The Dominionist Faith of Angus Buchan – Faith Like Potatoes

Angus buchan - Faith like Potatoes

The Dominionist Faith of Angus Buchan – Faith Like Potatoes

(ORIGINAL AND MOST UPDATED VERSION) It has taken me about 4 weeks to research Angus Buchan, author of ‘Faith like Potatoes’.  (This was last year 2008 when I wrote this, I had to delete my blog soon after writing this article because of threats – This article is back online now with a few updates). It’s been a long 4 weeks for me. I’ve read his website and newsletters and a book or two, and read over a hundred people say on blogs etc., that he preaches ‘repentance and Jesus Christ’. People are flocking from all over the country to attend his conferences, the two I will mention for now is the Mighty Men Conference in Greytown where 60,000 men pitched tent on a farm and Loftus Rugby Stadium in Pretoria where an approximate 71,000 people came to hear Angus Buchan speak.

When I saw the photo’s of the Mighty Men Conference I could not believe what I was seeing – it really did tug at my heart strings and my eyes welled up with tears. However the first thing that came to my mind was ‘Promise Keepers’ and the Holy Spirit telling me something is wrong.  Promise Keepers is a Masonic Word of Faith organisation that men and only men must come together and make a change for Christ. Then I received photos of Loftus and I had another heart tugging moment, but again the Holy Spirit said to me that something is not right. So off I went to research Angus Buchan. Boy was that only difficult – there is hardly any information about this man, except little excerpts on his ‘faith like potatoes’ book and movie. I put off my research for another day. Mainly because I truly wanted to believe that Angus Buchan is a genuine man of God, that he does preach true repentance and points to the Cross and Jesus Christ and NOT another gospel and another Jesus Christ. The tug on my heart strings had become a spiritual tug o’ war instead. I was reminded over and over again of what the Word of God says about the last days.

Loftus Versveld Stadium (71,000 people)

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Mighty Men Conference 2008 (60,000 thousand men)

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Absa Stadium 2008   (40,000+ people)

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I took this photo – it started to rain

Mighty Men Conference 2009  (200,000 + men showed up this year)

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Blowing of the Shofar – Hebrew Roots movement

This is going to be a very long article, please read the whole thing, then I urge you to go to your Bible and search the scriptures, study the Word of God and find yourself approved –

2 Timothy 2:15:15 Be diligent to present yourself approved to God as a workman who does not need to be ashamed, accurately handling the word of truth.”

Let those who love the truth hear the truth through the indwelling of the Holy Spirit in your life.

First things first, before I get into anything else, I want to address the matter of Revival for this is the crux of Angus Buchan  teachings.

Angus Buchan mentions revival many times:

  1. “Indeed we are living in a time of revival!” [1]
  2. “We are not praying for revival anymore, we believe that we are in revival!” [2]
  3. “My dear friends, we are in REVIVAL at the moment!” “and to ask Him to bring revival to our beloved Southern Africa.” [3]
  4. “We know that we are in revival now.” [4]
  5. “The good news is revival is here and we are part of this” [5]
  6. “We are really living in revival!” “God move in awesome miraculous ways in revival time” “Well I want to tell you that you are the revival” [6]
  7. “…and really trusting God for revival in their area” [7]
  8. “We know once again that we are in revival in South Africa!”  ” We are seeing revival in South Africa” [8]

Angus Buchan mentions many times that we are indeed living in the end times:

  1. “Even as we see things culminating, we believe that we are living in the last days. I know that we have said that for some time, but we can see that all the signs are there now and it is very exciting, because the Bible says that if Christ be for us, who can stand against us. Rom.8:31 [2]
  2. “I believe that we are in the last days and God is rallying His troops for the last battle.” [3]
  3. “The Lord has prompted me to share His intentions for His men in these last days” [5]

So we can clearly see that Angus Buchan believes wholeheartedly that we are in revival and he believes that were are clearly living in the last days as well. Is there anything out of the ordinary with his thinking?  Well…yes! I say yes because in the Word of God, Jesus spoke of the last days and gave us many warnings as to what is going to transpire. And it’s not all faith like potatoes. Jesus said there will be many false prophets rising up, deceiving many, leading many astray to a false gospel and a false Christ. Jesus warned us of three things: False Christ’s, false prophets and false signs and wonders.

Matthew 24:3-6  3 As He was sitting on the Mount of Olives, the disciples came to Him privately, saying, “Tell us, when will these things happen, and what will be the sign of Your coming, and of the end of the age?” 4 And Jesus answered and said to them, “See to it that no one misleads you. 5 For many will come in My name, saying, ‘I am the Christ,’ and will mislead many. 6 “You will be hearing of wars and rumors of wars. See that you are not frightened, for those things must take place, but that is not yet the end.”

  • Note: ‘I am the Christ’  or “Christed”, the word Christ means anointed (one)“.

2 Thessalonians 2:3  Let no one in any way deceive you, for it will not come unless the apostasy comes first, and the man of lawlessness is revealed, the son of destruction.”

  • Note: So first before the man of lawlessness is revealed we as Christians will face an apostasy, a great falling away from genuine faith in Jesus Christ to another Gospel that appears to be biblical but is not – hence the words, deceive and deception. It comes packaged in a nice pretty big box with a big ribbon on top, but inside lurks something sinister – you are being conditioned to accept the anti-Christ.

1 Timothy 4:1  1 But the Spirit explicitly says that in later times some will fall away from the faith, paying attention to deceitful spirits and doctrines of demons,

  • Note: Deception is just that, deception; it means you won’t be able to tell the wood from the trees UNLESS you adhere to the truth in the Bible. Anyone who says they are can’t be deceived is already deceived. People will listen to and follow men who preach a gospel that sounds so Biblical but yet at the same time their gospel is deceitful, and who is the greatest deceiver? Satan, the father of lies.

2 Timothy 3: 1,12-13  1 But realize this, that in the last days difficult times will come. … 12 Indeed, all who desire to live godly in Christ Jesus will be persecuted. [Adhere to the Word of God] 13 But evil men and impostors will proceed from bad to worse, deceiving and being deceived.

  • Note: Day by day, week by week, year by year, the deception will get worse and worse. We are truly in the last days. South Africa has been very sheltered from the deception that has wrought American Christianity. I would say that 90% of South Africa has no clue as to what has been going on, yet at the same time we have been subtly introduced to false teachers over the years and the Christian book stores (CUM bookstores) are filled to the brim with books and DVDs that preach another gospel and point to another Jesus. We have been deceived and we didn’t even know it. We have been deceived because we just take for granted that what we are being taught is correct without TESTING to see if it’s true. We have slowly but surely over the years been manipulated to accept ear tickling sermons and books by well known preachers that sound Biblical but yet contains a poisonous stream of unsound teachings. This poisonous stream that has infiltrated the true Gospel of Jesus Christ is growing larger and larger each year, in so much that it’s now a strong flowing river, drowning out the true Gospel of Jesus Christ.

Luke 17:20-21  “Being asked by the Pharisees when the kingdom of God would come, he answered them, “The kingdom of God is not coming with signs to be observed, nor will they say, “Look, here it is! or There!”  for behold, the kingdom of God is in the midst of you.”

  • This poison is as follows: Revival in the end times accompanied with signs and wonders (healings, signs in the sky etc, transferable anointings, contemplative prayer, angels, restoring of Apostles and Prophets (5 fold ministry) and the acceptance of extra Biblical revelation or new prophecy that does not come from the bible etc. They preach repentance and Jesus Christ and speak of His Blood, but the repentance is not true repentance and the Christ they speak of is not Jesus Christ for they do not adhere to the whole Truth.   Isaiah 8 v 20: “To the law and to the testimony if they do not speak according to this word, it is because there is no light in them.”
  • We do not have to establish a Kingdom of God on this earth through revival or try usher in the Kingdom of God on this earth through ‘revival’ because the Kingdom of God is already among us. It’s Jesus Christ!! Anyone who is attempting to usher in the Kingdom of God in the last days denies the fact that Jesus Christ is the ‘Kingdom of God’ and He is already here, in the Written Word of God (Bible) for Jesus Christ is the Word.    John 1 v 1; “1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

2 Thessalonians 2:9-11  “9  that is, the one whose coming is in accord with the activity of Satan, with all power and signs and false wonders, 10 and with all the deception of wickedness for those who perish, because they did not receive the love of the truth so as to be saved. 11 For this reason God will send upon them a deluding influence so that they will believe what is false.”

  • Note: The warning from God for the last days is very clear – love the Truth, the Word of God and you will not succumb to deception.
  • The last days are riddled with signs and wonders that encompass healing and people supposedly raised from the dead etc. But when these ministers are asked for verifiable proof of these wondrous things that have taken place they can’t provide a single bit of solid evidence. Some of them are brazen enough to have videos on their websites showing healings that have taken place – the blind see, pain is removed, cancer cured, etc. Yet no contact details are provided for the people who were healed so that we, you or anyone else can follow-up to see if they were genuinely healed or if it was it just psychological (they thought they were but turned out later they were not), has the sickness come back, what has happened to them since? Did they receive another illness in its place, or worse – what has happened to their spiritual lives; are they now finding themselves diving head first into greater deceptive doctrines because their healing was in exchange for something far worse, a demonic affliction? Of course Satan can heal – he is not dividing his kingdom if he takes away an illness and gives you something worse instead – something that will cause you to follow him instead of Jesus Christ.
  • So what’s it going to be? Illness or a good chance of losing your salvation? Which one would you rather have? No one likes to be sick, we all know this. But guess who also knows this…yes, Satan. Sickness is one of his greatest playing cards. He knows most people will accept ‘almost’ anything to be free from illness.

I will speak more on healings a little bit later in this article as healings seem to play a part in Angus Buchan ministry, but for now I want to get back to Angus Buchan and some other things he has said.

Angus Buchan, huge crowds and signs in the sky

So, what is it about Angus Buchan and his ‘ability’ to draw such huge crowds? What is it that Angus Buchan actually preaches? Why is there very little information about what he really preaches – everyone has to go on ‘hear say’.  For instance, “someone told me that he preaches repentance and Jesus Christ” or, “I heard from someone that a sign appeared above one of his gatherings which was witnessed by thousands of people – A heart shaped 3D cloud formed in a relatively clear blue sky – only God would do that, therefore Angus Buchan is truly a man of God.”  Stop…say that again? A sign appeared in the sky of a heart shaped cloud and this now validates that he is truly a man of God? Did I say stop? Yes I did. Stop and listen South Africa – listen and understand what the Word of God says to a generation who seeks after signs and wonders.

Matthew 12:39   3 But he [Jesus] answered and said unto them, An evil and adulterous generation seeketh after a sign…

So off I went to research again, here is what Angus Buchan had to say in a newsletter:

“Greetings, in Jesus’s precious name. I have recently returned from the Izak Steyl Stadium in Vanderbijlpark. I really want to thank God for Jurie Cilliers and his team (too many to mention), who did an outstanding job in organising this meeting. We saw 35,000+ men, women and children come to the stadium, starting at 11am. When I started speaking at 4pm, the place was absolutely pregnant with the presence of the Holy Spirit. I just thank God for what He did. We even had a sign! The people were pointing into the sky while I was preaching and I thought maybe a microlight had flown past, but there was a heart-shaped cloud in the sky above the stadium – awesome confirmation, again, from our precious Saviour that He was there in our midst![Emphasis added]

 width=Angus Buchan said, again?   I’ll get back that that one in a moment. Anyhow Angus Buchan says, ‘Awesome confirmation’ – actually no Angus, for Jesus says,

2 Thessalonians 2:9  “…the one whose coming is in accord with the activity of Satan, with all power and signs and false wonders…

So we can clearly see that a sign is not confirmation that it comes from God for Satan can make a heart shaped cloud as well.

