Paul Washer – Practice the Presence: Silence and Meditation

Paul Washer

Paul Washer – Practice the Presence: Silence and Meditation

Notes on the Youtube video below (Busyness and Spiritual Discipline by Paul Washer):

The first part has audio problems, but after minute 4:44 the audio is fixed. You can hear him repeating the same lies and leading sincere people away from genuine Faith in Christ. The Presence of God is not an experience. I am in God’s Presence through the blood of Jesus Christ, not by being silent and sitting at His feet. To be sitting at His feet means that you are learning from Him the truth that is written in the Word of God.

Comments are sprinkled throughout.  At the very beginning of the message he speaks of silence and meditation (5:50) and cites a poem or something that refers to the sacred silence (6:53).  The part were he talks about Practice the Presence is at (21:45) – Paul Washer is quoting “Brother Lawrence – Contemplative Monk”  (1611- 1691). 

Busyness and Spiritual Discipline by Paul Washer – Youtube on December 10, 2009.

 

Who was Brother Lawrence:He uses the phrase “Practice the Presence” and refutes the idea that you can pray as you go, but then he gives it heed by saying you must practice the presence in a time of stillness and solitude. He didn’t use those exact words, but that is the message. These are the buzz words. This teaching is being woven into the teaching of those who are trusted and it is sad to recognise it for what it is. A little leaven meant to leaven the whole lump.

 width=“[T]he 17th century [French] monk, Brother Lawrence, developed a technique–mostly through inspiration and intuition–which leads to results akin to those developed by the continued practice of either Zen or mindfulness meditation. In The Practice of the Presence of God” he wrote:

“This made me resolve to give the all for the All: so after having given myself wholly to GOD, to make all the satisfaction I could for my sins, I renounced, for the love of Him, everything that was not He; and I began to live as if there was none but He and I in the world … I worshipped Him the oftenest that I could, keeping my mind in His holy Presence, and recalling it as often as I found it wandered from Him. I found no small pain in this exercise, and yet I continued it, notwithstanding all the difficulties that occurred, without troubling or disquieting myself when my mind had wandered involuntarily. I made this my business, as much all the day long as at the appointed times of prayer; for at all times, every hour, every minute, even in the height of my business, I drove away from my mind everything that was capable of interrupting my thought of GOD. Such has been my common practice ever since I entered into religion.”   Western Mystical Traditions (Quote by Brother Lawrence from First Letter)

Source:  www.lighthousetrailsresearch.com/brotherlawrence.htm

Paul Washer and a few of his staff members at HeartCry Missionary often quote C.S. Lewis and promote his books along with J.I. Packer

Lewis’s Acceptance by Evangelicals width=

  1. According to a Christianity Today reader’s poll in 1998, Lewis was rated the most influential writer.
  2. Though Lewis died in 1963, sales of his books have risen to two million a year.
  3. In an article commemorating the 100th anniversary of Lewis’s birth, J.I. Packer called him “our patron saint.”
  4. Christianity Today said Lewis “has come to be the Aquinas, the Augustine, and the Aesop of contemporary Evangelicalism” (“Still Surprised by Lewis,” Christianity Today, Sept. 7, 1998).
  5. Wheaton College sponsored a lecture series on C.S. Lewis, and Eerdmans published “The Pilgrim’s Guide” to C.S. Lewis.

Lewis’s Heresies

  1. Christianity Today noted that he was “a man whose theology had decidedly unevangelical elements” (CT, Sept. 7, 1998).
  2. He believed in purgatory, confessed his sins to a priest, and had the last rites performed by a Catholic priest (C.S. Lewis: A Biography, pp. 198, 301). He received the Catholic sacrament of last rites on July 16, 1963.
  3. Lewis rejected the doctrine of bodily resurrection (Biblical Discernment Ministries Letter, Sept.-Oct. 1996).
  4. He believed there is salvation in pagan religions.
  5. Lewis denied the total depravity of man and the substitutionary atonement of Christ.
  6. He believed in theistic evolution and rejected the Bible as the infallible Word of God.
  7. He denied the biblical doctrine of an eternal fiery hell, claiming, instead, that hell is a state of mind: “And every state of mind, left to itself, every shutting up of the creature within the dungeon of its own mind-is, in the end, Hell” (Lewis, The Great Divorce, p. 65).

Source:  www.discerningtheworld.com/2010/03/29/the-new-evangelical-evil-fit-for-a-new-dark-age/

Are all the visible leaders falling for mysticism?

All I can say is that when Jesus Christ came the first time, it was a bunch of nobody’s that he called. The leaders were too busy with their own kingdom to be bothered with the Truth. In fact we know that they wanted to destroy the Messiah. There were apparently a few that eventually listened, but not the majority.

This is the other thing that we must always discern. Has someone changed their theology to be more biblical or are they moving away from a biblical position. We must discern which way their theology is moving. I would hate for someone to quote me from the fall of 2006, because I would have been endorsing the very same teaching that I now oppose. Unfortunately, the trend seems to be exactly what the Bible says, Apostasy!  That is what we are witnessing.

The thing that makes Washer appealing is his stance against lukewarm Christians and push for personal holiness. Funny how we always seems gravitate back to the law. But as Christians we are not under the law, but under grace.

