Dr. Chuck Missler, SWANsat and the Auric Currency
Dr. Chuck Missler, SWANsat and the Auric Currency
I am writing this article because I do not think that Chuck Missler is being at all honest with us as to what he really believes and who he ‘works’ for. For some unknown reason Chuck Missler is ‘protected’ in that he seems to be able to get away with all sorts of false prophecy and publishing books on ‘extra biblical’ occult subjects with no one battering an eyelid.
His resume (freely available on the internet) is profound in that Chuck’s interests, companies and world plans all seem to tie in with what he himself tries to expose as evil in his books.
Chuck Missler is not an expert on prophecy, he is helping to orchestrate Biblical prophecy by aiding and abetting the One World Order.
I will let you review the below information and you can ask yourself the question; “Why is a supposed born again Christian ‘serving the people‘ by connecting the world via 3 satellites and helping to establish the African Union which is part of the New World Order?” I know I am going to get some serious slack for this article, but someone has to say something. And seeing as though I have nothing to lose, let me be that person. In my research I have noted some highly recommended pastors support Chuck Missler, some even have their their books being published on Koinonia House Europe.
There are many things that I myself have fallen prey too and sometimes it’s been difficult for me to want to believe I was fooled. I am no one special, but I do my utter best to listen to the Holy Spirit’s warnings and I ask Jesus for forgiveness of these things and rectify my errors so that I do not lead people astray. I sincerely pray that these pastors that I myself love very much, take heed of what I have written here and re-evaluate their position regarding what the Bible says about false teachers and how it’s even possible for the elect to be deceived.
It sometimes takes a donkey to come along and show us something that was so glaringly obvious.
Dr. Charles ‘Chuck’ Missler: (Information below in no particular order)
Chuck and Nancy Missler established Koinonia House in 1973
Chuck Missler also has close ties with Chuck Smith and Calvary Chapel (where he preached) which was founded by The Jesus People
Close friend to Hal Lindsey (broadcasts shows on
Trinity Broadcasting Network). Hal Lindsey who had a show on TBN for years had his show removed by TBN in December 2005 because of his criticism against Islam. As of Feb 2007 he was back on TBN hosting his show, “The Hal Lindsey Report”. — http://www.religionnewsblog.com/17439/hal-lindsey
Pat Matrisciana is a director of Chuck Missler’s Koinonia House. Matrisciana also founded Campus Crusade for Christ with Bill Bright
Dr.William Welty was appointed to the board of Directors of Koinonia House on 24 October 2009, which creates, develops, and distributes materials to stimulate, encourage, and facilitate serious study of the Bible as the inerrant Word of God. Koinonia House is located in Coeur d’Alene, Idaho and was founded by Dr. Charles Missler.
Chuck Missler supporter of the Bible Code which is Gematria/Numerology –
literal Qabalah. Book: Hidden Treasures – Chuck Missler highlights many of the trademark discoveries of hidden messages within the Biblical texts that will challenge and excite you! A ‘must read’ for every thinking seeker of truth and serious inquirer of reality.
On TBN’s 12/29/99 ‘Praise the Lord’ program which Hal Lindsey and Cliff Ford, hosted. One of their guests was Chuck Missler. Missler said he was there for the purpose of endorsing TBN’s movie, The Omega Code, and promoting his own new book on the Code. The Omega Code movie did NOT promote the Gospel of Jesus Christ, but rather gave credence to the latest big lie — that there are hidden messages in the Bible when one uses the letters as an acrostic puzzle. This is the latest blasphemy sweeping through the professing church — using the Bible as a tool for divination.” —Biblical Discernment Ministries
Occult fascination with UFO’s. Alien Encounters: This book confronts the issues surrounding the sightings of UFOs and alien abductions and offers answers to many of the most pertinent questions. — http://www.alienencounters.com
Dr. Charles W. “Chuck” Missler’s Curriculum Vitae:
Member of a globalist group since 1998, the Council For National Policy (CNP).
Established the first international industrial computer network in 1966 while working at Ford Motor Company.
Founded a computer networking organisation later acquired by Automatic Data Processing (NYSE) to became its Network Services Division. Consultant to the Board of Directors of Rockwell International for corporate acquisitions. Pioneer in computer technologies, participation in the development of some of the most top-secret military systems, including the Stealth bomber, anti-submarine warfare, worked with William E. Simon, former Secretary of Treasury on a strategically sensitive ultraviolet laser project, partnered with Boeing on P-3 upgrade, CEO for Advanced developments for Department of Defense and other deeply classified customers, Global Positioning Satellite systems, Director of Applied Devices Corporation for data processing support services for international oil industry, state lotteries, etc.
Owner of The Phoenix Group, Inc., – 1989
Personally funded the first microchip implementation of the Data Encryption Standard (DES)
Gave false prophecy of Y2K where 2 videos were released by Chuck Missler and John Ankerberg with advertisting title: “The Coming Y2K Computer Crisis Will threaten Anyone Whose Faith is Not in God!”. This ‘false prophecy’ is very peculiar considering his unbelievable resume regarding anything computer orientated. Why would someone who is a genius in the computing field say such a stupid thing.
Partnership with company that will soon launch 3 Satellites that will connect the entire world in the year 2014.
Helping establish the African Union currency called the Auricâ Currency.
Participated in over 100 business ventures as a principal, strategic adviser, or turnaround specialist. Ford Motor Company, TRW, Western Digital Corporation, as well as U.S. and foreign governments.
Missler was Senior participant in highly classified projects serving the intelligence community and the Department of Defense.
Not so long ago Chuck Missler was at the:
God’s News Behind the News International Prophecy Conference 2000 – Orlando Florida, 5-8 April 2000
The prophets were:
- Jack and Rexella Van Impe,
- Morris Cerullo,
- Hal Lindsey,
- Grant Jeffrey,
- Perry Stone,
- John Bevere,
- Ray Brubaker,
- Joe Van Koevering,
- Zola Levitt,
- Chuck Missler,
- J.R.Church,
- Gary Kah,
- Bill Cloud.
The Quantum Leap II Conference – July 19-21 2007
- Hosted by: The Gateway Christian Fellowship with speakers from The Elijah List, etc:
- David van Koevering (The Elijah List, New Age Occultist) – As a visionary, his gift is the insight to see, and by this observation to cause, and then define and communicate what he saw to others.
- Chuck Missler (Chuck was encouraged by his close friend Hal Lindsey to pursue his long-time love of teaching the Bible on a full-time basis. Hal Lindsey regular on TBN.)
- JoAnne McFatter (The Elijah List- New Age Occultist),
- Steve Swanson – Worship and Arts Director of Extreme Prophetic run by Patricia King (both The Elijah List- New Age Occultists).
- Previous speakers at Quantum Leap I Conference included: Kansas City Prophet Bob Jones along with Mike and Kari Browning.
‘Quantum Leap’ is a popular new age idea of man’s spiritual evolution from human to divine.
“Barbara Marx Hubbard” wrote apologist Brooks Alexander, “has a similar event that she calls a planetary Pentecost. She explains to us that at this time, a ‘quantum leap’ in the evolution of mankind will occur as revealed to her by ‘the Christ’: ‘At the moment of cosmic contact, I will appear to you both through inner experience and through external communication on your mass media.’ Hubbard says, at this time when ‘the divisions of the religions would be over…We would each know that God is within us…If all who feel we are connected to each other, to nature and to God join in a planetary Pentecost, we shall be transformed in this lifetime.’ (Barbara Marx Hubbard and the Armageddon Alternative,” SCP Journal, Vol. 19:2/3, 1995, p. 49).”
Jackie Alnor from Apostasy Alert tried to contact Chuck Missler on why he attend this conference but did not receive a reply from him. http://www.apostasyalert.org/REFLECTIONS/quantum.htm
Chuck Missler of Koinonia House sponsored: The Malta Expedition – 2004, ‘Exclusive Archaeological Cruise Event’ .
Tourists sailed to the islands of Patmos, Malta and Crete with excursions to Ephesus and Athens, where they visited the Acropolis, Parthenon and Mars Hill. Two days were spent on the island of Malta, where the tour visited the Palace of the Grand Master of the Knights of Malta!