How do we then tell ‘who’ made the sign appear.

Well we need to examine the words of the man Angus Buchan to see if what he says lines up with the Word of God – if it contradicts, then we know that the sign was not from God – for God will never give a sign to endorse words spoken that contradict His Word.  Angus Buchan says something interesting though, in one of his newsletters he says;  “May the Lord bless you as you continue to walk by faith and not by sight.” [5] (Emphasis added)

So why did you say what you said above Angus, that the sign in the sky was an ‘awesome confirmation’ when we walk by faith and not by sight? Is it because this is actually what you believe: signs and wonders?

But that was not the first sign, (hence the ‘again’ in Angus Buchan ‘s comment above) another one appeared over the Mighty Men Conference in April 2007…here is what Angus Says, “

 width=“I was recently sent a photograph taken at the Mighty Men Conference that we held at Shalom in April 2007, which shows a white light coming down out of a dark sky, descending upon and spreading out over the tent. I can only describe it as looking like hot butter melting and spreading over the tent.

I have not yet personally met Bruno, the man who took the photograph; he comes from Phalaborwa, a town in the northern part of South Africa. He wept when he first saw the photograph and he was reluctant to send it to me because he wasn’t sure what my reaction would be. I choose to believe it was the Glory of God over the tent, which was full to capacity., numbering seven thousand men. We had been speaking about the Light of God, about the Glory of God’s presence at that time”– Angus Buchan [10] (Emphasis added)

That’s odd; the man in Phalaborwa was reluctant to send him the photo because he was not sure what Angus Buchan ‘s reaction would be? What was this man worried about? What was he expecting Angus Buchan to say;  ‘Do not follow signs and wonders for they do not validate my ministry, for the Word of God spoken in truth is what validates that what I am preaching is of God?’  Nope! When Angus Buchan does see the photo, “he chooses to believe” it was the Glory of God over the tent for they had been speaking about the ‘Light of God’. Wow! He chooses to believe? No testing the spirits as per 1 John, just believe. So again Angus Buchan comment above that says “May the Lord bless you as you continue to walk by faith and not by sight contradicts what Angus Buchan actually believes. He expects signs and wonders to follow him where ever he goes and will never denounce them. And by printing this in his book, ‘A Mustard Seed – A Daily Devotional’, he is telling you just that, that we need to trust him, because signs and wonders accompany his teachings, therefore he is a ‘man of God’.

Dominionism / Kingdom Now theology

As per above, AngusBuchan speaks of revivalin the last days, where the Word of God says the opposite. Who do we believe? The lie of revival in the last days that will lead millions astray to false doctrine, or the Word of God that says you must hold fast to His Word and the Truth pray because things are going to get bad, really bad in the end times. And the only hope we have is to rely on Him no matter how bad it gets.

The faith that Angus Buchan speaks of is an ear tickling faith of Dominionism or Kingdom Now theology – “take South Africa back for God so that Christ can return to a world that eagerly awaits Him.”  Angus Buchan doctrine states that, God wants you to be happy, He wants you to be healthy, He wants you to prosper, He wants you to have a wonderful future.  Nope, I’m sorry Angus; God never promised us any of this.

Jesus said in Matthew 10:22  “And ye shall be hated of all men for my name’s sake: but he that endureth to the end shall be saved.” and

2 Timothy 3:12 “Yea, and all that will live godly in Christ Jesus shall suffer persecution.” and

John 16:33 ” These things I have spoken unto you, that in me ye might have peace. In the world ye shall have tribulation: but be of good cheer; I have overcome the world. “

Being hated does not bring happiness or prosperity or allow us to take dominion of the world in preparation for Christs’s return.  What happiness does God promise us? That we will have peace and be of good cheer because we are saved by the blood of the Lamb and Jesus Christ gives us the strength, Jesus gives us the strength to carry on while we live in a world of evil, no matter if we end up in jail for preaching the Gospel or being martyred because we refuse to follow another god.

Angus Buchan says,  “However, things are getting so critical now, that everything else seems to be fading into insignificance when it come to talking about eternal issues, things like a man’s soul, his family, his marriage, his business and his future, not to mention his nation” [1]

Since when does family, marriage, your business, your future (while you are still alive) and this nation fall into the same critical category of individual salvation? When you die you can’t take your family, business or your money and your country you live and love so much in with you – it’s gone!

Angus Buchan says, “I would really encourage you to continue to let your expectation for your life, for your family, for your country, for your vision, to come only from God.” [4]

Confused Faith

Faith is not what God can do for you, but what you can do for Him! It’s about preaching the true gospel of Jesus Christ.  Your salvation and the salvation of those around you is the only thing on this earth we need to worry about! real repentance of sin, accepting Jesus Christ as your Saviour that He died on the cross and shed His Blood so that you may be saved, the baptism of the Holy Spirit (and that does not mean speaking in tongues or having someone lay hands on you to receive the Holy Spirit), striving to live a holy life through the conviction of sin in your life by the Holy Spirit that when you do sin you repent.

Angus Buchan says, ” It is only the faithful that will overcome Rom.1:17 ‘The just (righteous) will live by faith’. As we see trouble brewing up in every area, politically, financially, morally, we know that we will succeed as the children of promise. [5]  (Emphasis added)

Hebrew Roots Movement: 

Another error;  They attribute promises to Israel to the church. The church is not Israel and Israel is not the church. The only promise we have as spiritual children of Abraham is that of salvation (Galatians 3:11).  Angus Buchan’s ministry is called Shalom Ministries and has a Tabernacle on his premises

“…We will be staging it open air because we are concerned about the seating capacity in the tabernacle [at Shalom Ministries]” [5]

Angus Buchan has an infatuation with Israel, like all Pentecostal/Charismatics/New Apostolic’s do. And once again the faith he preaches is in order to ‘get something’: success politically, financially, morally etc   [Note: Dominionist’s like to substitute the word ‘morals’ with ‘Kingdom Values’]

A few months ago I bought a book by C. Peter Wagner called, “Dominion! How Kingdom Action Can Change the World”.  He says;

“Christians understand that their Kingdom values should penetrate all spheres of their personal lives, their families, their businesses, their political lives and the rest” [9]  (Emphasis added)

Sound familiar to what Angus Buchan says?   Hmmm, familiar is not really the word, more like identical.  These spheres are actually called the 7 Mountains of culture by the New Apostolic Reformation.  These 7 mountains are the areas of the world they need to take control of in order to rule the world:  business, government, media, arts and entertainment, education, the family and religion.

As per C. Peter Wagner and his agents:  Rick Joyner, John Arnott,  Cindy Jacob’s, etc., they are trying to build an army of Christians (taken from a horrendous misinterpretation of Joel 2 – also called Joel’s army) who are going to take the earth back for Christ. Now most of these preachers in America who follow this idea of thinking, stem from The Vineyard Christian Fellowship who started the Toronto Blessing etc, and then came Lakeland with Todd Bentley.

Dominionism and the Roman Catholic Church

I have read a lot of South African websites that seem to preach the idea of this generation being something special and promote the raising up of army of Christians that will be mighty for God (based on Joel 2) – The youth are their greatest focus for they are the least discerning.  And parents are just happy to know their kids are going to church, but don’t realise they are being indoctrinated into a very unbiblical and scary doctrine of Dominionism.

When I email the owners/pastors of these sites to find out if they believe in Kingdom Now teaching or Restoration teaching most of them say no, some of them say “not all”, that they don’t like those American preachers because most of them are heretical nuts and money grabbers but when questioned most allude to this: they say they have received a vision or prophecy from ‘God’ or someone that prophesied dover them that says the same thing that the heretical nuts and money grabbers are saying. Now we have to ask, what’s wrong with this picture? How can people who proclaim to be true Christians get visions/prophecies that are exactly the same as the people who proclaim New Age teachings?

So I need to pose this question to Angus, why are you promoting Revival based on Latter Rain / Dominionist / Kingdom Now Theology that people who delve into occult teachings have had visions of too, and are trying to do the exact same thing you are? Better yet, why are you teaching a doctrine that falls in line with the plan of the Roman Catholic Church – they too are currently taking dominion of the earth, bringing all Christian denominations under the wings of the RCC mother church in expectation of the returning Christ.  They call themselves Christians and you do too, so who do we believe to be correct? Difficult question to answer Angus, since you both believe the exact same thing!

After doing a bit more research with regards to some of the other ministers who accompany Angus Buchan on some of his conferences I found the name Bennie Mostert. In March this year Angus Buchan and Bennie Mostert and a few others held a conference called the Daniel Conference at the NG Church in Morelatapark in Pretoria:

“Die Daniêlkonferensie vind plaas van 14 tot 16 Maart 2008 by NG Gemeente Moreletapark se Woodlandssentrum in Pretoria. Die sprekers is Angus Buchan, drs. Johan Smith en Bennie Mostert en di. Elza Meyer en Willem Badenhorst.” [11]   [Emphasis added]

So who is Bennie Mostert? And why I am bothering to mention his name? Well, because he confirms that Angus Buchan follows Dominionist teachings and has ties to either C. Peter Wagner and his associates.

The roll of NUPSA in South Africa

by Prof Johan Malan

“An organization promoting the cause of this strange spiritual warfare in South Africa is NUPSA- Network For United Prayer in Southern Africa, with Dr. Bennie Mostert as chairman. He is a supporter of Peter Wagner’s spiritual warfare methods, promotes Wagner’s books and is affiliated to Wagner’s World Prayer Centre. He also has great admiration for George Otis and his Transformations video.

NUPSA has also become involved with the teachings of the ministry of Cleansing Stream. This comprises the new approach of spiritual warfare, but predominantly on a personal level. The principles are the same – the blame for problems are shifted from an individual to the devil and his demons that must consequently be exorcised – even from Christians! Spiritual problems are therefore not traced back to the flesh (the old sinful nature) with its passions and desires, but transferred to the devil and his demons.

Cleansing Stream found its way from America to us. Among the leading people in this ministry is Jack Hayford and Dr. Scott Bauer from The Church on the Way, and Joy Dawson of YWAM. It is claimed that the Lord will clean his church with wonders of healing and deliverance that will destroy the works of the devil. The view of Cleansing Stream is that salvation is not enough to cleanse people from demonic bindings and that other steps are required for full deliverance. They base this theory on the threefold nature of man –  spirit, soul and body. According to them, only your spirit is made free at salvation; consequently demons may still hide themselves in your soul or body. You are then in need of spiritual warfare for full deliverance. According to them, you may also inherit demonic bonds, or curses, from your ancestors.

Of course, people helped by this ministry give wonderful testimonies. This is however not a valid argument to justify their ministry biblically. There are people making the same claims with regard to the blessings allegedly received from participation in the Toronto phenomenon or the Alpha course. In 2 Thessalonians 2:11 we read: “And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie.” That is indeed the case.

Lesson nr. 9 from Cleansing Stream teaches intercessory warfare. This includes the discovery and identification of demons with the aid of “power encounters and spiritual mapping techniques, followed by exorcising them from the people (including Christians), buildings, and even whole cities and nations.” If this technique is so efficient, why does it need to be done repeatedly?

This ministry also promotes Word of Faith teachings by suggesting that there is power in our words: “Power is released through our tongue… every word that comes from my mouth is either a blessing or a curse.” Under the heading “Words” they say:” We can learn how the mouth of the prophet [that’s you] delivers him or herself.” This is a self-redemption teaching.

