The Nephilim: Sons of God, Daughters of Men

NephilimThe Biblical Truth of the Nephilim

A while ago I posted an article on the Nephilim stating that I did not believe that the Nephilim were demonic offspring.  I then deleted the article because I became uncertain if I was indeed correct.  Since then I have been searching for the truth and I am happy to say I have found the TRUTH.  The reason I am so passionate about the answer to this question is because of the rise in interest in the supernatural, i.e, aliens, trans-humanism etc.  There are stories running abound that during the tribulation demons will be free to do as they please on earth, producing offspring like the Nephilim.  The bible is very clear that we are to not let our minds be captured by occult imagination because when human minds get hold of unbiblical ideas it runs free and causes all sorts of havoc.

Permission received by Anton Bosch to re-publish his article. Thank you!  
[** Emphasis added by DTW]
[** See DTW notes at bottom of article.]

Nephilim

By Pastor Anton Bosch – www.antonbosch.org

The Hebrew word Nephilim is translated “giants” in the Old Testament. It only appears twice in Genesis 6:4 and Numbers 13:33.  A whole series of doctrines have been built around this word, in spite of the fact that the word only appears rarely. These doctrines on the Nephilim are based on Genesis 6:1-4.(It must be noted that most speculators lean very heavily on extra-biblical writings for most of their information.) The theories can basically be summed up as follows:

Demons / angels (sons of God) had illicit relationships with women (the daughters of men) and these perverted relations produced genetically mutated beings known as Nephilim (giants). God then imprisoned some of the angles who did this and in order to purify the bloodline of man God brought on the Flood. Through genetic engineering these Nephilim will be resurrected, one of which will be the Antichrist[i]. To these people, the Nephilim are also connected to so-called extra-terrestrial forms of life.

Since these theories are gaining ground and a number of books have been published based on this hypothesis, it is necessary to examine Genesis 6 again and see what exactly it teaches. We will discover that the proponents of these theories break every principle of hermeneutics. Here is the text:

“Now it came to pass, when men began to multiply on the face of the earth, and daughters were born to them, that the sons of God saw the daughters of men, that they were beautiful; and they took wives for themselves of all whom they chose. And the LORD said, “My Spirit shall not strive with man forever, for he is indeed flesh; yet his days shall be one hundred and twenty years.” There were giants on the earth in those days, and also afterward, when the sons of God came in to the daughters of men and they bore children to them. Those were the mighty men who were of old, men of renown“. (Genesis 6:1-4)

Sons of God

The first problem revolves around who in the passage are the “sons of God”. Some make the connection with Job 1:6; 2:1. “Now there was a day when the sons of God came to present themselves before the LORD, and Satan also came among them.” (Job 1:6). It is obvious, and not contested, that the “sons of God” in Job were angels. But does that mean that this term in Genesis 6:2 also refers to angels?

First, the normal meaning of “sons of God” is “believers”. “But as many as received him, to them gave He power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name” (John 1:12). Job 1:6 (a poetic book) is the only place where angels are called “sons of God”. It is logical and reasonable therefore that the normal meaning be attached to the term here, rather than the exception, as found in Job, unless there were something in the text that made a connection between Genesis 6 and Job 1 – which is absent.

Second Jesus explicitly said that “in the resurrection they neither marry nor are given in marriage, but are like angels of God in heaven.” (Matthew 22:30) (See also Luke 20:34-36). Therefore in Jesus’ own words, angels are asexual and do not procreate.

So here is the problem. Genesis is obscure about who had the relations. Jesus said angels do not have relations. So either Jesus was mistaken or the “sons of God” were not angels. You choose! It is really as simple as that – there are no other options.

Some try to get around this by saying that the angels inhabited (possessed) human bodies to do this. That sounds good. But here is the question: A Christian man has the Holy Spirit in him. When that man produces a child by his wife, what is the child? God or man? Clearly, it is a man. There are multitudes of people in the world who are demon possessed and who procreate. What do they produce? Human babies or mutants? Obviously human babies. So why should Genesis 6 be any different. If demons entered into men to produce offspring the children would be human, and only human.

One of the principles of hermeneutics is that the Old Testament is interpreted in the light of the New Testament and not the other way round. In order to say that the “sons of God” in Genesis 6 are angels (or demons) we must discard the light of the NT and that should never happen.

The nature of the relationships

The next problem is that it is claimed that the angels had illicit relations with women. Yet the text is very clear: “they took wives for themselves of all whom they chose” (Genesis 6:2b). The phrase “took wives for themselves” only, and always, means marriage. It never refers to casual, illicit or adulterous relationships. (See Genesis 11:29 & Ruth 1:4). To suggest otherwise is reading into the text that which is simply not there.

Giants

The theory goes that the giants were the product of these illicit relationships. We have shown that the text does not refer to illicit relationships and that the fathers could not be angels.

Genesis 6:4, again is very clear: “There were giants on the earth in those days, and also afterward, when the sons of God came in to the daughters of men and they bore children to them.”  Notice that it says there were giants (fact number 1) and afterwards the sons of God came into… (fact number 2). There is NO connection between the fact that there were giants and the fact that people had children.

It is exactly like me saying: “There is milk in the supermarket and eggs are $1.50 a dozen” Milk has no effect on the price, or even the existence, of eggs and the other way around. I am simply stating two facts that describe things about food in the supermarket.

In Genesis 6 Moses is describing the state of the world before the flood. He makes no connection between the Nephilim and the sons of God and daughters of men. If the sentence had been reversed as follows: “The sons of God came into the daughters of men and they bore Nephilim” then you could postulate some theory about the nature of this process. But the text does not give us any room to connect the Nephilim with these marriages.