Paul Washer is a staunch Calvinist believing in the 5 points of Calvinism (TULIP)

  • Total Hereditary Depravity
  • Unconditional Election
  • Limited Atonement
  • Irresistible Grace
  • Perseverance of the Saints

Paul Washer uses the Purpose Driven Church Model regarding Unity and Church Planting:

6. “Church Planting is the Primary Work of Missions. There are many gifts and callings in the body of Christ, but all of them are to work together on the mission field with the primary goal of planting a biblical church. It is one thing to do mass evangelism and to boast of the numbers of decisions; it is quite another to establish a biblical church.”   [Emphasis added] www.heartcrymissionary.com/about/statement_of_faith/essential_convictions

Paul Washer supports Dominion Theology/ Kingdom Now Teaching:

7. “True Missions is Costly. Amy Carmichael explained that missions is no more and no less than an opportunity to die. We live in a fallen world that is at enmity with God and opposes His truth; therefore, missions and suffering go hand in hand. Any advancement of the kingdom of Christ into the dominion of the devil will be met with warfare. There are many countries and people groups where  martyrdom cannot be avoided”.  [Emphasis added] www.heartcrymissionary.com/about/statement_of_faith/essential_convictions

[DTW note:  Even though “Amy Carmichael” is speaking about real warfare.  Spiritual warfare can be applied to this as well.  The buzz words – “advancement of the Kingdom of Christ” is what taking dominion is all about]

Paul Washer- Hear tCry Missionary Society

Paul Washer refers to HeartCry Missionary as a SOCIETY

This is very concerning.  Born Again Christians are not part of a society.  They are part of the Body of Christ.   Paul Washer considers his ministry a society of like minded people, with similar interests, purposes and passions.

He is subtly promoting Unity.  Like minded people?  Why not say born again Christians? Anyhow, it’s all about like-minded people coming together (does not matter what type of Christian you are) as long as you are coming together with one purpose.

“The HeartCry Missionary Society is not a para-church organisation, rather, we are a ministry under the authority and supervision of a local New Testament Church and its elders.

We call ourselves a society simply because the word denotes a proper association of people with similar interests, purposes, or passions. Those of our church and those who faithfully support this ministry have one abiding purpose:  That God’s Name be great among the nations through the redemption of men and the building up of Christ’s bride.”  [Emphasis added] —www.heartcrymissionary.com/about/accountability/church_and_elders

Some of HeartCry Missionary Recommended Links:

  • Grace to You by John MacArthur –  in-depth Bible teaching brings the life-transforming truth of God’s Word to millions of people every day.

[DTW note:  John Mac Arthur is a Calvinist.  Also see article here on John MacArthur exposed – UN connections, and denied the Blood of Jesus Christ and compares Jesus’ Blood as just being ‘liquid’:  John MacArthur I pray this is NOT true! ]

  • Desiring God  by John Piper – Provides God Centered resources from the ministry of Dr. John Piper.

[DTW note: John Piper supports Rick Warren wholeheartedly including contemplative spirituality as he condones Mark Driscoll.     See article on John Piper:  John Piper – Taking Leave and Asks for Forgiveness .      Mark Driscoll on meditation:  Mark Driscoll’s RESURGENCE and EMERGENCE with Catholicism

  • Justin Peters Ministries

[DTW note:  Justin Peters is also a Calvinist]

[EDITED:  27 May 2010 – Paul Washer has rescinded his support for Bill Graham in recent years (The Youth conference video below was filmed in 2002).]

Paul Washer promotes Billy Graham starting 37:00 min into the video.

Billy Graham denies Jesus Christ

Paul Washer and most of the staff at HeartCry Missionary believe in Amillennialism:

Here is a reply to an email I sent to Paul Washer’s Ministry over 2 years ago asking them about Pre-Tribulation, Post-Tribulation, the Rapture, etc.

 from:   Marc Glass <mdglass[at]heartcrymissionary. com>
date:    Tue, Jan 29, 2008 at 6:40 PM
subject:   Re:   HeartCry Missionary Society: For Paul Washer / Marc Glass

Deborah,

There are, basically, 3 views on eschatology (the study of the end times).
The first, which you’re most familiar with, is classified as pre-millennial.
A second, as you have mentioned post-millennial.  The third, and what most
of HeartCry’s staff believes, amillennial.
  One very important thing to keep
in mind is that there has been no consensus on what is the correct view for
2,000 years of Christian history.  There have been very good and godly men
in each eschatological camp.  The proper thing to do is to state what you
believe (and just as important, why you believe it) and then have grace and
love towards those who disagree.  This is certainly an issue that if we can
say anything about with certainty, it is that the Scriptures are not
perfectly clear on it.  God bless.

Marc Glass

What is Amillennialism:

Amillennialism (Latin: a- “no” + millennialism)

Amillennialism is a view in Christian end-times theology named for its rejection of the theory that Jesus Christ will have a thousand-year long, physical reign on the earth. This is in opposition to pre-millennial and some post-millennial views of chapter 20 of the Book of Revelation.

In contrast, the amillennial view holds that the thousand years mentioned in Revelation 20 is a symbolic number, not a literal description; that the millennium has already begun and is identical with the current church age, (or more rarely, that it ended with the destruction of Jerusalem in AD 70 – see Preterism).

