Logic
Logically I cannot understand how Calvinism has been in existence for 500 years and people are not saved whom hold and believed in that doctrine. Debs and BL, I am truly not attacking your knowledge which far exceeds mine, but I am struggling with understanding this. If Calvinism is the doctrine of demons then no-one holding to that doctrine can or was saved? If it is the false Gospel then we basically lost most of the world the past 500 years to hell? Hec, before that it was Roman Catholicism?
I know its tough questions and once you might have answered over and over again. I aim is not to open a repetitive dialogue for you and I know you have far more important work to do.
Anyhow, I am reading my Bible and praying the Holy Spirit will guide me towards all truths and maybe this is the way, asking those whom already had these tough questions in front of them.
BL. Thank you for the explanation on looking/focusing on Salvation and that truth. I agree, last year I used the statement that I am a baby Christian. However, today it still feels like I am drinking milk all the time…
God Bless
P

Deborah (Discerning the World)

Pieter

>> Logically I cannot understand how Calvinism has been in existence for 500 years and people are not saved whom hold and believed in that doctrine. Debs and BL, I am truly not attacking your knowledge which far exceeds mine, but I am struggling with understanding this. If Calvinism is the doctrine of demons then no-one holding to that doctrine can or was saved? If it is the false Gospel then we basically lost most of the world the past 500 years to hell? Hec, before that it was Roman Catholicism?

Oh no no lol, what makes you think Calvinism has been the doctrine that everyone has held to for the last 500 years? Calvinists would love you to believe that they ARE the Gospel. Go read up on the history of John Calvin and see how he was HATED by the people of Geneva because he was a tyrant. In fact Calvinism was so disliked it had to go underground and resurfaced as… Presbyterianism (surprise!!!) and then they changed their name again to Reformed Theology.

Before John Calvin were born again Christians and the Bible :) during the reign of John Calvin there were true Christians, afterward there there true Christians, today there are true Christians. And again, I’ve said this before, people sitting in the pews could most definitely be saved unless they have gone so far as to believe in TULIP.

No question is too tough for me. I spend my day studying and searching and constantly asking Jesus for help so I can help others!

Burning Lamp

Pieter, I would not presume to say that all those who believe in Reformed Theology are not saved. They believe Christ died for their sins, and we are saved by grace, not of works but it is what is beyond that is troubling. I should say they are promoting a false Gospel. Now Catholicism is another story. They believe in works salvation. That was the schism that Martin Luther split wide open. But sadly it went downhill from there.

Pieter

BL and Debs

Again thank you for your explanations. And thanks for graciously answering every “stupid” question I am asking.
I might not “see” what you are seeing at the moment and might even not understand everything, but with a Brother and Sister in Christ like the two of you, I don’t feel so alone….I feel there is someone with guidance from our Lord where I can ask these questions.
Debs I will go and do some research on Calvin you are one of the most knowledgably people I have ever met, online of course! Knowledge like that can only come from God, and BL its never easy to see a “tone” in writing since one cannot see someone’s face, but the way you always very humbly and graciously answer questions shows that Christ is with you and in you.
Truly thank you
God Bless you

Deborah (Discerning the World)

Pieter

I try my best dude. That’s all I can do. Because I know you need answers and if I don’t give the correct answer to your questions, where are you gonna get them from? My writing style might not come out as good as BL’s but believe me if you met me you will see I am lovable and very humble. I think the reason I come across as stern is because of my background, being in the occult for many many years and then escaping it has made me realise that Salvation is not a game to play. Satan will do anything and I mean anything to twist even just ever so slightly God’s word to change it’s meaning and fool men and lead them off to hell. I’ve seen hell (metaphorically speaking now) face to face and I do not want anyone to go there. The nightmare I went through when I called out to Jesus Christ to save me lasted a year, because Satan refused to let me go. I had no one to help me, only FAITH in Jesus that He WOULD SAVE ME and man did HE ONLY SAVE ME. The other side is not a game, the evil that lies there is beyond most people’s imaginations, but I have seen some of it and I do not want people to lose their souls to that. I sometimes sit here and cry as I answer peoples questions, people don’t see me crying, they just see what I type and how I have typed it.