At Valetta the tour will also visit an ancient Tarxien temple. ‘Tarxien’ means ‘huge stone’ which describes those used for the numerous prehistoric temples on Malta. The World Monuments Fund is trying to help protect these temples. In Lady of the Beasts: The Goddess and Her Sacred Animals, Buffie Johnson informs that Malta was renown for its temples and monuments to the Mother Goddess
Rockwell International:
A multifaceted company that worked in the manufacturing arena for defense and space industries. Rockwell International are Freemason/Illuminati.
The building that was originally built for Rockwell International was designed in the shape of a Ziggurat; a stepped pyramid in the style of ancient Babylonia. However they did not occupy the building and it became the regional branch office of the federal government, housing some National Archives material and other miscellaneous government documents.
Ziggurat
An ancient Mesopotamian temple tower consisting of a lofty pyramidal structure built in successive stages with outside staircases and a shrine at the top. [1] Form of temple common to the Sumerians, Babylonians and Assyrians. [2]
SWANsat: The Super-Wide Area Network Satellite
“People Serving People”
SWANsat’s satellite services will begin in 2014.
The SWANsat Project will place a constellation of three high-powered satellites into operation: One spacecraft will serve Europe, Africa, the Middle East, and western Asia. One spacecraft will serve North, Central, and South America. One spacecraft will serve central and east Asia, Australia, New Zealand, and the central Pacific. When operated together, all three spacecraft will provide coverage of the entire globe, except for polar areas.” — www.swansat.com
Dr. Charles W. “Chuck” Missler is a special advisor to the SWANsatâ„¢ project. —www.swansat.com/about_us_cmissler.htm
Introducing the World’s First Inflation-Proof Gold and Silver Standard Offered as Part of SWANsat’s Modern Marshall Plan for the African Union
Learn how SWANsat can help stabilize the world’s economy through the proposed gold-backed Auricâ currency. — http://www.swansat.com/index.htm
African Union Gold Currency – Auricâ
Dr. Welty is a founding member of the Global Settlement Foundation (GSF), a Geneva-based, independent, international non-profit organization that provides finality of settlement for global trade. The GSF System includes the GSF, duly appointed prime dealers, foundation members, lawful processes, and deliverable units. These trade in a cryptographically neutral marketplace. In the Global Standardâ„¢, one Globalâ„¢ is defined as 0.1 gram of gold by mass deliverable as 0.999 or better fine gold, and includes retail delivery of 0.9999 pure gold 1 Kg bars marked 10,000 Globals, high value coins designed for circulation and low value coins and notes. All circulating physical Globals contain at least 70% of the face value amount of gold with the balance stored in the GSF vaults. Counterfeits are impossible without the gold content. GSF enables the physical and lawful processes that facilitate creation and movement of goods and services, including the necessary infrastructure to allow entrepreneurs and investors who use Globals to create and use a real-capital stock market that allows the pricing function in the marketplace to price risk. The genius of the west – lawful real-money stock markets – has now again returned to the service of mankind. –– http://www.williamwelty.com/about_us.htm
In early June 2005 we began a feasibility study regarding formation of mySWANbank, a proposed banking service for SWANsatâ„¢ users. Our mySWANbank service will be operated in conjunction with SWANsat’s affiliated Banque de Commerce Internationale. — http://swansatfoundation.com/milestones.htm
Chuck Missler is nothing but a Luciferian cleverly disguised as a Dominionist.
Other Resources: [1] www.merriam-webster.com [2] www.encyclopedia.com/html/z1/ziggurat.asp
NEW!! UPDATED: 5/12/2016 – Please read this SHOCKING news about William P Welty, Chuck Missler, Ron Matsen and a new book released in May 2016 about Mary the mother of God aka Queen of Heaven: William Welty and Koinonia House – the Adoration of Mary book
I tend to agree that Missler is starting to lose his wheels; calling him out as a heretic and liar is a bit far, through, IMHO. Second, I think it’s quite funny that you use Dave Hunt’s dislike of Missler’s latest book as a reason against Missler, and yet you would agree with Missler’s book that we are saved by grace alone, and not by works. If you’re saved by grace alone, then you’re saved by grace alone. You don’t get it by works, you don’t keep it by works, and you don’t prove it by works. Any of these three are simply putting works into the game through the front door or the back door.
I’ve not read Dr. Missler’s book, but I’ve read many others in this area, and find the pure Calvinist position logically contradictory and untenable. So, I’m not so quick to judge anyone on the basis of soteriology any longer. In fact, one of the first things I’ve learned in Seminary is that few people have a readily classifiable view, and it’s probably not the wisest thing in the world to jump down someone’s throat on this score, or to call them a heretic on this front. It’s best to listen, learn, and disagree quietly and with dignity, rather than with screaming and much affront.
I think Dr. Missler is just getting a bit older, watching his ministry decline from its heights, and pulling in people he probably shouldn’t be pulling in to try and build it back up. Mylon Lefevre did the same thing, and Billy Graham, and many others, I think. He’s getting bad advice, I’m afraid, at this point. So, warning taken, but don’t toss out the watermelon with the seeds, or there won’t be anything good left to eat in the entire world.
Russ
Russ
>> calling him out as a heretic and liar is a bit far
Where did I call him an heretic or a liar? Good grief. I said he was not good, I also said that he is not kosher. But then again, the more I research the more I am beginning to wonder what we should class him under. Using Bible Code divination? You tell me what the Bible has to say about this.
>> I think it’s quite funny that you use Dave Hunt’s dislike of Missler’s latest book as a reason against Missler
I think it’s quite funny too, because I did not use Dave Hunt as a reason. – and if you READ all the comments properly – it’s clear that Dave Hunt in no way dislikes Missler. You are making stuff up here. The reason I used his name was because others asked me if Dave Hunt had said anything, which he has and I posted the newsletter.
>> and yet you would agree with Missler’s book that we are saved by grace alone, and not by works. If you’re saved by grace alone, then you’re saved by grace alone. You don’t get it by works, you don’t keep it by works, and you don’t prove it by works. Any of these three are simply putting works into the game through the front door or the back door.
I wont agree with Misslers book. Yes I agree that we are saved by grace alone. Basically you are saying that because Chuck is saved by grace alone that he can now go out and disobey the Holy Spirit in his life and lead people astray? Once saved always saved only counts when one was genuinely saved in the first place.
>> it’s probably not the wisest thing in the world to jump down someone’s throat on this score, or to call them a heretic on this front. It’s best to listen, learn, and disagree quietly and with dignity, rather than with screaming and much affront.
Screaming? I never scream, maybe make like little shrills but that’s it. lol. Amazing what you get taught at seminary – to just keep quiet at all costs. Second it is every born again believes task to test and warn others. If one doesn’t feel the necessity to do this then where is the love for ones brothers and sisters in Jesus who’s souls are hanging in the balance because of this man. Do you not understand that we are actually talking about peoples lives here when someone ministers falsely? Do you not understand that there is the HOLY SPIRIT who councils ALL born again Christians and keeps us on the right track – If Chuck is doing the opposite to the Word of God, then where is the Holy Spirit in His life?
>> I think Dr. Missler is just getting a bit older,
The Holy Spirit is the ONLY ONE, He is Jesus Christ, He is God that WILL keep you on the straight and narrow so to say he’s getting older does not quite cut it. There is not an expirary age limit attached to being faithful to Jesus Christ.
>>watching his ministry decline from its heights, and pulling in people he probably shouldn’t’t be pulling in to try and build it back up.
Well if that is the case, which I do not think it is, that’s a lovely reason for carrying on deceiving people, instead of stopping – getting back in line with God’s Word. What should be more important, 1) making sure you preached the Truth with nothing added or taken away or 2) allowing in wolves to get the business up and running again. Hmmm
>> but don’t toss out the watermelon with the seeds, or there won’t be anything good left to eat in the entire world.
And I will toss out an entire LOAF because of a smidgen of leaven. The Word of God is the BREAD of Life. What on earth do you want to eat of in this world?