NUPSA uses the error of Cleansing Stream for their approach to small groups. They are working on national strategies for the spiritual cleansing of the country and to organize worship-marches to neighbouring countries.” [12]

When I attended the Absa Stadium in 2008 when Angus Buchan spoke I managed to speak to some of the spiritual warfare intercessors that were there.  They told me that before Angus Buchan or anyone else for that matter could speak they needed to cleanse the area of all demonic forces so that Angus ‘smessage would be well received by the audience and not be hindered by demonic entities blocking his message.  They said they walked around the stadium 8 times and did some other mumbo jumbo to ward off evil.   This is totally unscriptural.  No where in the bible did the Disciples run off and prepare the place for Jesus Christ to go and speak at with spiritual warfare.  Please, would someone find me a verse in the bible where the disciples walked around the grounds 8 times waving their little Jesus flags and packaged soil into a bag to spiritually ‘lay claim to the ground and make it holy’.  This is occult people.

New Apostolic Reformation

C. Peter Wagner commissioned Todd Bentley (proven false prophet and heretic) and supported him wholeheartedly during the Lakeland Revival. Todd Bentley who ran the Lakeland Revival (Fresh Fire Ministries) in Florida from April to July 2008 was raised up by the New Apostolic Reformation (NAR) who consists of (amongst others): C. Peter Wagner, Rick Joyner (a confessed Knight of Malta Templar aka Freemason), Patricia King, Bob Jones, Paul Cain, Che Ahn, Lou Engle, Bill Johnson, Cal Pierce, Cindy Jacobs, Rodney Howard-Browne (founder of holy laughter movement), Kim Clement, Wendy and Rory Alec (owners of God TV), Jan and Jan (Trinity Broadcasting Network, TBN) , John Arnott, John Wimber, and pretty much everyone who thinks the Elijah List and it’s owner Steve Shultz are promoting biblical teachings when in fact they are nothing more than occultists/New Ager’s disguised as Christians.

Todd Bentley has been proved false over and over and over again, and exposed for being a liar, false prophet and charlatan – he departed from Lakeland shortly after being exposed by ABC nightline in July 2008 for running a money making racket also known as a healing ministry, except there were no genuine healings. Yet even after all this, C. Peter Wagner got on stage with Todd Bentley and a host of other liars and commissioned him by prophesying and decreeing over him verses in the bible that were meant for Jesus Christ only. The blasphemy that has taken place by the hands of these people is beyond comprehension, but still they preach and teach away to the undiscerning millions upon millions of people who are falling for it – are you one of them?

Winds in all directions

One of the biggest catch phrases (at the moment) of those who promote this diabolical teaching is, ‘Winds of Change/New Beginnings/New Wineskin’. They believe that God is moving in a new way, a new direction, change is coming, there is a new wine skin and that there are ‘winds of change’ blowing over the world,  i.e., revival.

“The winds of the Holy Spirit are coming, the winds of the Kingdom of God are coming, and the winds of change are coming to cities and nations around the world.” ….

“This is the day of outpouring, this is the day of revival, and this is the beginning days of revival and revivals. This revival is a fountainhead of revivals, is revival that prepares the way for other revivals to follow. This revival is a foundation of other revivals that come, the day has come that we will go from glory to glory, revival to revival and there will never be a moment without revival.”

“This is revival of divine healing, a revival of signs and wonders; this is a revival of anointing, and this is a revival of the power of God.”

“Restoration of signs and wonders has begun; the church will be covered with signs and wonders. This is a revival of anointing that church will be covered with rivers of the anointing. This revival is a restoration of revival!”

“What will follow this revival will be holiness and unity. Holiness will come by grace and of the heart, and unity of love, and unity of relationship will come.” [13] (Emphasis added)

[Note:  UnityALL religions/faiths uniting, joining hands under a false Christ – Unity in Diversity]

This is what Angus Buchan has to say in his 7 July Newsletter:

“Lord Jesus, how can we not believe in You? How can we doubt that you have caused winds of revival and repentance to blow over the whole of our country?” (Emphasis added)

The message preached today is all about what God can do for you, your family, your business, your nation, your health etc. It’s a direct attack on the true gospel of Jesus Christ. The sermons of old, most find unacceptable now-a-days because the ‘hell fire and brimstone’ sermons are just so not cool anymore, and we really don’t want to hear about the sin in our lives.  No we prefer the sermon where we only hear good, happy, positive things being preached, none of this negative stuff.  God will look after you and bless your little heart till it’s content no matter how sinful you are – and the crowd goes wild – AMENNNNNN they shout out.

Well I am sorry people, SIN is what drives a big thick wedge between you and God.  And the more you sin the wider the gap gets, and Satan rejoices. And I am not even talking about unbelievers here, I am taking about Christians. And if you don’t truly repent of your own individual sin through Jesus Christ, by getting on your knees in the privacy of your own bedroom then yes the day will come when you will find yourself standing before God and He says, ‘I don’t know you’!  (Matthew 7:22) .  We don’t like to hear this because it offends our minds and hearts, so we rather pack our pick nick baskets and go listen to someone who will tell us happy, pleasant things like how we can make our business more successful, our home life better just by having ‘faith and hope’ and if you have enough faith God will reward you with pleasantries in this life: health and wealth, and oh yes – you will take dominion of South Africa, make it a Christian country – all denominations in unity.

Hope and Faith

Oddly enough you can get similar results in your business or you home by attending motivational speaking conferences hosted by unbelievers. They speak of hope and faith too, either with the mention of a god (whichever one you follow) or they don’t mention one at all. When you walk out there you feel like you too can go climb Mt. Everest, anything seems possible. It’s called psychology and Angus Buchan  knows how to talk the talk, just like Joyce Meyer. Its psychology mixed with Biblical scripture or as I call it, ‘Biblical psychology’ also known as a load of hogwash that detracts one from the truth of the Bible.

Angus Buchan seems to have this thing for group repentance and repenting on behalf of others at his gatherings where it’s more of an emotional extravaganza than anything else. Being in the presence of thousands of people is very emotional and leads one to a false sense of faith, hope and repentance.  “Everyone close your eyes, lift your hands and say after me…”  is NOT true repentance. I was going to quote quite a few more of his ‘group repentance’ comments, but Shalom Ministries has update their website to a new website and 90% of what I have quoted above and what I was going to use has been removed, never the less the quote below is on his new website – you will have to create a login account to see it:

“I was so excited to see close on 100 first time commitments and literally the whole crowd repented before God and made a re commitment to Jesus.” [15] [Emphasis added]

UPDATED 2016: On Gateway news it talks of Sacred Assembly – a historic gathering of 50 000 Christians at the FNB Stadium, Soweto, November 19 2016 where Angus Buchan attended, it says regarding repentance, “We respect the government, because God put them in place, but we have come here to intercede and repent on behalf of the country, which is no longer walking in God’s ways.” (Emphasis added)

How on earth can you repent of someone else’s sin? One of the biggest concerns for me and many others is the ‘argument’ that is going around that, ‘many people, thousands of people are coming to Jesus because of Angus ‘s teachings – therefore what he is preaching is of God.”  The same argument was used for Todd Bentley’s revivals as well, that many were being ‘saved’ in Lakeland – yet the message Todd preached was laced in occult teaching about angels, portals, opening gates, opening the heavens, glory, false prophecies, etc. It’s all about the fruit I am told, if the fruit appears to look good then surely it must be good. Wrong.

Jesus said, in Matthew 7:16-20   16You will know them by their fruits. Grapes are not gathered from thorn bushes nor figs from thistles, are they? 17 “So every good tree bears good fruit, but the bad tree bears bad fruit. 18 “A good tree cannot produce bad fruit, nor can a bad tree produce good fruit. 19Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire. 20 “So then, you will know them by their fruits.”

It also says in Matthew 3:8  Therefore bear fruit in keeping with repentance…”

In other words, if the message preached by Angus Buchan or another other preacher contradicts the Word of God then the fruit that follows, the signs and wonders that follow can notbe from God – the fruit that is produced is bad fruit from a thorn tree. Looks good on the outside but rotten in the inside.  The same applies to those supposedly saved at these revivals. If the message preached is one that will lead you to accept a false Christ though Christian unity no matter what your faith, then by who’s name are these people being saved? It’s certainly not the true Jesus Christ of the Bible. It’s a false salvation.  And might I add that yes some people will find genuine salvation at these meetings for they seek the truth, that is Jesus Christ, their hearts are genuinely in the right place and when they repent of their sins they actually mean it ad they go home and change their ways.  And you will find when the they are born again the Holy Spirit will open their eyes to the false teaching that surrounds them.   But 95% of people will just follow, follow anything that sounds good, they will follow the false Christ that is presented to them for they do not care for the truth – their hearts are not really seeking Jesus Christ the Son of God, they seek worldly happiness and worldly wealth instead. They will go home and appear to be a changed man for few months to a year maybe more and then back to their old self they return.

Christian Unity

It’s all about Christian unity. Unite as Christians (no matter what you believe; be it Roman Catholic, Anglican, Latter Day Saints or Church of God (a branch off sect from 7th Day Adventists or even a Spiritualist) – (see 2nd snapshot below, then see last ‘church’ on the list). Just have faith and hope and ‘God’ will do wonderful things in this country and the rest of the world. You can witness the Christian unity first hand on Angus Buchan’s new website by going to sign up; there is a drop down list of churches of which you need to pick the one you belong too. The list is enormous. I have made snapshots of the drop down list so that it is cast in stone for all too see.

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SNAPSHOT 1 

 width=SNAPSHOT 2

Click here to see all the ‘Church’s’ one can select on Angus’ list. (Spiritualists, Mormons (Latter Day Saints) and British/Anglo Israelites for example are included in the list)

Unity in Diversity

So as we can see, it does not matter what church you attend, what unscriptural doctrine your church follows, just as long as we all unite under the ‘Christ’ that is being presented to the world today. The Roman Catholics call it the Eucharist Christ and they have an ‘Evangelization program’ that TBN has bought into lock, stock and barrel – In fact TBN is Roman Catholic.  New Agers are awaiting their ‘Christ’ and are accepting the so called Christian revivals with open arms for it aligns to their beliefs as well. Buddhists await their ‘Christ’ and there is an astounding number of Christian Buddhists who have even been baptised in Christ’s name. Muslims are awaiting their ‘Christ’ too as more and more Muslims accept Roman Catholicism because the Virgin Mary is mentioned no less than 36 times in the Koran.  Muslims revere Mary.  Hindu’s await their ‘Christ’ as well, and we all know that Hindu’s will worship just about anything that comes in the form of a statue which includes the Mary The Blessed Mother of God.

These people I mentioned above (C Peter Wagner, John Wimber, et al.) belong to the New Apostolic Reformation (NAR) and so does Angus Buchan. The New Apostolic Reformation is also a part of an Ecumenical (or Emergent Church)  message that is New Age. – The NAR are just more sneakier and use terminology that is less Ecumenical. But there are Ecumenical tell tale signs within the Angus Buchan  camp, as you will see below.

Angus Buchan recently went to Ireland and preached to Protestants and Roman Catholics:

“This Sunday I will be in Durban and next week I go to Belfast, Northern Ireland to preach to the Protestants and the Roman Catholics and the whosoevers.” [3]

“We saw many healings, salvations and re-commitments and a stirring in the hearts of the Irish people.” … [16]

“At our meetings we had Catholics and Protestants together, surrendering their lives to Jesus Christ. It was a wonderful time of reconciliation.” [16]    (Emphasis added)

Re-commitments? To what? How can a Roman Catholic re-commit to Jesus Christ? I am sure the Pope is jumping with joy at this – a reconciliation of all faiths to one Christ. So we now have Protestants and Catholics accepting a false Christ or re-committing to their false Christ, going back to their respective churches, never denouncing their heretical beliefs that go against the Word of God and repenting and thinking themselves ‘saved’. Great, I feel so much more at ease now.

