And I have to agree because this article below SCREAMS Contemplative Spirituality.
Not once is Jesus Christ the Son of God mentioned in this article. Not once is repentance of sin mentioned in this article. Not once is even salvation mentioned. Just silence *ssshhhhhhh, not a sound*.
What is mentioned is: silence, breath, contemplation, candlelit night walks, an eerie sense of anticipation, the presence and otherness of God that hung thick in the air, the scene was a little unnerving to onlookers, the idea was birthed out of a desire to see spiritual awakening, creating purpose in life, launching waves of renewal, fostering unity, breathing hope and carrying the vision to people everywhere, emotions sensed and hearts processed, that God’s greatness reflects in every facet of their lives.
Well… that’s Mysticism for you in a nutshell.
[Emphasis Added by DTW]
SOMETIMES SILENCE IS LOUD
By Louie Giglio, Date: 4/7/2005
Sometimes silence is louder than words, more powerful than any sound. That was certainly the case as over 11,000 college-aged young people converged on the corner of Fifth and Broadway in downtown Nashville on a January night in early 2005. Having exited fourteen smaller Community Group settings across the city, they walked in quiet contemplation as they returned to enter a candlelit late night worship gathering in the arena at the Gaylord Entertainment Center. I had encouraged them earlier in the night to return to the Gaylord without a sound, something that seemed problematic and unrealistic to some, but a challenge and unique opportunity the students eagerly embraced….
Considering the staggering grace and power of the cross of Christ, a hushed throng began to appear from every direction, filling the streets with an eerie sense of anticipation and reverence. Within minutes a crowd had gathered outside the main entrance to the arena, filling the wide esplanade and spilling over into the streets for blocks.
Officers on horseback looked on with stunned expressions. Bands in many of Nashville’s famed Broadway Street country bars ceased playing as partygoers curiously emptied into the streets to witness the rare and peculiar sight. Restaurant patrons did the same, leaving their meals to walk out among the quiet masses and investigate the silence.
Some students kneeled as they waited for the Arena doors to open. Others stood without uttering a sound, hands lifted in adoration and prayer. A sense of the presence and otherness of God hung thick in the air. And for a moment the heart of the city stood still.
I still heard onlookers and facility staffers talking about it days later. “We’ve seen twenty year olds party hard and crank up the volume,” one hotel employee commented, “but we’ve never seen kids this age that quiet before. It was incredibly cool and a little unnerving all at the same time.”
Such comments were not uncommon at Passion 05, a gathering of 18-25 year olds from all fifty states and several foreign nations that our Passion team hosted to usher in the New Year. The students and their leaders had descended on Nashville as a part of the Passion Movement for four days of worship, prayer and teaching centered on the greatness of God and His invitation to live for what is ultimate: His glory and His fame.
Birthed out of a desire to see spiritual awakening come to the 16 million college students in America, Passion emerged in 1996 as Shelley (my wife), myself and a small team set out to call this collegiate generation to a purpose in life much bigger than themselves. Inspired by a clear vision of what could be, we set our sites on Passion’s inaugural conference in January 1997. That gathering brought 2,000 students to Austin, TX, launching a wave of renewal that has reached campuses and churches around the world.
Rooted in the confession of Isaiah 26:8-Yes Lord, walking in the way of Your truth we wait eagerly for You, for Your name and renown are the desire of our souls-the Passion movement is forging a “268 Generation,” a generation living for His renown.
Widely known for OneDay gatherings in 2000 and 2003 that together united over 60,000 college students for solemn days of prayer and consecration, (we intentionally didn’t use the passion name on these gatherings to emphasize the unity they were designed to foster), we have had the humbling opportunity to be face to face with over half a million students during our Passion journey. Beyond that, God has impacted countless others through Passion Worship Projects and video/teaching resources that have carried the vision to people everywhere.
Recently, we were excited to host historic college-targeted Passion gatherings in the heart of Boston and New York City, breathing hope and encouragement in two of the nation’s collegiate hubs, two metro areas that combined are home to over 1.3 million college students. Offering free events made both outings huge steps of faith for us, but capacity crowds in Boston’s historic Orpheum Theater and Broadway’s Beacon Theater united the largest groups of college-aged people for worship in the recent history of both cities.