Amillennialism holds that while Christ’s reign during the millennium is spiritual in nature, at the end of the church age, Christ will return in final judgement and establish a permanent physical reign.”

Teaching

“Amillennialism teaches that the Kingdom of God will not be physically established on earth throughout the “millennium”, but rather

  • that Jesus is presently reigning from heaven, seated at the right hand of God the Father,      [DTW Note:  All mankind has to do is preach the gospel and turn the world into a Christian world so that Christ may finally return and judge the wicked]
  • that Jesus also is and will remain with the church until the end of the world, as he promised at the Ascension,    [DTW Note:   This is because they believe the Church is Israel]
  • that at Pentecost, the millennium began, as is shown by Peter using the prophecies of Joel, about the coming of the kingdom, to explain what was happening,     [DTW Note:   Again they can make this claim because they believe that the Church is Israel and that all prophecies have been fulfilled since 70 A.D.]
  • and that, therefore the church and its spread of the good news is Christ’s kingdom.     [DTW Note:   The church and it’s spreading of the good news is NOT Christ’s Kingdom.  The Kingdom of God is the Holy Spirit in every born again Christians life. Amazing how the correct interpretation of scripture changes EVERYTHING.]

Amillennialism also teaches that the binding of Satan described in Revelation has already occurred.

Therefore Satan has been prevented from deceiving the nations  i.e., he can’t prevent the spreading of the gospel.   This is the only binding he will suffer in history.

Amillennialism is sometimes associated with Idealism as both teach a symbolic interpretation of many of the prophecies of the Bible and especially the Book of Revelation.     [DTW Note:   Idealism – the tendency to represent things in their ideal forms, rather than as they are.]

Medieval and Reformation periods

Amillennialism gained ground after Christianity became a legal religion. It was systematised by St. Augustine in the fourth century, and this systematisation carried amillennialism over as the dominant eschatology of the Medieval and Reformation periods. Augustine was originally a premillennialist, but he retracted that view, claiming the doctrine was carnal.

Amillennialism was the dominant view of the Protestant Reformers. The Lutheran Church formally rejected chiliasm in the The Augsburg Confession-

“Art. XVII., condemns the Anabaptists and others ‘who now scatter Jewish opinions that, before the resurrection of the dead, the godly shall occupy the kingdom of the world, the wicked being everywhere suppressed.‘”

Likewise, the Swiss Reformer, Heinrich Bullinger wrote up the Second Helvetic Confession which reads

We also reject the Jewish dream of a millennium, or golden age on earth, before the last judgement.”

John Calvin wrote in Institutes that chiliasm is a “fiction” that is “too childish either to need or to be worth a refutation.” He interpreted the thousand year period of Revelation 20 non-literally, applying it to the “various disturbances that awaited the church, while still toiling on earth.”

chil·i·asm –  the belief that Jesus Christ will return to earth in visible form (after the Tribulation) and establish a kingdom too last 1000 years.

Modern times

Amillennialism has been widely held in the Eastern and Oriental Orthodox Churches as well as in the Roman Catholic Church, which generally follows Augustine on this point and which has deemed that pre-millennialism “cannot safely be taught.

Amillennialism is also common among “mainline” Protestant denominations such as the Lutheran, Reformed, Disciples of Christ, and Anglican churches, and even has a significant following amongst Evangelical Christian denominations.

Source:   http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amillennialism

Comparison between Amillennialism and Dominion Theology

  • The belief in Amillennialism or Preterism also called Victorious eschatology is part and parcel of Dominionist Theology.

Amillennialists believes that we are living in the millennial era and Jesus reigns spiritually from heaven.   The destruction of Jerusalem in 70 A.D means that all prophecy in the Bible has been fulfilled – especially the Book of Revelation.

Amillennialists can claim the earth and must dominate by instilling Christian principles and a moral code which will create a Christian society so that Jesus can manifest His presence one day and judge the wicked.

Dominionists can claim the earth and must dominate by instilling Christian principles and a moral code which will create a Christian society so that Jesus can manifest His presence and rule the world.

Amillennialism teaches that the Church is now Israel because natural Israel has been cut off from God.

Dominionism teaches that the Church is now Israel because natural Israel has been cut off from God.  Another word for Dominion Theology is Replacement Theology that teaches that the Church is the replacement for Israel.  The many promises made to Israel in the Bible are fulfilled in the Christian church, not in Israel.  All promises Abraham made to Israel now belong to the Church.

Martin Luther, like the Catholics, did not hold that the book of Revelation should be among the Canonical books.

C. Peter Wagner (Head Apostle in the New Apostolic Reformation), has openly declared that he is Amillennial/Preterist.

Victorious eschatology fits dominion theology like a hand in a glove. Eberle and Trench say, “Before Jesus returns, the Church will rise in glory, unity, and maturity. The Kingdom of God will grow and advance until it fills the Earth.”

Victorious eschatology makes a convincing argument that the biblical prophecies concerning the “last days” or the “end times” were literally fulfilled at the time of the destruction of Jerusalem in 70 A.D. The end times marked the ending of the old covenant and the beginning of the new covenant. Jesus literally will return to the earth in the future (see Matthew 24:36-25:46), but none of the signs of Matthew 24:4-34 are expected to precede His return, because they have already occurred. This is known by professional theologians as the Partial Preterist view of eschatology, and it is the view with which I personally identify.”  —  DOMINION! How Kingdom Action Can Change the World  p. 61

Dominionism can be traced back to Ambrose of Milan (338-397), who influenced St Augustine, (354-430).