“Once saved always saved only counts when one was genuinely saved in the first place.”
And which of your works of vitriol and self-righteous anger prove you were saved in the first place? Thank God I don’t eat that deadly spiritual diet every day. If you can only prove you were “saved in the first place” through your works, then no-one is saved.
Of course, I’m certain you’ll anything I say and twist it completely, as you’ve done above. Twisting people’s words is a hard habit to break, isn’t it?
Russ
Russ
Gee talk about twisting my words. What a nasty reply that was. I know who is speaking through you and it’s not Jesus Christ. You speak with a forked tongue.
If you think that being TRUTHFULL and ABIDING IN THE WORD OF GOD and FOLLOWING THE GOSPLE OF JESUS CHRIST and REPENTANCE OF SIN is a GOOD WORK then…
Matthew 16:23
23 But He [Jesus] turned and said to Peter, “Get behind Me, Satan! You are a stumbling block to Me; for you are not setting your mind on God’s interests, but man’s.”
Matthew 4:10
10 Then Jesus said to him, “Go, Satan! For it is written, ‘YOU SHALL WORSHIP THE LORD YOUR GOD, AND SERVE HIM ONLY.'”
Being saved by GRACE includes OBEYING THE WORD OF GOD, REPENTANCE OF SIN, LIVING A HOLY LIFE THROUGH THE CONVICTION OF THE HOLY SPIRIT, NOT FOLLOWING EVIL WICKED TEACHINGS, ABIDING IN ALL THINGS THAT ARE GOOD AND RUNNING AWAY FROM ALL THINGS THAT ARE EVIL.
Now I’m Satan himself? You really do like to call people names, don’t you? Now I know why I got out of the heresy hunting business years ago. It was eating me up inside, making me mad all the time, looking at people searching for that one little thing that would prove how wrong they are, looking for any reason at all to tear them down, to destroy, to rip someone apart. Guilt by association, guilt by the slip of a tongue, whatever–I was always seeking out some reason to condemn, to find that one piece of “fruit” that didn’t fit, and proved, beyond the shadow of a doubt, that someone “wasn’t really a Christian.”
Come out of it. Your constant anger isn’t making you any healthier; you’ll just end up hating yourself before it’s over with. And if you’re going to post my comments, post the whole thing, not the part that you think makes you look good.
(Not that it matters, I won’t be back to read your blog after you’ve stooped to calling me Satanic.)
Russ
Russ
I never said you were Satan, I said the spirit speaking through you is not of Jesus . You can insult me, but I cant quote biblical scripture to get you to stop insulting me. Well you said you won’t come back to read this blog, and that’s because the Word of God cuts like a double edged sword.
Have you come before Jesus and asked Him to forgive you of all your sins; you have done, thought and said, and have you turned away from them? – as Jesus commanded you to do in His Word with the help, council and guidance of the Holy Spirit that abides in you when you are truly saved.
Do you have conviction of the sin in your life? If not, then you need Jesus Christ in you life. You follow after men like Chuck Missler and make idols of these people, you make him out to be a god. If you are genuinely saved you will know that what I am saying now is Biblical and you will want to come before Jesus Christ and humbly ask for forgiveness.
You can insult me and call me names and pick and choose your words to suit your own version of what you want the gospel of Jesus Christ to be but you can’t no matter how you try, change what God expects of you as His Child. A obedient child obeys their Father and when they do wrong they say sorry and He forgives His child immediately.
I am not angry, you are the angry one, and being shown the truth but refusing to believe in the truth is what eats you up inside. The conviction in your life by the Holy Spirit speaking to you is what is bothering you. and cutting you up. You know Russ, you know fully well which side you are taking or chosen… and you know what, you still have the choice to listen to the Holy Spirit speaking to you or you can carry on and ignore Him. Will you listen to Him? Will you ignore Him? Will you listen to Him? Will you ignore Him? It’s alllllll upto you.
I don’t want an apology from you, but I would love you to go to Jesus and ask for forgives for everything in your life that opposes Him. You are either for Jesus are against Him.
You know your heart Russ. You know…
Hebrews 4:12 “For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any two-edged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.”
I think it’s about time I post this email I sent to lighthousetrails. I have no idea if this email was forwarded on. I hope it was.
This article has really caused a problem for a lot of people. Unfortunately the truth does hurt, even me. I am not immune to the shocks I face on a daily basis of things I believed to be true and turned out to be false. But you know what? I come before Jesus DAILY, my Lord and Saviour and I say I am sorry and I change my ways and stop following lies.
If people don’t want to accept the truth then do not make your problems mine. This article and everything on my blog is for those WHO WANT TO FOLLOW JESUS CHRIST TO THE LETTER OF HIS WORD. This blog is not for people who could not care about the truth.
Insult me if you will, I don’t care. But I will carry on warning for people’s souls are hanging in the balance here. Time is running out – soon people are going to be screaming and shouting out of sheer horror of what is going to take place in this ‘LOVING’ world our ours, cursing, because they think no one warned them. Yet Jesus spoke to you daily and warned you to change your ways and YOU REFUSED, YOU by your OWN FREE WILL CHOSE to IGNORE HIM.
Email sent to lighthousetrails.com:
On 22 February 2010 00:08
—————
Hi David,
I am writing to you with love and for the sake of genuine Christians looking after one another. I am hoping you can forward this email onto everyone at lighthouse trails. And if they can forward it onto other genuine Christians so they can be warned.
I wrote this article Dr. Chuck Missler, SWANsat and the Auric™ Currency a few days ago and while doing my research I came across a name or 2 of pastors who I have looked up to because of their obedience to God hence their preaching the true gospel of Jesus Christ. But was shocked to find their names associated with Missler. Can I tell you that I cried? Yip, I cried.
Please can I ask that you urgently review what I have written and prayerfully seek God regarding the issue. I am now even starting to get threats on my blog and 2 threats via email because of my article.
But I will not back down because I stand for Jesus Christ. We are living in terrible times where great ministers are falling on the way side by finding common ground with false teachers.
I think of all the articles I have researched to write non have hurt me more than this one, because of pastors that I love are associating with someone that promotes the Bible Code and now SWANsat and African Union Auric currency.
I just want pastors who are sincere to not be fooled by Missler. We are all fooled by people, everyone, but the Holy Spirit will warn us, but then it’s left up to you to decided what to do. There are so few great men to listen too, we have to keep our pastors safe.
Please, please, please keep your life on the straight and narrow for Jesus Christ. Time is running out.
I have already emailed Dave Hunt from BereanCall my article.
Thanks
Deborah
————–
And do I still cry? Yes! I find this to be the saddest article I have ever written because I know how many people are not going to listen to the truth and the PROOF I have given regarding Chuck Missler. Men are more important than Jesus Christ.
Jesus warns us that choosing our earthly family over Him will be disastrous, how much more so will He tell you to depart from Him for siding with a man that is not even your biological flesh and blood.
Matthew 10:32-33 “Whosoever therefore shall confess me before men, him will I confess also before my Father which is in heaven. But whosoever shall deny me before men, him will I also deny before my Father which is in heaven.”
Matthew 10:34-39 “Do not think that I came to bring peace on the earth; I did not come to bring peace, but a sword. For I came to set a man against his father, and a daughter against her mother, and a daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law; and a man’s enemies will be the members of his household. He who loves father or mother more than Me is not worthy of Me; and he who loves son or daughter more than Me is not worthy of Me. And he who does not take his cross and follow after Me is not worthy of Me. He who has found his life will lose it, and he who has lost his life for My sake will find it.”
Luke 12:49-53 “49 I have come to cast fire upon the earth; and how I wish it were already kindled! 50 But I have a baptism* to undergo, and how distressed I am until it is accomplished! 51 Do you suppose that I came to grant peace on earth? I tell you, no, but rather division; 52 for from now on five members in one household will be divided, three against two and two against three. 53 They will be divided, father* against son and son against father, mother against daughter and daughter against mother, mother-in-law against daughter-in-law and daughter-in-law against mother-in-law.
