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Kobus van Rensburg – The Immortal Conquered by Death

7DTW AuthorIcon75 Kobus van Rensburg   The Immortal Conquered by Death

Kobus van Rensburg Immortal Dead Passed away Kobus van Rensburg   The Immortal Conquered by DeathKobus van Rensburg passed away

This morning 21 December 2013 at 05:30 am from an ongoing battle with cancer.  We wish his family our sincerest condolences during this time.  However we can’t let it slip by that Kobus van Rensburg has led millions of people astray from the gospel of Jesus Christ through his incredible false teaching;  for instance that he was Christ and that you to can be Christ and be immortal while still living on earth.

  Here are some of the Facebook comments for Prophet Kobus van Rensburg:

Kobus Van Rensburg RIP like Christ Kobus van Rensburg   The Immortal Conquered by Death

https://www.facebook.com/Prophet.KVR

Kobus van Rensburg was a faith healer

That claimed he healed thousands of people, yet he could not heal himself. No where in scripture is there a verse that tells us that we can become faith healers.   He lied to the public multiple times that he had been healed by God when in fact he had not.  When Jesus heals he heals completely, not in bits and pieces allowing you to get sick again.  See article:  Can Satan Heal?

Kobus van Rensburg twisted version on his new revelation on the doctrine of Immortality.

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Immortality The Word Of Life Not Life Hereafter, Living Forever Now!

Also see the website of Spirit Word Ministries. Prophet Kobus van Rensburg,  http://www.spiritword.org.za

[Emphasis added]

IMMORTALITY

Immortal Life … Can it be?

Somewhere between the mainstream church and people out there looking for a God who really exist , the truth is hanging in the air. Day after day people struggle for life. Yes, not only to make a living. What is the use of making a living when we live such short life that is going to end anyway soon. What is the reason for living if we have to die and go to heaven some day. Why don’t we just die and go to heaven?

The answer to that is in the truth. The truth that is written in the Bible that had been overlooked, misquoted and miss interpreted for many years.

People calling themselves “Christians” sometimes do not even know what the word “Christ” means. It means the anointing and the Spirit of God which come unto Jesus when He was baptized in the Jordan. That same Spirit that was given back to the Father, was poured out on earth on the day of Pentecost.

God’s intention was never for Adam to die. His intention was never for us to die! The whole story in the Bible is about LIFE! Not about dying to go to heaven.

Immortality according to the Bible and according to most dictionaries means to live without dying.

I have realized with a shock that children commit suicide because of the teachings and preaching of most preachers in the main stream church. Most preachers preach that it is bad to live on earth and that it will be much better in heaven “ONE DAY”. What nonsense! You are killing our children, lying to them. The Bible does not say that! I challenge any preacher to show me the scripture saying that the only way to go to heaven is to die!

The whole Word of God is about Life! Right from the beginning and basically in every book of the Bible we can see the truth.

Most people will ask , but why are people still dying? Born again Christians who are supposed to have the Spirit of Christ in them. The Spirit that raised Christ from the dead that is supposed to quicken our mortal bodies.

You can only ask that question if the truth has never been preached to you. Surely you can also ask that question if you are not born again. The Bible says that you cannot hear the revelation if someone is not preaching it.

For many years the only “truth” for people was the catholic religion. Luther had to stand up and preach the revelation that you don’t have to pay for your sins. It was in the Bible all the time. But still, someone had to preach the truth. The same happens with new revelation. For many years no one spoke in tongues. It was in the Bible all the time, but someone had to stand up and preach it.

No difference with the word of immortality which is probably the greatest revelation you will ever hear.

The Bible can very easily be misinterpreted because of incorrect translations or translators, trying to push their own doctrines. A very good tip for Bible scholars will be to ensure that the scripture they read is declared by scripture and not something happening in the world or some preacher’s own interpretation. Always test the scriptures by reading the context of the whole chapter. Sometimes it will help to read different translations.

1Co 2:9 (KJV) But as it is written, Eye hath not seen, nor ear heard, neither have entered into the heart of man, the things which God hath prepared for them that love him. 1Co 2:10 (KJV) But God hath revealed them unto us by his Spirit: for the Spirit searcheth all things, yea, the deep things of God.

Welcome to this awesome Word of God. Today you have come here, to see one of the greatest revealed mysteries and secrets of God.

The Bible says in Deut 29:29 that “the secret things belong unto the Lord our God, but the things which are revealed belong to us and to our children for ever………..”

The Bible is very clear! You are supposed to be immortal. It says, that it is for those who believe and for those who seek it! Stick with me through this amazing teaching and you will be filled with joy and peace forever.

What is the meaning of the word Immortality?

Is God’s plan for us to die and then go to heaven?

If so, why don’t we just die and go?

What does the Bible say about it?

The word “Immortality” in the Websters’s Dictionary is described as ” EXEMPTION FROM DEATH” or ” UNENDING EXISTENCE” It does not say die and then live or life after death.

Christians will very easily and often quote John 10:10

Joh 10:10 The thief does not come except to steal and to kill and to destroy. I have come so that they might have life, and that they might have it more abundantly.

I don’t think they realize what they are quoting

See the following scriptures:

Rom 8:11 But if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his Spirit that dwelleth in you.

1Co 15:53 For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality.

1Co 15:54 So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.

2Co 4:11 For we which live are always delivered unto death for Jesus’ sake, that the life also of Jesus might be made manifest in our mortal flesh.

It does not say that it will be made manifest AFTER we have died ! It says in the mortal flesh. In other words the flesh which is liable to death. Not the flesh that is dead already.

Carefully look at the following scriptures. Note that Paul is talking about 2 groups of people. He says “death works in us, but life in you” two groups.

2Co 4:10 to 14: always bearing about the dying of the Lord Jesus in the body, so that the life of Jesus also might be revealed in our body. For we who live are always being delivered to death for Jesus’ sake, so that the life of Jesus might also be revealed in our body.So then death works in us, but life in you. For we, having the same spirit of faith (according as it is written, “I believed, and therefore I have spoken”); we also believed and therefore speak, knowing that He who raised up the Lord Jesus shall also raise us up by Jesus, and shall present us with you.

We know that people are dying and therefore most people who don’t get this revelation will say ” but why are people still dying today?”

Joh 6:47 Truly, truly, I say to you, He who believes on Me has everlasting life.

He did not say , he who believes in ME will die and go to heaven.

Read the whole of John 6 and see how many times HE says: If you eat of My flesh and drink of My blood , you will NEVER DIE!

Jesus says “I am the Bread of life.” & Your fathers ate the manna in the wilderness, and died. This is the Bread which comes down from Heaven, so that a man may eat of it and not die.

Doesnt the Bible say that the last enemy to be subdued and abolished is death?

Can I say this: When you die, you have been conquered by death! You have not subdued death or conquered death. Death is only conquered when you live and don’t die.

Right from the beginning, in Genesis, God’s plan for us was to live and not die. The question in the garden was not sin. It was all about LIFE and DEATH.

Gen 3:3 But of the fruit of the tree which is in the middle of the garden, God has said, You shall not eat of it, neither shall you touch it, lest you die.

Gen 3:22 And Jehovah God said, Behold, the man has become as one of Us, to know good and evil. And now, lest he put forth his hand and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live forever,

Gen 3:23 therefore Jehovah God sent him out from the garden of Eden to till the ground from which he had been taken.

Gen 3:24 And He drove out the man. And He placed cherubs at the east of the garden of Eden, and a flaming sword which turned every way, to guard the way to the tree of life.

Psa 118:17 I shall not die but live, and shall declare the works and recount the illustrious acts of the Lord.

Psa 118:24 This is the day which the Lord has brought about; we will rejoice and be glad in it.

Read the whole of Ps 118 and try to see the prophetic Word that the Psalmist is bringing.

Act 13:35 For this reason He says also in another psalm, You will not allow Your Holy One to see corruption [to undergo putrefaction and dissolution of the grave]. [Ps. 16:10.]

Act 13:36 For David, after he had served God’s will and purpose and counsel in his own generation, fell asleep [in death] and was buried among his forefathers, and he did see corruption and undergo putrefaction and dissolution [of the grave].

Act 13:37 But He Whom God raised up [to life] saw no corruption [did not experience putrefaction and dissolution of the grave].

Act 13:41 Look, you scoffers and scorners, and marvel and perish and vanish away; for I am doing a deed in your days, a deed which you will never have confidence in or believe, [even] if someone [clearly describing it in detail] declares it to you. [Hab. 1:5.]

Why will Paul refer to Habakkuk? What is the context?

Let us go to Habakkuk and see.

Hab 1:5 Look around [you, Habakkuk, replied the Lord] among the nations and see! And be astonished! Astounded! For I am putting into effect a work in your days [such] that you would not believe it if it were told you. [Acts 13:40, 41.]

Looking at this, we still battle to see any context.

Hab 2:2 And Jehovah answered me and said, Write the vision, and make it plain on the tablets, that he who reads it may run.

Hab 2:3 For the vision is still for an appointed time, but it speaks to the end, and it does not lie. Though it lingers, wait for it; because it will surely come. It will not tarry.

Hab 1:12 Are You not from everlasting, O Jehovah my God, my Holy One? We shall not die.

What is it saying?

The Lord says to Habakkuk , Write the vision down, for there is an appointed time, when it will manifest. Then no one will believe this. What vision? ” WE WILL NEVER DIE”

The word does say that we shall not all die before He returns!

Psa 102:18 Let this be recorded for the generation yet unborn, that a people yet to be created shall praise the Lord.

Psa 102:20 To hear the sighing and groaning of the prisoner, to loose those who are appointed to death,

These guys new that it was not for there time, but for a generation yet unborn.

1 Pe 1:23 You have been regenerated (born again), not from a mortal origin (seed, sperm), but from one that is immortal by the ever living and lasting Word of God.

1Pe 1:24 For all flesh (mankind) is like grass, and all its glory (honor) like [the] flower of grass. The grass withers and the flower drops off,

1Pe 1:25 But the Word of the Lord (divine instruction, the Gospel) endures forever. And this Word is the good news which was preached to you. [Isa. 40:6-9.]

Yes, all flesh is like grass, BUT when you become BORN AGAIN , from the IMMORTAL SEED of GOD, He will renew your strength and your mortal body will be quickened.

Remember that this is only for those who believe!

If it is still difficult to take it, try the next scripture:

Rom 2:7 To those who by patient persistence in well-doing [springing from piety] seek [unseen but sure] glory and honor and [the eternal blessedness of] immortality, He will give eternal life.

It is in all the translations

To those who seek Glory and Honor AND IMMORTALITY, He will give eternal life.

Right through the Bible we see that GOD wants us to live.

Deu 30:19 I call heaven and earth to witness this day against you that I have set before you life and death, the blessings and the curses; therefore choose life, that you and your descendants may live.

There was a time when people had an appointment with death, but that appointment with death is cancelled (Ps 102)

This is only a glimpse of what the Word really says.

There are 19 or more scripture packed teachings by Prophet Kobus van Rensburg on CD that will set you free. Be prepared to listen for more that a hour per teaching. This is true deliverance. You have not heard the message if you have not listened to the CD’s. You can order it directly from Spirit Word Ministries spiritword.org.za

IMMORTAL LIFE not only LIFE HEREAFTER – Born from the IMMORTAL WORD or SEED of GOD – CHOOSE LIFE Today

          Article Source:

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COMMENTS:

It is very sad to think that someone can be so fooled into thinking they can be immortal on earth. When the bible speaks about immortality it speaks about what will happen to us after we die.  When we become born again Christians, the Holy Spirit comes to abide in us and we become new creatures in Jesus Christ who can still physically die, but eternally our souls will go to heaven.  It appears that Kobus van Rensburg  rejected Heaven and wanted to stay on earth.  Why I do not know when the bible says:

(Matthew 6:19-21) 19Lay not up for yourselves treasures upon earth, where moth and rust doth corrupt, and where thieves break through and steal: 20But lay up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where neither moth nor rust doth corrupt, and where thieves do not break through nor steal: 21For where your treasure is, there will your heart be also.

Kobus van Rensburg quotes Corinthians above but he does not quote the verses in context.  These verses speak about the time of the rapture, when we are caught up in the air, and the perishable puts on the imperishable, and this mortal puts on immortality.

1 Corinthians 15:51-54
51 Listen, I will tell you a mystery: We will not all sleep, but we will all be changed –
52 in a moment, in the blinking of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, and the dead will be raised imperishable, and we will be changed.
53 For this perishable body must put on the imperishable, and this mortal body must put on immortality.
54 Now when this perishable puts on the imperishable, and this mortal puts on immortality, then the saying that is written will happen, ​​​​​​“Death has been swallowed up in victory.”

Kobus refers to Habakkuk in the most astonishing twisting of scripture I have ever seen.  He says:

Why will Paul refer to Habakkuk? What is the context?

Let us go to Habakkuk and see.

Hab 1:5 Look around [you, Habakkuk, replied the Lord] among the nations and see! And be astonished! Astounded! For I am putting into effect a work in your days [such] that you would not believe it if it were told you. [Acts 13:40, 41.]

Looking at this, we still battle to see any context.

Hab 2:2 And Jehovah answered me and said, Write the vision, and make it plain on the tablets, that he who reads it may run.

Hab 2:3 For the vision is still for an appointed time, but it speaks to the end, and it does not lie. Though it lingers, wait for it; because it will surely come. It will not tarry.

Hab 1:12 Are You not from everlasting, O Jehovah my God, my Holy One? We shall not die.

What is it saying?

The Lord says to Habakkuk , Write the vision down, for there is an appointed time, when it will manifest. Then no one will believe this. What vision? ” WE WILL NEVER DIE”

He quoted Habakkuk 1:5 that says:   “5 Behold ye among the heathen, and regard, and wonder marvellously: for I will work a work in your days, which ye will not believe, though it be told you.”   Kobus says that this thing that God will work in his days which no one will believe is when everyone becomes immortal.  The biblical understanding of this scripture is this.  God is telling Habbakkuk to write down a vision about the crucifixion of Jesus Christ of which the Jews would not believe!  And this is the verse Paul quoted by Antioch of Pisidia, when warning the Jews of the danger to which they were exposed themselves if they neglected the gospel of Jesus Christ (Acts 13:40, 41).

Let’s look at Habakkuk 1-12 that says “Hab 1:12 Are You not from everlasting, O Jehovah my God, my Holy One? We shall not die.”   Habbukuk was pleading with God to hear his voice over the state of the nation of Judah, they had become defiled and were extremely sinful.  God finally replied and tells him of the chastisements He has prepared for the instruction of His rebellous people.  1) v5 “Behold ye among the heathen, and regard, and wonder marvelously, for I will work a work in your days, which ye will not believe, though it be told you”  and 2) God rose rose up up the Chaldeans (Babylonians) Habakkuk 1:6-11  “that bitter and hasty nation” to “march through the breadth of the land, to possess the dwelling-places that were not theirs.”  The punishment was harsh and Habakkuk called out to God:

Habakkuk 1:12
12 “Art thou not from everlasting, O LORD my God, mine Holy One? we shall not die. O LORD, thou hast ordained them for judgment; and, O mighty God, thou hast established them for correction.”