Ambrose believed that the church should exert political authority over the state so that the courts and government would reflect the morality and ethics teachings of the church.

Martin Luther (1483-1546) and John Calvin (1509-1564) were ardent students of St Augustine’s theology.

In 1540 John Calvin set about creating a Genevan Society.

John Calvin’s plan was to incorporate the church into government by restructuring municipal government so that clergy would be involved in municipal decisions, particularly in disciplining the populace.

Dominionists are using a strategy called the ‘7 Mountains’ strategy where they are taking over top positions through a mass ‘Christian’ movement to infiltrate business, government, media, arts, education, family and religion.

Calvin imposed a hierarchy on the Genevan Society

Dominionists are doing the same through the 5 fold ministry concept (Ephesians 4:11).  The Apostles being at the top of the hierarchy who will govern the world.

Calvin began a series of statute reforms to impose a strict and uncompromising moral code on the city

Angus Buchan, Elza Meyer, Graham Power, Dion Forster, Stephen Johnson, Bennie Mostert with their programs such as Turn2God, Mighy Men Conference and Global Day of Prayer, are beginning to promote a strict moral and ethical code over the people of South Africa under the name of “Unashamedly Ethical, which I am sure will become a society soon enough.

The Genevan Society is actually a small scale model of what the Dominionists are currently doing to the whole world, and very successfully I might add.

Calvin’s idea was to enforce a new Christian moral code on the Geneva City.

Dominionists are currently doing the exact same.  They are enforcing an ethical code on mankind based on morals, values and principles,

A great emphasis is placed on man’s efforts, good works and the law – the right wing Christian calls it Revival, the left wing Religious calls its social transformation – revival of socialism.

Preterism and Dominionism originated from Roman Catholicism – The Preteristic Catholic church gives us the oldest Dominion Theology model.

Amillennialists believe that there will be no rapture.

Dominionists believe there will not be a rapture either.

Dominion Theology encompasses a special group of believers who will take control of the world.

These ‘special’ people are known as covenant people or overcomers (better known as ‘Joel’s Army’)

These chosen Dominionists see themselves as being elected/chosen by God to bring the world under the submission of the Church.

Calvinism believes in the same thing:  Unconditional Election or Predestination

In order for Dominionists to create their new Christian world, the people must be either coerced or lied too, into believing in this false Christianity.  Over time if you have not joined the movement you will be declared wicked and punished or purged from society

Calvinism believes in the same thing:   Total Hereditary Depravity

Amillennialists believe that there will be no anti-Christ in the future because he already showed himself in 70 A.D. which resulted in the destruction of Jerusalem – Satan is currently bound.  Therefore Revelation prophecy has already been fulfilled.

Amillennialists believe there is no coming tribulation as this too took place in 70 A.D.

[DTW note:  This is a very scary thought because if the anti-Christ has already been done and dusted back in 70 A.D then the current world should only expect Jesus Christ to return.  The world does not need to worry about an anti-Christ at all.  This is however completely false as masses of people will end up accepting the false Christ as being Jesus Christ the Son of God.]

The only project for Amillennialists/Dominionists is to reclaim the world for their Christ by preaching a gospel (does not matter what gospel as long as it mentions ‘Christ’).

And in doing so they will create a society of  people with similar interests, purposes, or passions that will dominate the world in order to create the Kingdom of God, a Heaven on Earth so that The Christ will return.  This is also called ‘God’s Plan or God’s Dream’.

Calvinism, Dominionism, Kingdom Now teaching, Replacement Theology, Latter Rain Manifest Sons of God teaching, Word of Faith, New Apostolic Reformation, Emerging Church Movement, Transformation, Reformation, etc, etc.  is all one and the same doctrine…

All these doctrines are can be classified under different things:

  • different names,
  • different terminology
  • different definitions
  • different interpretations of scripture
  • different eschatology
  • different theology
  • different ways of receiving the false spirit

The entire point is to make you think they are completely different doctrines when in fact they are all the same and each one of these movements will cause you to die spiritually if you don’t get out – they will ALL lead you back to Rome and to hell.

Please share:

Deborah (Discerning the World)

Deborah Ellish is the author of the above article. Discerning the World is an internet Christian Ministry based in Johannesburg South Africa. Tom Lessing and Deborah Ellish both own Discerning the World. For more information see the About this Website page below the comments section.

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Jim

Deborah – Appreciate the heads up on CS Lewis…did not know that.

Nay but, O man, who art thou that repliest against God? Shall the thing formed say to him that formed it, Why hast thou made me thus?

As you are aware the above is from Romans. I submit to you that because you can not cope with the bibles teaching on election you are the ‘thing’ twisting Scripture to fit your beliefs. What do you think God is teaching in the above verse? He is teaching what you have called elsewhere a ‘vile doctrine’. You mentioned Spurgeon had been a help to your Mother(?). He used the illustration of a railway line, where you stand between the tracks and they do not touch but in the distance they do. This applies to the offer of salvation to all men but the fact that only the predestined will be saved through Christ. Human logic will not join this us but faith will and sees the truths join in heaven. By the way Spurgeon was a staunch Calvinist & Ammillenialist.