Genesis 6:4 does say that the children that were produced “were the mighty men who were of old, men of renown“. “Mighty men” is a term which is used 154 times in the OT and simply refers to powerful men, either physically or politically. Just like there are many mighty men today and some are men of God and others are worldly and unsaved, so there were mighty men in those days, of which Noah was one.

“Men of old” also holds no mystique, these were simply the heroes of bygone days.

“Men of renown” is also used in Numbers 16:2 and Ezekiel 23:23. These are famous men, or well-known men. The Hebrew term literally means “men with a name” meaning they had “made a name” for themselves.

The descendants of these relationships were not monsters, mutants, or anything extraordinary. Some were ordinary people and some were powerful, some were little known and others had made a name for themselves. Genesis 6:5 (the next verse) goes on to describe these people as wicked and worthy of God’s judgment.

Furthermore, the translation of the word Nephilim in Genesis 6:4 as “giants” is very arbitrary. There are many other possible ways this word could be translated here: “Bullies”, “mighty ones” or “tyrants”.  At least one dictionary states that the Nephilim in Genesis and in Numbers were two different peoples[ii]. Once again, we cannot build an entire doctrine on a word which we cannot translate or explain with any measure of certainty.

Genesis 6:4 is simply a description of life before the flood and not a commentary on mysterious genetic mutant life forms. Jesus obviously has this verse in mind when he says: “But as the days of Noah were, so also will the coming of the Son of Man be. For as in the days before the flood, they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noah entered the ark, and did not know until the flood came and took them all away, so also will the coming of the Son of Man be.” (Matthew 24:37-39) (note the reference to marriage in both verses).

One of the most important principles of hermeneutics is that the verse has to be read in its context. The context is clear, that life was going on as usual, people were becoming more and more self-absorbed and sinful but judgment was coming. This is the same point Jesus was making in Matthew 24 – people will be self-absorbed and fixated on every-day life and will not be ready for His coming.

The cause of the Flood

Those who speculate about the Nephilim, connect them with the reason for the Flood. Once again, there is no connection there. Genesis 6 describes life on earth. Yes, there were Nephilim, but more significantly, people were marrying and having children and becoming more wicked. Genesis 6:5-6 cannot be clearer. God’s judgment fell because of the wickedness of man. This had absolutely nothing to do with demons, angels or mutants. Look at these verses again: “Then the LORD saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every intent of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually. And the LORD was sorry that He had made man on the earth, and He was grieved in His heart. So the LORD said, “I will destroy man whom I have created from the face of the earth, both man and beast, creeping thing and birds of the air, for I am sorry that I have made them.”(Genesis 6:5-7).

If the flood had anything to do with anything other than man’s sinfulness, either Moses or Jesus would have said something in that regard, but both are silent about demons, angels and mutants. The flood had nothing to do with clearing the gene pool. It was all about clearing the earth of sinful and wicked people. Even Sunday school children should be able to tell you that.

If the flood had anything to do with God wanting to destroy the giants because they were “contaminated seed” or to purge the gene pool then, Noah and his sons should have been destroyed also. Noah and his sons carried the gene from which giants were formed. This is obvious since giants (Nephilim) are born after the flood and were present in the Land when the spies were sent to scout out the land (Numbers 13:33). These giants were descendants of Noah since all of humankind after the flood descended from Noah.

Extra-biblical evidence

These speculators quote the Book of Enoch (and other apocryphal books) in support of their ideas as though they are Scripture. Yet, Enoch and the rest of the Apocrypha are not part of the canon of Scripture for obvious reasons – they are not, and have never been regarded as inspired except by apostate churches and false teachers.

Once again they break one of the fundamentals of Evangelical and Reformed hermeneutics: We hold only to Scripture and do not add, nor subtract from it (Revelation 22:18; Deuteronomy 4:2; 12:32). It is especially reprehensible to formulate an entire doctrine on extra-biblical evidence as these people are doing.

The fact is that there is overwhelming evidence in very old writings that the Hebrew sages never regarded the “sons of God” as angels or demons. But we dare not use that as evidence lest we sink to the same level as these speculators.

Jude 6 is quoted in support of the theories. This verse says: “And the angels who did not keep their proper domain, but left their own abode, He has reserved in everlasting chains under darkness for the judgment of the great day” (Jude 1:6).

Once again, there is absolutely nothing in the verse, or the context, that connects it with Genesis 6. There is nothing in the context that gives rise to understand that “not keep(ing) their proper domain” has anything to do with having relations with women. These angels sinned by overstepping their boundaries – that is evident. But what those boundaries were can be any of a hundred things. We just cannot draw connection between Genesis 6 and Jude 6, except that the chapter number is the same as the verse number!

2 Peter 2:4-5

Verse 4 is similar to Jude 6: “For if God did not spare the angels who sinned, but cast them down to hell and delivered them into chains of darkness, to be reserved for judgment and did not spare the ancient world, but saved Noah, one of eight people, a preacher of righteousness, bringing in the flood on the world of the ungodly.” (2 Peter 2:4-5).

To those who pluck verses out of their context there appears to be a connection between the sinning angels and the flood. But look at the context:

2Peter 2:1-3 There were, and will be, false teachers and they will “bring upon themselves swift destruction“.

2Peter 2:4 Angels sinned and God “reserved them for judgment

2Peter 2:5 The ancient world sinned and God judged them by the flood but spared Noah

2Peter 2:6-8 Sodom and Gomorrah sinned and God judged them but spared Lot

2Peter 2:9 Therefore in the future, the Lord will judge the unjust and save the godly.