Habakkuk was amazed that God would deal with his sheep by giving them over to the power of a satanic nation.  He knew that chastening was deserved, but he is shocked when he learns who the one metering out the punishment is going to be. So he turns to God praying,  “Art Thou not from everlasting, O Lord my God, my Holy One? We shall not die. O Lord, Thou hast ordained them for judgment; and, 0 mighty God, Thou hast established them for correction”   A very simple and faithful prayer – He knew Israel was in a covenant relationship with God, they were His people and God who would not go back on his promise. In other words, even through Judah would be sorely afflicted by the Chaldeans they would never be cut off from God, until such time as they rejected Jesus Christ out right, in the coming future.

Kobus van Resnburg says:

Joh 6:47 Truly, truly, I say to you, He who believes on Me has everlasting life.

He did not say , he who believes in ME will die and go to heaven.

Lets look at:

John 11:25-26
25 Jesus said unto her, I am the resurrection, and the life: he that believeth in me, though he were dead, yet shall he live:
26 And whosoever liveth and believeth in me shall never die. Believest thou this?

Lets look at the above verses for more clarity on the matter.

1) “I am the resurrection, and the life”  What is Jesus telling the woman? He is telling her that you do not have to wait until the resurrection on the last day because I (that is Jesus Christ) am the Resurrection and the Life and when you become a born again Christian I enter you and death is conquered.  You do not become physically immortal on earth, but your soul will see everlasting life.

2)  Jesus then added “He that believeth in me, though he were dead, yet shall he live.”  When will this be? When Jesus returns from heaven, he shall descend with a shout and all empty graves where all the dead Christians lie will rise up.

3)  Jesus then adds “Whosoever liveth and believeth in me shall never die.”  When will this be?  Jesus then looks into time when those who have never died at all, but will be living on earth when He returns through the Rapture, will be changed without dying and  “the perishable puts on the imperishable, and this mortal puts on immortality” as we get caught up in the air, What a wonderful revelation!  And then He puts the question, “Believest thou this?”

As we can see Kobus van Rensburg did not understand the bible and should never have been allowed the time he was given to preach and lead people astray.  And the people he has led astray are people who do not open their bibles to test the spirits to see if what Kobus van Rensburg is saying is true or not.

I pray that someone who was captured under Kobus van Rensburg’s spell of con-artistry and biblical illiteracy sees the truth.

pixel Kobus van Rensburg   The Immortal Conquered by Death

192 comments to Kobus van Rensburg – The Immortal Conquered by Death

  • Kobus van Rensburg wrote:

    What is the meaning of the word Immortality?

    Is God’s plan for us to die and then go to heaven?

    If so, why don’t we just die and go?

    Jesus of Nazareth wrote:

    Let not your heart be troubled: ye believe in God, believe also in me. In my Father’s house (heaven) are many mansions: if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you (in heaven). And if I go and prepare a place for you (in heaven), I will come again, and receive you unto myself; that where I am, there (in heaven) ye may be also. (John 14:1-3)

    Either Jesus or Kobus van Rensburg is lying. Take your pick and seal your fate and destination for all eternity. God is not mocked.

  • Rabe

    I followed the prophet teachings and i just want to say he was a true man of God regardless of what you have to say..He has run His race and I know that the grace of our God was sufficient for Him.just like Paul He asked God to remove the thorn from his flesh,3 times he asked and God said to him that the his grace was sufficient enough for Paul ,A true warrior ,a true soldier of God,He never gave up on God ,in the midst of it all He fixed his eyes on Jesus His master.We salute you man of God.you have now joined those that are cheering us…

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    Rabe

    Where exactly do you think Kobus van Rensburg has gone after his passing? Certainly not heaven because Kobus did not believe in heaven. Did you read the article?

    Does it not bother you in the slightest that Kobus preached that he was immortal yet he died? Does it not bother you that this doctrine of immortality is not found in the bible that is why Kobus is not immortal but a mere human who died?

  • Monica Koch

    The problem in this world is people do not know the Word and do not have a relationship with the Father, neither with His Son, but follow the doctrines of man, and not the Word.
    If and when we truely have a relationship with the Father, we will not teach the doctrines such as this man did.

    And on the other end we will also not blindly follow these doctrines of man.

    I didn’t have to listen to much of this man to know he is not on base with the Word of G-d.

  • Ruan

    With reference to immortality — i think Kobus referred to the immortality of the soul which will and can never die — of course it is common knowledge the our flesh will perish

  • Ruan wrote:

    With reference to immortality — i think Kobus referred to the immortality of the soul which will and can never die — of course it is common knowledge the our flesh will perish

    You know as well as I that it is NOT what Kobus van Rensburg had in mind when he said he is immortal. In any case the Bible clearly refers of the second death of all the souls who die without Jesus Christ. Do you think Kobus referred to this as well when he said he is immortal? You seem to suggest it when you say the soul, whether in heaven or hell, is immortal. Your argument is rather weak.

  • Monica Koch wrote:

    The problem in this world is people do not know the Word and do not have a relationship with the Father, neither with His Son, but follow the doctrines of man, and not the Word.
    If and when we truely have a relationship with the Father, we will not teach the doctrines such as this man did.

    And on the other end we will also not blindly follow these doctrines of man.

    I didn’t have to listen to much of this man to know he is not on base with the Word of G-d.

    I totally agree.

  • charles siamutwa

    The Prophet spoke the truth. His
    passing does not change the truth he spoke. You and your small religious dry website devoid of the Spirit will soon be forgotten once the fruit of the seeds of hate you have been spouting rippens and you drink of the same but the words of the Prophet will endure. I am sorry if this hurts your sensitive tiny egos but I truly hope you repent soon enough before hell sucks down your damned souls

  • David

    Let’s be like Peter and feed the sheep. Peter too performed miracles in Jesus name and by the power of Jesus. Even more we should try to be as Jesus: loving, merciful, forgiving, honest and true. Further as he is a never changing God, don’t change the context of the bible. Test each and everything by the Spirit. I feel this argument on a man named Kobus is fruitless from both sides. Do the work of God. Don’t be idle!

  • David wrote:

    Let’s be like Peter and feed the sheep. Peter too performed miracles in Jesus name and by the power of Jesus. Even more we should try to be as Jesus: loving, merciful, forgiving, honest and true. Further as he is a never changing God, don’t change the context of the bible. Test each and everything by the Spirit. I feel this argument on a man named Kobus is fruitless from both sides. Do the work of God. Don’t be idle!

    OK, let’s feed the sheep like Peter. “But Peter said to him, “May your silver perish with you, because you thought you could obtain the gift of God with money!” (Acts 8:20)

    And lest you forget, Peter was saying to him: “May you go to hell because you think the Gospel is a moneymaking business.”

    David wrote:

    I feel this argument on a man named Kobus is fruitless from both sides.

    You know, you’re so right. All the apostles’ arguments were fruitless. Observe!

    “But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed.”
    (Gal 1:8) – Paul of Tarsus

    Woe unto them! for they have gone in the way of Cain, and ran greedily after the error of Balaam for reward (money), and perished in the gainsaying of Core. These are spots in your feasts of charity, when they feast with you, feeding themselves without fear (enriching themselves without fear): clouds they are without water, carried about of winds; trees whose fruit withereth, without fruit, twice dead, plucked up by the roots; Raging waves of the sea, foaming out their own shame; wandering stars, to whom is reserved the blackness of darkness for ever. (Jude 1:11-13)

    So David, you are saying that we should stand by apathetically while millions are led astray by false teachers? Trying to stop people from landing up in hell, sure is fruitless. Goody for you.

  • charles siamutwa

    The Prophet spoke the truth. His passing does not change the truth he spoke. You and your small religious dry website devoid of the Spirit will soon be forgotten once the fruit of the seeds of hate you have been spouting rippens and you drink of the same but the words of the Prophet will endure. I am sorry if this hurts your sensitive tiny egos but I truly hope you repent soon enough before hell sucks down your damned souls

    You seem to be a very intelligent person who can understand reason For goodness sake, Kobus believed he is immortal here on earth and yet he has died. What more do you need to prove that he did not speak the truth? Are you so deceived that you fail to see, perceive, understand, notice that he is dead?

  • Stacey

    I would just like to say that this website is awesome!!!, :)

    I’m so glad other people are exposing the work’s of the enemy!! Whoohooo!!, (the wolve’s in sheep’s clothing), even taking place here in South Africa.

    An acquaintance spoke to me yesterday in the train on the way to work, he happen’s to listen to Kobus Van Rensburg’s teaching, sit’s under leadership that agree with his teaching and he is unfortunately deceived by it all. After he ‘excitedly’ spoke to me about Kobus’s passing and how he believe’s he will be raised from the dead, and stating the fact that we can be immortal on this earth,I felt very sad, hurt, upset, (mixed emotion’s), to know that people are deceived. I know the enemy is out there.

    He also mentioned that they’re keeping Kobus body in his church at current, praying over him.,.. to be raised from the dead.

    I gently mentioned to him that if he believe’s and preache’s he is immortal and does not have to die on this earth, first of all he will be the first one out of countless million’s of people (including true christian’s) that have lived on this earth, lol, second of all, it would not be neccesary for people to pray for him to be raised from the dead, if he so strongly belived in immortality-defeat’s the whole purpose.

    Once again I am so glad that this website is up and running. Keep up the good work, :)

    Please may I have one of the owner’s personal email address, I’d like to share something.

    Go well, Stacey, :)

  • Stacey

    With regard’s to the above article I wrote, I wanted to google Kobus Van Rensburg and he’s immortality on earth preaching, this is how I came across this website.

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    Hi Stacey

    Thank you for your comment!! Stick around :)

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    Ruan

    >> With reference to immortality — i think Kobus referred to the immortality of the soul which will and can never die — of course it is common knowledge the our flesh will perish

    That is not what Kobus taught, he taugth that you could be immortal on earth and not die.

  • Tendayi Zirima

    If this man lied to me that I am one with the father and that I could never die then God cannot be mocked for sure because I am not dead to sin buit alive in christ who gives me strength.

  • Lejaja

    Please note that Kobus reffered to that moment when Jesus comes for second time. No one knows when Jesus would come and it could have been well during Kobus’s life time. Immortalility is true and it is only that it may come at a time when you don’t know which may be today or tommorrow or years from now. If Jesus come on friday before Kobus died then you would well be saying he told the truth. everything with God is time bound. It is better to start talking or preaching about it now until it comes.

  • David

    Thomas Lessing, why argue about the word of Jesus Christ with such great wisdom when you can use such effort in the world? Jesus last request and question to Peter John 21-15 “Simon son of John, do you truly love me more than these?” And Peter replied “Yes Lord you know that I love you” Jesus replied “Feed my Lambs”
    Further you refer to money when we discuss being IDLE, I refer to the inactiveness of the world and all patrons to do as what Jesus requested. Also move on, Kobus is dead, Gods word is not.

  • David wrote:

    Thomas Lessing, why argue about the word of Jesus Christ with such great wisdom when you can use such effort in the world? Jesus last request and question to Peter John 21-15 “Simon son of John, do you truly love me more than these?” And Peter replied “Yes Lord you know that I love you” Jesus replied “Feed my Lambs”

    Further you refer to money when we discuss being IDLE, I refer to the inactiveness of the world and all patrons to do as what Jesus requested. Also move on, Kobus is dead, Gods word is not.

    If you are not concerned about the abundance of false teachings that are proliferating the church then you are not concerned about feeding the sheep. I mentioned money because it is the main driving force behind false teaching. You should know that. In any case your attitude that it is fruitless to expose false doctrine is the same as asking “Am I my brother’s keeper?” If you really love Jesus you won’t just preach the Gospel you will expose false doctrine and warn the church about it day and night. In fact Jude wrote:

    Beloved, when I gave all diligence to write unto you of the common salvation, it was needful for me to write unto you, and exhort you that ye should earnestly contend for the faith which was once delivered unto the saints. For there are certain men crept in unawares, who were before of old ordained to this condemnation, ungodly men, turning the grace of our God into lasciviousness, and denying the only Lord God, and our Lord Jesus Christ. (Jud 1:3-4)

    Yes, Kobus is dead but there are many still alive who are just like him. Are you going to warn people against them or let them be drawn into the abyss hook line and sinker?

  • David

    I humbly apoogise. I will go work thge streets while you work the blog.

  • Lejaja

    If Kobus was referring to Jesus Christ’s Second Coming in regard to immortality, why are his followers praying for his resurrection in their church? Do they believe the Second Coming has already taken place? And if so, why are they praying? When Jesus returns no one will need to pray because the believers are going to be resurrected without them having to pray.

  • David wrote:

    I humbly apoogise (sic). I will go work thge (sic) streets while you work the blog.

    The apostles had a two pronged ministry – to preach the Gospel and to expose false doctrine. You cannot preach the Gospel without exposing false doctrine. In any case the Word teaches us:

    But now are they many members, yet but one body. And the eye cannot say unto the hand, I have no need of thee: nor again the head to the feet, I have no need of you. (1 Co 12:20-21)

    We are no belittling your street work but you are demeaning our work on this blog. Why? Do you think your street work is more important? Perhaps it is but don’t hamper the less important work of exposing false teaching.

  • David

    What I have been trying to say is let God do His work for revenge is his not yours. Lies will be exposed and so also false prophets with time. You and I should be working on obtaining souls for Christ.
    “Let the dead bury the dead” words of Jesus, not mine

  • David

    And what about the poor souls who are being misled, especially the young lambs? Should we allow them to be thrown to the wolves in sheep’s clothing so that they may be ravished and torn apart by them?

  • Tshepo

    The word of GOD is foolish to those who are parishing.John3v16 he came to this world to save his beloved once.Immortality is not for non-believers.

  • Tshepo

    The word of GOD is foolish to those who are parishing.John3v16 he came to this world to save his beloved once.Immortality is not for non-believers.

    Was Kobus van Rensburg and unbeliever cause he died.

  • Grace

    Dear Deborah and the Crew that are judging Kobus. It’s a sure sign that you don’t know God, because if you knew God, you couldn’t sit back relax and wait for Kobus to say something that you perceive to be wrong, so that you can judge, criticise and prove him wrong. Instead, you would be crying, praying and fasting for him to truly know God, because he met a lot of people. You will pray that Oh God, let this man be saved, so that whatever comes out of his mouth will be pure for millions to be saved. If you know God, where is the love of God in you? Why casting stones? Pray, cry out to God for the souls that are going astray. You said Prophet TB Joshua and Kobus are false, fine. Then if you know that they are false, then it means you are true, then let God send you to Lagos, to Rustenburg etc to save the people their. If you can’t go and reach out to the people in the places I have mentioned, then shut up and pray. If you can’t shut up and pray , but judge, then you don’t know God, and if you don’t know God, then everything that is coming out of your mouth is useless. So you can quote all the verses you want, but you are denying the power. And if you are denying the power then everything you are quaoting is worthyless(to you). For Kobus, it is finished, you work out your own salvation with fear and terrimbling. At whatever point in time, that you feel that anyone is leading people astray, PRAY or enter the ministry and lead all the people on earth to God. Leave the judging business to God. By the way, if you ask me questions to argue, I won’t respond, but if you ask me questions to know, I will.

  • Gk

    so if someone passes away and does not wake up, how do u explain immortality. what I understand about life after death is in john 11:25 we will rise again with him. but saying that we live forever in this body is extreem and out of the blocks.

  • Grace

    You have a beautiful name but, ironically enough, you are judging us. We have never judged Kobus or his church. We have consistently evaluated his teachings and doctrines in the light of God’s Word, which I may add, is a direct command of God (1 John 4:1). If you are a child of God, as you claim, it is your duty to do the same.