Anyhow, that was lesson 101 as to why I might seem stern when I write comments.

Pieter

Thx debs

I am 100% sure of that! thx a mil and keep on fighting the good fight!

MJH

Deborah

To be upfront, I believe the doctrines of Calvinism to be true. So take me for what I am, but don’t just throw away what I say.

“I used to read John MacArthur and recommended him until I came to understand the ins and outs of Calvinism. When I realised how vile it was I could not believe how a man like John MacArthur (smile and all) could willingly follow such teachings.

Calvinism is terribly deceptive in that it sounds 90% biblical, but when it comes to Salvation, there is no genuine conversion, you are just ‘chosen’. And because one needs to be GENUINELY SAVED in order to be a GENUINE Christian, if there is no genuine salvation then everything is FALSE.”

You seem to have hatred in your heart, calling Calvinism vile and terribly deceptive. In fact, all of your posts seem in some way to show a high degree of contempt towards the doctrines that Calvinism teaches. You are making Calvinism out to be a villain. I can almost see your face enraged against it.

Why? Should you not be sorrowful if you truly believe Calvinism is heretical? So far, you have just shown yourself to be angry. I don’t see any hint of love. Just hatred. Your last post does show a deep concern for people’s souls, which I understand, but when it comes to Calvinism, you are not concerned for their souls, but simply filled with hate towards the doctrines.

And it would seem this hatred is blinding you from really understanding Calvinism. When you say things like, “there is no genuine conversion,” you make yourself out to be very foolish and you reveal your ignorance. It makes your anger seem childish. I’m being harsh, but the reality is, you sound like you are arguing from anger and not understanding. This is what children do. So far, you have an argument that says, Calvinism is evil and that is that. Have you defended this? No. Just continual slander is what I read.

“You can’t have DOCTRINES OF DEMONS and what you then think is a personal relationship with Jesus Christ. Jesus is the WORD, and the Holy Spirit will ALWAYS point you on the right path as to what is correct WORD. Darkness and Light do not mix together.”

“When you read anything written by a Calvinist, try read it from the Calvinist’s ‘Elect perspective’, only then will realise just how terrible their doctrine is.”

“You are right. It’s worse. As I said below, it’s Emergent Calvinism.”

“you attend a Reformed church which may as well be a Catholic church.”

“Oh boo hoo. What a load of nonsense.”

“You say you thank God for the Bible yet it’s clear you don’t read it other wise you would see the errors of Calvinism and run a mile from DARKNESS. You come and attack me instead – how cheap of you.”

There is a pattern to be noticed in your posts: Just slander and no explanation. Stabbing and no discussion. Hatred and no understanding. I could continue quoting you; I think I only got halfway down the posts.

And it is funny that we all use the same arguments to convince each other. I would say that if you search scriptures earnestly, you would find election, sovereignty, perseverance, total depravity, etc etc to be wonderfully true. You say if we search scriptures earnestly we would see how false these doctrines are. However, the way you speak makes me believe that you have not truly brought yourself to understand what and why Calvinists believe what they do. You have not engaged the world in a mature discussion. Please, show us scripture. Please tell us why you hate Calvinism. What about Calvinism is demonic?

Every post, from your article to the last post holds up “Calvinism” and says this, “Look. See how foolish it is?! Isn’t it demonic? Yes, it is demonic.” Yet you do not discuss what Calvinism really is. Your article says, “Listen to this, isn’t it stupid?” And yet what I am listening to actually sounds great to me and you did nothing to argue a point. You just said it was stupid and laughed. Please explain! Please do not slander Calvinism. Give substance to your arguments. Do not be immature and point and scoff. Tell me why. Tell me why.