I applaud all who stand up against false teaching. False teaching applies steering people away from the gospel of Christ. I agree that logically there is only one interpretation of Scripture, however two people can be saved but one can believe in election and the other in free will – same for eschatology.

I am not sure if you are misguided and believe what you are saying or simply enjoying the attention and so making provocative comments thus falling into the sin of pride.

Lastly Paul Washer, I have met him briefly and also have a friend at Heartcry. He is a man of God and preaches the true gospel of salvation alone through Christ. You have twisted his words greatly re meditation.

May I leave you with a simple question? As a professing Christian when was the last time you felt the presence of God and His peace, joy and love in your heart? When you were you last touched with an overwhelming sense of gratitude for His forgiveness of your sin?

Time is ticking, we fade like the grass and are soon gone then both of us have to face the Lord. Please pray to Him and ask him to guide you about this blog.

Christian love to all true believers that read this.

Jim

Tom Lessing (Discerning the World)

Jim wrote:

Nay but, O man, who art thou that repliest against God? Shall the thing formed say to him that formed it, Why hast thou made me thus

As you are aware the above is from Romans. I submit to you that because you can not cope with the bibles teaching on election you are the ‘thing’ twisting Scripture to fit your beliefs. What do you think God is teaching in the above verse? He is teaching what you have called elsewhere a ‘vile doctrine’. You mentioned Spurgeon had been a help to your Mother(?). He used the illustration of a railway line, where you stand between the tracks and they do not touch but in the distance they do. This applies to the offer of salvation to all men but the fact that only the predestined will be saved through Christ. Human logic will not join this us but faith will and sees the truths join in heaven. By the way Spurgeon was a staunch Calvinist & Ammillenialist.

Your brain seems to be stuck on Romans 9:20, as do all Calvinists’ brains. You should try reading some other verses in Scripture as well. It helps to get the full picture.

It is rather dangerous to liken salvation and other important doctrines in the Bible to a railway line with the two parallel spoors meeting in the distance to illustrate election. I assume you are married and have kids. Well, if not, I am sure you are already planning to get married and have kids. Whatever the case, the question is this. Would you prefer to use Surgeon’s insipid illustration to describe the most important doctrine in the Bible (salvation/redemption/regeneration/being born again/made alive) to them or would you rather use these following verses from Scripture – John 3:16, 1 John 2:2; Matthew 11:28-29, Revelation 22:17; John 4:13-14 (He did not say “whosoever is elelected; He said whosoever thirsts) to mention only a few? I suggest that you rather use these and other similar verses otherwise you may be guilty of the following indictment: “It were better for him that a millstone were hanged about his neck, and he cast into the sea, than that he should offend one of these little ones.” (Luke 17:2). I hope you understand why He used the sea as a metaphor? Let met tell you. The sea is used as a metaphor for the forgiveness of sins (Micah 7:19). So, that’s where everyone who tells little kids that salvation is like the two parallel tracks of a railway line that seems to meet in the distance but actually never meet ought to be cast into – into the sea where everyone’s sins are cast into.

Let’s get back to your kids. Let’s assume one of them turns out to be a serial killer and murders a multitude of women. I’m serious. I know a dear woman who is truly saved whose one son is in jail for life because he murdered many women. Are you going to say to him: “I wouldn’t worry too much, my son. God made you that way and He is sovereign, you know. He can do whatever He likes. We don’t have the right to say to Him, ‘why hast thou made me a murderer?’ He made you a murderer but we dare not blame Him because He did not make you to murder the women.” Jim, you don’t agree? Well, then you don’t have a clue what Calvinism is. Let me tell you. “God from all eternity, did, by the most wise and holy counsel of His own will, freely, and unchangeably ordain whatsoever comes to pass . . .”

Calvinism is indeed a vile doctrine and the sooner you renounce it and repent, the better – for your own and your kids’ sakes.

Referring to the pronouncement of this doctrine at the Synod of Dort, England’s King James of King James Bible fame, though he was no Arminiam, expressed his repugnance:

This doctrine is so horrible, that I am persuaded, if there were a council of unclean spirits assembled in hell, and their prince the devil were to [ask] their opinion about the most likely means of stirring up the hatred of men against God their Maker; nothing could be invented by them that would be more efficacious for this purpose, or that could put a greater affront upon God’s love for mankind than that infamous decree of the late Synod ….

Jim wrote:

May I leave you with a simple question? As a professing Christian when was the last time you felt the presence of God and His peace, joy and love in your heart? When you were you last touched with an overwhelming sense of gratitude for His forgiveness of your sin?

You can’t receive forgiveness from a false Jesus. That’s impossible. The Calvinist’s Jesus is not the Jesus of the Bible. Theirs is a false Jesus.

Jim

Deborah – after posting my article I then looked around the website and saw that you had already expressed your views on my points including Spurgeon ect. This would have changed my original post. After a challenging business meeting today I was driving back for an hour from London and pondering on matters in general. Having reflected on the numerous articles and no doubt hundreds(thousands?) of threads I found on the website which are diametrically opposed to what I believe the bible teaches I realised it would not be a wise use of time to enter into a debate which will achieve nothing for either of us. One sound bit of advice you dispense is that if you don’t like the website don’t come on here – which I will take. Would ask you to privately consider my last point in original post.