    But the spiritual man tries all things [he examines, investigates, inquires into, questions, and discerns all things], yet is himself to be put on trial and judged by no one [he can read the meaning of everything, but no one can properly discern or appraise or get an insight into him]. (1 Cor 2:15)

    If you are a grown saint (no longer drinking milk) then you should discern (judge) all things you hear to make sure it is of God and if is not of God, you should reject it outright. The Bible says that children are tossed to and fro by false doctrines and not spiritually grown saints.

    Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ: That we henceforth be no more children, tossed to and fro, and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the sleight of men, and cunning craftiness, whereby they lie in wait to deceive;
    (Eph 4:13-14)

    We are not judging Kobus. He judged himself though his erroneous belief that he was immortal. Please don’t blame us.

  • GK

    so if someone passes away and does not wake up, how do u explain immortality. what I understand about life after death is in john 11:25 we will rise again with him. but saying that we live forever in this body is extreem and out of the blocks.

    When Kobus said he was immortal he wasn’t thinking of John 11:25. What he meant is that he was already immortal in his earthly body this side of the grave, in other words, here and now and not in a place like heaven one day. His belief was an extreme form of Kingdom Now theology which is rife in the Emergent Church.

    In short, Kobus did not believe that he would be raised from the dead one day because he was already immortal. In fact, he believed that he was Christ.

    John 11:25 simply affirms that Jesus Christ is the only One who can give life to dead bodies, like Lazarus whom He raised from the dead to prove to the Jews that He was their Messiah. It doesn’t mean that saints never die and live forever on this earth. Why are Kobus’ followers still praying for his resurrection while nothing is happening and he remains dead? How long are they going to pray until it dawns on them that he was not immortal – never destined to die?

    It is obvious that you did not read Kobus’ sermon posted here.

  • kagiso

    Kobus was a man God,if he did not believe in immortality he was suppose do die very quickly,he was different he believed in life more than death,unlike lot believers who believe death more than life,obvious our body cannot live forever we can learn from these man to believe in life.

  • kagiso

    Kobus was a man God, if he did not believe in immortality he was suppose do die very quickly, he was different he believed in life more than death, unlike lot believers who believe death more than life, obvious our body cannot live forever we can learn from these man to believe in life.

    So, if you believe in immortality, you don’t die so quickly and your cancer lingers on for much longer than the cancer of those who do not believe in immortality. The latter die more quickly because they are unbelievers and do not believe in life but death. You are talking a lot of nonsense and you don’t even know that you are talking nonsense. This usually happens with people who are so heavily deceived and don’t even know it.

    Preach the word; be instant in season, out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort with all longsuffering and doctrine. For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears; And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables. (2 Ti 4:2-4)

    Kagiso, are you immortal in the sense that you will never die and go to heaven. If so, you cannot go to heaven because the Bible clearly says:

    Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption. (1 Co 15:50)

  • kagiso wrote:

    Kobus was a man God, if he did not believe in immortality he was suppose do die very quickly, he was different he believed in life more than death, unlike lot believers who believe death more than life, obvious our body cannot live forever we can learn from these man to believe in life.

    I can assure you that Kobus did not teach immortality so that you may believe more in life than in death. That’s not what the word “immortality” means. Immortality means that you will never die and that’s exactly what he blieved. He believed that he would never die, this side of the grave.

    What do mean you by “Kobus was a man God.” Only Jesus is truly man and truly God. Are you saying that Kobus was Christ?

  • Lourens

    #1 David clearly does not “get” how many people this blog reaches…

    #2 David clearly does not “get” that there is ONE body.. BUT different members… so the work on this blog is reaching different people online that it could NEVER EVER have reached on “the streets”…

    #3 Although the internet is littered with false information and therefore it’s difficult finding truth, it’s unfortunately EVEN HARDER finding truth on the streets or in churches.

    Conclusion…?

    KEEP GOING THOMAS & DEBORA… FEW have the courage to do what you guys are doing here!

  • Hi Debs, this exposure of Kobus is spot on. I note that as usual you stick to the Word and to logic. It’s nice to see that Thomas is doing the same.
    I checked the “Can Satan Heal?” article as suggested and know for definite that he heals. I joined the Armstrongite cult in 1978, and was healed after about eight years of LSD flashbacks and terrible panic attacks from having taken the hallucinogen. I was also healed totally of strange dreams that I had continually, and flashes in my sight as well as seeing halos around objects and people, &c.
    It was as if I was back to my original self again, at least mentally and physically. I did not become a proper Christian. My unChristian attitudes and living style didn’t change.
    HOwever, I was so convinced that the healing was from God that it made me accept Armstrong was “God’s only true apostle on earth today” as he taught. The healing convinced me that many of his erroneous doctrines were true.
    That was in spite of the fact that after two years the problems ALL came back and with a vengeance. I believed that God was punishing me for not being a good Worldwide Church of God member. What kept me clinging to the cult was that God had healed me and I’d need to remain in the cult to get back to being healed again.
    Paul tells us in Romans that the gifts of God are without repentance. He doesn’t give them and take them back, as I am now all too aware.
    So I thoroughly endorse the “Can Satan Heal?” conclusion: He can, if only to take from people the illnesses, &c., that he puts on them. Healings, like miracles, of themselves prove nothing.
    When, after around twenty years, my wife and I realized that WCG was a cult, we left. My problems are minor but they have not left me. Better that I have God’s Word, heed it, and act on it rather than on any healin; reminding myself as I do that: ALL things work to the good for those that are in Christ.
    Interesting, that these faith healers with their lucrative businesses cannot heal themselves! When they cannot heal others, they put the blame on the suffering person for not having enough faith. Kenneth Copeland is an expert in this kind of duplicity. You can see him on YouTube mock those who are not healed with that very accusation.
    My sister got involved with Jesse DuPlantis and a few other of those quacks. (Sorry if I’ve mentioned this before, my memory’s not too good.) She was told several times that she was healed, including by Rory and Wendy, and her cancer got worse till she died in excrutiating pain. For all the “teachings” she heeded, she knew very little of Scripture accept those things selected and twisted to fit the name-it-and-claim-it-paradigm.
    She spent a fortune on those quacks and paid dearly for it but not only in money!
    The scary thing is that whatever we put above God becomes our god. That means family, friends, pastors, churches and religion.
    God and His word must come first in our lives. These “healers”–and cult leaders–love it when they come first in people’s lives because it means they are in their disciples’ driving seats.
    That means these disciples are idolators having a god before God, and these quacks don’t mind it a bit. They are wolves in sheep’s clothing. The fleeced sheep are deceived and they need to be told that being deceived is as bad, if not worse, as being a deceiver [1 Tim 3 :13]. They ought to bear in mind that Eve was deceived and Adam wasn’t and though man had the curse of working the earth and getting his food by the sweat of his brow, woman was to bear children in pain and have the man rule over her.
    We are accountable for being deceived. Very often we think that deceivers are worse than the deceived victims. The Bible seems to say different.
    When people defend Hinn, Bonnke, DuPlantis, Copeland and the like (who are prophesied of in 2 Peter 2:3) and accuse those who reprove their works (obeying Ephesians 5:11) of spreading hate, such people are deceived. The fact that they contradict plain statements of Scripture, as well as ignore 1 Thessalonians 5:21 and 1 John 4:1, show that clearly to any biblically literate person.
    I notice that Kobus called himself a prophet. Did he never read Luke 16:16? They are the Words of Jesus Christ!

  • phillip

    let me pass on my on my condolencies to the prophet’s family and say that indeed we have lostva true man of God may the Spirit of Jesus comfort you.
    and let me say to those that say the teaching about immortality is a heresy are lost even the apostle paul believed and taught about it but he died also, so shoul we say thay he was a false apostle. the teaching on immortality is a true teaching the bible says not all of us will see death, enoch and elijah did not die but were raptured to heaven without testing death, the death of the prophet kobus does not discredit the truthfulness of the teaching on immortality. most preachers taught on healing but died of sickness, david once said l will not die but live and declare the works of the lord but he died. people need to be careful of what they say about the word thats meant to save them l am not saying that teachings must not be tested but do so with the leading of the holy spirit himself

  • Philip

    let me pass on my on my condolencies to the prophet’s family and say that indeed we have lostva true man of God may the Spirit of Jesus comfort you.
    and let me say to those that say the teaching about immortality is a heresy are lost even the apostle paul believed and taught about it but he died also, so shoul we say thay he was a false apostle. the teaching on immortality is a true teaching the bible says not all of us will see death, enoch and elijah did not die but were raptured to heaven without testing death, the death of the prophet kobus does not discredit the truthfulness of the teaching on immortality. most preachers taught on healing but died of sickness, david once said l will not die but live and declare the works of the lord but he died. people need to be careful of

    Please tell us, why are his followers still praying for his resurrection if he believed in immortality this side of the grave? One of his followers wrote on Facebook:

    PROPHET KOBUS VAN RENSBURG WILL LIVE… AND PROCLAIM THE GOOD WORKS OF THE LORD… WE CANCEL ALL EVIL AND DARKNESS AGAINST HIS LIFE, WE CONDEMN EVERY TONGUE THAT RISES UP AGAINST HIM, NO WEAPON FORMED AGAINST HIM SHALL PROSPER… HE IS RESTORED, HE IS RENEWED, HE IS REVIVED… THE SAME SPIRIT WHICH ALSO WAS IN CHRIST JESUS IS QUICKENING HIS MORTAL BODY… JESUS IS LORD OF KOBUS VAN RENSBURG’S LIFE, THEREFORE NOTHING WILL HURT OR HARM HIM. PROPHET KOBUS VAN RENSBURG IS HEALTHY & STRONG, HE HAS SUPERNATURAL ABUNDANT LIFE IN JESUS’ NAME

    As you can see, this was in April 2012 but they are still doing exactly the same now that Kobus is dead. They are still praying for his resurrection.

    If Kobus is healthy and strong and has supernatural abundant life in Jesus, why are they praying for him?

    If the person was speaking about immortality AFTER death in heaven, as you are doing, then Kobus must be very busy proclaiming the Good News of the Lord in heaven. Really???

    The immorality Paul and Jesus spoke of was not the immortality Kobus van Rensburg taught. Jesus said:

    I am the resurrection, and the life: he that believeth in me, though he were dead, yet shall he live: And whosoever liveth and believeth in me shall never die [in heaven and not on earth because flesh and blood [our earthly bodies] cannot inherit the Kingdom of God). Believest thou this? (Joh 11:25-26)

    Phillip, are you immortal in the sense that you are never bound for the grave or cremation but will live on in your present body for evermore?

    Let’s look at Kobus’ immortality teaching a bit closer. God said: “he that sins must die.” He was not only speaking of spiritual death (to be separated from Him for evermore) but also physical death (Genesis 3:19). Anyone who claims to be immortal this side of the grave is in fact boasting that he has never sinned and is sinless because it was sin that caused God to say “he that sins must die.” Anyone who claims to have never sinned (through his belief in immortality this side of the grave) is brazenly telling everyone that he is Christ, the only Person who never sinned. The immortality teaching makes God a liar and that’s pure blasphemy.

    Is that what you want, Phillip? Is this the kind of teaching you want to proclaim to millions of people – that they have never sinned and are sinless and therefore will never die?

    The sooner you discard and reject this infamous teaching that says man can be immortal this side of the grave, the better for you.

  • Martin Horan

    My sister got involved with Jesse DuPlantis and a few other of those quacks. (Sorry if I’ve mentioned this before, my memory’s not too good.) She was told several times that she was healed, including by Rory and Wendy, and her cancer got worse till she died in excrutiating pain. For all the “teachings” she heeded, she knew very little of Scripture accept those things selected and twisted to fit the name-it-and-claim-it-paradigm.

    The saddest thing about telling people they are healed and immortal, is that it puts unbelievers and even professing believers completely off of God when nothing happens. In most cases they turn their backs on Him, never to return. These people claim they are proclaiming the Gospel so that sinners may be saved. They are doing the exact opposite. They are chasing people away and hindering sinners to come to Jesus for their salvation. Indeed, they are playing with fire.

  • Shané Gosling

    hi deborah, i was wondering if you could maybe be so kind as to email me please.. i just have something i want to ask you & i don’t know how else to get into contact with you.. (:
    i promise it’s not some kind of personal attack or me wanting to stalk you or anything like that!

  • pastor Daniel from nigeria

    men and brethren, am very delighted with this site, before the death of this man kobus, we be following his teachings on the air but this teaching of immortality strange to me, this my first time to hear this kind of teaching, nevertheless am not the judge but if I may ask why are they waste their time praying for God to give him a new body, please let these people organized his bury his getting out of hand because their mind will never work, may the name of our lord Jesus be glorified ever more

  • Nnana

    Grace wrote:

    mocked

    that is so true.. thank you. surely she got the message.

    stay blessed

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    Lejaja

    What a load of nonsense, please quote bible scripture to back up your false claims of immortaility.

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    David

    Oh dear David, your argument is so weak. Trying to get us to shut down this blog that is preaching the word of God and trying to save people from the fires of hell is not going to happen, sorry for you.

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    David

    >> I humbly apoogise. I will go work thge streets while you work the blog.

    Make sure you are preaching the truth, you can walk a million streets and save no one if you are preaching a false gospel.

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    Dear Grace

    I am sorry that you have been conned by a dead man who thought he was immortal and is now trying to be rasied from the dead. When he does not come back to life what will you say?

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    Lourens

    Thanks you!!

  • Carol Mattstadt

    charles siamutwa wrote:

    The Prophet spoke the truth. His
    passing does not change the truth he spoke. You and your small religious dry website devoid of the Spirit will soon be forgotten once the fruit of the seeds of hate you have been spouting rippens and you drink of the same but the words of the Prophet will endure. I am sorry if this hurts your sensitive tiny egos but I truly hope you repent soon enough before hell sucks down your damned souls

    Jesus made it clear that we should love one another, love being the fulfillment of the law of the prophets. Your above comment is pure hatred!
    Repent and move on, before it is too late!

  • Joe

    I find it heartless and insensitive to give such a condemning report when Kobus’ family is grieving. Your condolensces then are not convincing. Sounds like you are glad he’s gone. So, have you proven a point? It’s easy to criticise someone who has passed on because he can no longer speak for himself. This is not God pleasing at all. If I have nothing good to say, I would rather not say anything.

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    Joe

    No I am very sad that he did not come to accept Jesus Christ as his Saviour before he died and I am very sad that he is (after his death) STILL leading millions of people straight to hell with his teachings.

    I presume you are a Kobus fan hence your attack on this blog.

    If you have nothing nice to say to us, then you should not say anything at all. The fact is million of souls are at stake here and YOU DON’T CARE.

  • Patrick Dumisani

    People must be careful of these New Revelation. We won’t live forever on these mortal bodies, our bodies must first be transformed to the likeness of the bodies of the Angels. The question that u have to ask urself is “can God lie” let all men be liars and God be true. Be careful of these New Revelation, and we must know that God loves His people and he won’t let them to be deceived. I agreed with Kobus on many other things, but when he started to preach immortality, I stopped watching him. May his soul rest in peace.

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    Dear Patrick

    >> our bodies must first be transformed to the likeness of the bodies of the Angels

    What do you mean ‘ transformed to the likeness of the bodies of the Angels?

    The bible says: 1 Corinthians 15:51-53, “51Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed, 52In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed. 53For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality.”

    The Bible teaches that the believer’s body will be “…changed, In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye…” Our corruptible flesh shall be CHANGED into an incorruptible body like that of the Lord Jesus when He rose from the dead.