Everything is ’emerging’:  Roman Catholics, Hindus, Buddhists, Islam and Christians

God TV and TBN:

Angus Buchan  is promoted heavily by God TV and TBN- the two biggest promoters of false prophets, liars, charlatans and blasphemers on this earth. Wendy Alec owner of God TV prophesied that Jesus was going to physically show up on Todd Bentley’s stage on the 8th June 2008 – of course this never happened. (click here for false prophecy by Wendy Alec, God TV amongst other things). And Paul Crouch and his wife Jan share an ecumenical bed with the Pope.  There are hundreds of books on the TBN online bookstore that promote Roman Catholicism, Mary the Queen of Heaven, Rosaries, the Eucharist Christ, etc.

“The GOD TV channel will be broadcasting the event LIVE to all their viewers throughout the world, starting from 2.30pm SA time. They tell me that they have access to a viewership of approximately 500 million people (amazing)!” (Emphasis added)

“I’m also on TV, recorded each week here on the farm and then broadcast every week on TBN, CTV and the Rhema Channel.” (Emphasis added)

Angus Buchan and his Healing Ministry:

“On Sunday, we had a healing service at Shalom …” 2nd July 2008. [15]

Angus Buchan  then spearheads this notion of signs and wonders accompanying him even further when again he writes in his book, ‘Jesus…a Farmer…and Miracles’:

“And they went out and preached everywhere the Lord working with them and confirming the Word through the accompanying signs. Amen. Mark 16. v20. People knew that Jesus was God because of the miralces [sic] He performed. However, that was not His motive for healing the sick or setting the captives free. Jesus had “compassion” for the sick and the hurting. So much so that He wept at the tomb of Lazarus when He saw the family grieving. Anyone desiring to be used by our Lord for Divine Healing must have a heart for those who suffer because Jesus uses hearts and hands and compassion to heal the sick. Mark 16 v20. [10] (Emphasis added)

So all you need is compassion and a desire to be used by the Lord….hmmm, does not matter if what you preach contradicts the Bible.

This quote above is not the first time I have heard Angus Buchan  speaking about his healing ministry.

The problem with Angus Buchan’shealing ministry etc, is that these signs were only given to the Apostles. Those who had the great task of taking the Gospel of Jesus Christ to the nations, the power given to them was to confirm the message they had to deliver. They then wrote the message down, which became the Word of God to us, God’s final Word to us – with no one adding to it and no one taking away from it. These men were given great power for they had the most difficult task ahead of them – they were imprisoned, beaten, tortured and martyred in the most dreadful of ways.  Does that mean healing and miracles don’t happen any more?  Of course not.  Go to Jesus Christ directly in prayer and if it’s His will you will be healed.  God to Jesus Christ directly in prayer to be delivered from smoking, alcoholism etc.   Go to Jesus Christ directly in prayer with all your problems.  We go to Jesus Christ directly in prayer!  So many people believe that they don’t have enough faith to be healed so they need to go find a middle man (the faith healer) who has oodles of faith and that will surely bring on a healing from God.  No, my dear friends, it doesn’t work like this.

“The new message delivered by the Apostles was confirmed by these signs. Once the message was written down, the signs ceased to be the confirming agent and the Bible confirms itself.” [17]

Satan’s greatest lie is to convince you that the ‘gift of healing to a selected person’ still plays a major role in the church today, this is not true.

Does God heal? Of course He does!  But not at the hands of a man who claims he has a ‘gift of healing’ or healings form part of his ministry. I know personally and have heard of people who were truly healed by God – they approached Jesus Christ in personal prayer and God chose to heal them.  And yes people can pray for you to be healed but that does not mean God will heal you. It is God who makes the final decision in the end. He has His reasons for everything He does.

Ultimately ones salvation is more important that being healed. Are you so willing to take a chance on your spiritual life by going to a man who supposedly heals people in Jesus’ name just for the sake of not being ill while still on earth? I hope not.

IMPORTANT TO NOTE:  The bible tells you to not allow people to lay hands on you.  Demons are transferred from one person to another very easily in this manner.

1 Timothy 5:22  “Lay hands suddenly on no man, neither be partaker of other men’s sins: keep thyself pure.”

Jesus Christ of the Bible and the Christ of the New Age

Please read and understand this verse, many people just read it, but never grasp what is actually being said – it’s like water on a ducks back to most.

Matthew 7:21-23  21 “Not everyone who says to Me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father who is in heaven will enter. 22 “Many will say to Me on that day, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in Your name, and in Your name cast out demons, and in Your name perform many miracles?‘ 23 “And then I will declare to them, ‘I never knew you; DEPART FROM ME, YOU WHO PRACTICE LAWLESSNESS.’

Just because someone uses the name of Jesus and perform miracles does not mean he is of God – quite the contrary.

Prosperity:

Lastly before I end, I want to talk about prosperity. Many Christians follow the Pentecostal/Word of Faith/Apostolic Prophetic etc., movement that has over taken our churches and ultimately led us to where we are today – mass apostasy.   All will agree that God wants to prosper us and will use the Bible and pull out verses to try back up their claims. I am going to now show you who this earth and its glory (riches) belongs too.  Our riches are with Jesus in Heaven; in receiving eternal life, for those who accept Him as the Son of God and believe.  Yes God does look after His children, He gives us what we NEED and some Christians are wealth, however our riches are not on this earth.

Luke 4:5-8  5 And he led Him up and showed Him all the kingdoms of the world in a moment of time. 6 And the devil said to Him, “I will give You all this domain and its glory; for it has been handed over to me, and I give it to whomever I wish. 7 Therefore if You worship before me, it shall all be Yours. 8 Jesus answered him, “It is written, ‘YOU SHALL WORSHIP THE LORD YOUR GOD AND SERVE HIM ONLY.'”

Satan who is god of this world owns all the wealth of this world, you wan’t wealth you get it from him.  Be careful what you ask for, Satan can’t wait to help you out with all the riches in the world.

Faith like Potatoes, the book and movie:

I had actually watched the video about +/- 4 years ago at a company I worked for. We were made to watch it as part of a team building exercise. Funnily enough, everyone found the movie inspirational;  from those interested in New Age Spiritualism, Hindus, right down to the last Muslim were emotionally affected by the movie – yet no one got saved.

We had a discussion afterwards on how to take the ‘principles’ given in this movie and apply them to our lives and our workplace, no mention of Jesus Christ and repentance of sin, just ‘learn and apply’, it was all about living a ‘good life’ and ‘accepting’ everyone around you no matter what they believed.  I was so unimpressed with the movie that I actually forgot all about it, until years later I received an email on the Mighty Men Conference that mentioned Angus Buchan. I thought, “Who is this man, and why does ‘Faith like Potatoes’ sound so familiar?” I let the photo’s of the filled stadiums overtake my logic; as I said above, I really wanted to believe he was the real deal. But through intensive research it is clear that all is not what it appears to be.

Quotes below taken from here by Shaun Willcock (biblebasedministries.co.uk). I encourage you to go read the full article by Shaun.

“In September 2006 a new religious movie premiered in South Africa, called Faith Like Potatoes.I say a religious movie rather than a Christian movie, because although it claims to be based on the life story of South African farmer and Charismatic evangelist Angus Buchan, it is not a biblically sound Christian film.”  

“According to one reviewer, “The film depicts some incredible miracles that God accomplishes through and around Angus. Perhaps, the most awe-inspiring part of the film is the point when, through the prayer of Angus Buchan, God raises to life a farm worker who had been struck dead by lightning” (Africa Christian Action film review).”   (Emphasis added)

[Note:  Todd Bentley claimed 32 people raised from the dead during the Lakeland Outpouring, unfortunately for him every one of these claims was proven false, and not one person came forward to help him verify his claims.  Yet he continued to lie to the millions of people following him, telling them it was true. They believed his every word; Todd could not put a foot wrong with those who desperately wanted to experience God.]

Quotes continued from biblebasedministries.co.uk:

“…Frank Rautenbach, the actor who plays the part of Angus Buchan and who had previously starred in a South African soap opera, said: “It was of paramount importance to me that we should make a real movie and not a “religious” one…. the most attractive thing to me about this role was the message of hope that the movie brings. Hope in spite of the difficulties of life.

“A truly Christian movie would not simply bring a “message of hope”. It would uncompromisingly bring the message of hope in Christ!”

“When the movie premiered in South Africa, it was reported that it did so to a ‘star-studded line-up’, the  who’s who of South African actors, movie-makers, entertainers, sports people, Christian leaders, and musicians.” Just one question arises here: Why? Why was this important to the movie’s producers? Why was it relevant at all? This is merely following the ways of the world, playing to the gallery, glorying in the world of showbiz.” (Emphasis added)

Mark 13:12-13;  “12 Brother will betray brother to death, and a father his child; and children will rise up against parents and have them put to death. 13 “You will be hated by ALL because of My name, but the one who endures to the end, he will be saved.

These words above are Jesus’ words. The real Jesus Christ that you barely hear preached today is hated, the counterfeit Jesus preached today…everyone loves. This is why ‘faith like potatoes’ is nota Christian movie, because everyone finds it acceptable!!!

New Apostolic Reformation…and it’s obsession with the Hebrew Calendar and Numbers (part of the Hebrew Roots Movement)

Taken from here – Die Erdekruik/The Vessel newspaper

“Die Erdekruik/The Vessel newspaper believes with thousands of others, that the year 2008 (the number ‘8’ has the significance of New Beginnings in the Bible) is a turning point for South Africa. With Angus Buchan, we proclaim in the Name of our Lord and Saviour, Jesus Christ, that there is hope for our country.” (Emphasis added)

[Update:  Die Erdekruik/The Vessel newspaper printed the 2 page newspaper at the Absa 2008 gathering in which Kobus Van Rensburg received quite a bit of advertising space.]

Taken here from the Elijah List – a prophecy by C. Peter Wagner, Cindy Jacobs, and many others: Word of the Lord for 2008 and Beyond

“2008: The Year to Possess the Gates…This year the Holy Spirit keyed off of the number “8” to us. The number 8 represents new beginnings. God wants us to go through new doors (or gates) to go to a new level in everything we do. The Lord cautioned us that while many want to experience the new wine (i.e., new moves of God), there are some who want to “wear their old robes,” or that which is comfortable to them, into this new season of time. This will not work. It is critical that we all are willing to give up old practices, structures, and the influence of relationships that tie us to the old if they refuse to allow us to move into the new things.” (Emphasis added)

[Note: These people that C. Peter Wagner is referring too, who wear old robes and refuse to give up old practices, are those who hold onto scripture for dear life and refuse to follow their New Age Spiritual utterances.]

So once again we have South Africans speaking the same message that false prophets like C. Peter Wagner and his diabolical agents Rick Joyner et al. are promoting…how is this possible?  Because it’s not biblical!

I truly pray that after reading this article, that the Holy Spirit is speaking to you and your eyes are opened as to what is going on in South Africa and the deception that has risen is not something to be taken lightly.  This has been planned I believe…planned by the New Apostolic Reformation, through visions and prophecy given by none other than Satan himself. Why do I say so? Here is why…

 “There is great prophetic interest in South Africa and its southern coastline from international circles. The major reason for this is because of the many prophecies that have gone out about the latter rain move of God that is to erupt from South Africa and spread into the nations.

The well-known prophet, Rick Joyner, visited Cape Town, South Africa in July 2004, and during a powerful prophetic conference on 22 July 2004, said that God is about to reveal powerful hidden ministries that are centered along the southern coastline of South Africa.[Emphasis added]  –link no longer on internet

Angus Buchan’s ministry fits their prophecy perfectly, however Angus Buchan  is notthe only one, he is only the start of what is yet to come. He is just a puppet on a string.