January 2005 found us in the heart of Nashville, returning to our four-day conference roots and hosting a gathering with teaching from Beth Moore, John Piper (and myself) and the music of, among others, Chris Tomlin, Charlie Hall, David Crowder Band and Matt Redman, artist/worshippers who have carried the heartbeat of Passion from the beginning. In large group settings in the Arena, Community Groups and smaller Family Groups (where each student could process what God was doing in their hearts), Passion 05 centered on the simple message of God’s goodness and glory-and His invitation to us to find joy in Him and our ultimate purpose in knowing and reflecting His greatness in every facet of our lives.
The conviction, emotion and surrender we sensed at Passion 05 are powerfully captured on the latest CD, PASSION: HOW GREAT IS OUR GOD. From the pulsing opening anthem from the David Crowder Band, “There Is No One Like You,” where over 11,000 voices echo the opening line, immediately jolting the listener with the raucous tone of much of Passion 05, to the raw and potent stripped down hymn classic “It Is Well With My Soul” from Shane and Shane that closes the 13 song disc, HOW GREAT IS OUR GOD, tells the story of a generation united for His renown.
The CD is amazing and God-breathed, and I can’t wait for the whole world to experience its power. But at the end of the day our loudest anthem might be the silence of that January night, and the echo of lives that reflect His glory.
Source: http://www.worshiptogether.com/resources/article.aspx?iid=354445
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Ive seen most of Giglio’s confrences and his silence and the emergent silence are two different things. I agree with you on most things Debs but Giglio is always word based and ive been to passion its more a way to bring praise to Jesus “become quiet and know that I am God”… If he hummed and bonged a drum I would be seriously worried but Ive seen interviews asking him about other religions and he always said that other religions cannot replace Jesus. He is aligned with John Piper and Piper is against contemplative prayer he has numerous articles on desiringgod.com urgeing people not to take part in contemplation.If it does come out that Giglio is emergent I will ask my friends to stop supporting passion…
My mum and I went to see Sarel Vd Merwe and we brought the dvds there is def strange things happening in this world and we need to fight it.
Yolandi
I know how you feel about Louie Giglio , I was the same in the beginning. I really liked him. So take it from me, what I am saying now is not due to lack of evidence. I will be posting more about him soon. John Piper and Louie Giglio and Mark Driscoll form part of what is called the ‘New Calvinists’. Giglio is dangerous – he isgood at preaching the world of God, he studied at southern baptist seminary – he is good looking, appeals to the youth big time. But he adds little things that are not at all biblical.
Yes there are very very BAD things going on.
I was also nearly caught by this Giglio Guy but in my spirit I could not find peace. I kept on looking for the problem until I was reminded again to go and look at his “method of operation” and BINGO, I hit pay dirt !!
He uses prepares his audience by using awesome pictures, awesome music/sounds creating an atmosphere that manipulates emotions and lowers your cognitive defenses and then finally he “clobbers” you over and sweeps you doubts away with clever leading sentences/phrases and stories that takes your emotions on a joyride . . .
I always maintain that the deception that we are seeing currently is just a shadow of the real Deceiver that is coming and we should now learn to discern this “shadow” so when the REAL BIG GUYS comes along we will be ready and spot and expose them straight away.
Mat 24:24 For false Christs and false prophets will appear and display great signs and wonders to deceive, if possible, even the elect.
I personally think that time is very near when these current deceivers are going to look like “Pikaniens” when the real demon possessed deceivers start doing their “big” signs and wonders.
These current “pikanies” are dangerous and yes, they do deceive many, but they are only just “preparing” the masses and giving us an opportunity to learn to discern properly.
I have noticed how these deceivers are getting more and more slick as time goes on and it is getting “a little” more difficult to “catch them out”.
Wonder why ??? ;-)
Jean101
>> He uses prepares his audience by using awesome pictures, awesome music/sounds creating an atmosphere that manipulates emotions and lowers your cognitive defenses and then finally he “clobbers” you over and sweeps you doubts away with clever leading sentences/phrases and stories that takes your emotions on a joyride . . .
Exactly. I watched some of his videos and the hooooo’s and aaaahhhh’s really do take your focus off what he is really trying to say.
And you are so right, they are getting more difficult to catch out. I have been following Giglio for a year now on and off …. waiting…patiently…for the time when he started to show his true colours.