    Philippians 3:20-21, “For our conversation is in heaven; from whence also we look for the Saviour, the Lord Jesus Christ: Who shall change our vile body, that it may be FASHIONED LIKE UNTO HIS GLORIOUS BODY, according to the working whereby he is able even to subdue all things unto himself.”

    Now listen to this, we will not be anything like the angels, we will be higher than the angels. Why? Because We are created in God’s image, and redeemed by Jesus Christ (Galatians 3:13; 1 Peter 2:9; Luke 1:68; Ephesians 1:7). Angels are not created in God’s image and are not redeemed by Jesus Christ (Hebrews 1:14; 2:16).

    So we will not be in transformed to the likeness of the bodies of the Angels.

    I would like to ask you to please please TEST the rest of Kobus van Rensburg’s teaching that you ‘believed’ is ok, because I can promise you there is a good chance it’s not, and if you have not tested to see if it’s true, there’s no way to tell if you are being hoodwinked. I know Kobus van Rensburg preach A LOT of false doctrine, not just this immortality stuff, so please I ask you to go back to basics and look at everything Kobus has taught you since you started listening to him and TEST it – because this is what the BIBLE WANTS you to do! TEST!

  • trishia

    *[[Heb 11:13]] KJV* These all died in faith, not having received the promises, but having seen them afar off, and were persuaded of them, and embraced them, and confessed…..

    His dying does not in ANY way make the immortality gospel void. I still commend. Kobus in that though he did not receive the promise of immortality, he saw it, was persuaded of it and embraced it and confessed it till the. day he died. So Abraham died with few children yet God had said his children would be many as the sands. Does that make God a liar? no! Does that make Abraham a heretic. no! the Bible clearly states that true faith is holding onto what God says WHETHER YOU GET IT IN THIS LIFETIME OR NOT!!
    ok fine, assuming he made a mistake and there is no immortality (though the Bible clearly makes reference to it) , who then are we to say he is a heretic and went to hell? Do you not make mistakes? Are you assured of heaven because you have worked for it? Oh and another thing… it is very common for Christians to disagree it happend in the book of acts didn’t it? However the most important thing is love. The Bible also states that when light comes in, darkness leaves by itself. how about we stop making a huge fuss of darkness and start spreading the light instead? how about we. stop preaching and dwelling so much on the devil (and other people’s) badness and invest our time and ability on preaching God’s goodness? Even the Bible says to let the grain and tares grow together till judgement day

  • trishia wrote

    *[[Heb 11:13]] KJV* These all died in faith, not having received the promises, but having seen them afar off, and were persuaded of them, and embraced them, and confessed…..

    His dying does not in ANY way make the immortality gospel void. I still commend. Kobus in that though he did not receive the promise of immortality, he saw it, was persuaded of it and embraced it and confessed it till the. day he died. So Abraham died with few children yet God had said his children would be many as the sands. Does that make God a liar? no! Does that make Abraham a heretic. no! the Bible clearly states that true faith is holding onto what God says WHETHER YOU GET IT IN THIS LIFETIME OR NOT!!
    ok fine, assuming he made a mistake and there is no immortality (though the Bible clearly makes reference to it) , who then are we to say he is a heretic and went to hell? Do you not make mistakes? Are you assured of heaven because you have worked for it? Oh and another thing… it is very common for Christians to disagree it happend in the book of acts didn’t it? However the most important thing is love. The Bible also states that when light comes in, darkness leaves by itself. how about we stop making a huge fuss of darkness and start spreading the light instead? how about we. stop preaching and dwelling so much on the devil (and other people’s) badness and invest our time and ability on preaching God’s goodness? Even the Bible says to let the grain and tares grow together till judgement day

    You just love to twist Scripture, don’t you? Where does the Bible make reference to immortality this side of the grave? Kobus van Rensburg’s interpretation of John 11:26 is totally wrong. At any rate, if Kobus’ interpretation was correct and if those who are still alive and believe shall never die, it would mean that he was not a true believer because he died. Only those who live and believe shall never die. Isn’t that what Kobus taught you?

    Hebrews 11:13 does not speak about immortality but a country (the land of Israel that was promised to Abraham and his descendants, the Jews) which he had not yet inherited but saw afar off and believed with all his heart that his descendants would inherit it.

    Stop twisting Scripture.

    Look, I am as sad about Kobus’ death as what you are but I am more concerned about the people whom he had misled and is still misleading from the grave with his false teachings.

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    trishia

    >> His dying does not in ANY way make the immortality gospel void.

    You kidding? He believed HE WAS IMMORTAL but he died, I consider that void as void can be and the doctrine as false as false as can be.

    >> ok fine, assuming he made a mistake and there is no immortality (though the Bible clearly makes reference to it)

    where does the bible make reference to it? Please state the verses please so we can chat about this.

    >> who then are we to say he is a heretic and went to hell? Do you not make mistakes?

    Actually the bible says so.

    Matt 7:21-23
    21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.
    22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
    23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

    Kobus van Rensburg believed he was Christ, what does the bible say: (Matthew 24:5) For many will come in my name, claiming, ‘I am the Christ, ‘ and will deceive many.

    Kobus produced lying signs and wonders and preaches many false teachings: (Mark 13:22) For false Christs and false prophets shall rise, and shall shew signs and wonders, to seduce, if it were possible, even the elect.

    You seek after Kobus van Rensburg for his signs and wonders and false teaching, the bible says, (Mathewt 16:4) A wicked and adulterous generation seeketh after a sign; and there shall no sign be given unto it, but the sign of the prophet Jonas. And he left them, and departed.

    The bible tells you that if someone teaches a doctrine CONTRARY to what the bible teaches then you are to, (Romans 16:17-18) 17Now I beseech you, brethren, mark them which cause divisions and offences contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned; and avoid them. 18For they that are such serve not our Lord Jesus Christ, but their own belly; and by good words and fair speeches deceive the hearts of the simple.

    I am sorry Trishia but your ideas of spreading light and love sounds very New Age to me. You either speak the truth or you don’t. The bible makes no if’s or buts about it.

  • Robbie

    Patrick Dumisani wrote:
    I agreed with Kobus on many other things, but when he started to preach immortality, I stopped watching him. May his soul rest in peace.

    Now this is rat poison Patrick. 99,9% percent good food and 0,1% poison. It still kills. For the sake of peace we let the lie “flow”. It is like sticking a band aid on cancer.

    Your complete comment is typically one of someone that is under the “spell” of Kobus. Let me ask you one thing. Now that Kobus is not there anymore… please start reading the Word yourself and let the Spirit guide you in your interpretation. NOT the next in line at SPM.

    You see Patrick, losing scriptural context is evident in all the quotes of W.O.F followers and it points to a way that is WIDE with a humongous roll-a-gate. My dog closes it’s eyes when I tickles it’s ears. Why man??

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    Thanks Robbie!

  • James Potgieter

    I salute you Kobus—you are the closest person on earth to Jesus i have ever seen,my entire life,your LEGACY will NEVER die !!!!

  • James Potgieter wrote:

    I salute you Kobus — you are the closest person on earth to Jesus i have ever seen, my entire life, your LEGACY will NEVER die !!!!

    Who are you speaking (praying) to – a dead person?

    There shall not be found among you . . . a charmer, or a consulter with familiar spirits, or a wizard, or a necromancer. (Deu 18:11).

    Or are you just obeying his son who said you must speak to Kobus’ spirit?

    Thou shalt have no other gods before me. (Exo 20:3).

  • These are some of the things Kobus van Rensburg’s followers wrote on his Facebook wall.

    “If vwe do not perservere, WHO WILL… Heaven and earth is waiting for the manifestation of the sons of God.
    We honour and praise you Father… let YOUR glory come forth and be demonstrated in this day… as we speak LIFE and let your prophet Kobus (JA Janse van Rensburg) come back to life and in perfect health. Your promises MUST be fulfilled because YOU CANNOT LIE. Thank you Jesus for paying the full and complete price, perfect settlement… IS IS FINISHED.”

    Kobus wake up from your sleep in the name of Jesus Christ, we already miss you. We want to be with you come Christmas day.”

    “The meekness shall inherit the earth Prophet kobus u too big for the grave man get up.”

    I wonder what this person has to say about Jesus Christ who was buried in a grave. Was He smaller than Kobus?

    “Prophet Kobus is not dead…. i still blv its a caught up…. he will rise…..”

    Enoch and Elijah did not leave behind their dead bodies (cadavers) on earth when they were caught up without dying.

    “The greatest miracle of our time is about to happen, the Prophet is gonna live aaaaw I cant wait for that moment man, what a Mighty God we serve!”

    The greatest miracle ever to happen on earth was when God (Jesus Christ) became man and lived among us, died, was buried and rose again from the dead. This person doesn’t think so. Her greatest miracle is something that never happened.

    “Heavenly Father, in the precious Name of our Lord Jesus Christ, as your servant Lord,I pray that the body of your servant produces and manufactures white and red blood cells! Let the marrow of his bones begin to manufacture the white and red blood cells!”

    “we pray for the body of Kobus, to come in line with the Word of God. bone marrow produce the perfect blood of Jesus, enemy remove your hand from the life of Kobus. KOBUS YOU ARE HEALED- RESERECTION TO PERFECTION… IN JESUS NAME…”

    This is blasphemy – “produce the perfect blood of Jesus.”

    “Friends the doctors says Prophet Kobus van Rensburg will not see tonight. We come against that report and say the report of the Lord says we will live and not die and proclaim the Good Works of God…Agree with us and ask everybody you know to agree also PLEASE…”

    What does the Bible say about false prophecies?

    “Therefore, behold, I am against the prophets, saith the LORD, that steal my words every one from his neighbour. Behold, I am against the prophets, saith the LORD, that use their tongues, and say, He saith. Behold, I am against them that prophesy false dreams, saith the LORD, and do tell them, and cause my people to err by their lies, and by their lightness; yet I sent them not, nor commanded them: therefore they shall not profit this people at all, saith the LORD. (Jer 23:30-32)

    Because God had not spoken to these false prophets they were forced to plagiarize one from another. God sets Himself against them because they are leading people atray.

    Read https://www.facebook.com/Prophet.KVR

  • Robbie

    James Potgieter wrote:

    I salute you Kobus—you are the closest person on earth to Jesus i have ever seen,my entire life,your LEGACY will NEVER die !!!!

    oh boy…

    People think God is a senile old man that will allow anyone into heaven. There are so many people deceived and bound today, because they do not know the Living God is a consuming fire.

  • Naomi

    I’ve been reading all these comments and Im so amazed as to what everyone is saying, the bible is the true word of the Living God open your bible and ask the Holy Spirit to guide you .The word of God says call upon me and I will show you great and unsearchable things you do not know, so if you guys are doing this then you will easily be able to know a true prophet from a false one. Finally the word of God says I will share my Glory with no man,doesn’t the bible tells us abt Lazarus and the rich man, even God said they will not believe if I send Lazarus back from the dead,People if you know Kobus is gone to be with the Lord then stop praying for him to come back cos if he’s tasted heaven he wouldn’t want to come back to earth so rather pray for Christians to know the truth cos the truth will set you free! Remember Test all things,

  • Sarah

    I bet all of you critics have ‘a calling on your life and is appointed by God’ in the ‘calling’of critisism! Jesus said that the one without sin, must pick up a stone and stone the adulterating woman. I see you’re using more than one stone, hopefully you are also busy throwing yourselves with stone. ‘Sies, man’, you’re calling yourselves Christians and go on like devil worshipers! The Word says that every man must run his own race, but you’re running all over the track. If you don’t agree with these people, don’t read what they say, you’re trying to ‘rid’ the world of so-called ‘sinners’ by sinning yourselves. I feel very sorry for you, cuz it’s evident that you’ll NEVER grow spiritually with so much offense in your hearts. What I read in your articles are NOT discernment (as you are calling your wickedness), it’s plain hatred. The only way by which one can be identified as a disciple of Christ is by love (Jesus himself gave that new commandment) and He didn’t only say towards those who agree with what you believe. Jesus described people like you as ‘vipers’ and ‘the children of the devil’. Not even the real false religions such as Buddists, Muslims, etc. Have so much hate amongst themselves as you guys. It is not without reason that Mahatmar Ghandi said “I would easily have converted to the Christian religion, had it not been for the Christians”. The Word warns us against biting each other! You’re nothing more than ‘spiritual cannibals’. If an unbeliever reads the opinions of all you so-called Christians, they will run away from accepting Jesus as Saviour! So by the way, do do even get time to obey Jesus’ big commandment to ‘go ye therefore…make disciples…” Etc? It rather seems to me that ‘feeding your snakes’ on this website is much more important! Looking up what people have to say about the preachers in their churches is VERY time consuming! I just wasted a lot of my time on writing to you about all the dung you are writing on this site-in fact I’m going to vomit afterwards because of exposure to toxic so-called Christians! If Jesus comes NOW, what will He find you busy with…..?

  • Sarah wrote:

    I bet all of you critics have ‘a calling on your life and is appointed by God’ in the ‘calling’of critisism! Jesus said that the one without sin, must pick up a stone and stone the adulterating woman.

    Jesus warned “Take heed that no man deceive you.” Why? Because deception is a sin. To deceive someone or to allow yourself to be deceived is one of the worst sins imaginable. Why? Because it teaches you to serve another Jesus, proclaim another gospel and to receive another spirit. Those who help them to see the light and to turn them from their deception, are not sinning.

    My brothers, if anyone among you wanders from the truth and someone brings him back, let him know that whoever brings back a sinner from his wandering will save his soul from death and will cover a multitude of sins. (Jas 5:19-20)

    You have been deceived and the quicker you repent, the better for you.

  • trishia

    I soooo agree with Sarah. you’re on point girl… high five.

  • trishia wrote:

    I soooo agree with Sarah. you’re on point girl… high five.

    I’m not surprised.

  • Sarah wrote:

    I bet all of you critics have ‘a calling on your life and is appointed by God’ in the ‘calling’of critisism! Jesus said that the one without sin, must pick up a stone and stone the adulterating woman. I see you’re using more than one stone, hopefully you are also busy throwing yourselves with stone. ‘Sies, man’, you’re calling yourselves Christians and go on like devil worshipers! The Word says that every man must run his own race, but you’re running all over the track. If you don’t agree with these people, don’t read what they say, you’re trying to ‘rid’ the world of so-called ‘sinners’ by sinning yourselves. I feel very sorry for you, cuz it’s evident that you’ll NEVER grow spiritually with so much offense in your hearts. What I read in your articles are NOT discernment (as you are calling your wickedness), it’s plain hatred. The only way by which one can be identified as a disciple of Christ is by love (Jesus himself gave that new commandment) and He didn’t only say towards those who agree with what you believe. Jesus described people like you as ‘vipers’ and ‘the children of the devil’. Not even the real false religions such as Buddists, Muslims, etc. Have so much hate amongst themselves as you guys. It is not without reason that Mahatmar Ghandi said “I would easily have converted to the Christian religion, had it not been for the Christians”. The Word warns us against biting each other! You’re nothing more than ‘spiritual cannibals’. If an unbeliever reads the opinions of all you so-called Christians, they will run away from accepting Jesus as Saviour! So by the way, do do even get time to obey Jesus’ big commandment to ‘go ye therefore…make disciples…” Etc? It rather seems to me that ‘feeding your snakes’ on this website is much more important! Looking up what people have to say about the preachers in their churches is VERY time consuming! I just wasted a lot of my time on writing to you about all the dung you are writing on this site-in fact I’m going to vomit afterwards because of exposure to toxic so-called Christians! If Jesus comes NOW, what will He find you busy with…..?