Conclusion

We are truly in the LAST DAYS. Watch and Pray! Be on Guard at all times, adhere to the Word of God at all times – question, test and weight all things to the Word of God before you deem it to be correct. Do not be swindled into accepting things just because we need to believe by faith and accept every message that comes our way no matter how Biblical it may seem – test it first! And remember experience and emotions do not validate that what is spoken or what manifests (signs and wonders) are from God.

The number of Wolves out number the Sheep.

While I am at it here is the correct interpretation of 2 Chronicles 7:14 seeing as though this is the verse so miss-used by these people to do nothing but deceive.

2 Chronicles 7:14  “14 and My people who are called by My name humble themselves and pray and seek My face and turn from their wicked ways, then I will hear from heaven, will forgive their sin and will heal their land.”

This verse is for Israel and Israel only. If they humbled themselves and sought after God through prayer, longing for Him and repenting of their wicked ways, God would forgive them of their sin and heal their land.   However!  Every verse in the Bible applies to every individual person who has a personal spiritual relationship with God through Jesus Christ His Son and the conviction of sin by the Holy Spirit which leads to repentance of sin in our own lives – of which repentance is an ongoing part of one’s relationship with Jesus.

You do not repent on behalf of others lives, or your next door neighbor, the government, or an entire nation for that matter.  The ‘heal their land’ in this verse means that if you personally seeks after God, humble yourself, genuinely repent of your sin (wicked ways) and actually change your ways;  God will hear you, forgive you and He will save you, and bring you back into a relationship with Him.   As for “physical land” – this applies to ancient and modern day Israel only.

For God to heal an entire nation in this day and age because a few thousand people got together and repented on behalf of others in this country is ludicrous to say the least. The Bible clearly states that in the last days everyone will follow a false Christ and turn away from genuine teaching. And it’s happening right before your own eyes..  It also clearly states that when the world seeks peace and reconciliation, it’s all a lie.  It’s a false peace and false reconciliation to a false Christ.  The Bible says:

1 Thessalonians 5:2-4 2 For you yourselves know full well that the day of the Lord will come just like a thief in the night.  3 While they are saying, “Peace and safety!” then destruction will come upon them suddenly like labor pains upon a woman with child, and they will not escape.  4 But you, brethren, are not in darkness, that the day would overtake you like a thief;

So when the world cries for peace and unity and being one global community, so then starts the beginnings of the coming of the Tribulation.  It will overcome those who are unbelievers, who refuse the truth.  But the brethren (those who are truly born again) can see what is clearly taking place for they love the truth of God’s Word and we will notbe surprised when the lies of world peace and the lies of the anti-Christ turns into death and destruction.  I am not one bit surprised right now and I know that many other genuine Christians out there are not one bit surprised either, and we can’t be silent and need to warn with long-suffering.

But the message for us (the true Body of Christ) in God’s Word is too not worry, too not fear, for He will look after us – Jesus is coming to Rapture His bride before the Tribulation starts.  He also tells us to watch and pray and be prepared spiritually at all times.  And being prepared does not mean growing organic food, or climbing to the tops of mountains to seek spiritual refuge.


Updated: 

  • 28 August 2008
  • 9 May 2009:  Absa Stadium, Mighty Men Conference 2009, Image of Mustard Seed – A Daily Devotional book
  • 28 May 2009:  Correction in formatting and typo’s plus extra Biblical verses with explanations.
  • 9 April 2010:  Link added to list of ‘denominations’ one can select on Shalom Ministries website.
  • 30 April 2010:  Heading “A strange comment by Angus Buchan on his website” should have said “A strange verse by Angus on his website”  with explanation.
  • 19 August 2012 –  NAR Invasion of SA – Rick Joyner, Angus Buchan, Danie Slabbert, Nevil Norden @ Apostolic Prophetic Conference – July 2012
  • 18 December 2016 – added new quote from Gateway magazine regarding praying for others sins.

References:

  • [Please note that [1-8] do no longer work as Shalom Trust Ministries website was revamped and most of the newsletters posted by Angus Buchan have been removed]
  • [10-11] url removed from the internet
  • [13-17] url removed from the internet
  • [9] C. Peter Wager – Dominion! How Kingdom Action Can Change the World, 2008. pg 16.
  • [12] http://www.bibleguidance.co.za/Engarticles/Transformations.htm
  • [13] http://watchmenview.blogspot.com/2008_05_01_archive.html
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Deborah (Discerning the World)

Deborah Ellish is the author of the above article. Discerning the World is an internet Christian Ministry based in Johannesburg South Africa. Tom Lessing and Deborah Ellish both own Discerning the World. For more information see the About this Website page below the comments section.

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Harry

As I said I feel the love ooooozzzzzingggggggggggggggggg from your comments. You are nothing but a bunch of self-righteous hypocrites, the kind my Saviour called white washed graves who go and find a convert and making him worse than themselves. This is in the word by the way. As I keep on asking, What have you done for the kingdom that will withstand the test of fire to come? This is also in the word. Please put in my whole comment and not only the parts that you can knock with your ridiculous doctrine that send more people to hell than save them.

Amanda

Robbie

Because Oom Angus is the best South Africa has to offer. People are starving for the Word of God now that the Purpose Driven and Emergent churches have found something else to preach. At least Oom Angus can work a crowd and get the men to believe that the Kingdom of God is being established by their efforts.

BOD

The Kingdom of God will not be established through the efforts of those who seek to knock and diminish Godly men. It will be established through the efforts of Godly men and women who have a love for Jesus and are passionate to spread His Good News to others. The Apostles showed us that human effort is required to establish the Kingdom of God. They demonstrated this through toil, perseverence, long suffering, not out of a works mentality to boast of, but out of a love for Jesus and a burden on their hearts to partner with the Lord and spread the Good news.

Amanda

Harry

I will not lift a finger to help establish the kingdom of the Manifest Sons of god, Joel’s Army, the dominionists, the emergents, the New Age, Maitreya and Dr. Dion Forster’s cosmic christ. In order for them to be successful, all they have to do is to make you believe that it is up to you, and it is not.

Did you see what BOD did? He said:

He [Angus Buchan] preaches the full Gospel, ie repentance for sin.

If you believe that repentance is the Gospel, then you will fall prey to these men telling you what to repent of and what works to do.

According to Dr. Dion Forster, who “serves as a consultant and spiritual adviser / Chaplain to the Global Day of Prayer and Unashamedly Ethical movements and their founder, Graham Power”, Oom Angus sent you out with a ‘simple’ challenge:

Rather, it was a simple challenge to men to work for social transformation, racial reconciliation, responsibility in their families.

Dr. Dion reported on Oom Angus’ teaching at the Cape Town for Jesus event:

The first part of his message encouraged South Africans to start taking responsibility for the nation, and to start making a really positive contribution towards transformation and renewal in society (which includes elements such as racial reconciliation, shifting the wealth of the nation, and of course also standing against crime and corruption). The second part of his message encouraged men to live responsibility in their family lives and work lives.

Those are just some of the ‘elements’ for establishing the kingdom on earth. They bind you with their laws and fool you into believing that it is Christian! Beware!

For if someone comes and proclaims another Jesus than the one we proclaimed, or if you receive a different spirit from the one you received, or if you accept a different gospel from the one you accepted, you put up with it readily enough. (2Co 11:4)

And what I do I will continue to do, in order to undermine the claim of those who would like to claim that in their boasted mission they work on the same terms as we do. For such men are false apostles, deceitful workmen, disguising themselves as apostles of Christ. And no wonder, for even Satan disguises himself as an angel of light. So it is no surprise if his servants, also, disguise themselves as servants of righteousness. Their end will correspond to their deeds. (2Co 11:12-15)

For you bear it if someone makes slaves of you, or devours you, or takes advantage of you, or puts on airs, or strikes you in the face. To my shame, I must say, we were too weak for that! …(2Co 11:20-21)

Jesus Christ said that His Kingdom is NOT of this world:

Jesus answered, “My kingdom is not of this world. If my kingdom were of this world, my servants would have been fighting, that I might not be delivered over to the Jews. But my kingdom is not from the world.” (Joh 18:36)

And He told the church what they ought to teach:

“Thus it is written, that the Christ should suffer and on the third day rise from the dead, and that repentance and forgiveness of sins should be proclaimed in his name to all nations, beginning from Jerusalem. (Luk 24:46-47)

Harry, why do you want us to boast? Proclaiming our deeds will not save anybody. That is why we proclaim Jesus Christ’s deeds. So if you want us to boast, I shall boast about this:

But now the righteousness of God has been manifested apart from the law, although the Law and the Prophets bear witness to it– the righteousness of God through faith in Jesus Christ for all who believe. For there is no distinction: for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, and are justified by his grace as a gift, through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus, whom God put forward as a propitiation by his blood, to be received by faith. This was to show God’s righteousness, because in his divine forbearance he had passed over former sins. It was to show his righteousness at the present time, so that he might be just and the justifier of the one who has faith in Jesus. Then what becomes of our boasting? It is excluded. By what kind of law? By a law of works? No, but by the law of faith. For we hold that one is justified by faith apart from works of the law. (Rom 3:21-28)

Harry, you said:

Please put in my whole comment and not only the parts that you can knock with your ridiculous doctrine that send more people to hell than save them.

Is that the real stumbling block for you, that those without faith will go to hell? Would you rather that all who help establish the kingdom through good deeds inherit the kingdom?

Elmarie A

Amanda

I eco your words to Harry.

Amanda

DTW

BOD is indeed speaking about a kingdom here on earth and the gospel, which he preaches, is their gospel. Look at all the work they have to do in order to establish their kingdom! That god is helpless without them.

Our God is independent of our effort. If we refuse to proclaim Him, the stones will cry out:

And as he rode along, they spread their cloaks on the road. As he was drawing near–already on the way down the Mount of Olives–the whole multitude of his disciples began to rejoice and praise God with a loud voice for all the mighty works that they had seen, saying, “Blessed is the King who comes in the name of the Lord! Peace in heaven and glory in the highest!” And some of the Pharisees in the crowd said to him, “Teacher, rebuke your disciples.” He answered, “I tell you, if these were silent, the very stones would cry out.” (Luk 19:36-40)

Elmarie A

Amanda

Harry

I will not lift a finger to help establish the kingdom of the Manifest Sons of god, Joel’s Army, the dominionists, the emergents, the New Age, Maitreya and Dr. Dion Forster’s cosmic christ. In order for them to be successful, all they have to do is to make you believe that it is up to you, and it is not.

I eco your words again, when will people like Harry realize they seem lost and time is getting shorter. I have noted Harry made 7 comments and quoted only one Scripture twice the Scripture Romans 8:22 and is this not the most loved Scripture that they use out of context and connect it to the Joel’s Army and all the others to justify themselves for the Purpose Driven life , Kingdom Now Theology.

On April 18th, 2010 at 7:52 pm Harry said it will be his last comment and since then Harry has been back 3 times and this could be good news, as It seems Harry is worried about something. I truly hope and pray Harry finds the real Jesus.

Why is it Harry thinks that by us all giving him Scripture, it is ridiculous doctrines? Harry seems to then think the Word if God is ridiculous. That is so sad you know.

Amanda

Elmarie

Yes. Maybe Harry has been taught that Christianity is about what we do and not about what Jesus Christ has done for us. Maybe he cannot get himself to believe that the Good News is really as good as we claim it to be. Maybe he thinks it is prudent to buy some insurance through good works, just in case Jesus Christ did not quite pull it off for us. Until he is willing to compare to Scripture the outrageous demands made by the Dion Forsters, he will remain enslaved to men and the world. The day that he loves Jesus Christ more than Oom Angus, we will celebrate with him.