Luke 14:26 “If anyone comes to Me, and does not hate his own father and mother and wife and children and brothers and sisters, yes, and even his own life, he cannot be My disciple.”
Romans 1:20-21: “Ever since the creation of the world his invisible nature, namely, his eternal power and deity, has been clearly perceived in the things that have been made. So they are without excuse; for although they knew God they did not honour him as God or give thanks to him, but they became futile in their thinking and their senseless minds were darkened.”
John 1:10-13 “He was in the world, and the world was made through him, yet the world knew him not. He came to his own home, and his own people received him not. But to all who received him, who believed in his name, he gave power to become children of God.”
The LOVE that is spoken of today is the LOVE of the World NOT love for Jesus Christ the SON OF GOD who is the one you should be bowing before not Chuck Missler.
Regarding Guilt by Association: http://www.discerningtheworld.com/2010/02/14/do-not-let-him-into-your-home/ It’s very simple to overcome.
Russ
I see the church you pastor does not believe in repentance of sin as an ongoing part of ones relationship with Jesus Christ: . You are Emergent.
Deb-
My heart breaks as I read your words with absolute shared emotion. My eyes are filled with tears to know that you, along with so many, including myself, have been so viciously attacked for daring to speak out in this darkened world. I added a link to a blog I posted about David Reagan and his using a mystic to illustrate his advice toward subjective leading a few comments up, and I have since been treated so poorly by his Gargoyle gate-keepers. It encouraged me to read what mijadedios said above about not throwing our pearls before swine. And, as good and Holy as it feels to be the righteous voice, according to Scripture, sometimes their hateful rhetoric stings. That is why I feel so blessed to have found this blog- it encourages me in the fight. My husband giggles when he reads our dialogue because he says you are my SA counter-part. Thank you for your continued strength.
I see that you sent a letter to lighthouse trails. I look forward to seeing their response. I have emailed them with my concerns, specifically, with the above mentioned issues with Dave Hunt and they never replied. I used to dialogue with them regularly through email/phone, but I don’t receive responses anymore. I also emailed them because I took issue with a post Roger Oakland had on Christmas. He dismissed the fact that Christmas is pagan simply by saying, “Is it possible to become so pure and righteous in this world that one can no longer live in this world?…If you take the position you are going to set all things right, you will be considered right off. Unbelievers will think you have lost your mind.” He ends by saying, “Don’t stop celebrating Christmas to make yourself more righteous than others. If you do, forget about telling your lost neighbor about Jesus Christ the rest of the year.” So, now my Christian witness is comromised if I DON’T celebrate a Roman Catholic/Pagan holiday? Tell me where I can find that in the Bible. I DON’T THINK SO! And, yet again, I can’t get a response from them.
With your contributer ‘Russ’- I laugh, albeit sadly. When he mentioned something about being in seminary, I knew immediately he was emergent. A person is pure UNTIL these lovely seminaries get their apostate claws into people. People love to tout that they come from a seminary to lend themselves credibility, as if they are more grounded in Truth because they paid someone to explain the Bible to them, but I pretty much run the other direction when someone starts blabbing about their seminary credentials.
mom4truth
Thank you. I wrote that earlier this morning and had to take the rest of the day off just to pray and thank Jesus for everything He has done for me and will continue to do for me as He promised in His Word. There is nothing greater than the comfort of the Holy Spirit in onces life, knowing Jesus is with you every moment of every day and that we can enter the presence of our heavenly Father, the most glorious place anyone would ever want to be and kneel before Him in utter most reverence and worship.
I was stuck in traffic today on my way back home and I just sobbed, thinking of this article and 1 person in sepecific. The thought broke my heart that he might be persuaded at the moment, but I pray he sees what is going on. He is one tough puppy and I know he will realise what’s happened.
You know, I can understand if no one knew about Chuck Misslers satellite escapades but knowing he believes the Bible Code and the UFO stuff is something I am just really struggling to comprehend in my mind how anyone could miss that? How does Chuck get it right that he can convince even great ministers that what ‘he’ knows is true and biblical? Apparently he is pretty good at it. So 10/10 for Chuck on that one.
I dunno. I am going to have to take my focus off this and place it onto – ah that’s a surprise for tomorrow. Got a fantastic email with some fantastical’ false teaching.
Oh wait it is tomorrow. It’s now 02:20am in the morning… Ok, I shall depart, tomorrow is another long day.
Thanks again mom4truth, official USA-counter part.
When Africa becomes the “United States of Africa”, then I can officially say that we both live in the USA. I’ll send you my only Auric gold coin when they are minted. I say my only ‘one’ cos by then Africa will be in the same situation Greece is sitting in now. Having created mass debt that Africa will never be able to repay, EU will take over because Africa is just not pulling it’s weight. My little gold coin will be under my pillow, so I will post it to you for safe keeping. Oh hold on, I will need to pay for the postage with my gold coin. Hmmmm. Scrap that thought. lol
Ok, it’s 6:30am, sleep is not on my side today and I have just seen that http://lighthousetrailsresearch.com/links.htm has linked me as an international site on theirs. Oh here I go again *crying*. Sinus headache here I come. I am just way to emotional for this right now. This is why I have a blog lol. I can hide my puffy eyes and runny nose.
All I want from those at lighthouse trails and elsewhere is to be careful, be extra vigilant. Each day that goes by you have to listen to the Holy Spirit more and more and more. It’s now a time where the whole Armour of God HAS to be put on 24/7. And there is NO COMMON GROUND with men who seek common ground.
Please pray for ALL good men of God who are being under attack and being deceived right now as the enemy slithers in closer – that they obey JESUS CHRIST THE SON OF GOD, over piddly little earthly men who come bearing an array of degrees and doctorates and ‘services’ that oppose God, who are there to deceive and drag our pastors down with them.
I said that it’s time that the little sheep surround our pastors. Oh how I would love to illustrate the picture I have in my head lol. Maybe today I will try come up with something.
Regarding Chuck I have asked the Holy Spirit to show me if he has any error. I have not as yet come across anything he has said which will make me run away. I have a few negatives about him personally, which I dont need to discuss here. I never take mans word for it. I listen, then seek the truth through the word and the holy spirit. If I find error I leave it alone. This method has taken me through Rhema, which I ran out when GOD said through his word “Come Out Of Her My People” a teaching I was listening to from John Mcaurthur. I shall heed the warning from this site but I shall leave it up to GOD to show me as I seek only his truth. I dont care to place man, Pastors or Preachers on any level. God always answers my prayers. Thank you. I do not attend any church as error lurks in every corner. Instead we have home fellowship and we have no leader but the Holy Spirit. Neither do we Tithe but God shows me who to bless by that quiet small voice I have.
louise
Did you actually read my article?
I printed it out for tonights study reading. I go through realms of paper. Trust me
The person in whom we get our Chuck tapes from did not wish to meet us, or could not and still does not. It gets posted from his home to ours. Sometimes one is really impatient so we have to wait.
Can you recommend anyone else who we can support by listening to their tape ministry. We long for true fellowship. Thank you
I was sorry to see negative comments about Dave Hunt and LHT. Guys, can I exhort you to extend grace to these discernment ministries? We all need correction from time to time and when the critics who reject reality of error slice and dice us it is tough, but when we start to throw darts at each other, that is truly sad.
I don’t know what LHT did, somehow I missed that. But look at the courageous stands they take and the heat and hate they receive on a daily basis. If there is correction, keep it in the family and admonish with tenderness as did the Apostle Paul.
We are never going to agree on every single point. Take the observance of Christmas for instance. Some are very convicted in this area and abstain as they should, others choose to celebrate a holiday that is part of the fabric of society and use it to reach out to the lost.
This is different from Halloween that is clearly occultic.
The same goes with Resurrection Sunday. This is an area which we should reserve judgment. Follow your own convictions, but allow others liberty to follow theirs. To castigate Roger Oakland for his comments about Christmas is quite frankly, nitpicking. Roger has taken courageous stands for truth at great personal expense. And now he has been down for the count from a terrible accident and is still in the recovery process and is not able to be in ministry. To discount his ministry over this is short-sighted. Also, his assistant has gone through a horrible time with a brain tumor. Right now the ministry is limping along as best it can. We need to pray for these men who have sacrificed much for the sake of the truth.