The angels and the pre-flood world are simply two of four examples that Peter quotes to show that God will punish sin. The connections between the sinning angels and the flood are the same connection with false teachers and Sodom – the connections have nothing to do with gene mutation but is all about sin and the consequences thereof.

Conclusion

The purpose of this brief article is not to provide answers to all the questions that surround Genesis 6. In fact, we do not have all the answers and those who claim they have a full and detailed explanation for these verses are speculating. The point of the text in Genesis 6, and 2Peter 2 is to warn that God will not tolerate sin and will judge it.

But what we are certain of is that the theories about angels producing mutant life forms are not Biblical and that the conclusions derived from this theory are fictional, at best.

“…charge some that they teach no other doctrine, nor give heed to fables and endless genealogies, which cause disputes rather than godly edification which is in faith“. (1 Timothy 1:3-4).

“But reject profane and old wives’ fables, and exercise yourself toward godliness.”(1 Timothy 4:7).

For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine, but according to their own desires, because they have itching ears, they will heap up for themselves teachers; and they will turn their ears away from the truth, and be turned aside to fables.” (2 Timothy 4:3-4)


[i] This is a very brief and highly sanitized summary of some very extreme and bizarre teachings. But it must also be noted that those who hold to these teachings differ greatly amongst themselves as to how far they take their conclusions.

[ii]Thomas, R. L. (1998). New American Standard Hebrew-Aramaic and Greek dictionaries : Updated edition. Anaheim: Foundation Publications, Inc.


[DTW notes with the help of Anton Bosch (thank you again for all your assistance):

1)  David and Goliath – 

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Yes, there were giants but not in the sense of the pictures of Jack and the beanstalk. Goliath was anywhere between 6’9” to 10′ tall.  The oldest manuscripts – the Dead Sea Scrolls text of Samuel, the first-century historian Josephus, and the fourth century Septuagint manuscripts – all give his height as “four cubits and a span”, about six feet, nine inches tall (two meters), but later manuscripts have it as “six cubits and a span,” which would make him almost ten feet tall (three meters). The average height of the LA Lakers basketball team is 6’4″, with a few of them at 6’9″.  Andre the Giant from the WWE (World Wrestling Entertainment) stood at 7’4″ while the Great Khali currently stands at 7’1″.  [Note that DTW has never referred to the dead-sea scrolls for information, but to help explain Goliath in this instance, it is very necessary.]

Saul stood “head-and-shoulders” above the rest of the people and David (it seems) could fit into his armour. David appears extra small to Goliath because he was just a youth when he fought and killed Goliath. However when David grew up he was able to use Goliath’s sword (1Sam 21). So as adults David and Saul were almost as big as Goliath! – now that’s a revolutionary thought!

The same goes for the Canaanites, they were giant men, but not from another world.  There is no possible way that these giants were of an extraterrestrial nature because the bible does not say so – the bible does say there were giants before the flood and their DNA must have been in Noah because the DNA is carried forward to beyond the flood. We need to remain silent on the things the Bible is silent on – we can’t go around and make wild speculations as many well known pastors are doing.  To again speculate that angels came down again to have relations with human women to produce more giants after the flood is just nonsense.

2)  Those giant skeletons they supposedly found in Greece and Middle East –

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THERE’S A good reason we haven’t heard about this epic discovery in the New York TimesScientific American, or any other legitimate publication, and that is that these photos, like the one circulating since 2004 purporting to show a giant skeleton found in the Middle East, are fakes.

As if it weren’t preposterous enough to claim that one 15-foot-tall fossilized human skeleton had turned up without media fanfare, we’re asked to believe that archaeologists recently dug up four of them in a single location (Greece). In point of fact, each of the photos appears to have been taken at a different time and place.

So far I’ve only been able to locate the original of one of them, but it serves as clear proof that Photoshopping took place. Image #4 was created by inserting an outsized human skull into a photo of a 1993 University of Chicago dinosaur dig in Niger, Africa (see the original here). If you look at a blow-up of the doctored image, the skull appears flattened and unnatural (and one of the workers actually appears to be standing on it!).

Moreover, the same cut-and-pasted skull was used to create image #2 (see side-by-side comparison). A blow-up of image #2 with brightness and contrast enhanced reveals unnaturally dark “shadows” around the skull. The skull in Image #3 is marked by incongruously bright highlights on the teeth and around the edges of the gaping temple wound. And in image #5 the shadows coming off the skeleton fall more or less toward the camera, while the worker’s shadow falls due left, suggesting that elements of two different photos were combined.

Finally, despite frequent references to “giants” in ancient mythology and English translations of the Bible, there is no generally accepted scientific or historical evidence that such beings ever actually existed (unless you consider the Weekly World News a reliable source).

source:  http://urbanlegends.about.com/od/supernaturalwonders/ss/giants_in_greece_6.htm

NB!! See here for more giant skeletons and why they are a hoax as well:  http://yowcrooks.blogspot.com/2008/12/giant-skeleton-hoax.html

3)  Nephilim: A greater understanding of Jude 5-10:

And the angels who did not keep their proper domain, but left their own abode, He has reserved in everlasting chains under darkness for the judgment of the great day” (Jude 1:6)

Jude 6 is quoted in support of their theories connecting it to Genesis 6 that angels came down and had relations with women. Once again, there is absolutely nothing in the verse, or the context, that connects it with Genesis 6. There is nothing in the context that gives rise to understand that “not keep(ing) their proper domain” has anything to do with having relations with women. These angels sinned by overstepping their boundaries – that is evident. But what those boundaries were can be any of a hundred things. We just cannot draw connection between Genesis 6 and Jude 6, except that the chapter number is the same as the verse number!