I’ve got another article on him which I will have up tomorrow morning. That one is riveting stuff, more riveting that his video of the human cell that looks like a cross. pffff…to think I of all people fell for that one. *hangs head in shame*. But it just goes to show that NOT ONE OF US are safe from deception and that is why we need to test and ground ourselves in the Word of God. Test everything and listen to the gentle voice of the Holy Spirit when he warns us.
Jean
That methods of operation article you wrote received great reviews. So *hint hint* we would like more of that please lol ;)
“He uses prepares his audience by using awesome pictures, awesome music/sounds creating an atmosphere that manipulates emotions and lowers your cognitive defenses and then finally he “clobbers” you over and sweeps you doubts away with clever leading sentences/phrases and stories that takes your emotions on a joyride . .”
So it’s evil of him to be a good speaker/preacher? And its evil to appeal to the emotions, eh? Comon.
The original post by the owner of this website is a streeeetttch.
GrowingandLearing
>> So it’s evil of him to be a good speaker/preacher? And its evil to appeal to the emotions, eh?
No it’s not evil to be a good speaker and preacher. But preaching contemplative spirituality is. Do you know what contemplative spirituality is?
“But preaching contemplative spirituality is. Do you know what contemplative spirituality is?”
Yes. After much *contemplation* I don’t see where Louie Giglio is preaching it, even after having read your article(s). I think you’re projecting too much of your own meaning over what he is saying. But that’s that. Thanks for the articles anyway.
GrowingandLearning
Oh well… usually that’s what we are told. We are always over exaggerating until the truth really comes out. And even when the truth really comes out, only a handful listen.
Ok let’s pick this apart for you since you insist, although I’m probably sure it’s a waste of time as you’re going to reply in some irrelevant way. And I’m going to treat it in the same way you’ve treated this article and others – having an unhealthy dose of cynicism, taking things way out of context, projecting your own meanings over a sentence, and picking apart little words and sentences to prove a hopelessly invalid point.
My tone in this reply is very cynical, but that’s just to show you what it feels like when people treat your writing the way you’ve treated theirs.
I’ll address what you underlined:
“Sometimes silence is louder than words, more powerful than any sound.”
So genuine Christians must never be quiet, you say?
“they walked in quiet contemplation as they returned to enter a candlelit late night worship gathering”
So there is something evil about walking in quiet contemplation to a candlelit worship gathering where people gathered to worship the Lord?
Next time your husband invites you to a candlelit dinner, I hope you tell him to douse out the candles as he may actually be inviting you to some emergent contemplative practice, by your reasoning.
“I had encouraged them earlier in the night to return to the Gaylord without a sound”
So maybe what, he should have encouraged them to have made a noise instead? Is noise now more holier than silence? lol.
“Considering the staggering grace and power of the cross of Christ, a hushed throng began to appear from every direction, filling the streets with an eerie sense of anticipation and reverence”
How convenient for you to have left out the ‘cross of Christ’ part in your underlining. The streets were filled with an eerie sense of anticipation and reverence? Oh dear, it must be horrible for people to have reverence for Christ by your reasoning.
“kneeled as they waited for the Arena doors to open. Others stood without uttering a sound, hands lifted in adoration and prayer. A sense of the presence and otherness of God hung thick in the air”
Do you believe the presence of God cannot and should not be felt? It looks like you have an issue with this. So they lifted hands in adoration and prayer? Oh dear, by your reasoning there is something incredibly evil about that.
“and a little unnerving all at the same time.”
Good. God is a god of judgement and grace. If people felt unnerved because of His presence, then good. They must realise that they are sinners and need God’s grace. But you seem to be under the impression that people should just feel fine and dandy when God’s around, regardless of whether they believe in Christ or not.
“prayer and teaching centered on the greatness of God and His invitation to live for what is ultimate: His glory and His fame.”
So prayer and teaching centred on the greatness of God and His invitation to live for His glory and fame is contemplative spirituality and a bad thing? This is why I ask: Do YOU know what contemplative spirituality is? Contemplative spirituality is about using techniques to find God and to achieve a type of union with him. It is focused inwards and often talks of the ‘otherness of God’ and how God is in everything. It is pantheistic. So now show where Giglio is pantheistic. Oh, you can’t.