BOD

Hello Deborah,

Your quote:

“Do you not understand that a man made kingdom of god is impossible and that you seek to do is unbiblical. Jesus Christ will rapture those born again, in which the earth is left in the hands of THE anti-Christ who wants to create his kingdom on earth because he can’t create his kingdom elsewhere – this is the one you are currently helping create (unbeknown to you I hope?)”

Why are you so quick to accuse others of serving the anti-christ?

Why do you twist my words and paint them as unbiblical?

I have stated that human effort is required to establish the Kingdom of God, ie Christ loving people partnering with God to love others and spread the Good News. This is achieved through Christ living in their hearts! I have presented the model of the Apostles who worked hard, persevered, out of a love for Christ and others, to spread the Good News. Many of them gave their lives for this. Through their toil and the Grace of Lord Jesus, lives were transformed and the Kingdom of God did come into the hearts of men and women.

We are called by Jesus to be a light unto the world.

Matthew 5:14-16 (New International Version)

14″You are the light of the world. A city on a hill cannot be hidden. 15Neither do people light a lamp and put it under a bowl. Instead they put it on its stand, and it gives light to everyone in the house. 16In the same way, let your light shine before men, that they may see your good deeds and praise your Father in heaven.

How do you reconcile your biblical view with the Parable of the Talents? Matthew 25:14-30
Would you rather we bury the talent, as it is taboo to serve God with our effort?

How about the Parable of the fig tree, Luke 13: 6-9?

We are called to serve God!

God bless you,

Brett

Elmarie A

Amanda

it is so so sad indeed. But again God gave us all a perfect mind, that should be used to His glory. When one don’t want to use what God gave us, we must then sadly suffer the consequences. The Holy spirit within us guides us to the truth, and if we grieve Him we are surely in great danger.

John 12:40
“He has blinded their eyes and deadened their hearts, so they can neither see with their eyes, nor understand with their hearts, nor turn—and I would heal them.”

Ephesians 4:30
And do not grieve the Holy Spirit of God [do not offend or vex or sadden Him], by Whom you were sealed (marked, branded as God’s own, secured) for the day of redemption (of final deliverance through Christ from evil and the consequences of sin)

Harry

[EDITED by DTW: Harry, please stop commenting with your insults, you are really wasting our time – please go speak to Angus as too why you are struggling to be ‘ethical’ and can’t understand what the bible says].

Eric

Remember that a Prophet gets no honor in her/his own land.

Remember that indeed in the end days there will be many false teachers and prophets as is said and is being observed.

Keep up your great work, Truth must always be spoken. I am glad you listened to The Holy Spirit because none can find fault with it. When you had the “nagging” in your heart you knew what you saw and heard. They are mesmerized by a man but not by The Holy Spirit ? They come in their numbers to hear false prophets and teachers, to see the miracles they perform and yet they claim to be in Christ ?

Surely if you are a true follower you will get instruction from The Holy Spirit ? God will guide your way not a mere mortal ?

Anyway keep up your great work, Jesus is coming.

Burning Lamp

Talk about a TRAVESTY!! Angus speaking at an event honoring Andrew Murray?

Please pray for me this weekend as I go to Worcester to speak at the 150 year anniversary celebrations of the Andrew Murray revival. I will be speaking at 3.30 Saturday afternoon. I would really covet your prayers and if you can come, it would obviously be wonderful to have you there to support us.

Yours in Christ’s service
Angus & Jill and the Shalom team

cecilia

Seen that it has been posted in a public magazine, I want to quote a letter in the Huisgenoot, May 13 2010 –

“BEKEERDE MAN?

My man was ook vanjaar by Angus Buchan se Mighty Men-konferensie.

Ek verwag toe Sondag om ‘n nuwe man terug te verwelkom, een wat sy vrou weer gaan raak sien, sy naastes met respek gaan behandel en so sal leef dat die kinders hom sal respekteer.

Maar die man wat terugkom van ‘n Christen-mannekamp, verskree eers sy 15-jarige seun en daarna kry sy vrou raas omdat sy die kinders verdedig. En toe word ons vertel hy is die hoof van die huis. Net hy besluit en ons sal na hom luister.

Ek slaap nie die Sondagnag nie. Met oë dik gehuil, gaan ek Maandag werk. My man groet nie, klim net in sy kar en ry.

Ek begin my klere pak en bel ‘n vriendin vir blyplek. Sy paai en sê ek moenie sulke besluite neem as ek omgekrap is nie. Ek besluit om te bly.

My man dink nie hy het enigiets verkeerds gedoen nie. Hoe word byna 400 000 mans mak soos lammetjies en myne word die duiwel self? – Anti-Mighty Men, Durban”

So we can see even from an unknown writer, that all’s not well at the MMC!

Harry

Hi please explain this to me. This weekend I went to the Helen Joseph hospital to pray and minister to people.

God healed a Muslim man who in his own words was “in excruciating pain” because of a pinched nerve. After laying hands on him in the name of Jesus, in an instant he sat up touching his toes.

So what do you call me, a false healer, someone that teaches false doctrine or someone who does what Jesus commanded us to do?
Please do not edit this but post it on your site, I would like to see you and your critical friend’s comments. My shoulders are big i can handle criticism.

I am sure you will criticize me for using the I word, I had to use the I word as I am the one who went but I went in the name of my God and Saviour Jesus Christ. (Usually people who do nothing for the Kingdom hate it when people who are active in furthering the Kingdom use it.)

Elmarie A

Harry

Did your hands heal this Muslim man?

Elmarie A

Harry
April 24th, 2010 at 1:16 pm

As I said I feel the love ooooozzzzzingggggggggggggggggg from your comments. You are nothing but a bunch of self-righteous hypocrites, the kind my Saviour called white washed graves who go and find a convert and making him worse than themselves. This is in the word by the way. As I keep on asking, What have you done for the kingdom that will withstand the test of fire to come? This is also in the word. Please put in my whole comment and not only the parts that you can knock with your ridiculous doctrine that send more people to hell than save them.

I do hope you leave the insults alone this time!!!

Elmarie A

Harry

You must still answer allot of other questions here before we move to the latest. Please page up and have a look start answering. Harry why are you back here? to tell us about your healing powers?

I don’t think we should even touch your latest comment placed May 16th, 2010 at 7:38 pm before you answered our other questions.

Naaaaah Harry it just struck me you are here to boast!!!!That is not Scriptural is it??

These are all your comments and I think you are here to cause division and boast again Harry.

Harry
April 7th, 2010 at 6:08 pm

Hi Mister no-all.
Please tell me what you have done for the Gospel?
You sit in your little armchair with your big ego and judge the world. You are probably some idiot “Theologian’ who are nothing more than the same thing as the Lawyer or Scribe mentioned in the Gospels who try and give their own interpretation of what is actually being said. You are probably also a Calvinists who follow a Theology written by a mass murderer who had to preach his drivel so he could convince himself that he cannot be lost.( A man who believed in infant baptism, now that is heresy).
The sad thing is that he is taking millions of people with him.
I would much rather follow my Lord who gave us the great commission. If I may say as Paul did I probably sound like an idiot as I have to say I, (a supporter of Angus who has done more for the Gospel than all you and your computer faultfinders will ever do), reach out by myself to the poor and sick. I have had people healed by the laying on of my hands by the POWER OF THE HOLY SPIRIT WHO IS STILL HERE TO HEAL AND SAVE. Why would Jesus say go and preach the Gospel heal the sick…… if He has stopped healing the sick than He must stop saving the lost as well? These were all part of the great commission. So take your theology and flush it down the toilet and do something for the Kingdom that will stand on the day of Judgement.
Of course as you preach and reach out you get to deal with people that you do not agree with 100%.
But if we have to stop preaching and reaching out we will become like you who does nothing but criticize and whose opinion is nothing but hot air.
Thanks you but I would rather be a humble man like Angus who preaches repentance and holiness.
Harry Coetsee
South Africa.
On my way to MMC 2010.
Thank you Jesus.
__________________________________________________________
Harry
April 7th, 2010 at 10:56 pm

As i said I am sorry I had to use I, the same as Paul did not want to use I, but had to when he wanted to show some braggarts that they had to get of their self-crated thrones. Obviously you can’t read as I said THE HEALING WAS BY THE POWER OF THE HOLY SPIRIT, I had nothing to do with it I am only a vessel that seek to do God’s will. The same as when I lead someone to Jesus by BY THE POWER OF THE HOLY SPIRIT I have nothing to do with it. I cannot heal a fly or save a sole, only My Father can do it by BY THE POWER OF THE HOLY SPIRIT. I am only a willing servant that chooses to do the work instead of sitting on the side-line criticising the one who are prepared to get the job done. What amazes me is that you guys can say and insult as much as you like but can’t handle it when you get it back.
Dear Elmarie and Cecilia: Sorry to have to tell you this Philip was not an apostle and he led the Ethiopian to the Lord. So was he not supposed to do that because he was not one of the twelve? When the Holy Spirit was poured out was it only on the 12 or the 120? This can go on and on but if you deny the power of the Gospel you are deceiving yourself, I suppose that why you have to sit on your little throne and judge the once who are doing the work.
Angus does not preach a prosperity Gospel he preaches a simple message that simple people like me can understand. I am sorry if it is to simple a message for your mind that has been polluted by theologians who make it impossible for simple folk to understand. You see if a illiterate person cannot understand the Gospel then it is worthless as Paul said God uses the simple to bring the wise to nought, or confound the wise.(Not bad for a guy who knows this without reading much as Deborah said)
Elmarie sorry to tell you this but you come over sarcastic as shown in your comment about the nurses. I am only saying this as it seems you think you walk in perfect love and need to pray for me. Thanks for your prayer please pray that I become more like Jesus and do the works He did and dare I say do even greater works than Him. By the way Jesus said that not me.
____________________________________________________________
Harry
April 18th, 2010 at 7:52 pm

Hi Harry is back.
I have just come back from MMC2010. Great to see thousands of men promising to be the watchmen of their families!!!! Thank you my Jesus for putting one man in our country who look for a solution instead of trying to get us to sit and feel sorry for ourselves and judge and condemn the people who strife to make a difference.
I see you are a few people who sit and criticise Angus.
What qualifies you to do what you do?
I can feel the love of Jesus oozing from the pages.(Ha,Ha)
Examine your hearts and motives.
Please let me know how many people you have brought to the feet of Jesus?
How many poor people have you helped?
BY YOUR FRUITS YOU WILL BE KNOWN.
Please look at your face in the mirror and realize you are not the sheriff of the church.
By the way neither Angus nor I hold is part of the Kingdom now bunch. The word states clearly in Romans 8:22 For the earnest expectation of the creature waiteth for the manifestation of the sons of God. Just because Angus used this scripture publicity does not make him one of them.
Get a life and do something positive for the Kingdom of Jesus Christ
Hi Harry is back.
I have just come back from MMC2010. Great to see thousands of men promising to be the watchmen of their families!!!! Thank you my Jesus for putting one man in our country who look for a solution instead of trying to get us to sit and feel sorry for ourselves and judge and condemn the people who strife to make a difference.
I see you are a few people who sit and criticise Angus.
What qualifies you to do what you do?
I can feel the love of Jesus oozing from the pages.(Ha,Ha)
Examine your hearts and motives.
Please let me know how many people you have brought to the feet of Jesus?
How many poor people have you helped?
BY YOUR FRUITS YOU WILL BE KNOWN.
Please look at your face in the mirror and realize you are not the sheriff of the church.
By the way neither Angus nor I hold is part of the Kingdom now bunch. The word states clearly in Romans 8:22 For the earnest expectation of the creature waiteth for the manifestation of the sons of God. Just because Angus used this scripture publicity does not make him one of them.
Get a life and do something positive for the Kingdom of Jesus Christ
Get a life and do something positive for the Kingdom of Jesus Christ
This will be my last comment. Please blow up your computers and do something for God that will stand the test of fire. Remember you will be judged for every word you say.
This is for Bod, Bod please do not waste your time with these bitter Pharisees!