To explain Jude 5 – 8 properly, it contains a number of separate examples of God judging  sin. Just like paprables where there is a central truth and the only connection between the parables is that truth (e.g. That which was lost is found: lost coin, lost sheep, lost son).  Here there are four examples showing the same truth that God judges sin. The examples are: 1) Israel’s unbelief in not crossing into the land, 2) angels who did not keep their proper domain, 3) Sodom and Gomorrah’s sexual sin and 4) false teachers.
——
If there is a sexual connection between Sodom and the angels (the angels sinned in a sexual way) then there must also be a connection between Sodom and Israel and between Israel and the angels. But that is not the link here.  The link is sin.In the case of Israel it is unbelief (Hebrews 3 & 4), in the case of Sodom and Gomorrah it is homosexuality and in the case of the angels it was rebellion when Satan was cast down from heaven and 1/3 of the angels followed.
——
Note that the text must be read in its context and we cannot simply make connections and draw conclusions that are not there. Now concerning the statement “who did not keep their proper domain, but left their own abode”. People connect that to Sodom and say that this means angels had relations with women. But we need to examine the statement carefully. The first word “proper domain” according to Thayer means:
——
 Original: oiketerion
– Transliteration: Arche
– Phonetic: ar-khay’
– Definition:
1.  beginning, origin
2.  the person or thing that commences, the first person or thing in a series, the leader
3.  that by which anything begins to be, the origin, the active cause
4.  the extremity of a thing
a.  of the corners of a sail
5.  the first place, principality, rule, magistracy
a.  of angels and demons
Note the word is “Arche” from which we get “arch-enemy”, “arch-rival” etc. This has nothing to do with sexual orientation but with primacy, authority etc. The second is “abode”. This is also a very common word: (oiketerion) which simply means house, habitation or abode.The verse then teaches that the angels did not remain in their proper authority and left their place. This could be construed to mean they had relations with the daughters of men. But it forces and construes a meaning that is NOT obvious to the sentence.
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A more natural interpretation is that the angels rebelled against God’s authority at the very beginning when Satan was cast out of heaven and left their place in the order and hierarchy of God. The English Standard version (ESV) is one of the best translations available. The ESV has the verse as follows:  “And the angels who did not stay within their own position of authority, but left their proper dwelling, he has kept in eternal chains under gloomy darkness until the judgment of the great day-
“This is supported by June 9-10 which speaks about false preachers who do not know their proper place when dealing with the Devil and demons(and yes, Satan is a “dignitary”  – powerful person ).
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What we do not know is why some of these angels (demons) were chained in the “abyss” and others were left to roam the earth. We can only surmise that some sinned more grievously than others. But it also seems that the Lord can (and probably does) throw more of them into the abyss for whatever reason:
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Luke 8:30-32   “30 Jesus asked him, saying, “What is your name?” And he said, “Legion,” because many demons had entered him. 31 And they begged Him that He would not command them to go out into the abyss.  32 Now a herd of many swine was feeding there on the mountain. So they begged Him that He would permit them to enter them. And He permitted them..”
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Now for Jude 7:  The cities around them refers to Admah and Zeboim:

Deuteronomy 29:23  “And that the whole land thereof is brimstone, and salt, and burning, that it is not sown, nor beareth, nor any grass groweth therein, like the overthrow of Sodom, and Gomorrah, Admah, and Zeboim, which the LORD overthrew in his anger, and in his wrath:”

Hosea 11:8  “How shall I give thee up, Ephraim? how shall I deliver thee, Israel? how shall I make thee as Admah? how shall I set thee as Zeboim? mine heart is turned within me, my repentings are kindled together.”

The words “similar manner to these” can only refer to the most recently mentioned subjects – the cities. There is no way, at all that it can refer to the Angels. No language works like that.

When we say “Tom went to church and John went to the mall and Jerry went to the beach and he got sunburned.” The “he” can only refer to the most recent subject – Jerry.

So the meaning is very clear and obvious that Sodom and Gomorrah gave themselves over to immorality and Admah and Zeboim did likewise. There is no other possibility.

The problem here is that it all begins with a bad exegesis is Genesis 6. If you read Genesis 6 to mean that Angels had relations with women (and reject the words of Jesus that they cannot) then you have to find further support. Once you have jumped to that conclusion, it is easy to misread and misinterpret Jude 6&7. But if you do not make assumptions about relations between angels and women, then there is no way you can read that into Jude. So, you have to force the meaning of Gen 6 and then you have to force the meaning of Jude 6 to come to a conclusion.

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Mom4Truth

Thanks for posting this article. Interesting (read: providential) timing, really. My husband and I have been discussing this topic for hours every evening because, as you mentioned, the proponents of the “angels breeding with women” theory seems to be everywhere, even as the wicked Catholic church has been talking a lot about an alien invasion.

We agreed that much has to be read into in order to come to that conclusion, and a lot of Scripture must be twisted, contorted, and even over-looked in favor of Enoch and Jasher. But the two things we couldn’t get over for any reason were:

Christ’s own words that angels do not marry, nor are they given in marriage and the text clearly indicates that they “took them wives” and, the biggest one, is the concept that Satan could produce life.

I think of Satan’s own words in Isaiah where he threatens that he would become as God. Now, he has convinced masses that he has the ability to create life in the form of mutant offspring! God says HE is the Author of Life, not Satan. Satan could not produce more demons, nor could he produce a demon/man child. What a lie from the Father of Lies! My faith in the Word of God will not allow me the peace to believe that Satan has any authority to create life.