“emphasize the unity they were designed to foster”
According to your logic, best you rip out the passages in the Bible which talk about unity, since clearly you have an issue with the word ‘unity’.
“Birthed out of a desire to see spiritual awakening”
Wow, even Spurgeon used to say this sort of thing. You got a problem with Spurgeon now too? What about Christians and reformers all over the ages who use the phrase ‘spiritual awakening.’ You’ve single handedly put every single other Christian in history on one side and you on another, and claimed that you alone are genuine while everyone else isn’t. Otherwise, what’s your beef with the phrase ‘spiritual awakening’?
“generation to a purpose in life much bigger than themselves”
Since when does contemplative spirituality teach people to look to a purpose in life much bigger than themselves? Oh yes, NEVER. It always commands you look INWARD. It’s all about the ‘inner heart’. It’s thoroughly inward looking. This is outward looking. By your reasoning, anyone who looks for a purpose in life much bigger than themselves is now emergent? Come now.
“breathing hope ”
Oh. My. Word. Did you just do a search for your favourite catch-phrases for contemplative spirituality and underline it or did you actually bother reading the context of this sentence and article? ‘Breathing hope’ is a common phrase, as common as ‘aching heart’. By your reasoning one should never use common phrases??
“where each student could process what God was doing in their hearts”
By underlining this phrase you’re basically saying that God processing something in someone’s heart is contemplative spirituality. Otherwise I don’t know why you underlined this. Oh dear. So God must not process and work in people’s hearts then? So where does he work? In your left foot or something?
“His invitation to us to find joy in Him and our ultimate purpose in knowing and reflecting His greatness in every facet of our lives.”
Why the heck this was underlined is a mystery to me. Really. It’s wrong to want to reflect God’s greatness?? So what are we, created in God’s image, meant to reflect? Our left feet? Come on.
“conviction, emotion and surrender”
So it’s not right to have conviction? It’s not right to have emotion? One shouldn’t surrender to God? So what is repentance if not surrendering to God? Looks to me like you have an issue with repentance, despite your claims.
“loudest anthem might be the silence of that January night, and the echo of lives that reflect His glory”
So you clearly have an issue with the words ‘loud’ (oh but I thought we were supposed to be loud, since silence is evil) ‘silence’ (well at least now you’re consistent) and lives that reflect God’s glory? (Because they should reflect our left feet instead).
Here’s some contemplative spirituality emergent quotes for you. I’ll give you one guess as to who said these things:
“We shall not be satisfied until there is a thorough awakening in this land. We did not raise the feeling in our own minds, and we do not desire to repress it. We do not believe it can be repressed; but others will feel the same heavenly affection, and will sigh and cry to God day and night until the blessing comes.
“This is the sowing, this is the ploughing, this is the harrowing—may it go on to harvesting. I long to hear my brethren and sisters universally saying, “We are full of anguish, we are in agony till souls be saved.”
“The cry of Rachel, “Give me children, or I die,” is the cry of your minister this day, and the longing of thousands more besides. As that desire grows in intensity a revival is approaching. We must have spiritual children born to Christ, or our hearts will break for the longing that we have for their salvation. Oh for more of these longings, yearnings, cravings, travailings! If we plead till the harvest or revival comes we shall partake in the joy of it.”
“The glory which surrounds the ascended Lord should breathe hope into every believer’s breast.” (oh dear, they also used the phrase ‘breathe hope??)
“Moreover, the Christian knows not only that there is this unity in design, but that there is a real union between Christ and all his people…. have you ever felt that unity to Christ?”
There’s more where that came from.
GrowingandLearing
Oh finally. And no it’s not a waste of time. If it was a waste of time I would never have asked you.
And based on your cynical replies no one can take what you have said seriously. I asked you to explain to me WHAT Contemplative spirituality was. You have not done that. I asked you to go and research for yourself, but you have not done that.
By your reply (which was not a waste of time) you have shown everyone who reads this blog that you are happy to follow new age teaching.
Oh I am sure there is, and it’s not biblical.
I wont ask you again to explain yourself further, but if you feel you must, then go ahead, you are helping me explain to others how ‘christians’ are happy to side with false teaching. Anyhow you have said more than enough on this blog that explains what you believe and very clearly I might add.