    I just love the way how you express your love with words like “devil worshipers,”vipers’ and ‘the children of the devil,”spiritual cannibals,”feeding your snakes,”the dung you are writing,” and “I’m going to vomit.” Where did you learn to love in such an awesome way? I suggest you practice what you preach.

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    Sarah

    My goodness, I’ve never seen such lovely Christian words come out of one persons mouth in such a long time – did Kobus van Rensburg teach you that is how you should love others as you love yourself? I bet he did, because it certainly was not Jesus Christ that taught you to speak like that.

  • LouisJ

    It is typical for those who realise that they are defeated in an argument to attack the character of their opponent.
    Kobus van Rensburg’s disciples have no defence left. Their false beliefs are exposed and now all we can expect from them will be insults and more insults.

    This forum is exactly what they don’t want. It confuses them. They begin to doubt, but are too blind to accept the truth.

    Great job Deborah!

  • Robbie

    I cannot agree more LouisJ.

    John Lennon has been long gone but his fans still “twist and shout”
    We can expect the same here.

  • Just a Question

    Just a question for this website……..I’m neither for or against anything said here but in all fairness where is the debut on Harold Egbert Camping the Mighty Doomsday/Rapture preacher who got the date wrong twice??? Just asking……… below taken from wikipedia……… Don’t hate the Player Hate the Game…….

    Harold Egbert Camping (July 19, 1921 – December 15, 2013) was an American Christian radio broadcaster, author and evangelist.[1] Beginning in 1958, he served as president of Family Radio, a California-based radio station group that broadcasts to more than 150 markets in the United States. In October 2011, he retired from active broadcasting following a stroke, but still maintained a role at Family Radio.[2] Camping is notable for issuing multiple failed predictions of dates for the End Times, which temporarily gained him a global following and millions of dollars of donations.[4][5][6]

    Camping predicted that Jesus Christ would return to Earth on May 21, 2011, whereupon believers would be taken up to heaven, and that there would follow five months of fire, brimstone and plagues on Earth, with millions of people dying each day, culminating on October 21, 2011, with the final destruction of the world.[7][8] He had previously predicted that Judgment Day would occur on or about September 6, 1994.[9][10][11]

    His prediction for May 21, 2011, was widely reported, in part because of a large-scale publicity campaign by Family Radio, and it prompted ridicule from atheist organizations[12] and rebuttals from Christian organizations.[13] After May 21 passed without the predicted incidents, Camping said he believed that a “spiritual” judgment had occurred on that date, and that the physical Rapture would occur on October 21, 2011, simultaneously with the final destruction of the universe by God.[14] Except for one press appearance on May 23, 2011, Camping largely avoided press interviews after May 21, particularly after he suffered a stroke in June 2011.[15] October 21, 2011, passed without the predicted apocalypse, leading to comments that Camping’s ministry would collapse after the false prophecy.[16][17]

    Camping was reported to have retired from his position at Family Radio on October 16, 2011,[18] only days before his last predicted date for the end of the world. However, his daughter later clarified that he had not retired outright, but was maintaining a role at Family Radio while working from home.[2] Camping admitted in a private interview that he no longer believed that anybody could know the time of the Rapture or the end of the world, in stark contrast to his previously staunch position on the subject.[18] In March 2012, he stated that his attempt to predict a date was “sinful”, and that his critics had been right in emphasizing the words of Matthew 24:36: “of that day and hour knoweth no man”. He added that he was now searching the Bible “even more fervently…not to find dates, but to be more faithful in [his] understanding.”[19] Since the failure of Camping’s prophecies, Family Radio has suffered from a significant loss of assets, staff and revenue.[20]

  • Just a Question:

    What’s your point? Both Harold Camping and Kobus van Rensburg are false teachers.

    Camping predicted that Jesus would return on certain dates. HE LIED.

    Kobus van Renbsburg said he was immortal – HE LIED.

    So, what’s the difference?

  • Just a Question

    Just a Question wrote:

    Just a question for this website……..I’m neither for or against anything said here but in all fairness where is the debut on Harold Egbert Camping the Mighty Doomsday/Rapture preacher who got the date wrong a few time???
    Harold Egbert Camping (July 19, 1921 – December 15, 2013)

    Kobus van Rensburg called Jesus Christ’s Rapture trash. As I said previously, both Camping and van Rensburg are/were false teachers.

    The Pre-Trib Rapture is not a doomsday doctrine. In fact Paul wrote:

    Wherefore comfort one another with these words. (1 Th 4:18)

  • Just a Question

    The point is why all the hype about Kobus. So what he was wrong certainly not the only person to get Religion Wrong and I bet he won’t be the last to get it Wrong as well……. still many will be proven wrong……

  • Tommy

    Stacey wrote:

    I would just like to say that this website is awesome!!!, :)
    I’m so glad other people are exposing the work’s of the enemy!! Whoohooo!!, (the wolve’s in sheep’s clothing), even taking place here in South Africa.
    An acquaintance spoke to me yesterday in the train on the way to work, he happen’s to listen to Kobus Van Rensburg’s teaching, sit’s under leadership that agree with his teaching and he is unfortunately deceived by it all. After he ‘excitedly’ spoke to me about Kobus’s passing and how he believe’s he will be raised from the dead, and stating the fact that we can be immortal on this earth,I felt very sad, hurt, upset, (mixed emotion’s), to know that people are deceived. I know the enemy is out there.
    He also mentioned that they’re keeping Kobus body in his church at current, praying over him.,.. to be raised from the dead.
    I gently mentioned to him that if he believe’s and preache’s he is immortal and does not have to die on this earth, first of all he will be the first one out of countless million’s of people (including true christian’s) that have lived on this earth, lol, second of all, it would not be neccesary for people to pray for him to be raised from the dead, if he so strongly belived in immortality-defeat’s the whole purpose.
    Once again I am so glad that this website is up and running. Keep up the good work, :)
    Please may I have one of the owner’s personal email address, I’d like to share something.
    Go well, Stacey, :)

    And so say all of us…

    I met Kobus when he was in the tent, living in a prefab house, with an ancient clapped out old bakkie and his wife making country and western dresses from calico to support the family.

    It was in the same period that Trevor Yoko was involved in getting the whole Christian schooling thing going here.

    I saw a miracle there when an old man that I knew and that had had a stroke a few weeks previously and was brain damaged was healed. While the community was in worship Kobus called him to the front of the tent did not touch him, just said “Ag Here, genees hom asseblief” and the old man was healed immediately. That was the first time that the old man had ever been in that church….Kobus did not know him from a bar of soap, and neither did anybody in the community. His grandson had brought him there from another town.

    No falling over, no fireworks, just the Holiness of God filling the whole tent….

    Believe me I am a skeptic of “godly” healings because I come from the occult and satanism and knew where a lot of them actually came from…so when I got miraculously saved at the Cross, by and through God’s Grace, it carried through with me, but that one healing was real.

    His teaching was pure and scriptural then, but some years later I met him again and I felt a jolt in my spirit and felt contaminated when I shook his hand. That was at the beginning of the (“Toronto “Blessing”” which is the occultist practice of the kundalini….)in South Africa.

    Was it TB Joshua, money, false doctrines or a combination of them all that led him down the path till the unholy hole that he was in where he died?

    Calling himself “prophet”: one of the most responsible functions in the Body, meanwhile acting like a fortune teller….Oy Vey, total mishegas

    I seriously doubt that he has gone to Heaven……

  • Robbie

    Just a Question

    And Proverbs 6:16 – 17 tells you how God feels about lies.

    Deception, in one form or another, is a regular part of many people’s lives in our world today. However, much to the church’s shame, many Christians continue to give in to the temptation to lie their way through life as well.
    What does God think of this? Proverbs 6:19 includes on the list of things that God hates, “a false witness who utters lies.” Why does God hate lying? And why does he not only hate lying, but liars as well?

    The Bible provides MANY reasons.

  • Just a Question wrote

    The point is why all the hype about Kobus. So what he was wrong certainly not the only person to get Religion Wrong and I bet he won’t be the last to get it Wrong as well……. still many will be proven wrong . . .

    I don’t know whether you have any kids. Anyway, would you allow your kids to be led astray by pimps into a life of drugs, sex, drunk parties and all kinds of other vices? NO? Well, why then would you think God, who has more children than you can imagine, would want them to be led astray by false apostles and teachers (who are worse than pimps) into spiritual adultery (which is much worse than drugs). Do you really think God says as you do: “So what if the false apostles and teachers are wrong. They are certainly not the only persons to get religion wrong. They won’t be the last to get it wrong either. Still many others will be proven wrong. So, let them be.” That’s not what God says. He says:

    Beloved, when I gave all diligence to write unto you of the common salvation, it was needful for me to write unto you, and exhort you that ye should earnestly contend for the faith which was once delivered unto the saints. (Jud 1:3)

    Your attitude reminds me of Cain who said: “Am I my brother’s keeper?”

    I suppose you have no respect for the follow passage in Scripture>

    Let him know, that he which converteth the sinner from the error of his way shall save a soul from death, and shall hide a multitude of sins. (James 5:20)

    I suppose you will also say: “James, why all the hype about error, deception and false teachers and apostles? Saving someone from death is not such a big issue.”

  • Just a Question

    No James you are wrong I was more thinking of the line ” James you full of . . . nonsense”…….. you keep on repeating yourself. ….. fact is Kobus believed there would be a generation who would live and not die…… he believed that it was his generation. ….. fact Kobus accepted Jesus Christ on live tv many times as his saviour and lead others into the salvation prayer……. fact Kobus said many times on tv how much he loved Jesus. ….. look I’m not a “Kobus fan” to be honest watched a few times and yes he brought some good teaching and some . . . “rubbish” in my opinion however I’m not to judge him he alone will answer for his wrong doings I’m not Father God………. you think you are doing the world a favour by breaking him down in fact you are breaking down your own faith……..and that is something you will have to answer to. …. In closing surely the Father gave us the knowledge to see right from wrong and what to accept as truth or lies and for your opinion to be valid I urge you to not only focus on the “immortality” side of Kobus as that was not his only teaching. ……. Thanks. ……by the way this is only my opinion. ….. I don’t claim to know all or be all

  • Edward Lubbe

    Would be interesting to see how deborah and thomas look like… From the comments on this website I think it’s people who never laugh, people who are bitter. May you get to Jesus who might actually change your life for the better. You should rather run your own race and leave other people alone…

  • Joe

    Christians, be careful with visiting sites like these (Acts 16:16-18). Dont waste time arguing with critics because you excite them. The best way of handling critics is, If they are right about you, make adjustments; if they are wrong about you, ignore them. Let them talk until the sun shines. Ignoring critics is the best way of dealing with them. They can be so judgemental that they even forget that only God can judge us. They think they speak on God’s behalf, unaware that He is not pleased with their judgemental attitude. Kobus is resting in peace while his critics have no peace, arguing left, right and centre. Judge not and you will not be judged. Good night.

  • Joe

    Christians, be careful with visiting sites like these (Acts 16:16-18). Dont waste time arguing with critics because you excite them. The best way of handling critics is, If they are right about you, make adjustments; if they are wrong about you, ignore them. Let them talk until the sun shines. Ignoring critics is the best way of dealing with them. They can be so judgemental that they even forget that only God can judge us. They think they speak on God’s behalf, unaware that He is not pleased with their judgemental attitude. Kobus is resting in peace while his critics have no peace, arguing left, right and centre. Judge not and you will not be judged. Good night.

    The reason why you have been misled to a stupor of utter blindness is because you have been ignoring God along along who said: ” . . . Take heed that no man deceive you. For many shall come in my name, saying, I am Christ; and shall deceive many.” (Mat 24:4-5)

    By all means, continue in your madness. We are not concerned about people like you. We are concerned about the millions of other little lambs who he has misled.

  • Edward Lubbe spat out:

    Would be interesting to see how deborah and thomas look like… From the comments on this website I think it’s people who never laugh, people who are bitter. May you get to Jesus who might actually change your life for the better. You should rather run your own race and leave other people alone…

    You may love to laugh while others run their race smack bang into the deepest pits of of hell. We don’t. Like Jesus, we weep.

    O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, thou that killest the prophets, and stonest them which are sent unto thee, how often would I have gathered thy children together, even as a hen gathereth her chickens under her wings, and ye would not! (Mat 23:37)

    .

    How sure are you that you are following the real Jesus?

    But I fear, lest by any means, as the serpent beguiled Eve through his subtilty, so your minds should be corrupted from the simplicity that is in Christ. For if he that cometh preacheth another Jesus, whom we have not preached, or if ye receive another spirit, which ye have not received, or another gospel, which ye have not accepted, ye might well bear with him. (2 Co 11:3-4)

  • James Just a Question wrote:

    . . . in my opinion however I’m not to judge him [Kobus] he alone will answer for his wrong doings I’m not Father God………. you think you are doing the world a favour by breaking him down in fact you are breaking down your own faith……..and that is something you will have to answer to. …. In closing surely the Father gave us the knowledge to see right from wrong and what to accept as truth or lies and for your opinion to be valid I urge you to not only focus on the “immortality” side of Kobus as that was not his only teaching. ……. Thanks. ……by the way this is only my opinion. ….. I don’t claim to know all or be all

    You are not supposed to judge the person but his teachings. Paul of Tarsus and the other disciples constantly did so in obedience to Jesus Christ. But, then of course, why would you want to obey Jesus Christ?

    If God has given you the knowledge to discern between the true and the false, why does Jesus warn you to “Take heed that no man deceive you?” Once again, it is because you refuse to obey Him.

    We are not focusing on immortality. We are proving that Kobus was a false teacher because the Bible says that a prophet who prophesies and it does not come to pass, is a false prophet. And yet thousands upon thousands are still following his teachings.

    You “don’t claim to know all or be all” but you have the guts to say a lot AGAINST God and his Word. Really??? When are you going to learn that discernment is a indispensable part of preaching the Gospel of Jesus Christ? Or are you going to sit by as smug as a bug and a rug while millions are deceived and nonchalantly say “by the way this is only my opinion. . . . I don’t claim to know all or be all.” I must say, you are so humble, even the mere mortal can see it.

  • Joe wrote

    Christians, be careful with visiting sites like these (Acts 16:16-18).

    And it came to pass, as we went to prayer, a certain damsel possessed with a spirit of divination met us, which brought her masters much gain by soothsaying: The same followed Paul and us, and cried, saying, These men are the servants of the most high God, which shew unto us the way of salvation. And this did she many days. But Paul, being grieved, turned and said to the spirit, I command thee in the name of Jesus Christ to come out of her. And he came out the same hour. (Act 16:16-18)

    Are you saying that you are shouting “This man [Kobus] is the servant of the most high God, which shew unto us the way of salvation” and that he commanded the spirit of divination to leave you? Hmmmm, interesting!

  • Robbie

    Joe wrote:

    Christians, be careful with visiting sites like these (Acts 16:16-18). Dont waste time arguing with critics because you excite them. The best way of handling critics is, If they are right about you, make adjustments; …… Judge not and you will not be judged. Good night.

    So what are you doing here Joe? – going to make adjustments?

    One of the most oft’-quoted verses in the Bible is Matthew 7:1—“Judge not, that you be not judged.” Those engaged in immoral behavior frequently quote this verse when attempting to defend their sinful lifestyle.