Thanks, Debs!

Deborah (Discerning the World)

Mom4Truth

My pleasure!

And isn’t it just a co-incidence that the RCC are not looking for aliens and talking about an alien invasion? Well we as Christians know there are no such things, but mankind has the technology to create lying signs and wonders, therefore enter project blue beam 🙂

Truthseeker

Thank you so much for this! It is such a coincidence (OR NOT!) that I have been learning about this Nephilim theory just the past week! I was shocked to say the least in the theory that was put forward like in your first paragraphs! And this in the Book, Unlocking the Bible by David Pawson! I was also not comfortable that they took their evidence from extrabiblical books! I have learnt a big lesson and will remember this text: “…charge some that they teach no other doctrine, nor give heed to fables and endless genealogies, which cause disputes rather than godly edification which is in faith”. (1 Timothy 1:3-4).

Deborah (Discerning the World)

Truthseeker

I tell you it was like I had to do this article and get this info to EVERYONE. The Holy Spirit reminded me almost weekly. ‘Find the truth about the Nephilim’, He told me. I searched for a good year and a half. Going back and forth, back and forth, until finally the Holy Spirit said, “THAT’S IT” 🙂

Truthseeker

Regarding David Pawson, I noticed a while ago on his website some strange leanings toward New Age teaching. hmmmm

Bob

Im still confused about falling angels, giants,demons, and bizzard things the Bible mentions but as Paul said one day mysteries will be reveiled to us.I’ve never been into the demon stuff but the Bible does mention it as well as reports from missionarys thoughout the world.
Once my sister who was a single mom and was involved in occult stuff called me and said something was lifting her kids bed up and dropping them in the middle of the night and slamed doors as well as moved small articles around the house which scared the children and her>
Some call this a Polargist others a haunting.
I studied the scriptures on this fasted and prayed that the Lord would help me cast whatever it was out of the house. I told my sister about how evil can be invited in through witchcraft,books,palm reading, horoscopes,and other evil things the world has to offer that seem so innocent,which she got rid of.We read the scriptures on Jesus Death on the Cross and The Power of The Resurrection and commanded the demon to leave which it did after awhile!Eventhough the evil force did do somethings that where a little scary I held on to The Truth Of Jesus and His Power to evict this evil being.Im not a nut case and have spent several years in the prison ministry and never encountered anything like this since that event. Sorry for any mispelled words>

Deborah (Discerning the World)

Bob

>> Im still confused about falling angels, giants,demons, and bizzard things

How can you be confused? I have just given you the answer, the truth. Did you even read the article properly?

This article is not denying that demons do not exist hence there is reference to Jesus casing out demons in the article and sending the demons into pigs! All this article is saying that angels did not have sex with woman and produce a mutant race of people.

Bob

Well there is much writings in the Old Testament about the size of giants king of OZ is one of many, also David had men of ar join him that had faces of bronze and could run up a hill fast as a Gazelle what does that mean. Also I think Mosess fought a half man and half beast i can find the scriptures if needed.
A museum in Az has skulls of some type of beast? giants. American indians legenes talk of a race of sometime the could chase down Buffalo and and put them under their arms sounds like somethingbig to me if true.
There is enough evidence of differant races of something in the past. maybe the falling Angels knew secrets of the womb similar to what the labs are doing today to animals.
Well our salvation isn’t based on this stuff but just because wee read an article dosn’t mean that its fact!

Deborah (Discerning the World)

Bob

>> Well there is much writings in the Old Testament about the size of giants king of Og is one of many, also David had men of war join him that had faces of bronze and could run up a hill fast as a Gazelle what does that mean. Also I think Mosess fought a half man and half beast i can find the scriptures if needed.

Um, ok. Yes please find the scriptures for the bronze faces and Moses fighting and half man/half beast.

If you are referring to this: Asahel, was one of the fastest runners in David’s army and his skill was his downfall. It was said of Asahel that he was, ‘as light of foot as a wild roe.’ (See 2 Samuel 2:18) – Dude, this is a FIGURE OF SPEECH. The guy was not a gazelle, or a beast.

>> American indians legenes talk of a race of sometime the could chase down Buffalo and and put them under their arms sounds like somethingbig to me if true.

PS. why do you refer to American Indians as a source of info? You may as well refer to the book of Enoch as well and other occult sources too.

>> There is enough evidence of differant races of something in the past.

No there is no evidence. You are basing your so called facts on ‘legends’ aka stories.

And you would think with all these so called hundreds of ‘giant skeleton’ discoveries their bones would be preserved somewhere safe, like the Dinosaurs, but they are not, because they don’t exist, they are fairytales.

I tried to search for your so called skull at the museum in Az? (I am presuming that is Arizona) and I can’t find anything, Unless I am looking in the wrong place.

Bob

also the Bible does mention types of genetic variations that came from someplace….

Deborah (Discerning the World)

Bob

>> also the Bible does mention types of genetic variations that came from someplace….

Now you are speaking utter nonsense please provide me with scripture to support your arguments. You can’t make wild claims like this and expect me to just believe you. Back it up with the Bible – the TRUTH.

Are you sure you’re a pastor?

Bob

King Og was approx 12 feet tall, BUT GUESS how tall Noah was? He was 12 feet tall. (Cecil Dougherty, author of Valley of the Giants (Valley of the Giants Publishers, first edition, 1971) – And even if Noah was not 12′ tall but 7′ tall – does that make Noah a Nephilim as well. Noah lived to 950 years old, he had a lot of growing to do, as did everyone else in those days! Come now wake up an smell the coffee.