I hope you are brave enough to publish this on your demonic site. (It is easy to throw names around, calling Angus a demon)
____________________________________________________________
Harry
April 20th, 2010 at 1:32 pm

Hi Bod
You are wasting your time!
These self-righteous Pharisees feel they are the sheriff of the church.
Move on and let them be judged for doing nothing but criticise the people who are prepared to get their hands dirty and seek the lost, sick, rejected and poor.
Every answer you have they will find a scripture to shoot you down. Some advice to you lot when you find a truth balance it with a scripture that might not fit your theology and then you will see the real meaning of the scriptures you take out of context. What amazes me is how you have perfected the way you accuse me of not “walking in love” yet you are sarcastic and self-righteous.

_____________________________________________________
Harry
April 26th, 2010 at 6:08 pm

[EDITED by DTW: Harry, please stop commenting with your insults, you are really wasting our time – please go speak to Angus as too why you are struggling to be ‘ethical’ and can’t understand what the bible says].

Elmarie A

Deborah (Discerning the World)

Yikes yes Harry is here to boast and we have taken note!!! Harry!!!

Harry

I will leave you guys in your own hole.
Jesus said: If the light you think you have is darkness…………….
Just remember that the Pharisees were criticising Jesus for the miracles he did and he said they were blaspheming the Holy Spirit.
Be careful when you judge when other people do the works commanded by Jesus, you might be blaspheming the Holy Spirit…this is unpardonable…
I have never claimed to do anything myself…Jesus said ……those who believe will speak in tongues…..will lay hands on the sick and they will recover……maybe each you should ask yourselves this question: do I really believe?

Elmarie A

Harry

Your persistence in not wanting to answer any of our questions says allot about you. Your Comment on April 26th, 2010 at 6:08 pm had to be removed it was so insulting.

Harry I pray you find Jesus in your life who Commanded us to love the Lord our God with our whole body, soul en mind the most important command and the second most important is to love our neighbor as thy self. You have not shown love toward any one here Harry.

Mark 12:29-31 (Amplified Bible)

29Jesus answered, The first and principal one of all commands is: Hear, O Israel, The Lord our God is one Lord;

30And you shall love the Lord your God [a]out of and with your whole heart and out of and with all your soul (your [b]life) and out of and with all your mind (with [c]your faculty of thought and your moral understanding) and out of and with all your strength. [d]This is the first and principal commandment.(A)

31The second is like it and is this, You shall love your neighbor as yourself. There is no other commandment greater than these.(B

You have come here to cause division and strife and you could not get it right.

You have been very insulting towards us all here.

Romans 16:16-18 (Amplified Bible)

16Greet one another with a holy (consecrated) kiss. All the churches of Christ (the Messiah) wish to be remembered to you.

17 I appeal to you, brethren, to be on your guard concerning those who create dissensions and difficulties and cause divisions, in opposition to the doctrine (the teaching) which you have been taught. [I warn you to turn aside from them, to] avoid them.

18For such persons do not serve our Lord Christ but their own appetites and base desires, and by ingratiating and flattering speech, they beguile the hearts of the unsuspecting and simpleminded [people].

1 Corinthians 1:9-11 (Amplified Bible)

9God is faithful (reliable, trustworthy, and therefore ever true to His promise, and He can be depended on); by Him you were called into companionship and participation with His Son, Jesus Christ our Lord.

10But I urge and entreat you, brethren, by the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that all of you be in perfect harmony and full agreement in what you say, and that there be no dissensions or factions or divisions among you, but that you be perfectly united in your common understanding and in your opinions and judgments.

11For it has been made clear to me, my brethren, by those of Chloe’s household, that there are contentions and wrangling and factions among you.

Harry

Ok I looked at some of your comments you made .(To be honest I have only glanced over them before as I always get the same answers from the guys who sit on the side line.)
Let me answer a few.
—————————————————————————————-
Elmarie said
Jesus spoke to the apostles Only not to you or me. Jesus gave the apostles this power of healing and driving out demons and to cure disease purely SO THAT THEY COULD GO OUT AND MAKE NON BELIEVERS TO BELIEVE. The non believers those days had nothing not even Scripture. Neither did the apostles have Scripture, they were writing the Bible not reading it.

Mark 16: 15 And then he told them, “Go into all the world and preach the Good News to everyone. 16 Anyone who believes and is baptized will be saved. But anyone who refuses to believe will be condemned. 17 These miraculous signs will accompany those who believe: They will cast out demons in my name, and they will speak in new languages.[e] 18 They will be able to handle snakes with safety, and if they drink anything poisonous, it won’t hurt them. They will be able to place their hands on the sick, and they will be healed.”

He told THEM (the apostles) you are probably right. But then he says ANYONE (that’s me and also you, if you believe) who believes, 17 These miraculous signs will accompany those who believe: They will cast out demons in my name, and they will speak in new languages.[e] 18 They will be able to handle snakes with safety, and if they drink anything poisonous, it won’t hurt them. THEY (THOSE WHO BELIEVE THE WORD THE APOSTLES TOOK TO THE UNBELIEVERS, THE EXACT THING I DO, I TAKE THE WORD TO THE UNBELIEVER THE SAME AS YOU WERE ONCE. YOU WOULD STILL HAVE BEEN DEAD IN YOUR SIN IF SOMONE LIKE me DID NOT BRING THE GOSPEL TO YOU.)

IT THEN SAYES THOSE WHO BELIEVE… will be able to place their hands on the sick, and they will be healed.”(The same as what happened to the Muslim man I laid my hands on and God healed. The same with numerous others. Please do not twist my words now and say I claim to heal and save, I do it in the name of Jesus. He gets the glory, I am the vessel.

Romans 10: 14How, then, can they call on the one they have not believed in? And how can they believe in the one of whom they have not heard? And how can they hear without someone preaching to them? 15And how can they preach unless they are sent? As it is written, “How beautiful are the feet of those who bring good news!

You see this scripture says HOW CAN THEY HEAR WITHOUT SOMEONE PREACHING TO THEM. You might have a low opinion of me, at least the Bible says I have beautiful feet!!!!

What about Paul, he was not there that day or any of the other people mentioned in acts.

What about James 5:13 13Is any one of you in trouble? He should pray. Is anyone happy? Let him sing songs of praise. 14Is any one of you sick? He should call the elders of the church to pray over him and anoint him with oil in the name of the Lord. 15And the prayer offered in faith will make the sick person well; the Lord will raise him up. If he has sinned, he will be forgiven.

——————————————————————-
Elmarie you said

With all the supposed faith healers at our beck and call today, someone should go tell the medical students in all universities that their professions are becoming obsolete. Luke the apostle was a physician before he was an apostle. If laying on of hands and faith healing was intended to grow into the preposterous proportions in the church of today why did Luke, who had direct access to Jesus Himself continue on as a physician and as saint.

This is such a stupid remark it speaks for itself. We are not in competition with doctors, in fact we fight the same enemy.

————————————————————————-
Elmarie you said

Harry
I’m telling you this in the love of the true Jesus. Please check whether this is true in the Word.
I think my previous explanation shows you the truth.

Elamarie said
But Hary you should know that men do not bring people to Jesus, but the Holy Spirit.
I know only the Holy Spirit can convict. Someone still has to take the message, as mentioned before.
The rest of the comments are not worth an answer.

_______________________________________________________________
A few scriptures

Romans 2:7 To those who by persistence in doing good seek glory, honor and immortality, he will give eternal life.
John 15 “I am the true grapevine, and my Father is the gardener. 2 He cuts off every branch of mine that doesn’t produce fruit,(Have you seen what Calvinist do to this scripture to fit into their theology)

James 2:14 What does it profit, my brethren, if someone says he has faith but does not have works? Can faith save him? 15 If a brother or sister is naked and destitute of daily food, 16 and one of you says to them, “Depart in peace, be warmed and filled,” but you do not give them the things which are needed for the body, what does it profit? 17 Thus also faith by itself, if it does not have works, is dead.
18 But someone will say, “You have faith, and I have works.” Show me your faith without your[d] works, and I will show you my faith by my[e] works. 19 You believe that there is one God. You do well. Even the demons believe—and tremble! 20 But do you want to know, O foolish man, that faith without works is dead?

If you do not have works you are the same as the devil for he also believes.

You see faith and works are like rowing a boat you can’t only use one ore. You need to otherwise you will be going in circles. ( I know it is very difficult for a Calvinist to accept the book of James as part of the Bible)

Elmarie A

To be honest I have
only glanced over them before as I always get the same answers from the guys who sit on the side line

So Then Harry you are Judgmental as you are saying the people whom answer you sit on the side line? You don’t know anyone’s heart Harry and that includes mine. Only God knows my heart.
You have no idea who I am. You are more likely being influenced by False preachers. Do you even know what Discernment means Harry.

You might have a low opinion of me, at least the
Bible says I have beautiful feet!!!!

We are all meek and weak as mere humans and pray and depend on the gift of Salvation from God and no true Christian may hold himself as being higher than others that is not Scriptural or representative of our fruits as His children.

Harry go read the verse about your feet in context please, you are twisting the Word to suit you.

<blockquote This is such a stupid remark it speaks for itself. We are not incompetition with doctors, in fact we fight the same enemy.

It was supposed to be stupid to prove my point Harry. Oh so you believe only Satan send disease and sickness hmmmmmmmmmmmm

The rest of the comments are not worth an answer.

There was no need for you to answer any of my Comments I never asked you to.

Have you seen what Calvinist do to this scripture to fit into their theology

Nope Nooooo because I am not interested in Calvinism or any man made doctrine or theology. I believe that the Word of God is our only God Breathed Doctrine we should follow.

If you do not have works you are the same as the devil for he also believes.You see faith and works are like rowing a boat you can’t only use one ore. You need to otherwise you will be going in circles. ( I know it
is very difficult for a Calvinist to accept the book of James as partof the Bible)

Now which cult taught you that?? huh. What has Calvinism got to do with anything here? You know Harry I actually love the book of James as much as I love the whole Bible. Harry Harry you don’t know me so you cannot label me as a Calvinist as I do not believe in any Doctrine other than THE WORD OF GOD and we are not allowed to remove or add to His Word.

I will give you some links below to read because much is to be said about the fact that you think works can save one. You row what ever boat you want Harry we where all given free will. So are you saying that Calvinist removed or ignore the book of James oh my oh my . Yikes I think you have to make the
world aware of that.

THEY (THOSE WHO BELIEVE THE WORD THE APOSTLES TOOK TO THE UNBELIEVERS, THE EXACT THING
I DO, I TAKE THE WORD TO THE UNBELIEVER THE SAME AS YOU WERE ONCE. YOU WOULD STILL HAVE BEEN DEAD IN YOUR SIN IF SOMONE LIKE me DID NOT BRING THE GOSPEL TO YOU.)IT THEN SAYES THOSE WHO BELIEVE

Just remember Harry that You are not an Apstotel as there where only the 12 chosen by Jesus. We are only to spread the Goodnews the Gospel to unbelievers not concetrate on Works.