I am deeply concerned for your doctrine as you isolate yourself from the body of believers. Paul exhorts pastors to be on guard against wolves who come in and twist doctrine and lead the body astray. He exhorts them to rebuke, reprove, correct, and train in righteousness. You have removed yourself from this, thinking your doctrine is true doctrine and no church shares your convictions. This is a sign of heresy brewing in your heart. You are well on your way to being a heretic. Who is there to tell you when you are wrong? Who is there to point out your incorrect interpretations? Who is double checking you? Who is sharpening you? Do not surround your itching ears with those who will affirm your doctrines. You need the church. Get back to the church. You have excommunicated yourself. You have divorced yourself from Christ’s beloved.

Burning Lamp

MJH, you deserve credit for showing your Calvinist/Reformed badge and not sneaking in unawares as others have done.

However, you show your own ignorance and blindness. Yes, Deborah can get a little flippant in her remarks, but she has to have a lot of spunk to give a retort to those who are far off the track.

You are guilty of judging Deborah’s heart while she has not done that. She has exposed a wicked and evil and destructivew doctrine.
She has used scripture and this is clearly shown in all discussions here.

You tell her to get back in church as if that will make her more spiritual. There are many believers who are disenfranchised by the current apostasy and have no place of worship. They cry out and desire sound teaching but it is not to be found in their areas. They grieve over this. They long for the gathering together and fellowship. But many of them have had to resort to the internet to find like-minded people who still value God’s truth. How dare you condemn Deborah for not being in church. Just any church? The Bible commands us to come out and be separate and this means that many dedicated believers have sadly been called out of their churches that no longer preach sound doctrine. Would you condemn them as well?

I can’t say for sure, but I believe it is quite possible that Deborah is more in the Word than you and walks closer to the Lord than you and is driven to her knees more than you because of her circumstance.

She has the courage to stand for truth and takes incredible heat for it. She has a husband who supports her and that is none of your business sir. You sit in your church and your pride comes out loud and clear. And if you know your scriptures, you know that pride is most hated by our Lord. Deborah would not be doing this if she didn’t care about the souls of people. She is defending the faith and trying to snatch people from the fire as it speaks of in Jude.

Calvinism instills pride rather than repentance. It totally leaves out the main ingredient in salvation – repentance. God requires that of each one of us according to His Word and that concept seems to be foreign to you.

I am sorry if this seems harsh. I care DEEPLY about every lost soul and I care DEEPLY about every person who is devoured by wolves in sheep’s clothing and every believer who is led astray. I care DEEPLY about YOU and I pray that you will come to a true knowledge of the true Gospel of the Bible.

We do not judge your heart sir, we judge the doctrine on which you hang your hat.

Gerhard Ebersöhn

ol boy wrote:

I am somewhat new to Calvinism. No one had to teach me or lead me to it but even as I read the bible, I began to see certain truths about salvation that led me to accept reformed theology. That being said, true biblical Christianity is not some kind of mental acceptance to some doctrines (I am not ecumenical!!). When the scriptures speaks of believing just like (Abraham believed and it was counted to him as righteousness) it speaks of a belief that leads to action/obedience not that I mentally accept that Jesus died on the cross for me or i mentally accept some doctrine from my church. thats absolute nonsense. I came from a charismatic background and I have friends who although our theological viewpoints now differ are genuine believers whose lives have been transformed by the gospel of Christ and who are bearing much fruit. I am convinced that the issue is not what doctrines u may mentally cling to but rather whether a genuine work of salvation has been done in your heart resulting in practicing a lifestyle of obedience to Jesus and lifestyle of righteousness as the book of 1 john speaks of. (Calvinism, pentecostalism, arminianism, neocalvinism is not the issue, saving faith in Jesus Christ is and belkieve me in all denominations we have the lost and we have the true sheep of Christ)

GE wishes to encourage an honest man:

And say, Ol Boy, you persevere! The Word of God does not return to Him empty. And your faith is inalienable to see you through till the day you will be received on the other side of the door OF DEATH THROUGH THE RESURRECTION by your SAviour God and Lord Jesus Christ!