Thomas – If one of my children sadly took that path – why would I condone sin? At present I have counselled them to turn from their sin and trust in the Lord Jesus as that is the only way for salvation. The bible clearly teaches several truths. 1. Salvation alone through Christ. 2- God offers salvation to all. 3 – Only the elect will trust in him(obviously you disagree with this last one) However two people can be trusting in Christ but one can believe that this only happened because God elected him whilst the other can think it is all down to his free will. Also their experience may be similar – a hunger for forgiveness, following Christ – seeking him and finally through God’s grace trusting in Him. Yet, I repeat these two believers can disagree about the exact cause of the arrival at the cross. The main point is they arrived at the cross. This is not a false Jesus. If you believe election but believe your only hope before God is repentance and belief in Christ then according to the Bible you are saved.

Anyhow, this will be my last post for reasons stated. I can’t express this clearly but there is a harsh dark tone about these pages. Still God is sovereign and allows these things to happen for His own mysterious purposes. In the end the truth will be revealed by Him.

Jim

Tom Lessing (Discerning the World)

Jim wrote

Thomas – If one of my children sadly took that path – why would I condone sin? At present I have counselled them to turn from their sin and trust in the Lord Jesus as that is the only way for salvation. The bible clearly teaches several truths. 1. Salvation alone through Christ. 2- God offers salvation to all. 3 – Only the elect will trust in him(obviously you disagree with this last one) However two people can be trusting in Christ but one can believe that this only happened because God elected him whilst the other can think it is all down to his free will. Also their experience may be similar – a hunger for forgiveness, following Christ – seeking him and finally through God’s grace trusting in Him. Yet, I repeat these two believers can disagree about the exact cause of the arrival at the cross. The main point is they arrived at the cross. This is not a false Jesus. If you believe election but believe your only hope before God is repentance and belief in Christ then according to the Bible you are saved.

Anyhow, this will be my last post for reasons stated. I can’t express this clearly but there is a harsh dark tone about these pages. Still God is sovereign and allows these things to happen for His own mysterious purposes. In the end the truth will be revealed by Him.

The example I used with children was merely to illustrate the Calvinists’ view that God decreed everything precisely the way it happens. I did not say or suggest that you condone sin. Please read my comments correctly. But let’s get down to the nitty gritty of things and try to do away with vagueness. Would you mind answering the following questions?

1) Does God love all people savingly?
2) Did Jesus Christ die for all people?
3) Are sinners saved because, as a precondition for salvation, they believed in Jesus and his finished work on the cross or are they saved because they are the elect? Did God only elect some to salvation and chose to damn the rest because it pleases Him?
4) Is turning away from sin a prerequisite for salvation? How can someone who is as dead as a cadaver in sin and transgressions turn away from sin in order to be saved? Paul Washer says that man is as dead as a corpse in sin and transgressions. Can a corpse sin?

You say ” In the end the truth will be revealed by Him.” NO, He has already revealed the truth. The problem is that most people refuse to believe and accept his revealed truth.

Godissupernatural

I WILL MEDITATE IN CHRIST… IT’S BIBLICAL

1. “May my meditation be pleasing to him, as I rejoice in the Lord” Psalm 104:34
2. “Commune with your own heart upon your bed and be still.” Psalm 4:4
3. “The Kingdom of God is within you.” Luke 17:21
4. “The book of the law shall not depart from your mouth, but you shall meditate on it day and night.” Joshua 1:8

So can you explain how meditating on the word of God, what the meaning is, is false practice? Meditation is bringing you closer to God, this is not the same as meditation new agers do when they are trying to awake their chakras..we worship God by making him our priority as we do in prayer. This meditation is not to get to some “enlightened” place but to spend time with God, remembering and honoring Jesus Christ, and the holy spirit. This is not mysticism by any means…it is what God wants us to do. I will say, anyone that has been regenerated understands this concept. God is in our thoughts all day, we think about how underserving we are to be shown God’s grace and how the love of God is unexplainable.. Paul Washer will always be respected because he speaks the truth and people that know the word of God understand his message. If you know the WORD OF GOD you will never be lead astray. Sorry but I disagree with your article.

Tom Lessing (Discerning the World)

Godissupernatural wrote:

I WILL MEDITATE IN CHRIST… IT’S BIBLICAL

1. “May my meditation be pleasing to him, as I rejoice in the Lord” Psalm 104:34
2. “Commune with your own heart upon your bed and be still.” Psalm 4:4
3. “The Kingdom of God is within you.” Luke 17:21
4. “The book of the law shall not depart from your mouth, but you shall meditate on it day and night.” Joshua 1:8

So can you explain how meditating on the word of God, what the meaning is, is false practice? Meditation is bringing you closer to God, this is not the same as meditation new agers do when they are trying to awake their chakras..we worship God by making him our priority as we do in prayer. This meditation is not to get to some “enlightened” place but to spend time with God, remembering and honoring Jesus Christ, and the holy spirit. This is not mysticism by any means…it is what God wants us to do. I will say, anyone that has been regenerated understands this concept. God is in our thoughts all day, we think about how underserving we are to be shown God’s grace and how the love of God is unexplainable.. Paul Washer will always be respected because he speaks the truth and people that know the word of God understand his message. If you know the WORD OF GOD you will never be lead astray. Sorry but I disagree with your article.