  • Rina

    Goeie more op hierdie laaste dag van 2013. Hier is soveel kommentaar oor Kobus. Goed en sleg / positief en negatief. Het een van julle al gaan stil sit en stilgeraak voor God? Hy mag alleen oordeel nie ek of jy nie, wat jou oortuiging ookal mag wees. Het jy al gedink wat het hierdie man regtig bereik het? Gedoen het? Die Woord oopgebreek? Wat het jy en ek bereik? Gedoen? Waar is ons liefde??? As hy so n slegte mens was waarom jou tyd en energie mors om kommentaar te lewer. Stamp die stof van jou voete af en beweeg aan!! Jesus se as een van julle sonder sonde is mag julle die 1ste klip optel!!! Of is julle nog melk drinkers?? In plaas van lekker biestuk eters uit die Woord van God?? Seen vir julle mag julle vrede vind en die liefde van ons God Jesus Christus en die Heilige Gees ervaar. Seen en vrede aan sy geliefdes wat agterbly. Staan op die Woord en bou op die stewige fondament wat Kobus vir julle en die res gelaat het. Waar hy nou is, is geen pyn ongemak nie. Hy is in die paradys. God het vooruitgegaan om vir ons n plek te berei, hy het sy plekkie bereik. Jesus liefde

  • Rina skryf:

    Goeie more op hierdie laaste dag van 2013. Hier is soveel kommentaar oor Kobus. Goed en sleg / positief en negatief. Het een van julle al gaan stil sit en stilgeraak voor God? Hy mag alleen oordeel nie ek of jy nie, wat jou oortuiging ookal mag wees. Het jy al gedink wat het hierdie man regtig bereik het? Gedoen het? Die Woord oopgebreek? Wat het jy en ek bereik? Gedoen? Waar is ons liefde??? As hy so n slegte mens was waarom jou tyd en energie mors om kommentaar te lewer. Stamp die stof van jou voete af en beweeg aan!! Jesus se as een van julle sonder sonde is mag julle die 1ste klip optel!!! Of is julle nog melk drinkers?? In plaas van lekker biestuk eters uit die Woord van God?? Seen vir julle mag julle vrede vind en die liefde van ons God Jesus Christus en die Heilige Gees ervaar. Seen en vrede aan sy geliefdes wat agterbly. Staan op die Woord en bou op die stewige fondament wat Kobus vir julle en die res gelaat het. Waar hy nou is, is geen pyn ongemak nie. Hy is in die paradys. God het vooruitgegaan om vir ons n plek te berei, hy het sy plekkie bereik. Jesus liefde.

    Rina, waarom dink jy het Jesus gewaarsku “Pas op dat niemand julle mislei nie. Want baie sal onder my Naam kom en sê: Ek is die Christus! en hulle sal baie mense mislei.” (Matthew 24:4-5). Dink jy miskien Hy het sommer ‘n ou grappie gemaak? Of miskien het sy dissipels ook maar net gewaarsku om ‘n “April’s fool” grappie op mense uit te haal (2 Corinthians 11:13-15; 1 John 4:1; 1 Timothy 4:1).

    Jy weet tog sekerlik net so goed soos ek dat Kobus gevra het “Why must you die to go to heaven?” Blykbaar het hy bedoel dat net sekere super-mense wat nie so baie sondig nie, hemel toe sal gaan sonder om te sterwe.

    Jy praat so maklik van liefde maar blykbaar weet jy nie wat dit is nie. Het jy geweet Jesus het ‘n ware goddelike liefde onlosmaaklik gekoppel aan onderskeiding en die plig om ander te waarsku teen valse profete en hulle leringe? Toe Hy vir Petrus gevra het “Het jy my lief,” het Hy hom telkens vermaan om sy skape en lammers op te pas (teen valse leraars en hulle leringe) en hulle die regte geestelike voeding te gee. Nie een van sy dissipels, insluitende Paulus, het ooit gesê dat die mens onsterflik kan wees nie. Dit is dus nie ‘n leerstelling van God nie, maar van mense soos Kobus van Rensburg. Wie gaan jy glo – vir God of Kobus van Rensburg? Wat sê die Skrif?

    Elkeen wat ‘n oortreder is en nie bly in die leer van Christus nie, hy het God nie. Wie in die leer van Christus bly, hy het die Vader sowel as die Seun. (2 John 1:9).

    Kan jy sien hoe gevaarlik dit is om mense te glo wat ‘n ander evangelie en ‘n ander Jesus verkondig?

  • LouisJ

    Rina wrote:

    Goeie more op hierdie laaste dag van 2013. Hier is soveel kommentaar oor Kobus. Goed en sleg / positief en negatief. Het een van julle al gaan stil sit en stilgeraak voor God? Hy mag alleen oordeel nie ek of jy nie, wat jou oortuiging ookal mag wees. Het jy al gedink wat het hierdie man regtig bereik het? Gedoen het? Die Woord oopgebreek? Wat het jy en ek bereik? Gedoen? Waar is ons liefde??? As hy so n slegte mens was waarom jou tyd en energie mors om kommentaar te lewer. Stamp die stof van jou voete af en beweeg aan!! Jesus se as een van julle sonder sonde is mag julle die 1ste klip optel!!! Of is julle nog melk drinkers?? In plaas van lekker biestuk eters uit die Woord van God?? Seen vir julle mag julle vrede vind en die liefde van ons God Jesus Christus en die Heilige Gees ervaar. Seen en vrede aan sy geliefdes wat agterbly. Staan op die Woord en bou op die stewige fondament wat Kobus vir julle en die res gelaat het. Waar hy nou is, is geen pyn ongemak nie. Hy is in die paradys. God het vooruitgegaan om vir ons n plek te berei, hy het sy plekkie bereik. Jesus liefde

    Why is it that when a false doctrine is exposed the reaction is that nobody should judge? No arguments that questions the proof given, just a simple instruction: ” Don’t prove our false doctrine false please, rather talk about something else”?
    If your belief is solid and you are completely convinced that it is right, why even bother defending it? The fact is that you cannot defend it. The immortality doctrine was proven to be false the very second that Kobus van Rensburg died. His false prophecy that he is immortal and will never die has confused those who believe it. You make excuses, you interpret what he meant and not what he said, you try to move the focus onto something else (like “don’t judge”) but you have no answer to the question” Why didn’t he live like he prophesied? “. You don’t want to answer that question because you would have to agree that his prophecies about him being healed of cancer and him never dying were false. So all you do is point to other things.
    Everything that you believe about Kobus van Rensburg is found in the Bible when it mentions false prophet’s. Everything!
    Rather come up with arguments proving that his false teaching is not false. Trying to shine the spotlight on something else is proof of ignorance.

  • This is what SWM wrote on their Facebook wall recently:

    WOW!!! What Supernatural prayer meeting we had tonight… People were drunk in the spirit, rolling on the floor… Truly there is Revival at Spirit Word. JOIN US TOMORROW NIGHT FOR OUR NEW YEAR CELEBRATION… COME AND RECEIVE THE WORD OF THE LORD FOR 2014… IT’S GONNA BE SUPERNATURAL!!!

    The Bible says:

    Stay yourselves, and wonder; cry ye out, and cry: they are drunken, but not with wine; they stagger, but not with strong drink. (Isa 29:9)

    The people’s spiritual stupor and insensitivity to the truth was likened to a staggering drunken man who had not taken wine or strong drink and was in itself a judgment of God. And yet they call it revival and a supernatural blessing of God.

    Woe unto them that call evil good, and good evil; that put darkness for light, and light for darkness; that put bitter for sweet, and sweet for bitter! (Isa 5:20)

  • Just a Question

    on your banner at the top of this page you have : Romans 1:16 “i am not ashamed of the gospel because it is the power of god for the salvation of EVERYONE WHO BELIEVES”. Everyone means All Who believes in Jesus Christ of Nazareth.
    not just the select who you think is right or wrong…practice what you preach……. Well i think SWM must be doing something right to be getting all this attention maybe i’ll have to turn in again and see what a revival looks like cos here is just doom and gloom….
    “Keep well all my brothers and sisters who are in Jesus Christ of Nazareth” and have an blessed new year.

  • Edward Lubbe

    Thomas Lessing (Watch and Pray / Waak en Bid) wrote:
    Edward Lubbe spat out:

    Would be interesting to see how deborah and thomas look like… From the comments on this website I think it’s people who never laugh, people who are bitter. May you get to Jesus who might actually change your life for the better. You should rather run your own race and leave other people alone…

    You may love to laugh while others run their race smack bang into the deepest pits of of hell.

    Some truth coming from you… your words come from the deepest pits of the hell… The way you are judging other people are not from God – God is love. Learn how to love.

    Do you even read what you quote?

    O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, thou that killest the prophets, and stonest them which are sent unto thee, how often would I have gathered thy children together, even as a hen gathereth her chickens under her wings, and ye would not! (Mat 23:37)

  • Marlene

    Ons het nie nodig om te oordeel nie, “aan jou vrugte word jy uitgeken”!

  • Marlene skryf:

    Ons het nie nodig om te oordeel nie, “aan jou vrugte word jy uitgeken”!

    Om leuens te versprei en vals te profeteer, is beslis nie goeie vrug nie. Dit is slegte vrugte.

    Wat sê Paulus?

    Want waarom sou ek ook die wat buite (die kerk) is, oordeel? Oordeel julle nie die wat binne (die kerk) is nie? (1 Co 5:12)

  • Edward Lubbe

    I am not judging people. I am judging their teachings from the Word of God, and so should you.

    The children of Israel stoned the true prophets of God and followed false prophets who predicted lies and deceit. It sounds familiar, doesn’t it.

    Was Kobus telling the truth when he said immortality is attainable this side of the grave – yes or no?

  • Just a Question wrote:

    Well i think SWM must be doing something right to be getting all this attention maybe i’ll have to turn in again and see what a revival looks like cos here is just doom and gloom….

    If we were to go along with your barometer of success, then hell and Satan are helluva successful because more people are going to hell than heaven. Hell and Satan must be doing something right to be getting all the attention – RIGHT?

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    Just a Question.

    >> on your banner at the top of this page you have : Romans 1:16 “i am not ashamed of the gospel because it is the power of god for the salvation of EVERYONE WHO BELIEVES”. Everyone means All Who believes in Jesus Christ of Nazareth.

    Judas Iscariot believed in Jesus, he walked with Jesus – but in the end Judas was not a REAL Christian, He had head knowledge about Jesus Christ, but no HEART knowledge – Jesus was not in his heart. Just like the there are millions of Christians today who say they are Christian but they don’t REALLY know Jesus Christ. They are called professing Christians. Even demons believe in Jesus. (James 2:19)

    This blog is for genuine Christians who believe and you will know that because we all speak the same message – one gospel message. The Holy Spirit never gives one message to one person and a different message to another. He leads us into ALL TRUTH. (John 16:13) Then the professing Christians come along and they speak ANOTHER gospel – one that does not tie up with the Bible. We try and show them they are wrong and need to repent and get out of the bondage they are in. But there is that saying, “you can take the horse to the water but you can’y make him drink.”

  • LouisJ

    Deborah (Discerning the World) wrote:

    This blog is for genuine Christians who believe and you will know that because we all speak the same message – one gospel message. The Holy Spirit never gives one message to one person and a different message to another. He leads us into ALL TRUTH. (John 16:13) Then the professing Christians come along and they speak ANOTHER gospel – one that does not tie up with the Bible.

    Kobus Snr: “Can I say this: When you die, you have been conquered by death! You have not subdued death or conquered death. Death is only conquered when you live and don’t die.” (and let’s not forget that he is dead now)

    Kobus Jnr: “Screw death, it’s already beaten”

    One church, one pulpit, one family, TWO messages!

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    Oh boy…

    I really hope Kobus Jr does not take over…

  • Robbie

    He’s got the whole tower to himself…

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    Hi Tommy

    You said:

    >> I met Kobus when he was in the tent, living in a prefab house, with an ancient clapped out old bakkie and his wife making country and western dresses from calico to support the family.

    It was in the same period that Trevor Yoko was involved in getting the whole Christian schooling thing going here.

    I saw a miracle there when an old man that I knew and that had had a stroke a few weeks previously and was brain damaged was healed. While the community was in worship Kobus called him to the front of the tent did not touch him, just said “Ag Here, genees hom asseblief” and the old man was healed immediately. That was the first time that the old man had ever been in that church….Kobus did not know him from a bar of soap, and neither did anybody in the community. His grandson had brought him there from another town.

    No falling over, no fireworks, just the Holiness of God filling the whole tent….

    Believe me I am a skeptic of “godly” healings because I come from the occult and satanism and knew where a lot of them actually came from…so when I got miraculously saved at the Cross, by and through God’s Grace, it carried through with me, but that one healing was real.

    His teaching was pure and scriptural then…

    I would dare to say that its possible the healing was not real. Have you read: Can Satan heal? You do not know what became of that man? Did his health get worse later?

    The reason I believe it was not a genuine healing is because 1) Kobus could not have started out a good minister and then moved onto being a bad minister. 2) That’s like saying you can get saved and preach the gospel truth, but then lose your salvation and stop preaching the truth. 3) You can’t lose your salvation once you are saved, when the Holy Spirit enters you He SEALS you and stays there permanently. So Kobus was false from the beginning, and so was that healing. And I don’t believe his teaching was pure and 100% scriptural either. Kobus started off as a small false preacher who preached on a small scale and as he expanded he became more false as he sought after more power through Toronto and TB Joshua.

  • Robbie

    Deborah (Discerning the World) wrote:

    Hi Tommy

    … Kobus started off as a small false preacher who preached on a small scale and as he expanded he became more false as he sought after more power through Toronto and TB Joshua.

    … Debs, did he not also get power from praying at someone’s grave?

  • Philip

    Kobus believed immortality. He had faith to live forever on earth. He believed he was healed. But God knew better. Do not judge. At least he confessed Jesus as His Lord and that is all what we need to be saved.
    So do not condemn him. I believe he is with his Saviour. What he believed did not make him a sinner. He was still a born again child of God. Let us rather forgive him and not judge him.

  • Phlip wrote:

    Kobus believed immortality. He had faith to live forever on earth. He believed he was healed. But God knew better. Do not judge. At least he confessed Jesus as His Lord and that is all what we need to be saved.

    So do not condemn him. I believe he is with his Saviour. What he believed did not make him a sinner. He was still a born again child of God. Let us rather forgive him and not judge him

    No one on this site is condemning Kobus van Rensburg. Like Paul of Tarsus we are merely exposing his heresies and warning others who had been led astray by his teachings to repent. If Kobus was wrong, as you candidly admit, why are so many still following his teachings and why are his family members still teaching his heresies? Indeed, what Kobus taught is the oldest heresy on earth for GOD said “for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die.” (physically and spiritually). But Satan said: “Ye shall not surely die.” Now tell me, whose doctrine was Kobus teaching?

    The Bible says if a prophet prophesies things and it does not come to pass, he is a false prophet. To confess Jesus as Lord, means nothing (Matthew 7:22-23). In fact Paul anathematized anyone who preaches another Gospel (Galatians 1: 8-9). No one can teach whatever he wishes and then say “Jesus is my Lord.” Even the devils cried out “Jesus, Son of God” and they trembled (Matthew 8:29). What they actually said was: “Jesus (who had come to save his people from their sins – Matthew 1:21), Son of the only true and living God.”