“Strengthened with all might according to God’s glorious POWER, unto all patience and longsuffering with joyfulness, giving thanks to the Father who has made us meet (in Jesus Christ) to be partakers of the inheritance of the saints in light: Who hath delivered us from the power of darkness and hath translated us into the Kingdom of his dear Son IN WHOM WE _HAVE_ redemption through his blood, even the forgiveness of sins. … That their hearts might be COMFORTED … and this I say lest any man BEGUILE YOU WITH ENTICING WORDS…”

Stand fast in truth God has set you free in!

Gerhard Ebersöhn

Burning Lamp wrote:

MJH, you deserve credit for showing your Calvinist/Reformed badge and not sneaking in unawares as others have done.

However, you show your own ignorance and blindness. Yes, Deborah can get a little flippant in her remarks, but she has to have a lot of spunk to give a retort to those who are far off the track.

You are guilty of judging Deborah’s heart while she has not done that. She has exposed a wicked and evil and destructivew doctrine.
She has used scripture and this is clearly shown in all discussions here.

You tell her to get back in church as if that will make her more spiritual. There are many believers who are disenfranchised by the current apostasy and have no place of worship. They cry out and desire sound teaching but it is not to be found in their areas. They grieve over this. They long for the gathering together and fellowship. But many of them have had to resort to the internet to find like-minded people who still value God’s truth. How dare you condemn Deborah for not being in church. Just any church? The Bible commands us to come out and be separate and this means that many dedicated believers have sadly been called out of their churches that no longer preach sound doctrine. Would you condemn them as well?

I can’t say for sure, but I believe it is quite possible that Deborah is more in the Word than you and walks closer to the Lord than you and is driven to her knees more than you because of her circumstance.

She has the courage to stand for truth and takes incredible heat for it. She has a husband who supports her and that is none of your business sir. You sit in your church and your pride comes out loud and clear. And if you know your scriptures, you know that pride is most hated by our Lord. Deborah would not be doing this if she didn’t care about the souls of people. She is defending the faith and trying to snatch people from the fire as it speaks of in Jude.

Calvinism instills pride rather than repentance. It totally leaves out the main ingredient in salvation – repentance. God requires that of each one of us according to His Word and that concept seems to be foreign to you.

I am sorry if this seems harsh. I care DEEPLY about every lost soul and I care DEEPLY about every person who is devoured by wolves in sheep’s clothing and every believer who is led astray. I care DEEPLY about YOU and I pray that you will come to a true knowledge of the true Gospel of the Bible.

We do not judge your heart sir, we judge the doctrine on which you hang your hat.

GE says,

How many times have I read and heard and experienced this — you, ‘Burning Lamp’ — in all its splendour.

NEVER SO POTENT, POISONOUS, POLITE AND CONCENTRATED. this post of yours merits saving in my ‘BEST’ folder.

Gerhard Ebersöhn

[EDITED by DTW – This is not the PLACE TO PREACH YOUR FALSE TULIP DOCTRINE]

Deborah (Discerning the World)

GE

>>How many times have I read and heard and experienced this — you, ‘Burning Lamp’ — in all its splendour.

>> NEVER SO POTENT, POISONOUS, POLITE AND CONCENTRATED. this post of yours merits saving in my ‘BEST’ folder.

Well, lets see what we have here. We have a TERRIBLY NASTY comment FOR NO REASON AT ALL. I wonder why. Is is because of the this part, “Calvinism instills pride rather than repentance. It totally leaves out the main ingredient in salvation – repentance.” Well Burning Lamp is 100% correct. Because a Calvinist is CHOSEN (always secure) there is NO need for repentance because they are CHOSEN by God, before birth. They can lapse into sin, in fact they can become as mean and nasty as John Calvin himself and resort to murdering people and never repent, as they have this ‘I am Chosen chip on their shoulder’. I mean what is the point of repentance and all that if you are chosen – nothing at all.

If that was not your REASON for your mean comment, please do let me know what was?

Deborah (Discerning the World)

GE

>> Stand fast in truth God has set you free in!

Notice the words TRUTH Gerhard, If you believe in a false doctrine it wont set you free. You are blinded by TULIP.

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