Thanks for your reply. Move on please, to other websites who will love your new found spirituality. Or don’t and continue exposing yourself and Louie Giglio for that matter. I am sure he is sincerily chuffed to know that those who follow him have no idea what the Word of God means. He is a great communicator after all as you first said. You would think he would have explained himself clearly.
Maybe he has explained himself clearly? And you really do get that he preaches a false gospel. Hmmmm. Oh well, you will never know because you don’t want to go and find out for yourself. Please don’t come and ever tell me that I forced the gospel of Jesus Christ onto you.
GrowingandLearing
Oh btw, just incase you think Louie Gigliio knows nothing of all my articles, you think wrong. I have emailed his ministry – I didn’t get a reply but that’s pretty common. If you would like to just make sure he knows you are standing up for him, please please email him all my articles. And make sure you get an acknowledgement from them.
“Oh I am sure there is, and it’s not biblical.”
Well Those quotes were from Charles Spurgeon. Are you saying he was New Age too?
Growing and Learing
I was not talking about your quotes. I am talking about your ENTIRE cynical response which is what you stated your ENTIRE comment was about. So those quotes from you mean nothing because everything was a joke to you. Why don’t you quote scripture instead to back up that Contemplative Spirituality is biblical. Come on, give it a go…
Nice way of avoiding…
Are those quotes biblical or not? What about the fact that Spurgeon used the phrase “breathing hope”? Does the use of the phrase mean Spurgeon is new age now too? What about the other things he said?
Please answer straight forwardly for a change.
GrowingAndLearning
Allow me. Please compare
with
In the quotes that you have provided, Spurgeon is shown as a man who took the Lord’s Words seriously. He proclaimed the Lord Jesus Christ and Him crucified to lost sinners. That New Agers / emergents have filled the old terms with new meanings, is hardly his fault. Read Spurgeon and the Down-Grade Controversy. Do you agree with Spurgeon’s statement:
Hi Amanda,
Sure I can compare those two scriptures. I can also compare Giglio’s comment with other scriptures too, such as Psalm 16:11 –
“You make known to me(A) the path of life; in your presence there is fullness of joy; at your right hand are pleasures forevermore.”
Or, the Lord’s invitation(s) in the Bible for us to ‘taste and see’ that He is good and come to Him for rest and living water. In light of these, which are all invitations, I really don’t see how anything Giglio has said is not within Scriptural bounds and invitations.
Yeah I agree with Spurgeon’s statement. I also agree with other statements he made at that link where he didn’t say ALL churches had down-graded, but the point was that there were many who had. Do you think ALL have strayed from the Lord in these days?
Do you agree with Spurgeon’s method not to name names but rather address the issue of contention on a doctrinal level?
As an aside, I would find a discernment website which teaches others to discern, rather than tries to discern for everyone itself, as a great tool. A site that says ‘look out for these things rather than look out for these people. You might notice that Paul or the apostles actually never mention the names of false teachers, they only refer to them. Once or twice they mention names of people they had a fall-out with or caused them hurt personally, but we never see them name actual names. In this I see Spurgeon followed the scriptural method. Do you agree?
GrowingandLearning
He said:
I am doomed to failure before I even attempt to keep that one. What I can do is to proclaim Jesus Christ who did it on my behalf. When people look in wonder that a wretched sinner such as myself could be saved, then they get a glimpse of Jesus Christ’s greatness who died for His enemies.
I think many Christians are fleeing the churches that have given up on the power of the Gospel and replaced it with their own ‘wisdom’.
From the article “Is It Right: To Judge, To Expose Error, & To Name Names?” By Pastor E.L. Bynum:
“I am doomed to failure before I even attempt to keep that one. What I can do is to proclaim Jesus Christ who did it on my behalf. When people look in wonder that a wretched sinner such as myself could be saved, then they get a glimpse of Jesus Christ’s greatness who died for His enemies.”
But if you knew what Giglio teaches in general you would know he agrees with you. We reflect God’s glory because the Holy SPirit lives in us because of God’s grace, Jesus, his death and resurrection, and so forth. In my opinion, you guys are nitpicking on a few articles and nitpicking is not discernment.