    John, the apostle of love warned those who had been led astray by false prophets: “And I heard another voice from heaven, saying, Come out of her, my people, that ye be not partakers of her sins, and that ye receive not of her plagues.” (Rev 18:4). John spoke about Vatican City (the headquarters of the Roman Catholic Church) which are seven hills on which the woman sits (Rev 17:9). Kobus taught the abominable heresy of the RCC called transubstantiation which says a priest has the power to change the communion bread and wine into the literal body and blood of Jesus Christ. This is pure blasphemy, and yet Kobus taught it to his followers.

    Furthermore, Kobus made a mockery of the Rapture and called it trash. It was the RCC who first started to make a mockery of the Rapture because they believe their Church represents the Kingdom of God on earth. Kobus, took it a little further by suggesting that the Kingdom of God is already here because he and all those who follow his teaching can achieve immortality right here and now. Voila! The kingdom of God is already here.

    You said:

    What he believed did not make him a sinner.

    Really? Now, anyone can believe and whatever he likes and it does not make him a sinner? In the Old Testament false prophets were stoned (Deut 18:20). And you dare say false prophecy is not a sin? It proves just how far you have been led astray by Kobus van Rensburg. I suggest you repent and turn to God for mercy.

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    Robbie

    Hi Tommy

    … Kobus started off as a small false preacher who preached on a small scale and as he expanded he became more false as he sought after more power through Toronto and TB Joshua.

    … Debs, did he not also get power from praying at someone’s grave?

    Yes he went to William Branham’s grave and actually got on his hands and knees and actually ate the ground and grass from around his grave in the hopes to get William Branham’s mantel.

    The bible calls this sorcery (Deuteronomy 18:10; Galatians 5:19-20)

  • Amanda

    Kobus laat na ‘n vrou wat hom deur alles bygestaan het soos haar belofte was op die dag van hul huwelik. Drie pragtige seuns en dogters en kleinkinders wat die Here dien. ‘n Skool, ‘n sateliet skottel, tv kanaal met 24uur uitsedding waarvan 3 diente lewendig uitgesaai word, ‘n kerk en gebedstoring. huise vir sy vrou en kinders., Ek wonder maar net wat het die kritici om te wys na 30 jaar in bediening. Word die boom nie aan sy vrugte geken?

  • Amanda skryf:

    Kobus laat na ‘n vrou wat hom deur alles bygestaan het soos haar belofte was op die dag van hul huwelik. Drie pragtige seuns en dogters en kleinkinders wat die Here dien. ‘n Skool, ‘n sateliet skottel, tv kanaal met 24uur uitsedding waarvan 3 diente lewendig uitgesaai word, ‘n kerk en gebedstoring. huise vir sy vrou en kinders., Ek wonder maar net wat het die kritici om te wys na 30 jaar in bediening. Word die boom nie aan sy vrugte geken?

    Ek kan jou verseker Paulus het beslis nie kinders, kleinkinders, huise, gebedstorings, televisiestasies en TV uitsendings in gedagte gehad toe hy oor die vrug van die Gees geskryf het nie. In elk geval, Kobus het nie ‘n skool, ‘n satelliet skottel, ‘n TV kanaal met 24 uur uitsendings waarvan 3 dienste lewendig uitgesaai word, ‘n kerk en gebedstoring, en huise vir sy vrou en kinders” nagelaat nie. Hy het dit met die geld gedoen van die mense wat graag in hulle gehoor gestreel wil wees.

    Intussen weergalm Jesus se woorde in Mattheus 24 nog steeds deur die hele wêreld: “Pasop dat niemand (insluitende jou man, jou vrou, jou kinders, jou kleinkinders, jou eie familie, jou beste vriende en vriendinne) julle mislei nie. Kobus het derduisende mislei deur hulle te laat glo hulle is “immortal.”

  • Kevin

    Amazing the agape love and judgement of all above! Everyone seems to know better! All I can prayer is God forgive all above as no one seems to know what they do! Your people perish for a lack of wisdom! No wonder you will say away from me I know you not…

  • Kevin wrote:

    Amazing the agape love and judgement of all above! Everyone seems to know better! All I can prayer is God forgive all above as no one seems to know what they do! Your people perish for a lack of wisdom! No wonder you will say away from me I know you not…

    Do you believe that man is immortal this side of the grave? If you do, you are deceived and deceiving others which is very dangerous because your are proclaiming another Gospel (Galatians 1:8-9). If you don’t you’d better warn others in your church because it is very dangerous not to warn them against a false Gospel (Galatians 1:8-9).

  • Hans

    Kevin wrote:

    Amazing the agape love and judgement of all above! Everyone seems to know better! All I can prayer is God forgive all above as no one seems to know what they do! Your people perish for a lack of wisdom! No wonder you will say away from me I know you not…

    Kevin, the agape love of God killed “millions” of men woman and “innocent” babies in the flood, and only Noah and his family survived. The agape love of God made a law unto the Israelites, his chosen nation, to stone their own children should they persist in disobedience to their parents. The agape love of God told His chosen not to spare the rod in rectifying bad behaviour in their children. Jesus Christ, in the agape love of God, told the religious leaders:Mat 23:33 Ye serpents, ye generation of vipers, how can ye escape the damnation of hell?
    Love, God’s agape love, is a love in truth, and not what most of humanity see as love.

  • Robbie

    Exactly Hans!

    Since when do you hate when you tell the truth?

    But for the sake of peace they would rather tell a lie … or withhold the truth. In this carnal world, That is what parents are doing to their children too and then they tell them they love them.

  • Ab

    There is now therefore no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus. I will examine myself before casting stones, For we all fall short of the glory of God.

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    Kevin

    And do you wanna know something, the agape love of God’s love for mankind is such that if you know the truth/warnings and don’t spread the truth/warning, or prevent the truth/warnings from being spread to people who need to hear it and they die and go to hell, their blood will be on your hands.

    Ezekiel 3:18 “When I say unto the wicked, Thou shalt surely die; and thou givest him not warning, nor speakest to warn the wicked from his wicked way, to save his life; the same wicked man shall die in his iniquity; but his blood will I require at thine hand.”

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    Ab

    >> There is now therefore no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus. Romans 8:1

    Kobus van Rensburg preached a false gospel from beginning to end with fake healings /signs and wonders
    Therefore Kobus is not in Jesus Christ
    And is therefore condemned.

    >> I will examine myself before casting stones John 8:7

    You are now speaking about sin Ab, everyone one of us is a sinner. You can’t apply this verse to us and Kobus. The difference is this: DTW does not preach false teaching, but we are still sinners saved by grace. And because we are genuinely saved we preach the truth. If you are not genuinely saved you preach a false gospel.

    >> For we all fall short of the glory of God.

    Is this your excuse to do and say the wrong thing and think you can get away with it when the bible (that is God) says clearly that you wont?

  • Louise

    When i read that Kobus had died my immediate thought was “And now Kobus are you really in the arms of Jesus.” He was a false teacher regardless of how many people he may have healed. The rapture is soon to happen and it saddens me that there are still so many people who are following man and his ministries instead of Christ and the word.
    Patrick Heron also died on the 2nd Jan 2014. He wrote the book on the Nephillim. My hubby and I are not making long term plans as we feel that time is almost up. We are occupying but just barely. Take care.

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    Hi Louise

    Paul Heron wrote some really outrageous stuff that was totally unscriptural, his ideas about the Nephillim were not true and if he just stuck to scripture he would have had far less to write about lol. http://www.discerningtheworld.com/2011/09/06/the-truth-about-the-sons-of-god-the-daughters-of-men-and-the-nephilim/

  • Joe

    Its more than two weeks since Kobus passed om. Good people, don’t you think you have talked about this long enough? Let us go into the market place and preach the gospel (whether you are for or against Kobus). These arguements are definitely going nowhere and no one will be rewarded for this (criticising or defending Kobus). The enemy loves it when Christians get so busy with fruitless effort. Can we all concentrate on the fruitful things now (winning souls for the Lord). Why cant we discuss positive things like “How to be an effective soul winner.” Let’s think about it, how many souls have the enemy thrown into eternal darkness since this arguement started. I hope that at least on person will get this message positively without being smart or critical.

  • Joe wrote:

    Its more than two weeks since Kobus passed om. Good people, don’t you think you have talked about this long enough? Let us go into the market place and preach the gospel (whether you are for or against Kobus). These arguements are definitely going nowhere and no one will be rewarded for this (criticising or defending Kobus). The enemy loves it when Christians get so busy with fruitless effort. Can we all concentrate on the fruitful things now (winning souls for the Lord). Why cant we discuss positive things like “How to be an effective soul winner.” Let’s think about it, how many souls have the enemy thrown into eternal darkness since this arguement started. I hope that at least on person will get this message positively without being smart or critical.

    Did the command to earnestly contend for the faith (Jude 1:3) cease with Kobus van Rensburg’s death? The reward for contending and holding fast to the faith which was once delivered to us by the apostles of Christ (and not false apostles like Kobus) is the following:

    Whosoever transgresseth, and abideth not in the doctrine of Christ, hath not God. He that abideth in the doctrine of Christ, he hath both the Father and the Son. (2 John 9)

    Note carefully that Jude, like you, was also very concerned about lost souls and at first preferred to write about man’s salvation. However, something so dangerous had crept into the church that he deemed it necessary to change his message from salvation to exhortation. Why? Listen carefully.

    For there are certain men crept in unawares, who were before of old ordained to this condemnation, ungodly men, turning the grace of our God into lasciviousness, and denying the only Lord God, and our Lord Jesus Christ.

    You ask “Why can’t we discuss positive things like ‘How to be an effective soul winner.'” You can’t be an effective soul winner unless you warn people against false teachers who are leading millions astray. All Jesus’ disciples continually warned their brethren against false teachers. You don’t seem to be concerned about giving people water with a tinge of poison in it. That’s not love. You are disobeying Jesus who said “Take heed that no man deceive you.”

  • Osito

    I see on kobus facebook they did ask people for money support for the medical treatment. Did they sell all there luxury s before asking the poor people for money and are they now living like the most, poor after spending all there money on medic. And if there was money left from that money received, what happened to that?

  • Andre Niemand

    Who is next on your hit list Deborah? Know that you will be judged in the same manner than you are judging others. If Christ must judge you accordingly he will give you the same amount of mercy and grace you give others which equates to zero. Sister what about start loving with mercy and grace?

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    Andre

    >> Who is next on your hit list Deborah? Know that you will be judged in the same manner than you are judging others. If Christ must judge you accordingly he will give you the same amount of mercy and grace you give others which equates to zero. Sister what about start loving with mercy and grace?

    The next one to be written about will be the next one leading millions of people to hell because they preach a false gospel that preaches another ‘Jesus’. What about you start loving with mercy all those you are going to hell because of Kobus van Rensburg and his family ministry. It’s clear you don’t care about people.

    The difference between false teachers standing before God on judgement day and I standing before God after the Rapture at the BEMA Seat is that they preached a gospel that is contrary to the Bible. I do not preach contrary to scripture and if there was something that I was wrong about, and someone told me the truth I would immediately rectify the issue. Unlike Kobus van Rensburg who was warned over and over and did nothing to fix the wicked path he was travelling on. He never recanted his evil doctrines he taught, in fact he just got worse.

  • Louise

    Deborah (Discerning the World) wrote:

    Hi Louise

    Paul Heron wrote some really outrageous stuff that was totally unscriptural, his ideas about the Nephillim were not true and if he just stuck to scripture he would have had far less to write about lol. http://www.discerningtheworld.com/2011/09/06/the-truth-about-the-sons-of-god-the-daughters-of-men-and-the-nephilim/

    Hi Debra yes i know he did and he also did a youtube series on the great falling away which he claimed is not going to happen. I don’t agree with him as I see the great falling away in the Christians today and so many are deceived. We try and speak to as many as we can but the lights are on but nobody is at home. They seem to place man on a pedestal and many Afrikaans speaking Christians are now going into the Hebrew Roots movement. They went from the frying pan (calvinist) into the Charismatic movement (fire) then into the Hebrew Roots (total apostasy) with never becoming bereans as they allowed the pastor to do all the work for them. How sad.

    We are to name false prophets just as Paul named them and yet these apostate Christians will tell you you are judging. They love using that verse on us. They will memorise it off by heart but they won’t check out the bible for themselves. You see they learnt that from their many false teachers. I will never stop telling people the truth as long as I have air in my lungs as “Eternity” is forever and those who don’t make it to heaven will understand the burden we had for them when they would not listen and check the word of God out for themselves.

    If you take the average amount of people who are for Kobus on this site which is 95% it reminds me of this and it does not shock me.

    Luke 6:26 (NAS) “Woe to you when all men speak well of you, for in the same way their fathers used to treat the false prophets.”

    Jer 14:14 (NIV) “The prophets are prophesying lies in my name. I have not sent them or appointed them or spoken to them. They are prophesying to you false visions, divinations, idolatries, and the delusion of their own
    minds.”

    Jer 8:10-12 (NIV) “From the least to the greatest all are greedy for gain; prophet and priest alike, ALL practice deceit. They dress the wound of my people as though it were not serious. ‘Peace, peace,’ they say, when there is no peace. Are they ashamed of their loathsome conduct? No, they have no shame at all; they do not even know how to blush.”

    Mat 24:25 (Phi) “False christs and false prophets are going to appear and produce great signs and wonders to mislead, if it were possible, even God’s own people. Listen, I am warning you.”

    GOD IS WARNING US ALL IN HIS WORD AND WE DO NOT TAKE HEED. WHY? BECAUSE MANY HAVE ALREADY BECOME REPROBATE. THEY WILL BE LEFT BEHIND. THE BRIDE HAS MADE HERSELF READY FOR HER HUSBAND.

  • Louise

    Andre Niemand wrote:

    Who is next on your hit list Deborah? Know that you will be judged in the same manner than you are judging others. If Christ must judge you accordingly he will give you the same amount of mercy and grace you give others which equates to zero. Sister what about start loving with mercy and grace?

    Good Morning Andre,

    I wish to ask you a question. Do you know any false prophets and if so will you please name them for me? This is not a trick cynical question. I pose it to you as I do many other people who I feel might be deceived in the last days. I have an obligation as a Christian to instruct the body when I see they are in error and if I come across arrogant forgive me but thats my intension.

    I assume you feel that Kobus was a Man Of God. I am sending you a bible study which I feel will benefit you greatly. It was done by my hubby. Thank you.

    “LORD LORD”

    Matt. 7:21 – 23 “Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of My Father which is in heaven.

    MANY (HOW MANY) MANY will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works.?

    And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from Me, ye that work iniquity.”

    The above statement was made at the end of the Sermon on the Mount.
    Notice something carefully…

    1. There is a “class” of persons that address Jesus as “Lord Lord”, that will not be entering the Kingdom of Heaven.

    2. There are many such persons, and not just a few. Furthermore, the Greek word translated to “many” in verse 22 almost always indicates the majority of those in view.

    3. They claim to have prophesied (spoken the word of God for God).
    They claim to have cast out devils (exercised supernatural powers).
    They claim to have done many wonderful works (beneficial to mankind).

    4. Jesus does not deny that they did these things. He does not say that everything they prophesied was false. Neither does He say that the devils they cast out were not really devils, or were not really cast out. and, Jesus does not say that their works were not wonderful.

    5. Jesus says to them, “I never knew you.” The word translated to “knew” in verse 23 can mean “to be personally acquainted with, and/or, to approve of”.

    In either case, what Our Lord is saying to these men is: I don’t know and/or like you, and, I never knew and/or liked you. Nothing could be clearer than that these men are not, and never were, His sheep (John 10:27).