Lee

This is a good article Debs!

I stand corrected! I also am guilty of believing that there were demons/fallen angels that had relations with women. there was a documentary about finding other large species of the human race from thousands of years and they were saying that that is why evolution must be true e.t.c. but I told my mum that it must have been the demons/fallen angels! stupid me, now I have to go correct her and anyone else I told that too.

Deborah (Discerning the World)

Lee

We have all been fooled. And very subtly so by people using the bible. Worse of all there are well known (relatively good) pastors at the moment promoting the angels/women theory. It brings us back to knowing the truth and nothing but the truth about scripture. I truly believe that as born again Christians we will know ALL truth and never lies because the Holy Spirit won’t tells us lies – only the truth.

I firmly believe that currently this Nephilim stuff is the open door to occult like thinking that will bring many good pastors down in these end times if they don’t change their thinking and listen to the HOLY SPIRIT on this matter.

Lee

“We have all been fooled. And very subtly so by people using the bible. Worse of all there are well known (relatively good) pastors at the moment promoting the angels/women theory. It brings us back to knowing the truth and nothing but the truth about scripture. I truly believe that as born again Christians we will know ALL truth and never lies because the Holy Spirit won’t tells us lies – only the truth.

I firmly believe that currently this Nephilim stuff is the open door to occult like thinking that will bring many good pastors down in these end times if they don’t change their thinking and listen to the HOLY SPIRIT on this matter.”

Phew! I thought you were about to beat on me head lol! I did not know some pastors are teaching this. Whats they’e business with teaching this for? Shouldn’t they be focused on the Gospel!?

Deborah (Discerning the World)

Lee

>> I did not know some pastors are teaching this. Whats they’e business with teaching this for? Shouldn’t they be focused on the Gospel!?

Well according to them demons are going to come down during these last days and have relations with woman – same as it was in the days of Noah. This ‘most utterly ridiculous teaching is gaining a wide spread audience and pastors are now having conferences on occult teaching, aliens, supernatural, quantum leaps, and other weird stuff. The NAR on the other hand are so scared that they feel they have to review their spiritual warfare practices because the old ways of doing spiritual warfare are not going to be good enough to prevent these demons from coming down and doing their business. LOL.

>> Shouldn’t they be focused on the Gospel!?

Well we gotta first ask this question, what is going on with their spiritual lives if they are going on another path, one that leads AWAY from the gospel. See they might very much believe it is gospel (because it’s in the bible) – so they say. But where is the Holy Spirit in their lives telling them that what they are preaching is wrong? hmmm.

Lee

“Well according to them demons are going to come down during these last days and have relations with woman – same as it was in the days of Noah. This ‘most utterly ridiculous teaching is gaining a wide spread audience and pastors are now having conferences on occult teaching, aliens, supernatural, quantum leaps, and other weird stuff. The NAR on the other hand are so scared that they feel they have to review their spiritual warfare practices because the old ways of doing spiritual warfare are not going to be good enough to prevent these demons from coming down and doing their business. LOL.”

Are you serious? Are they for REAL?!

Deborah (Discerning the World)

Lee

Seriouuuuussssss

Lee

lol….thats all i can say

Renjy

hi guys,
I must say there is a whole lot of confusion in the world concerning this topic. It is really hard for one to believe in these things. I have been looking into this for about 8yrs now and things are still strange to me. Archeologically,and Historically the evidences discovered do leave us a question we must consider. What has happened in our distant past? How come no one really has an answer? The Truth is, the Bible has been the only Book that has been telling the truth. God has given us our history and our future in one place. We need to read it with spiritual insight, that one can only have through the Holy Spirit. There are a lot of things I can say…for starters…the early Church believed in the existence of giants called the Nephalim and their desendents. I am aware the most of you are well versed with what Chuck Missler and Tom Horn are saying. I am not here to endorse what they are saying, but rather I am speaking from what I have checked out for myself. Most of these leaders refer the Book of Enoch because Jude refers it in his book in the Bible. I also thought of it as heretical but then I was confronted with the question:If the Book of Enoch was not considered why would Jude use it as reference? Mind you Jude didn’t write it or put it there by his own will!

All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness 2Tim 3:16

This scripture that Jude wrote is because God told him to! I believe it is there for a reason. There are so many unbelievable incidences and stories in the Bible, that would overshadow this topic..yet not many complain. I will tell you why this is an area that makes a whole lot of people restless…it directly deals with how things are going to pan out in the last days…which is where we are now currently. It will allow men to align themselves with God to see and prepare themselves & others for the supernatural shaking that satan is about to unleash upon the unsuspecting world.

Have anyone wondered what would cause all the armies of the world to gather and fight against the armies of Jesus?

And I saw the beast, and the kings of the earth, and their armies, having been gathered together to make war with him who is sitting upon the horse, and with his army. Rev 19:19

satan has a hidden agenda and he likes to keep it that way. However, God on the other hand exposes all works of darkness. He prophesied right at the begining that the serpent would have seed!!!!

And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel. Gen 3:15

We all know women have no seed..yet God says she will…Yes it was God telling her about the virgin birth of Christ. God goes on to say the serpent will also have seed!