As to naming names, Peter was not a false prophet or false teacher. He was in friendship and relationship with Paul, and they were ministering together. The example doesn’t work for you – you are not ministering with Giglio nor do you have a friendship with him.
The Bible NT does not actually name the names of false teachers. Paul mentions how one guy caused them harm (who appears to have been in thei circle of friendship) and that’s about all. I’m sticking with Spurgeon on this one, you disagree with Spurgeon I see.
GrowingAndLearning
Ok seeing that you wont go to scripture to find the answer to your problem let me do it for you.
Romans 16:17 “Mark them which cause divisions and offences contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned; and avoid them.”
Identify then and mark people that cause division and preach contrary to the word of God. Let others know and avoid them.
I think if Paul and the rest of the desciples and apostles had to write down all the names of everyone in the bible he came across that were false there would have been another 1000 pages. But he did rebuke by name.
Colossians 2:8
“Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ.”
Proverbs 27:5 “Open rebuke is better than secret love.”
For the sake of the offending party and those under his influence, there are instances where open rebuke is called for instead of love that is hidden and withheld.
Ephesians 5:11 “And have no fellowship with the unfruitful works of darkness, but rather reprove (EXPOSE) them.”
When false teaching is discovered, it is to be exposed.
“Them that sin rebuke before all, that others also may fear.” 1 Timothy 5:20
It is a sin to condone and not expose deadly falsehoods propagated by leaders “who privily (secretly) shall bring in damnable heresies.” (2 Pet. 2:1) The divine purpose here is to identify and announce those who are marked for destruction so they don’t bring others with them.
Isa. 58:1; Ezek. 33:7-9; 34:1-10; Acts 20:26-32; Gal. 1:6-9; 2 Tim. 2:17-18
GrowingAndLearing, you have made it VERY clear that you refuse point blank to want to test and weigh Louie Giglio to the WORD OF GOD. That means take what he has said and go and open your BIBLE and test to see if ‘eerie feelings’ are biblical for instance. Did any onlookers get saved during this wonderful process of walking down the street in utter silence when they should have been preaching the gospel?
Anyhow, you do what you want to do Growing and Learning. I am not here to force the gospel onto you, as I said before.
>>> GrowingandLearning, March 9th,”I would find a discernment website which teaches others to discern, rather than tries to discern for everyone itself”
I have been searching all over the web in the beginning… there’s no such discernment site…
but wait, isn’t Holy Spirit the one who teaches us to discern? or would we rather listen to a mere man, who themselves make mistakes and cover-ups etc.?
so when one finds a page that suites your taste, will it be proper discernment or a compromising business?
just asking…
Discernment is a gift of the Spirit , and as such should be used for the benefit of the church.
Several months worth of comments have been posted about a man who so clearly loves Jesus, and has devoted his life to leading young people to do the same. Isnt there a better use of all the time exhausted here? What do you think Jesus is thinking as he reads your thoughts, which you have chosen to share? I believe the Holy Spirt is doing amazing things through Louie Giglio. He isn’t leading anyone astray, he is leading them straight to Christ. I’ll sign off now and spend some time praying for everyone engaging in this debate, more specifically those who engaged in this in an effort to impress or “one-up” each other. Bashing someone for the way they deliver the Word of God is just sad.
Lori Ann
This is not a debate site it is a Discernment site do you know what that is?
Read your Bible about testing all things to see whether they proceed from God.
Lori
Several months worth of comments have been posted about a man who so clearly loves Jesus, and has devoted his life to leading young people to do the same. Isnt there a better use of all the time exhausted here? What do you think Jesus is thinking as he reads your thoughts, which you have chosen to share? I believe the Holy Spirt is doing amazing things through Louie Giglio. He isn’t leading anyone astray, he is leading them straight to Christ. I’ll sign off now and spend some time praying for everyone engaging in this debate, more specifically those who engaged in this in an effort to impress or “one-up” each other. Bashing someone for the way they deliver the Word of God is just sad.
What ever you do, when you pray, just don’t silence yourself and meditate as you try experience God in a deeper way. Just pray normally. Thanks
http://redemptionstory.wordpress.com/2008/03/22/145/
I’ve just come across this website on this article searching about Louie Giglio, he is leading people to Christ. i wonder if you have heard this story in the link i posted.
Dave
Which Christ?