Yes of course meditation is biblical but then it ought to be BIBLICAL and NOT MYSTICAL. The latter, also known as Contemplative Prayer and as you may know, aims to bring the mind into altered states of consciousness, is very dangerous. It opens you to demonic activity.

I appreciate your rejection of the New Age and Emergent types of meditative prayer, but ironically you believe the very same thing they do. You say “meditation is bringing you closer to God.” They say, “meditation brings into the presence of God.” That’s absurd because their is only one thing that brings believers closer and into the presence of God and that is the Blood of Jesus Christ (Hebrews 10:19; Ephesians 2:13). To say that meditation (either biblical or mystical) brings you closer and into the presence of God is pure blasphemy and idolatry. Indeed, it is the blood of Christ and his blood alone that brings you into his presence so that you may pray (meditate). The Bible says that believers are IN Christ and that He is IN them. How much closer do you want to get?

Godissupernatural wrote:

Paul Washer will always be respected because he speaks the truth and people that know the word of God understand his message. If you know the WORD OF GOD you will never be lead astray. Sorry but I disagree with your article.

I beg to differ. First of all, if you believe you will never be deceived because you know the WORD OF GOD, you are already deceived. Jesus never said: “Take heed that no man deceive you (Matthew 24:4), but don’t fret, if you know the WORD OF GOD no one will ever be able to deceive you.” The very fact that you believe Paul Washer speaks the truth, proves that you are not only deceived but heavily deceived. Paul’s Washer does NOT, I repeat does NOT preach the Gospel (Good News). He preaches another gospel that says Jesus only loves the elect and consequently only died for them. It is a lie of the devil and you say he speaks the truth? You must be kidding!

Woe unto them that call evil good, and good evil; that put darkness for light, and light for darkness; that put bitter for sweet, and sweet for bitter! (Isaiah 5:20)

Lo.

Even if it is our duty to detect false doctrine, it should not become our activity. Our duty is to be careful about what we believe! We must detect false doctrine, but if it makes us bitter, or full of hatred, it is not a good thing. You see, we are very competent to transform what is good in something bad.
Our first and most important duty is to love one another, in response to what Christ did. And he loved sinful people. Very sinful people, he died for false preachers to have eternal life, because he died for every one who believes in him. Isn’t that the good news?
Who are we to judge the servant of another? Let God judge his servants and preachers. As for us, let’s follow him and not let his blood be shed in vain for us. Let us be like Christ who served his apostles even if they did not understand much. Everyone will be held accountable for his own words and deeds, so let these preachers be judged by God only, please… I cry for you to do so and be filled with Christ’s love, patience and hope.
And let us remember that all the knowledge and truth we have has been given by God’s spirit, we have no credit for it. It all came by God’s grace and revelation and does not make us better than other people. We have discovered the truth, and that truth is Jesus. And if we have not yet understood everything, we should let Him teach us!
May God’s grace be unto you all,
Lo.

Tom Lessing (Discerning the World)

Lo,

May I ask, did you address your comment to Paul of Tarsus who wrote:

But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed. As we said before, so say I now again, If any man preach any other gospel unto you than that ye have received, let him be accursed. (Gal 1:8-9)

Or maybe you addressed it to Jude who said:

These are spots in your feasts of charity, when they feast with you, feeding themselves without fear: clouds they are without water, carried about of winds; trees whose fruit withereth, without fruit, twice dead, plucked up by the roots; Raging waves of the sea, foaming out their own shame; wandering stars, to whom is reserved the blackness of darkness for ever. (Jud 1:12-13)

Hopefully you know that they were addressing false teachers, prophets and apostles. Would you say they were being judgmental? And Lo, you may not realize this but you are judging us by assuming that we are being judgmental.

The following is real love.

Let him know, that he which converteth the sinner from the error of his way shall save a soul from death, and shall hide a multitude of sins. (Jas 5:20)

But, then again, you wouldn’t agree because you have a strange idea of what real love is.

Tom Lessing (Discerning the World)

Lo wrote:

And if we have not yet understood everything, we should let Him teach us!

Nope, you should allow the Holy Spirit to be your teacher.

Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come. (Joh 16:13)

Robbie

Lo. wrote:

Even if it is our duty to detect false doctrine, it should not become our activity. Our duty is to be careful about what we believe! We must detect false doctrine, but if it makes us bitter, or full of hatred, it is not a good thing. You see, we are very competent to transform what is good in something bad.

I was going to ask you to support your “opinion” Lo, but Thom nailed it.
The majority would probably agree with you. Decades ago the majority believed the earth was flat, Lo and behold, they were wrong.

Margie Rapley

Are you aware Paul Washer spoke at (Catholic) Holy Cross Monastery in Italy on 4/21/13? THE GOSPEL TO THE CENTER!

Appreciate your article above, and all the information. Very hard to find such info. Thank you, for the time you spent researching. Have shared.