Something interesting points for you to ponder on:

Question: “Laying on of hands – what does the Bible say?”

Answer: “Laying on of hands” is a Biblical action; however, there is no biblical mandate requiring the physical laying on of hands for a particular spiritual ministry. Jesus certainly laid His hands on many of those He healed; however, He also healed without laying His hands on people. In fact, there were times when He was nowhere near the vicinity of those He healed. Matthew 8:8 describes Jesus healing the servant of the centurion without going near the centurion’s house.

Following are two instances to consider where in one case the Holy Spirit bestows the gift of speaking in tongues with the act of an apostle’s laying on of hands and in the other case He does so without the laying on of hands, but simply through the apostle’s preaching:

“Paul said, ‘John’s baptism was a baptism of repentance. He told the people to believe in the one coming after him, that is, in Jesus.’ On hearing this, they were baptized into the name of the Lord Jesus. When Paul placed his hands on them, the Holy Spirit came on them, and they spoke in tongues and prophesied.” (Acts 19:4-6).

“While Peter was still speaking these words, the Holy Spirit came on all who heard the message. The circumcised believers who had come with Peter were astonished that the gift of the Holy Spirit had been poured out even on the Gentiles. For they heard them speaking in tongues and praising God?” (Acts 10:44-46).

In the following verse, the thought is not so much in cautioning the physical action of laying on of hands as it is to the idea that bestowing the responsibility of spiritual leadership (however it is done) is to be done with care. It is not to be done “suddenly” or without due consideration. “Do not be hasty in the laying on of hands, and do not share in the sins of others. Keep yourself pure” (1 Timothy 5:22).

Undoubtedly the laying on of hands in the early church was a means of connecting the message with the messenger, or the spiritual gift with the gifted giver. It provided a “sign” authenticating him through whom the physical manifestation of a spiritual gift was bestowed. We need to understand very carefully that there are no magical biblical formulas for the ministry of the Church. Laying on of hands has no power in itself. Laying on of hands is only used by God when it is done in agreement with God’s Word.
http://www.gotquestions.org/laying-on-of-hands.html

Question: “Is salvation by faith alone, or by faith plus works?”

Answer: This is perhaps the most important question in all of Christian theology. This question is the cause of the Reformation, the split between the Protestant churches and Catholic Church. This question is a key difference between biblical Christianity and most of the “Christian” cults. Is salvation by faith alone, or by faith plus works? Am I saved just by believing in Jesus, or do I have to believe in Jesus and do certain things?

The question of faith alone or faith plus works is made difficult by some hard-to-reconcile Bible passages. Compare Romans 3:28, 5:1 and Galatians 3:24 with James 2:24. Some see a difference between Paul (salvation is by faith alone) and James (salvation is by faith plus works). Paul dogmatically says that justification is by faith alone (Ephesians 2:8-9), while James appears to be saying that justification is by faith plus works. This apparent problem is answered by examining what exactly James is talking about. James is refuting the belief that a person can have faith without producing any good works (James 2:17-18). James is emphasizing the point that genuine faith in Christ will produce a changed life and good works (James 2:20-26). James is not saying that justification is by faith plus works, but rather that a person who is truly justified by faith will have good works in his/her life. If a person claims to be a believer, but has no good works in his/her life, then he/she likely does not have genuine faith in Christ (James 2:14, 17, 20, 26).

Paul says the same thing in his writings. The good fruit believers should have in their lives is listed in Galatians 5:22-23. Immediately after telling us that we are saved by faith, not works (Ephesians 2:8-9), Paul informs us that we were created to do good works (Ephesians 2:10). Paul expects just as much of a changed life as James does: “Therefore, if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creation; the old has gone, the new has come” (2 Corinthians 5:17). James and Paul do not disagree in their teaching regarding salvation. They approach the same subject from different perspectives. Paul simply emphasized that justification is by faith alone while James put emphasis on the fact that genuine faith in Christ produces good works.
http://www.gotquestions.org/salvation-faith-alone.html

Question: “What is salvation? What is the Christian doctrine of salvation?”

Answer: Salvation is deliverance from danger or suffering. To save is to deliver or protect. The word carries the idea of victory, health, or preservation. Sometimes, the Bible uses the words saved or salvation to refer to temporal, physical deliverance, such as Paul’s deliverance from prison (Philippians 1:19).

More often, the word “salvation” concerns an eternal, spiritual deliverance. When Paul told the Philippian jailer what he must do to be saved, he was referring to the jailer’s eternal destiny (Acts 16:30-31). Jesus equated being saved with entering the kingdom of God (Matthew 19:24-25).

What are we saved from? In the Christian doctrine of salvation, we are saved from “wrath,” that is, from God’s judgment of sin (Romans 5:9; 1 Thessalonians 5:9). Our sin has separated us from God, and the consequence of sin is death (Romans 6:23). Biblical salvation refers to our deliverance from the consequence of sin and therefore involves the removal of sin.

Who does the saving? Only God can remove sin and deliver us from sin’s penalty (2 Timothy 1:9; Titus 3:5).

How does God save? In the Christian doctrine of salvation, God has rescued us through Christ (John 3:17). Specifically, it was Jesus’ death on the cross and subsequent resurrection that achieved our salvation (Romans 5:10; Ephesians 1:7). Scripture is clear that salvation is the gracious, undeserved gift of God (Ephesians 2:5, 8) and is only available through faith in Jesus Christ (Acts 4:12).

How do we receive salvation? We are saved by faith. First, we must hear the gospel—the good news of Jesus’ death and resurrection (Ephesians 1:13). Then, we must believe—fully trust the Lord Jesus (Romans 1:16). This involves repentance, a changing of mind about sin and Christ (Acts 3:19), and calling on the name of the Lord (Romans 10:9-10, 13).

A definition of the Christian doctrine of salvation would be “The deliverance, by the grace of God, from eternal punishment for sin which is granted to those who accept by faith God’s conditions of repentance and faith in the Lord Jesus.” Salvation is available in Jesus alone (John 14:6; Acts 4:12) and is dependent on God alone for provision, assurance, and security.
http://www.gotquestions.org/Christian-doctrine-salvation.html

“Why does God allow sickness?”

Answer: The issue of sickness is always a difficult one to deal with. The key is remembering that God’s ways are higher than our ways (Isaiah 55:9). When we are suffering with a sickness, disease, or injury, we usually focus solely on our own suffering. In the midst of a trial of sickness, it is very difficult to focus on what good God might bring about as a result. Romans 8:28 reminds us that God can bring about good from any situation. Many people look back on times of sickness as times when they grew closer to God, learned to trust Him more, and/or learned how to truly value life. This is the perspective God has because He is sovereign and knows the end result.

This does not mean sickness is always from God or that God always inflicts us with sickness to teach us a spiritual lesson. In a world tainted by sin, sickness, disease, and death will always be with us. We are fallen beings, with physical bodies prone to disease and illness. Some sickness is simply a result of the natural course of things in this world. Sickness can also be the result of a demonic attack. The Bible describes several instances when physical suffering was caused by Satan and his demons (Matthew 17:14-18; Luke 13:10-16). So, some sickness is not from God, but from Satan. Even in these instances, God is still in control. God sometimes allows sin and/or Satan to cause physical suffering. Even when sickness is not directly from God, He will still use it according to His perfect will.

It is undeniable, though, that God sometimes intentionally allows, or even causes sickness to accomplish His sovereign purposes. While sickness is not directly addressed in the passage, Hebrews 12:5-11 describes God disciplining us to “produce a harvest of righteousness” (verse 11). Sickness can be a means of God’s loving discipline. It is difficult for us to comprehend why God would work in this manner. But, believing in the sovereignty of God, there is no other option than suffering being something God allows and/or causes.

The clearest example of this in Scripture is found is Psalm 119. Notice the progression through verses 67, 71, and 75 – “Before I was afflicted I went astray, but now I obey your word…It was good for me to be afflicted so that I might learn your decrees…I know, O LORD, that your laws are righteous, and in faithfulness you have afflicted me.” The author of Psalm 119 was looking at suffering from God’s perspective. It was good for him to be afflicted. It was faithfulness that caused God to afflict him. The result of the affliction was so that he could learn God’s decrees and obey His Word.

Again, sickness and suffering is never an easy thing to deal with. One thing is for sure, sickness should not cause us to lose faith in God. God is good, even when we are suffering. Even the ultimate of suffering—death—is an act of God’s goodness. It is hard to imagine that anyone who is in Heaven as a result of sickness or suffering regrets what they went through in this life.

One final note—when people are suffering, it is our responsibility to minister to them, care for them, pray for them, and comfort them. When a person is suffering, it is not always appropriate to emphasize that God will bring good out of the suffering. Yes, that is the truth. However, in the midst of suffering, it is not always the best time to share that truth. Suffering people need our love and encouragement, not necessarily a reminder of sound biblical theology.
http://www.gotquestions.org/God-allow-sickness.html

Question: “Are faith healers for real? Does a faith healer heal with the same power as Jesus?”

Answer: There is no doubt that God has the power to heal anyone at any time. The question is whether He chooses to do so through those who are called “faith healers.” These individuals typically convince their audiences that God wants them to be well and that through their faith—and usually a financial offering—God will reward their faith by healing them through the power of Jesus.

By comparing the healing ministry of the Lord Jesus to that of the modern faith healers, we can determine whether their claims have any basis in Scripture. If, as they say, they heal through the same power and in the same way that Jesus healed, we should be able to see marked similarities between them. However, just the opposite is true. Mark 1:29-34 gives us a description of just one day of Jesus’ healing ministry. His power to heal—and to do all kinds of miracles—was evidence that He had power over both the physical and spiritual effects of the curse of sin. He healed those afflicted with physical diseases, illnesses, and injuries, even raising the dead, and He cast demons out of those who were possessed by them. Only God can rescue us from the results of the Fall of man into sin—disease and death, and by His miracles, Jesus proved His deity.

There are several distinctives in the way Jesus healed that are not characteristic of the modern faith healers. First, He healed instantly. Peter’s mother-in-law (Mark 1:31), the centurion’s son (Matthew 8:13), Jairus’ daughter (Mark 5:41-42), and the paralytic (Luke 5:24-25) were all healed immediately. They did not have to go home and start to get better, as is the advice from many faith healers. Second, Jesus healed totally. Peter’s mother-in-law was fully functional after being healed from an illness so severe she was bedridden, but when Jesus healed her, she rose immediately and prepared a meal for all who were in the house. The blind beggars in Matthew 20:34 were given instant sight. Third, Jesus healed everyone (Matthew 4:24; Luke 4:40). They were not required to be pre-screened by the disciples before coming to Jesus for healing, as is the standard procedure with the healers today. There was no healing line they had to qualify for. Jesus healed all the time in many places, not in a studio with carefully-controlled circumstances.

Fourth, Jesus healed actual organic diseases, not symptoms as the faith healers do. Jesus never healed anyone of a headache or back pain. He healed of leprosy, blindness, and paralysis, miracles that were truly verifiable. Finally, Jesus healed the ultimate disease—death. He brought forth Lazarus after four days in the grave. No faith healer can duplicate that. In addition, His healings did not require faith as a precondition. In fact, most of those He healed were unbelievers.

There have always been false healers who prey on the suffering and the desperate in order to pad their bank accounts. Such behavior is the worst kind of blasphemy because many whose money is wasted on false promises reject Christ outright because He does not do what the healer has promised. Why, if faith healers have the power to heal, do they not walk the halls of the hospitals healing everyone and releasing them all? Why do they not go to Africa and cure all the AIDS cases? They do not because they cannot. They do not have the power of healing that Jesus possessed.
http://www.gotquestions.org/faith-healers.html

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