Also, Dave Hunt who is in advanced years and poor health continues to faithfully write books and press on. T.A. has had serious health challenges the past couple of years. I have found his work to be very helpful except for a couple of very minor areas.
I do not believe that Dave is defending Missler. Dave weighs his words. Perhaps he is reaching out behind the scenes to correct. Let’s not be hasty to judge. Yes, hold him to account, but remember his advanced years and health challenges. Let’s pray for him and for Roger and others who are under attack.
As for LHT they are under constant attack and we need to hold them up in prayer and lovingly and gently edify them. We all need that from each other on the discernment team. These are perilous times and we can’t afford division in the discernment ranks.
Grace and peace to all!
Burning Lamp
From my side the comments are not negative about Dave Hunt and LHT. But there are one or 2 ministers who are involved with Chuck and I pray with all my heart they realise what’s happened. This is why we have to look after one another. Times have changed and we the little sheep need to help them. They need our help and I hope they are willing to let up help them. In the last days the Bible says that the man of lawlessness will wear the saints down. And this is exactly what is happening.
And yes, we always discern between those who are blatantly erroneous vs those who are genuine men of God who are under attack. We all make mistakes. I am so far from not making mistakes it’s quite ridiculous. In fact I am an accident looking for a place to happen lol.
I really admire all at Lighthousetrails for all they do on a daily basis. They stick to the Word of God like no one’s business and it’s awesome to know I can go there and get excellent information. And yeah sometimes there are topics that are very difficult to handle, like Christmas. I still celebrate Christmas day, but I don’t do the tree, and I do buy pressies for everyone. I know that the 25th is pagan. But in my heart, Christmas day is a day just like any other day created by God. I like it because of the delicious food we make for lunch hahaha. Like Easter – Never once bothered about Easter, I know Jesus died for me and was resurrected. But come Easter here in SA they make these little marshmallow chocolate coated easter eggs and oh boy, are they only good stuff.
Anyhow that’s my 2 cents for the day. I am tired. 3 hours sleep last night. I need to cook dinner for my starving husband. Hmmm I just noticed this comment seem to revolved around food.
Burning Lamp-
To start off, Debs isn’t just saying they are off on a little issue, she is concerned that they are promoting wolves amongst the sheep. I also emailed them about some of the concerns I had with Dave Hunt. Not on a “get em'” mission, but just asking if they were aware and to see if and how they were handling it. It’s not some little family issue, as you state, but if they are departing, even in subtle ways, we have to question that. I’m sure you would agree that Deborah would never handle them harshly, or more importantly, in an un-Scriptural manner, so why so much concern about a simple letter asking questions?
Did you actually read the quotes Roger Oakland made in the Christmas article? Take the idea of Christmas out of the fold, just briefly, and examine the quotes in light of themselves: He asks if we can become so pure and righteous that we can no longer live in this world. So, am I to assume that we should give up pursuing purity and righteousness, as we are compelled by the Lord Himself, simply because we can never attain perfection? Why should I not do everything in my human power to live unblemished from the world? IN the world, not OF it, right? I happen to live IN a world that, when I take my very young children to the grocery store from Oct to Jan, they are exposed to Halloween AND Christmas items, but the choice becomes mine if I choose to engage it and become OF the world. I cannot eliminate the pagan aspects of society, but by the grace of Christ, I can choose whether I engage them!
Further, Oakland takes the completely un-biblical stance that if we try to do things so right, the unbelievers of the world will think we’ve lost our mind. Since when are we to live parallel with the world in order to accommodate the comforts of the unbelieving of the community? “The message of the cross is FOOLISHNESS to those who are perishing, but unto us which are saved, it is the power of God!” 1 Cor 1:18. Couldn’t his argument be made over any decision we make not to partake in society’s sins? If we choose not to own a TV or go to the movies, people may think we’re out of touch, and that we’ve lost our minds, “For do I now persuade men, or God? or do I seek to please men? for if I yet pleased men, I SHOULD not be a servant of Christ.” Gal 1:10 My decision to pursue Holiness is for the glory of Christ, to improve my testimony in a world craving Truth, craving something different than the status quo- looking for a Christian who actually lives the Word. And I certainly don’t care if unbelievers think I’m weird! What most Christians don’t realize that by partaking in these pagan practices, we confuse the world. Jews don’t understand Christians that celebrate the pagan holidays of Christmas/Easter because they know the truth of their origins. The Lord drove them out of their land because of the spiritual adultery- swearing by the Lord, yet adopting the vain traditions of man. Instead of maintaining their purity, they simply began to partake in the pagan practices, customs, and holiday’s of the pagan nations that surrounded them. You can go to many Wiccan sites and see that they often times mock Christians around Christmas for our ignorance on its true origins. Do we not think that compromises our testimony?
Further, Oakland says that if we choose not to participate in Christmas, we lose our right to share the gospel with our “neighbors” any other day of the year. How does that make sense? We have 365 days a year to share the gospel of Christ, but we have successfully convinced ourselves that we need to adopt the Festival of Saturnalia to strengthen our testimony? Imagine a church that dared say, “We don’t subscribe to the pagan practices of Babylon, nor the equally as offensive practices of the Roman Catholic harlot religion, but only Truth. And here, 365 days a year, that’s what you’ll get- not some culturally-tailored message to accommodate the unbelievers of our community.” If I ever started a church, that would be my motto!
So, you say it “castigates” Oakland to question his un-Scriptural comments and that it is nit-picking. Okay. I will nit-pick the tar out of someone who is clearly violating Scripture with his man-made opinion. Nothing he says is Scriptural! And if he can nit-pick Scripture, than I will use Scripture to nit-pick his opinions.
You also say it is short-sighted to discount a ministry for this reason. Well, if said ministry is forming opinions not absolutely grounded and contracted from Scripture, it seems to me that they discount themselves. Second of all, I find it interesting that discernment ministries will clearly point out the connections of the emergent church and the contemplative spirituality movement to the Roman Catholic Church, in fact, there are books out that speak of all road’s leading to Rome. A book authored by Oakland himself, warns of that trend. We can watch the Protestant churches of today beginning to adopt all of the trends of the RC Church- Stations of the Cross, vain prayer repetitions, candles, incense, even Mary-veneration and we are warned against this, but yet, we think God will simply wink if we partake in their pagan traditions/holidays because the greeting card companies say it’s okay? Or because, “Every body else is doing it!” This mass-following ideology is exactly why masses are falling into deception- because they find power in numbers, but yet Scripture gives examples of people who stood alone in their community, against the grain, to follow God. It seems to me Scripture exhorts us that we should avoid mass consumption to follow the narrow way that leads to everlasting life.
In regards to the celebration of Christmas, when God says in Rev 18, after having clearly defined in Rev 17 and 18 the harlot religion, to, “Come out of her my people, that ye be not partakers of her sins, and that ye receive not of her plagues,” he is saying do not participate in her behaviors, nor in her traditions, or we will, in turn, receive of her plagues! Acts 17:30 says,”And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men everywhere to repent.” We don’t get to live a life of ignorance if we want to truly deny ourselves, pick up our crosses, and follow Christ- we must repent of behaviors we could once claim ignorance of, and walk in the light of Truth. I hear many Christians say Halloween is clearly wrong, but Christmas is questionable. Halloween AND Christmas come from the same pagan backgrounds. One Satan has succeeded in fooling only the majority of the masses in, the other he has convinced the multitudes. I’m sure you can tell which is which. Satan masquerades as an angel of light- he won’t just use the pitchfork holiday to deceive God’s people! Eph. 5:11, “But have no fellowship with the unfruitful works of darkness, but rather reprove them!”