If God said it then it must be true. I believe satan had been planning to thwart this prophesy of Christ crushing his head from the moment God spoke it. He started of by tainting the human genome. Genetics ahs proven that one does not need to have sexual intercourse to sire children. Then why would we have so much issue when the Bible clearly says that women begot giants!I do not believe that angels are going to come back and repeat Gen 6 all over again. Oh! they have learnt their lesson the first time round. They about it on a different path. human anomalies are commonly uncommon. The great Kali, and other tall athelets are exception among the human race. Being tall is not enemity with God. It would not make God angry enough to destroy everything. There definately something more there. The Bible is clear that there were races of giants…desendants of the Nephalim…the Emmim, Zamzumim, Anakim, Amelek, Rephaim… if we are taking about Cain’s desendents marrying Seth’s..we wouldn’t get such a distortion of the human genepool. Guys I understand that the need of the hour is not a debate on these topics. Life is enough and more confusing without it. But, we need to warn people of the great deception that is currently being played out right before our very eyes. The best way to keep a secret is to leave it in the open. No one will notice it!

God has already revealed it in His word what satan will unleash, but glory be to God…satan has his limits. We need to prepare ourselves for His coming is at hand. Let us move on readying ourselves to be with Him. We also need to educate the next generation on the word of God. The antichrist cannot be revealed unless there is a widespread church apostacy unlike anything we can ever imagine.

Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition; Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God. 2Ths 2:3-4

If you need further info on this topic or any other I’d be happy to post. Please to inform.
God bless

Deborah (Discerning the World)

Renjy

Did you even READ my article?

Renjy

Please explain to a Biblical Reason why every ancient Civilization of the world starting from the ancient Sumerians, Babylonians,Egyptians,Norse,Aboriginal, Greek, Roman,Persian,Hindu,Mayan,Inca,Aztec,Chinese,Native American Indians (hopi/cherokee etc), even very small tribes of the African continent and even among the islanders in the Pacific Ocean all have their belief systems based on sky gods descending and giving them knowledge, and siring children with theirs women?

Deborah (Discerning the World)

Renjy

There once upon a time was a guy called Satan (I think you have heard of him before) who went to all these people, the Sumerians, Babylonians, Egyptians, Norse, Aboriginal, Greek, Roman, Persian, Hindu, Mayan, Inca, Aztec, Chinese, Native American Indians (hopi/cherokee etc), even very small tribes of the African continent and even among the islanders in the Pacific Ocean and told them the same occult stories over and over and over again under different fables, that all their belief systems based would be based on sky gods descending and giving them knowledge, and siring children with their women.

Satan gave them fables and magic and they believed him. You seem to have been following Satan’s fables too. When will you turn to follow the Bible Renjy?

Renjy

Absolutely right Deborah. However, a fable is not a fable when it becomes a reality in ones life, which it seemingly did in those days. I asked you for a Biblical explantation, which you have not furnished. I have been studying how men went so wrong and away from God with all these gods and religions? My quest has been to debunk false religions n gods. I am not here to disprove your thoughts but rather redirect them. There is a lot of sarcasm in your reply. I do not think it is a rigth way to answer someones questions? What if an unbeliever was asking you this…your reply would give him/her the feeling that you are mocking them, for asking a question! Let your words be seasoned with salt and full of grace is what the Bible, you and I read, commands us to speak.
satan did spread these things but no one will believe a story or a fable without evidence. You mean to tell me that a few stories would influence someone. It would if they were gullible enough. Our ancestors were not that stupid. By the way what is magic…how does it work..it is part of the fable as well? Meaning that it is not real.I did read your article and have found a lot of the points you have used are incorrect readings of the verses. For example:

“First, the normal meaning of “sons of God” is “believers”. “But as many as received him, to them gave He power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name” (John 1:12). Job 1:6 (a poetic book) is the only place where angels are called “sons of God”. It is logical and reasonable therefore that the normal meaning be attached to the term here, rather than the exception, as found in Job, unless there were something in the text that made a connection between Genesis 6 and Job 1 – which is absent.”

The term “sons of God” can never be interpreted as believers in this chapter because Christ hadn’t come nor died in order for man to be redeemed. Using John 1:12 would actually disprove your point than establish it. To use this verse to prove the point is far worse than someone using Job 1:6 to prove who the sons of God are.

There are more mistakes. I suggest that you recheck what you have understood becasue it is very important. I understand this topic is outrageous and most people wouldn’t even consider it. I am asking you to look deeper becasue I see that you are in a position of influence and I believe a lot of people accept what you say. It is my humble request.

Deborah (Discerning the World)

Renjy

First I was not sarcastic, don’t read into my words things that are not there. I was being deadly serious. When are you going to turn from looking at occult teachings and focus on the Word of God only.

>> However, a fable is not a fable when it becomes a reality in ones life, which it seemingly did in those days. I asked you for a Biblical explantation, which you have not furnished.
>> You mean to tell me that a few stories would influence someone. It would if they were gullible enough. Our ancestors were not that stupid. By the way what is magic…how does it work..it is part of the fable as well?

How do you know it became REALITY in these peoples lives? Reality means that demons actually came down and did things. Instead how do you know they did not enter trances and experience these things via an occult means of communication? And pray tell how do I furnish biblical explanation for something that is not in the bible? Goodness that’s a bit ridiculous.

>> satan did spread these things but no one will believe a story or a fable without evidence. You mean to tell me that a few stories would influence someone. It would if they were gullible enough. Our ancestors were not that stupid. By the way what is magic…how does it work..it is part of the fable as well?

(Matt. 24:24 ) “For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect.”