MY NOTE: This is how Paul Washer has always struck me. He is a very pious individual and gives you the impression; that you are not living up to the holy standards Paul Washer has set down. He reminds me of a Catholic monk. And I say that with all kindness. When he preaches, you almost question your confidence in the Lord and his word; by his condemning self righteous approach to the gospel. What he believes in explains why he is that way. He is a five point Calvinist with an Anabaptist slant. Paul Washer by his ardent preaching must have a genuine love for God. However, it would be far better to read and study the Word of God for yourself; that you may know the confidence of the Lord. Than to listen to this man, who when you finish listening wonder if your even saved. Paul Washer, has a false PIETY. An exaggerated pious attitude. He also has a martyr complex, by how he speaks of people who don’t agree with him; and he has said it’s persecution. Where is the JOY of the Lord in all this PIETY he professes? It’s a sad state of affairs.

james

Margie Rapley wrote:

Are you aware Paul Washer spoke at (Catholic) Holy Cross Monastery in Italy on 4/21/13? THE GOSPEL TO THE CENTER!

Appreciate your article above, and all the information. Very hard to find such info. Thank you, for the time you spent researching. Have shared.

MY NOTE: This is how Paul Washer has always struck me. He is a very pious individual and gives you the impression; that you are not living up to the holy standards Paul Washer has set down. He reminds me of a Catholic monk. And I say that with all kindness. When he preaches, you almost question your confidence in the Lord and his word; by his condemning self righteous approach to the gospel. What he believes in explains why he is that way. He is a five point Calvinist with an Anabaptist slant. Paul Washer by his ardent preaching must have a genuine love for God. However, it would be far better to read and study the Word of God for yourself; that you may know the confidence of the Lord. Than to listen to this man, who when you finish listening wonder if your even saved. Paul Washer, has a false PIETY. An exaggerated pious attitude. He also has a martyr complex, by how he speaks of people who don’t agree with him; and he has said it’s persecution. Where is the JOY of the Lord in all this PIETY he professes? It’s a sad state of affairs.

james

Thank you Margie for expresssing your view on Pw sermons. I was for a time an avid listener but that pious and bitter taste you discribed left me with unanswered guestions. This website has been a blessing for me a babe in Christ. I am now beginning to discearn for myself the errors in calvinism! Thank you DTW for your good works here thats magnifying our Lord’s name by properly dividing the Word for brethren like me!!! May you stay strengthened with joyfulness by our Blessed Hope Jesus Christ of Nazareth!

jeff

Anyone read the word mellenial any where in the bible? Doesn’t it state and the saints with rule with Him for a thousand years?

My understanding of that would be like:

My dad who rules the household, but I get to rule the household WITH him for a month ie., he will always rule the household, but I get to rule with him for a month. I don’t like to take God’s omnimpotence from Him, but I would think Christ will rule forever and that ruling or judging with Him for a thousand years doesn’t mean He will rule for only 1000 years, but forever with us reigning with Him for a short time during His forever reign.

Tom Lessing (Discerning the World)

jeff,

The saints will reign with Jesus during his millennial Kingdom on earth after the seven years Tribulation has run its full course. (Revelation 20).

John Matthew

Deborah , sad to say, is willfully blind or not knowledgeable that “Calvinism’ so called is nothing more that the ‘old gospel’ before it became depurified by carnally minded people. Paul was contending against such things even in the bible itself. Just a little bit more knowledge would alleviate the problem. I saw a favorable reference to Spurgeon yet he was a Calvinist (The Prince of Preachers) and yet better, John Owen. Search on ‘The Death of death by The death of Christ” and read the Introductory material. Is man spiritually dead? Is all you have to know apart from being Given Resurrect Life? Yes or no. If yes, he is depraved. A ‘dead’ person cannot come to Christ…if we say so, we’ve just perverted the Cross and made God a liar. It’s that simple. If by one’s own self will they come to believe, it’s impossible to be true for ‘the carnal man is at Enmity with God”. To say otherwise is to say “I gave birth to myself — I am my own salvation’

Tom Lessing (Discerning the World)

Hi John,

I have one question for you. Were Abraham, Isaac and Jacob, and King David Calvinists?

Deborah (Discerning the World)

By the way, if anyone commented or quoted Spurgeon favorably it was not us, he was a false teacher aka Calvinist and a Clairvoyant. And who is John Owen? Never heard of him and not too sure I want to either.

Kris R

Paul Washer is a Jesuit…….. Yes

Robbie

Had a massive heart attack yesterday. Paul Washer is stable but in ICU.

robbie

How did I know we’d agree on something like that :-)

Peggy Jameson

I don’t expect or even want my comment to be posted. I only want to say that this entire site is pathetic. Especially the final comment on Paul Washer’s condition after his heart attack. Debbie, IF you are a true believer, I would be repenting right now. Don’t notify me of anything, and I won’t be rechecking this site for comments. …and no I didn’t already say that!! (regarding your terms and conditions comment)

Clarabelle

Hi Valerie

I have just found this (7 years late!), but the clip is no longer on You Tube. I have tried to find it, do you know where Leonard Ravenhill was when talking about Jeanne Guyon what he was talking on what year etc? Thanks.

Valerie wrote:

Deborah,
I found another piece of the puzzle with Paul Washer that might explain some of his terminology. He likes to quote Leonard Ravenhill a lot.
Watch this video clip, within the first few minutes Ravenhill heaps praise on Madame Jeanne Guyon, the famous French Mystic.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PgvaFErZFVY
Interesting huh?
We are so influence by those we listen to and most times don’t even realize where we’ve picked up these viruses.

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