Burning Lamp, that is 2 posts where you point out the physical ailments of the leaders spoken of, and also the elderly age. I appreciate your compassion, but find it lacking Scriptural support. I don’t mean this to be trite, but Noah was 600 years old when he built the ark! And he only lived another 350 years after the flood. So he was OLD, but even in the age context of his time, he was WAY over mid-way and God called him “just” and “perfect in his generations”, saying, he “walked with God”- meaning he separated himself from the wickedness of his culture and followed the Lord. The same is said of Enoch. It said he lived 365 years, and he “walked with God.” Job was afflicted with health issues and never once gave into the temptation to compromise in his faith. The Lord promises us he would give us the strength to endure temptations (trials). Romans 5 gives us a clear description of the benefit of trials. Further, Proverbs tells us, “The hoary (gray) head is a crown of glory, if it be found in the way of righteousness.” Gray hair is a crown of glory to those who have walked in righteousness- age does not mean your testimony or Scriptural truths should be compromised! I hear a lot of people using age to explain away Billy Graham’s comments- and I say False! Age doesn’t deceive! Rather, we should be MORE grounded in truth at the end of our lives!
What I hope you and others like you, who view it as a negative to call out wrong teaching from even those we’ve come to know and love, is that it is only negative if we neglect to say something. Scripture tells us that if we really love our children, we will discipline them, right? But yet, our perverse generation has people convinced that we show our love by letting them get away with whatever they want. God’s kingdom is different. He knows growth can only happen if we are willing to hold each other accountable. Think about Paul and Peter (Galatians). By your definition, Paul should have left Peter alone simply because he always had said the right things- afterall, he was a disciple of Christ Himself. But Paul, out of love for the disciples, out of love for Christ’s church, and mostly, for the love of Christ Himself, Paul confronted Peter, and the other disciples, who dared teach a different gospel. It was because of love for the Truth! We must speak out against wrong or false teaching! Why? Because we claim allegiance to Christ, and Christ alone. Again I proclaim Eph. 5:11.
I do agree that we should be praying daily for discernment ministries and any other pastor we see traveling the wide road, but this “feel-good” message of, “Poor babies- just leave them alone” comes not from Scripture…With Russ and the many others I see come on here at every turn to defend the leaders they think are fine against the righteous way we are to call them out, I say, “Get thee behind me, Satan…”
mom4truth
I have to totally agree with you. Age is not a factor, nor health for that matter. Paul was 90, under immense persecution, and got it right first time, all the time.
And as much as I pray for these ministers to get back on track. If they don’t I will have to say something. As a born again Christian we are compelled to speak out and warn others. And Chuck is a perfect example of ‘apologising’ but not changing his ways. So for these other ministers to fix what they have said and made ‘friends’ with, all they need to do is fix the problem but correcting what they said, removing these ‘friends’ from their lives who will ultimately destroy them and not do it again < -- That's the crux of the matter - not doing it again and listening to the Holy Spirit on such important matters as this. I have noticed a trend where many speak out against WoF but are blind to Emergent Transformation/Reformation and then the opposite where they speak out against the Emergent movement and WoF but still have ties with people who are not ok and are deceivers. I think many do not realise that this Transformation movement is part and parcel of the WoF which grew into the Apostolic and Prophetic movement which is now the Transformation/Reformation movement (can we call these people New Calvinists?) and that the Transformations movement is just another name for the Emergent movement with different terminology and less intense in Roman Catholic practices, but as time goes by it will all come together and everyone will have been caught up into Vatican II. New Calvinists is the new name for people who have taken a bit from WoF, the Apostolic, the Prophetic, moved into Transformation/Reformation (Unity of all 'Christian' faiths) and a little bit of Emergence without even knowing it and within all these lies a great deal of New Age teaching and practices that will push everyone into a New World 'Christ-ian' consciousness. In fact it's happened already and no one even knows it. They call it 'Love'. So as much as we the little sheep need to help our ministers stay on track and warn them too for they are not immune to the lies of this world - if they don't listen they will need to be asked outright why they have changed their stance.
Mom,
if you knew me you would know that I take a very strong stand for truth – I respect no man/woman/person over the Word of God. I have seen teacher after teacher, pastor after pastor who I have respected fall into apostasy. I do not for a minute believe that Dave Hunt and T.A. Macmahon fall into that category. I am willing to give them the benefit of the doubt based on their faithful service in defense of the faith and the truth. We all make mistakes or are you the exception? I am not excusing Dave because of his age – but I do respect him and realize that it may take him a little longer to respond. He is always very careful to get his facts straight. I think I owe him for the many ways he defends the faith and takes horrendous heat for doing so. He is one of the few who has dared to expose Billy Graham.
Are you aware of what a devious teaching Calvinism is for instance? He took this on when no one else had the courage to do so and got raked over the coals for it.
Now Roger Oakland. Perhaps you would like to take a walk in his shoes. You are ready to throw out all the good work he has done for the Lord because of some remarks he made about Christmas? I know a good number of godly men of God who celebrate Christmas – you should read John R. Rice’s little book I Love Christmas and see how he expounds on it and answers the concerns about the paganism. This is NOT something to cause division. If you are so particular then you would have to throw out your calendar because all the names have pagan roots.
Roger Oakland is one of the most courageous and remarkable men of God of our time. He has been the butt of jokes from others who call themselves Christian. Then he suffered a terrible accident that left his brain disabled and he is still recovering. Talk about kicking someone when they are down!
You would discount someone’s ministry because they suggest that a Christian could celebrate Christmas and use it for God’s glory? Are you condemning every believer who celebrates Christmas or Easter as sinning? You certainly have the right to your convictions, but please don’t judge so harshly those who have not reached that conclusion. This happens to be something you feel strongly about and that is fine. If you are convicted about it you should act accordingly.
Personally, I use the Christmas custom to share our testimony of what the Lord has done in the past year with those we only contact once a year. I have a friend who gets vehement if anyone mentions Christmas. This does nothing for the cause of Christ!.Opportunities abound to give witness of the Lord and share the Gospel. We demonstrate the true meaning of Christmas as a witness to our neighbors. It opens the door to be able to witness. This is a holiday that neither you or I can change. Trust me, I am just as much against pagan influence as you are. But there are much more sinister and sneaky forces at work that we often miss while dwelling on the obvious.
We have to pick our battles. There are countless abberant teachings and false teachers and religions. There are many errors. We have to choose the ones we take on.
Bottom line, I am going to cut Dave and T.A. some slack and let them deal with the Missler issue. Perhaps there is something going on behind the scenes we don’t know about. I am just saying let’s not be so quick to criticize. Dave has been a living sacrifice for the Lord as has T.A. If he falls into deception I will be the first to call him out.
Burning Lamp
>> Are you aware of what a devious teaching Calvinism is for instance? He took this on when no one else had the courage to do so and got raked over the coals for it.
That is very true and that is why we have so many baptists leading the emergent front lines. Many thought (as did I) that last year (lol) a baptist church was the savest place to go too. Errrr…. my bad.
>> Roger Oakland is one of the most courageous and remarkable men of God of our time.
I know, that is why I love him very much. I didn’t know how severe his accident was. Let us pray that during this time he recovers well because I know (well I say “I know”, but it’s more just like me praying) that he has still has a lot to do.
Watch and pray is what Jesus told us to do regarding His return and the same applies to people we know and have come to love and respect as wonderful men of God. Just watch, and keep watching and praying. We say things sometimes and it comes out the wrong way. But we keep watching. And we listen to the Holy Spirit speaking to us. We can’t take matters into our own hands either so to say, when we are born again we have the Holy Spirit in us who identifies born again Christians with eachother. But…when these little ‘errors’ somehow become more blatant that is when we put out our first BIG question mark.
Take notice, well it’s something I have noticed anyhow. When a man is genuinely losing the plot he loses it fast. Sometimes you don’t even get time to ask, ‘hey that’s not right…’ because he’s already sipping tea with Rick Warren.
Let’s keep everyone in our prayers, watch and pray.
PS, Christmas is 9 months plus a few days away. I will be more than welcome to send y’all my address as to where pressies can go.
Deborah,
Great post on Missler. He’s definitely an anti-Christian globalist.