If it is possible for the Elect to be deceived how much more so is it possible for ungodly people to be deceived by LYING signs and wonders, using witchcraft, magic, sorcery etc. They will believe anything. You just have to spend a few minutes watching Youtube videos on syngomas/witchdoctors to know that all scruples go out the window when witchcraft is involved – and this is in the 21st century. The Maya were so intelligent it would appear they they wiped themselves out through sacrificing each other to their rain god because it stopped raining. They believed the sacrificing caused the rain god to make it rain, so when it stopped they thought their god was angry and they increased the sacrifices. It became so ferocious that they changed the manner in how they would sacrifice and the more brutal the better as they believed this would appease their Satanic rain god – but it never rained and they all died through drought and sacrificial death. When it comes to Satan BLINDING mankind, all intelligence goes out the window and he believes anything.

Concerning occult practices, the Israelites were warned:
“When you come into the land which the LORD your God is giving you, you shall not learn to follow the abominations of those nations. There shall not be found among you anyone who makes his son or his daughter pass through the fire [an ancient occult practice], or one who practices witchcraft, or a soothsayer, or one who interprets omens, or a sorcerer, or one who conjures spells, or a medium, or a spiritist, or one who calls up the dead. For all who do these things are an abomination [detestable] to the LORD…” (Deuteronomy 18:9-12a)

>> The term “sons of God” can never be interpreted as believers in this chapter because Christ hadn’t come nor died in order for man to be redeemed. Using John 1:12 would actually disprove your point than establish it. To use this verse to prove the point is far worse than someone using Job 1:6 to prove who the sons of God are.

Of course they were believers, (not in a physical Jesus Christ) but in GOD. Just as people were children of God / sons of God in the OT so we are today. The Israelites where children of God / sons of God were they not? Of course yes.

>> There are more mistakes

lol, there are no mistakes.

I can however point out some of yours… based on your first comment – see next comment

Deborah (Discerning the World)

Renjy

>> Most of these leaders refer the Book of Enoch because Jude refers it in his book in the Bible. I also thought of it as heretical but then I was confronted with the question: If the Book of Enoch was not considered why would Jude use it as reference? Mind you Jude didn’t write it or put it there by his own will! All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness 2Tim 3:16 This scripture that Jude wrote is because God told him to! I believe it is there for a reason.

Let’s me fix some of your mistakes…

Jude neither called Enoch “scripture,” nor prefaced his quotation of it with, “it is written.” Clearly, Jude did NOT view Enoch to be Scripture, or to be a sacred text, but merely cited a common prophecy of future judgment that elsewhere was canonically predicted by the Old Testament (Zechariah 14:5) “the Lord . . . will come, and all the holy ones with Him!” -(see Deuteronomy 33:2.) Confirmed by Jesus (Matthew 16:27) “For the Son of man shall come in the glory of his Father with his angels; and then he shall reward every man according to his works,” (See also Matthew 25:31, Mark 8:38 and Luke 9:26.) and affirmed by the Apostle Paul (2 Thessalonians 1:7-8) “the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels, In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ,” (See 1 Thessalonians 3:13)

So why did Jude cite Enoch 1:9? Jude quoted Enoch because on the one hand false teachers rejected the authority of Scripture that Jesus and the Apostles were telling them, but on the other hand treasured Enoch and other UNSCRIPTURAL books (i.e., the corpus of spurious writings, esp. writings erroneously credited to Biblical characters and times). Pseudo-teachers thrive on pseudo-books. So inspired by the Holy Spirit, Jude told his readers that false teachers were heading for judgment, something that they, in their smug self-righteousness, presumed they were going to avoid! And he did so by citing the sacred book of the false teachers.Take that, Jude tells them, and from your own “sacred” source!

Renjy, if the words appear outside of the BIBLE then the texts are NOT BIBLICAL.

(Revelation 22:18–20) “18 I warn everyone who hears the words of the prophecy of this book: if anyone adds to them, God will add to him the plagues described in this book, 19 and if anyone takes away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God will take away his share in the tree of life and in the holy city, which are described in this book. 20 He who testifies to these things says, “Surely I am coming soon.” Amen. Come, Lord Jesus!”

And I will quote this verse right back at ya: (2Ths 2:3-4) Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition; Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.

We are in the GREAT APOSTASY Renjy, stop following after occult stories and focus on the Word of God only and most importantly UNDERSTAND the Bible properly and that can only be done with the guidance of the Holy Spirit. 🙂
Please read this: to understand what Salvation means and how the Holy Spirit works.

Greg

Deborah and readers,
In connection with the Nephilm and the books of Enoch and the finding of giant skeletons.

I have read the books of Enoch for research purposes and also some of “the Lost books of Eden” and “The shepard of Hermes” The inconsistencies within them compared to the scriptures are obvious and staggering…to me at least.

On the finding of the giant skeleton bones some of which are pictured above;

Some time back a photography competition was ran, I think in the united states, to see if photographers could concoct photos of a fake archeological find. The competition was won by a guy who had a psueudonym of “Iorn Kite” He produced most of the photographs of the giant skeletons one of which was a skelton in a grave with a six gun by his side. He concocted shots that were supposed to be of bones found in India also. I believe his fake photo’s were featured in national geographic.

You can see a commentary on his work on youtube.

Greg.

DANIEL JOHNSON

i am still not convinced by all the comment, the are all asumptions to the core. i think we should just accept it the way it is.may be GOD has many sons, we are the sons of GOD, angels are the sons of GOD, as well as heavenly being. this kind of sons were still carrying the same fresh as human being

tina

[deleted – this is not an article on Positive Speaking]

Sheugnet

Renjy. The seed of Satan refers to those who lie and oppose God. One reference is where Jesus called the Pharisees a brood of vipers. He plainly said that they had the devil as father.

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