Thanks Bob. And boy what a shocker is was
A comment from me on this. Chuck Missler is promoted by some discerning christians as you say. I’ve never understood why. He seems to be into some very strange stuff (UFOs and all that) which has nothing to do with Biblical faith.
I thought that Deborah’s second paragraph was particularly perceptive (Chuck’s teachings fitting in with his business interests). This is a standard marketing practice found not just in the world, but also in some less than scrupulous branches of the church. You create fear (where none previously existed) and sell a product that takes away the fear.
Worldly example 1: there are lots of burglars around and your home could be next, but buy an alarm system from me and they’ll choose another house.
Worldly example 2: your business could be prosecuted if it’s health and safety paperwork isn’t up to scratch, but buy my book and you’ll be able to do it all.
Church example 1: you find it hard to understand the Bible and may risk going off the path of sound doctrine (which could put your salvation in doubt), but everything I preach is 100% correct so subscribe to my weekly teaching tapes and I’ll explain it all to you.
Church example 2: the end-times are coming, christians will be persecuted and be unable to buy food unless they have the mark of the beast, but buy my book and I’ll show you how to be self-sufficient.
So I take a very dim view of this sort of thing.
Andrew
My husband said to me the other night. “Expert says: There will be a nuclear explosion on the one side of the world, rush out and buy canned food, especially tuna fish. The guy with the finger on the nuclear bomb button just so happens to own the cannery and the largest tuna fishing company in the world.”
This is exactly what they did with the financial crisis. Create a fear and then add THEIR solution. In fact this is what is happening in SA at the moment. A lot of fear is being created amongst the people so the EU/UN can help us out with their solution.
Saul was a Roman citizen by birth, of Tarsus, a student of Gamaliel, circumcised the eighth day, of the stock of Israel, of the stock of Benjamin, an Hebrew of the Hebrews; as touching the law, a Pharisee; concerning zeal, persecuting the church; touching the righteousness which is in the law, blameless. But what things were gain to him, those he counted loss for Christ.
Paul could converse in the theology, religion, politics, poetry and history and culture and mythology of his day. When Paul spoke in Acts 17: 17-33, he spoke of “THE UNKNOWN GOD”, and by doing it Paul spoke to them of Christ resurrected.
Can you discuss the topics of our day and bring to mind Christ resurrected?
Today any conversation with any person, anywhere at anytime, could result in approaching the dreaded three topics: sex, religion and politics. What does the word of truth say about those subjects? Can you rightly divide the word of truth on these three subjects and bring to mind Christ resurrected? II Timothy 2:15
If those three subjects become uncomfortable, the subject might well become any other number of odd topics. UFO’s, Atlantis, King Arthur, Black holes, sports, global finances, dog training, everything from Super Novae, to radiometric dating, evolution, movies, to the pot of gold at the end of the rainbow and any endless number of subjects from witchcraft to automobile racing and comparative religion are possible.
You can choose your own list. I guarantee that if you live in this world with humans who are still breathing and still possessing the ability to speak, odd subjects will come up, and unless you hide your belief in Jesus Christ, our Lord and Savior, you will be asked to explain the hope that lies within you. At that critical place you will make a decision. You will either share from the wealth of your personal opinion or if you have been diligent and studied, you will do your best to explain it from the word of God.
You decide what is preferable. God will decide what he thinks is best.
I wonder how many actually read Acts 17:11 before listening to Chuck Missler? It is the cornerstone of his approach. Get the people to check it out themselves. Make up your own mind and be diligent. Read and study, and test and prove.
Matthew 24:15 Read it. Mark 13:14 Read it. Jesus says whoever reads it, let them understand! There is no way around this one!
That means you!
Can you understand it?
If you cannot understand the importance of Daniel chapter 9, I suggest you get yourself a little free time and learn to understand it. If Jesus is your King and Lord, why would you resist his words in the middle of his personal teaching on the “sign of his coming”, and “the end of the world”.
There are many excellent commentaries and books on the subject. Read a bunch of them and as many as you can until you are reasonably familiar and understand it. Barnhouse and Walvoord are very good and very readable. The Coming Prince, by Anderson is excellent and a gem but sometimes is a little difficult. Understand that there are different opinions within the context of scripture, learn them and then submit your work to God as one who needs not be ashamed.
If you want multi media I suggest Chuck Missler and his Daniel DVD’s. If you cannot afford it, you can find the sections on Daniel 9, online on Youtube
or Google video for free. They are excellent.
Whatever way you do it, learn the material. Do not cheat yourself.
Everything points us in only one direction.
HOLINESS UNTO THE LORD
jlbriem
Firstly, I have no idea what you are speaking about in 3/4 of your comment. But if you want to HEAR about Jesus Christ, there is this book called the Bible. It’s very affordable. And in that way you will never be cheated by the likes of Chuck Missler.
Deborah (Discerning the World):
I always want to hear about Jesus and I have Bibles. What makes you think that Chuck Missler would cheat me?
Hmm! 1/4 only, I shall try to clear that up! If I walk around the issue a bit, please be patient with me. You copy and paste large amounts of data into your website.
Acts 17:10, Acts 17:11. If I am going to act like a Berean it will take me sometime to actually go through all the references you include. I guess I need to clear up a few points before I can explain what is meant in my comments which you kindly allowed in your website.
Thanks for the using software in your website which shows scripture verses when the cursor is placed on it. It will save me some time typing out the verses. I think technology is great. Some people do not.
Romans 14:14 Technology can be a great thing and is not unclean of itself. Romans 14:22 If you thought that technology was evil and still used it, you would condemn yourself and not be happy. Romans 14:23
You have a computer and have a website. You allow it. Be happy in faith before God.
Romans 14:17 The Kingdom of God is not meat and drink.
Is it evil according to the word of God to have a computer and a website? It is an acceptable and yet difficult question. I know people who think that because so much of the computer and internet is used for pornography, the technology itself is evil. Are we evil for being online or for using technology in general?
How do you prove or disprove the question with scripture?
We both accept technology even though the word computer and website are nowhere in the text of scripture. That is a fact. How does a person get past this point and still do what is legal and acceptable in their life before God.
How do you do it?
This is how I do it!
In Romans 14:17, I allow myself the liberty before God for “meat and drink”, to be a kind of substitute for computers and websites and technology in general. I trust the Lord to understand and not be displeased. Jeremiah 10:23, Jeremiah 10:24 In my life I trust the Lord to be gentle in all those areas not clearly specified in scripture and yet still a part of my life. Micah 6:8 always applies when there is any doubt.
Romans 14:14 Technology can be a great thing and is not unclean of itself.
Accusing anyone of heresy because you think that a certain technology such as SWANsat is bad and that involvement with it by itself is evil, is contrary to the spirit of the text. Was the inventor of television evil because Revelation 11:9 says that “they … shall SEE their dead bodies…”.
I think not. It may not be television at all. What you imply is your personal business but to call your personal opinion about Chuck Missler a violation of Christian law is unacceptable. If you have clear proof that they intend SWANsat for evil and knowingly express that fact, show it. If you do not, than it is nothing more than your opinion and a shallow one at that.
That is my first point!
My point is not simple but then neither is the Book of Romans. Issues of the law concerning devotional matters, personal and private matters, or public actions are difficult in themselves.
You make very serious public accusations and judgments in the name of Christ about people and groups in your website without consistent documentation. Some of the groups are clearly nonscriptural and are not Christian by their own words. Some of them are clearly professing Christ resurrected and declaring him as Lord and King and you still declare them heretics. You make declarations on legal issues and act like an apologist.
If you want to act like a lawyer you should expect to be treated like one. Hiding behind a phrase like,”be gentle, I bruise easily” does not work in a secular non believing courthouse and we as Christians should live by a higher standard of ethics anyway. But you seem to relish the power you have to delete and the proxy authority you use because it is your website. If you cannot make an explanation for your positions, what you do is nothing but gossip and slander, even if it is hid behind mountains of copied and pasted things. Having a group of people who agree with you through constant postings does not change anything. Even the unbelieving world understands the concepts of slander and misrepresentation and allows for civil penalties under the law.
You make unsupported and silly statements sometimes. Here is one. Rockwell International:
A multifaceted company that worked in the manufacturing arena for defense and space industries. Rockwell International are Freemason/Illuminati.
Please note the webpage. (http://www.waymarking.com/waymarks/WM5MXN_Chet_Holifield_Federal_Building_AKA_The_Ziggurat_Building_Laguna_Niguel_CA)
I lived in Southern California. I remember finding this building while driving around looking for a place to eat. I have seen it and I have been on the property. There was no security or fenced enclosure; it was empty and unoccupied for years. Whoever built it lost a lot of money. No conspiracy here. The government got the office space cheap. Rockwell left the building long before the government started using it.
Rockwell International are the people who built the Space Shuttle. Good job and a job well done. They are people like you and me, working hard and feeding their families. Over 78,000 employees*. Some of them, and I mean Rockwell Employees, may be Shriners and drive the little clown cars in parades but to make them all Freemasons/ Illuminati shows that you understand neither. It demeans you and insults them.
* http://www.fundinguniverse.com/company-histories/Rockwell-International-Corporation-Company-History.html
Not so long ago Chuck Missler was at the:
God’s News Behind the News International Prophecy Conference 2000 – Orlando Florida, 5-8 April 2000
Do you have a copy of his message delivered on that day? You have no link to it. WHY NOT? If you cannot judge him on what he said, what are you judging him for? Are you judging him for hidden secret things that only you know?
Are you implying that simply by being there he was guilty of something? If that kind of logic is used, we should never preach to the sinners because just being around them makes us guilty of heresy by absorption. If you are talking about something you know, say it and document it. Statements without support when you talk about people are called gossip. When it defames a person it is called slander. Truthful statements are never considered slanderous or gossip.
You have taken the time to include a reference:
Jackie Alnor from Apostasy Alert tried to contact Chuck Missler on why he attend this conference but did not receive a reply from him. http://www.apostasyalert.org/REFLECTIONS/quantum.htm
Lets look at what she said about Chuck Missler and include every comment.
1. Chuck Missler: “Chuck was encouraged by his close friend Hal Lindsey to pursue his long-time love of teaching the Bible on a full-time basis. Chuck had spent over twenty-five years teaching the Word of God under Pastor Chuck Smith at Calvary Chapel in Costa Mesa. Koinonia House was soon formed, with the mission to encourage people to seriously study the Bible as the inerrant Word of God” (Answer: all true )
2. With the exception of Chuck Missler, the speakers sound like a bunch of spiritual alchemists who think they can make angels appear, change reality by the power of their own words, and impart power to others. (Answer: Chuck is the exception and the others are weird and unscriptural by Jackie Alnor’s definition. I no nothing about them at all. I have listened to Chuck Missler and he documents his comments and makes them available to check and research. )
3. But how did Jones get replaced by Chuck Missler in this conference? He stands out as one coming from an entirely different camp than the others. He has ministered in Calvary Chapel circles for decades while the Kansas City Prophets element in the church has always been suspect to any Bible-believing Calvary Chapel leader (Answer: He got lucky and I suspect that they were unused to hearing someone preach Christ Resurrected and that salvation comes only through the shed blood of Jesus. I would think that most of them regretted his attendance.)
4. Maybe they just recognize some of the common ground they share with Missler who has toyed with the mystical realm in some of his books and teachings on Y2K, “Cosmic Codes – Hidden Messages From the Edge of Eternity,” and “Alien Encounters.” (Answer: The titles are probably why he got in the door. What he thinks and teaches about those subjects is completely different than the other speakers. Where in these lessons does he not preach Christ crucified and ressurected? Y2K was a serious technical problem with computers and timekeeping and had nothing to do with spiritual things. By the grace of God the best case scenario happened at Y2K. Nothing happened. Many people were worried, I was not. Chuck Missler did not write the Torah! Underlying structure in the Torah is there. It is not the DaVinci or the Omega code of the movies. Ask an orthodox Jew if he knows anything about it. Nothing is unclean of itself and if you do not like the titles that is your problem. Talking about odd issues is not criminal. If he is scripturally wrong, quote the mistakes and make your point. If you do not listen to what he says but judge only by the title of the lesson it is simply foolishness. We all can speculate on weird things without sinning before God, and if we do sin we have an Advocate to speak for us before the Father, Jesus Christ.)
5. I attempted to contact Missler for his comments, but he did not reply to my emails and his staff intercepted my phone calls and wouldn’t patch me through. I couldn’t get any further than Missler’s assistant Gordon McDonald. He seemed unfamiliar with Gateway or Elijah List but brushed off my concerns with the statement that Missler does not turn down any requests for him to speak as long as he is given liberty to say what he wants to say. He dismissed all of my objections that Missler sharing the stage with mystics and false prophets could stumble many young believers who could assume Missler’s involvement was an endorsement of any and all teaching and actions that might occur. Since the names Chuck Smith and Calvary Chapel were used in the advertising, could this be a ploy to draw in unsuspecting Christians to a gathering where deceiving spirits are welcome?
(Answer: He does not have to reply to Jackie personally and not talking to her is not proof of a conspiracy. For all she knows he could have been in New Zealand and unavailable over the phone. She did talk to someone and was not satisfied. The fact that Gordon is unfamiliar with Gateway and Elijah list means nothing. I am unfamiliar with them as well. It is probably a good thing. It is not for Jackie to be the judge of where Chuck Missler goes or what he says. He is an educated, experienced and bible believing Christian. “could this be a ploy”? Jackie does not know if it is a ploy so the comment is meaningless and just speculation and conjecture. She cannot know. Who is she to judge the intentions of a man before God without any proof of any kind.)
6. So the question remains: Will Missler speak up against these dark teachings when he takes the platform or will he go on as if they’re all one big happy family? If anyone can attend Quantum Leap-2, please report back so that leaders in Calvary Chapels who are booking their next pastors conferences will know whether or not to include Missler on their own rosters. (Answer: I do not see any mention by Jackie Alnor that she received any video, audio, or text materials from that meeting or that she listened at any time to any of it. She did not attend and does not know what went on. She should be quiet and mind her own business unless gossip is her business. Since she did not attend the conference, her concern over what a Christian teacher and a pastor said or did at that conference, is based only in her own doubt and from her own worries, the rest is silence and unproven accusations. The fact is that her lack of support quietly implies an appearance of evil even if there is no proof of it. That is unbiblical, unethical and wrong. The law demands evidence and testimony before guilt can be proven. By the way, what are her credentials that you receive her accusations so quickly without any knowledge about a matter and doubt someone who has been speaking in public and teaching scripture for over 30 years. I am fairly certain that at no time do the Pastors of any of the Calvary Chapels ask Jackie Alnor for her advice on whom they book and who they allow to speak. I know they do not ask me and they do not ask you either. Why would they?)
I have a question. You do not say anything at all about( Chuck Missler of Koinonia House sponsored: The Malta Expedition – 2004, ‘Exclusive Archaeological Cruise Event’ . ), other than to describe it. Is it a problem in your philosophy to visit a place that may have a dubious history? If so, why do you feel that way and what scripture do you use to support this view?
Vad Yashem, holocaust day is just past us. Does a visit to Auschwitz imply a problem in a person’s theology? If it does, what problem do you see? Does it imply that the person visiting Auschwitz is a Nazi? What if the person is Jewish? If it does not imply a problem, what is the problem with a visit to Malta on a biblical tour to the Mideast?
It baffles me unless you are accusing by subtlety that somehow a visit to Malta means that Chuck Missler is up to something evil because something evil happened there in the past.
You do not sound like a hater and I just do not get or understand the anger and lack of detailed support of your position. I could be wrong. You might be a hater. I hope not.
I have not finished reading about SWANsat and I cannot comment on it at this time. There is a lot to read.
Thank you for your time and patience. When posted I look forward to your response.
This is how I do it!
In Romans 17:17, I allow myself the liberty before God for “meat and drink”, to be a kind of substitute for computers and websites and technology in general.
Deborah will you please correct the reference before posting. It should read Romans 14:17. Thank you.
[Edited: fix it – now says Romans 14:17]