    The scene is evidently the Day of Judgement at the Great White Throne Judgement. These people produce their “list” of things they “did for God” before they are rejected. There is no mention, or intimation of any previous conversation. It is not reasonable, and insults God’s Dignity to suggest, that after these people are condemned, that they still are given time to argue and make excuses; therefore, it must be concluded that they spoke first.

    The first thing they say is, “Lord, Lord”. There are only 2 other times in the Bible where
    people are said to address Our Lord Jesus Christ as “Lord, Lord”.

    Mattthew 25:11 – 12 “Afterward also came the other virgins, saying, LORD,
    LORD, open to us. But He answered and said, Verily, I say unto you, I
    know you not.”

    Luke 6:46 “And why call ye Me, Lord, Lord, and do not the things which I say?”

    NOTICE the similarity between these two verses, when taken together, to
    Matt. 7:21-23.

    1. They address Jesus as, “Lord, Lord”.

    2. They didn’t do the will of God.

    3. Jesus does not know and/or approve of them.

    4. They are shut out of the Kingdom of God.

    The fact that these are virgins, which are shut out of the Kingdom of God, corresponds to the claims made by the many to have done good works.
    In the case of the many, the appeal is made on the basis of services rendered. In the case of the virgins, there is a “presumption of acceptance” based on a claim to moral purity. Maybe they had said the “Sinners Prayer” and assumed that they were OK.

    Both groups have failed to do the will of God, even though they have “works of piety” and “moral purity” to their credit. They know who the Lord is, too, but even that does not help them. What we have here, are two types of false brethren whose claim to righteousness is going to be repudiated by Jesus Christ. He says, I never knew you.

    The Day of Reckoning has arrived for the many in Matt. 7:21 – 23.
    After living a Charismatic Christian lifestyle of prophesying, casting out demons, and doing wonderful works; all done in the name of the Lord, these find themselves in hell with all those who thought that their way was acceptable to God.

    They thought that they were saved because they said the Sinners Prayer and believed in God. Satan believes in God too, but he is not saved. The demons believe in Jesus Christ also and they tremble. How many demons are saved?

    They find out that it is not simply believing in Jesus Christ, but WHAT you believe about Jesus Christ that leads to salvation.

    The act of asking God to foegive you and save you from your sin is an act of repentance. That repentance is a lifelong condition from there on. It is not a “Once Off” thing. Many are convinced by their Pastors and Teachers that they are saved because they said the Sinners Prayer.
    “All you have to do is believe” they will you.

    No! that is not all you have to do. You have to repent by rejecting your lifestyle and former ways by humbly surrendering your life on a daily basis into a loving Father’s hands. It is walking in the Spirit by giving up all, even your very life.

    Galatians 2:20 “I have been crucified with Christ; it is no longer I who live, but Christ lives in me; and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by faith in the Son of God, who loved me and gave Himself for me.”

    At the Great White Throne judgement “that Lord” approaches them, they are suddenly filled with fear, and begin to say “Lord, Lord!” This is an appeal for mercy from the merciful.
    They appeal to Jesus by reminding Him of what they had done for Him on earth.

    Perhaps they never read Titus 3: 5 “…not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to His mercy He saved us, through the washing of regeneration and renewing of the Holy Spirit…”

    Is this the greeting to be given to Our Lord Jesus? “I did this or that for you…”
    I hope not!

    Finally allow me to quote 2 Corinthians 13: 5, 6 “Examine yourselves as to whether you are in the faith. Test yourselves. Do you not know yourselves, that Jesus Christ is in you?—unless indeed you are disqualified.
    But I trust that you will know that we are not disqualified.”

    NOW I ASK YOU AGAIN HOW MANY FALSE PROPHETS CAN YOU NAME ME. WE ALL KNOW WE ARE IN THE LAST DAYS AND IF JESUS SAYS MANY AND CHRISTIANS DONT SEE THEM IN THE PULPITS THEM THEY ARE DEEPLY DECEIVED.

  • Osito

    Andre Niemand, if one of the devils servants open his own church and make him self visible as a pastor for God and you know who he really is, and in all the thousands you are the only one knowing his from the devil and what he is preaches is not the truth, then will you not warn the people about it?

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    Louise

    >> i know he did and he also did a youtube series on the great falling away which he claimed is not going to happen. I don’t agree with him as I see the great falling away in the Christians today and so many are deceived.

    Yes I read his commentary on the verse 2 Thessalonians 2:3 where he says ‘the falling away’ does not mean apostasy it means ‘departure’ and that this verse speaks of the rapture – departure from earth. He says there is no falling away from the faith, the world in fact turns towards Christ in the last days and he gives examples of how the in the east people are turning towards Christianity by leaps and bounds (however he does not go into details to explain what type of Christianity they are falling for). He goes into all sorts of in depth study of the words ‘falling away’ to make himself sound really learned in the topic that if you did not know you would be fooled into believing him. The rapture is real but this verse is not speaking about the rapture. And Paul Heron is a false teacher through and through.

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    Thank you Louise and Hubby, that was excellent :)

  • Louise

    And thank you for all the work you do to keep us posted. Much appreciated.

  • Dan

    Louise wrote:
    The act of asking God to foegive you and save you from your sin is an act of repentance. That repentance is a lifelong condition from there on. It is not a “Once Off” thing. Many are convinced by their Pastors and Teachers that they are saved because they said the Sinners Prayer.
    “All you have to do is believe” they will you.
    No! that is not all you have to do. You have to repent by rejecting your lifestyle and former ways by humbly surrendering your life on a daily basis into a loving Father’s hands.

    Hi Louise,
    I have a question if you don’t mind. Let’s say I am a true believer, I’m filled with Holy Spirit, but something happens and in a moment of madness, despite the warnings of the Holy Spirit inside me not to do it, I kill someone. Before I get a chance to repent, I die suddenly. What happens to me?

  • Stacey

    Louise wrote:

    Good Morning Andre,

    I wish to ask you a question. Do you know any false prophets and if so will you please name them for me? This is not a trick cynical question. I pose it to you as I do many other people who I feel might be deceived in the last days. I have an obligation as a Christian to instruct the body when I see they are in error and if I come across arrogant forgive me but thats my intension.

    I assume you feel that Kobus was a Man Of God. I am sending you a bible study which I feel will benefit you greatly. It was done by my hubby. Thank you.

    “LORD LORD”

    Matt. 7:21 – 23 “Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of My Father which is in heaven.

    MANY (HOW MANY) MANY will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works.?

    And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from Me, ye that work iniquity.”

    The above statement was made at the end of the Sermon on the Mount.
    Notice something carefully…

    1. There is a “class” of persons that address Jesus as “Lord Lord”, that will not be entering the Kingdom of Heaven.

    2. There are many such persons, and not just a few. Furthermore, the Greek word translated to “many” in verse 22 almost always indicates the majority of those in view.

    3. They claim to have prophesied (spoken the word of God for God).
    They claim to have cast out devils (exercised supernatural powers).
    They claim to have done many wonderful works (beneficial to mankind).

    4. Jesus does not deny that they did these things. He does not say that everything they prophesied was false. Neither does He say that the devils they cast out were not really devils, or were not really cast out. and, Jesus does not say that their works were not wonderful.

    5. Jesus says to them, “I never knew you.” The word translated to “knew” in verse 23 can mean “to be personally acquainted with, and/or, to approve of”.

    In either case, what Our Lord is saying to these men is: I don’t know and/or like you, and, I never knew and/or liked you. Nothing could be clearer than that these men are not, and never were, His sheep (John 10:27).

    The scene is evidently the Day of Judgement at the Great White Throne Judgement. These people produce their “list” of things they “did for God” before they are rejected. There is no mention, or intimation of any previous conversation. It is not reasonable, and insults God’s Dignity to suggest, that after these people are condemned, that they still are given time to argue and make excuses; therefore, it must be concluded that they spoke first.

    The first thing they say is, “Lord, Lord”. There are only 2 other times in the Bible where
    people are said to address Our Lord Jesus Christ as “Lord, Lord”.

    Mattthew 25:11 – 12 “Afterward also came the other virgins, saying, LORD,
    LORD, open to us. But He answered and said, Verily, I say unto you, I
    know you not.”

    Luke 6:46 “And why call ye Me, Lord, Lord, and do not the things which I say?”

    NOTICE the similarity between these two verses, when taken together, to
    Matt. 7:21-23.

    1. They address Jesus as, “Lord, Lord”.

    2. They didn’t do the will of God.

    3. Jesus does not know and/or approve of them.

    4. They are shut out of the Kingdom of God.

    The fact that these are virgins, which are shut out of the Kingdom of God, corresponds to the claims made by the many to have done good works.
    In the case of the many, the appeal is made on the basis of services rendered. In the case of the virgins, there is a “presumption of acceptance” based on a claim to moral purity. Maybe they had said the “Sinners Prayer” and assumed that they were OK.

    Both groups have failed to do the will of God, even though they have “works of piety” and “moral purity” to their credit. They know who the Lord is, too, but even that does not help them. What we have here, are two types of false brethren whose claim to righteousness is going to be repudiated by Jesus Christ. He says, I never knew you.

    The Day of Reckoning has arrived for the many in Matt. 7:21 – 23.
    After living a Charismatic Christian lifestyle of prophesying, casting out demons, and doing wonderful works; all done in the name of the Lord, these find themselves in hell with all those who thought that their way was acceptable to God.

    They thought that they were saved because they said the Sinners Prayer and believed in God. Satan believes in God too, but he is not saved. The demons believe in Jesus Christ also and they tremble. How many demons are saved?

    They find out that it is not simply believing in Jesus Christ, but WHAT you believe about Jesus Christ that leads to salvation.

    The act of asking God to foegive you and save you from your sin is an act of repentance. That repentance is a lifelong condition from there on. It is not a “Once Off” thing. Many are convinced by their Pastors and Teachers that they are saved because they said the Sinners Prayer.
    “All you have to do is believe” they will you.

    No! that is not all you have to do. You have to repent by rejecting your lifestyle and former ways by humbly surrendering your life on a daily basis into a loving Father’s hands. It is walking in the Spirit by giving up all, even your very life.

    Galatians 2:20 “I have been crucified with Christ; it is no longer I who live, but Christ lives in me; and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by faith in the Son of God, who loved me and gave Himself for me.”

    At the Great White Throne judgement “that Lord” approaches them, they are suddenly filled with fear, and begin to say “Lord, Lord!” This is an appeal for mercy from the merciful.
    They appeal to Jesus by reminding Him of what they had done for Him on earth.

    Perhaps they never read Titus 3: 5 “…not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to His mercy He saved us, through the washing of regeneration and renewing of the Holy Spirit…”

    Is this the greeting to be given to Our Lord Jesus? “I did this or that for you…”
    I hope not!

    Finally allow me to quote 2 Corinthians 13: 5, 6 “Examine yourselves as to whether you are in the faith. Test yourselves. Do you not know yourselves, that Jesus Christ is in you?—unless indeed you are disqualified.
    But I trust that you will know that we are not disqualified.”

    NOW I ASK YOU AGAIN HOW MANY FALSE PROPHETS CAN YOU NAME ME. WE ALL KNOW WE ARE IN THE LAST DAYS AND IF JESUS SAYS MANY AND CHRISTIANS DONT SEE THEM IN THE PULPITS THEM THEY ARE DEEPLY DECEIVED.

    Wow, the above bible study is true.!! I would definitely like to print this out. People/Pastor’s/leaders NEED TO GET A WAKE UP CALL,!!! THIS IS ETERNITY WE’RE TALKING ABOUT!!, :(, I’ve seen/noticed pastor’s that would like to be called pastor all the time, pastor’s that want to make a name for themselve’s, pastor’s who want to be seen important, sitting on special chair’s in their congregation-im sure there is a verse that say’s something along the line’s of: ”should be the most servant of all”,.. aahh sadden’s and anger’s me that I feel that some people are not seeing the bigger picture-Eternal, there’s a very real God, that made the flippin massive hot sun that’s misprobaly a hundred time’s bigger than the earth and then when they start praying to God in front of their church or people it sometime’s seem as if they own God, aaahhh, BeCome AlivE memeber’s of Christ. Like the above say’s we are living in the last day’s, . :( Wake up call is needed, most importantly with regard’s to your personal relationship with Jesus, :),(, I hope people read this,)
    Stacey

  • Stacey

    Louise wrote:

    When i read that Kobus had died my immediate thought was “And now Kobus are you really in the arms of Jesus.” He was a false teacher regardless of how many people he may have healed. The rapture is soon to happen and it saddens me that there are still so many people who are following man and his ministries instead of Christ and the word.
    Patrick Heron also died on the 2nd Jan 2014. He wrote the book on the Nephillim. My hubby and I are not making long term plans as we feel that time is almost up. We are occupying but just barely. Take care.

    Stacey write’s: Wow Louise, this is awesome, :), I feel time is also on it’s way to the end, espicially if you’ve seen the weather report’s on youtube for the last two year’s and strange thing’s happening, ‘strange sound’s heard in the sky around the world-I first thought it was a hoax, but then saw numerous newsreporter’s talking about it on different tv channel’s-the big hail falling, dead fish/ sea animals washing up on shore all together and much more, (even the famous singer’s video’s etc-portraing alot of spiritual darkness-InCreASingly much more than 5 years ago. I really love what you wrote. Stacey.

  • Harry

    Sincere condolence to the prophets family.
    But realy,d fact is I never heard prophet kobus saying he doesnt believe in heaven,the rapture or that he is among the trinity,or that he is Jesus christ,the savior of the world.these accusations are merely twisting his words.i read the comments of his congregatn sayin they believe he will rise again and I think is scriptural to believe in the raising of the dead or pray for the dead to rise.if u v been taught that God can raise d dead it is natural to believe so wen anyone dies.i dont thinks their believing for him to rise is peculiar to him alone.even if it were any of u who died,dey wil stil believe you’d rise.
    You might av notice extreems in his teachings but that does not completely rule him out as not belonging to christ.even paul emphasised that we should not be quick to be teachers because of the sensitiveness of the office and the greater judgement that awaits teacher.the prophet was never seen speaking against christ or denying the faith or trampling under foot the blood of christ by which he was redeemed…..
    Also the fact that he died after preaching about immortality here on earth does not make God’s word on immortality void!There are dimensions of truth.while it is true that Mortality shall be swallowed up of life at the rapture,some people believe it for themselves now and also teach others to do thesame and bcos of that they are enjoyin a life free from sickness or weakness.i am a witness.i am alive becos of the quikenin of Gods spirit In my body.i cant remember wen last I fell ill.there are several people with such testimonies today.yet there was a time critics fought against devine health because they couldnt imagine it with their tiny brains.the teaching on immortality is thesame.what can u believe for?i believe a time is coming here on earth when it will be easy to meet people who dont die.people who are pressd by death etc,bt not crushed,strucked down bt not destroyd.john the beloved according to theologians,was someone like that who survived lots of thing that should kill him.he outlived all other disciples.even Jesus demonstrated immortality as a man when he said I av the power to lay down my life and to take it up…also,paul the apostle in his day said he chose to stay alive because it wil be more profitable to the philipian church.like I said,the time is coming.watch!

  • Anthony

    I’m fully agreed with most things that are written in this website. But Jesus taught. Us in Matthew 10:8 to heal the sick, cleans the leprosy and raise the death. My question is if it was a commandement to raise the death. Why is it not ok that people pray that he would raise for the death. So that he could repent?

  • Anthony

    I’m fully agreed with most things that are written in this website. But Jesus taught. Us in Matthew 10:8 to heal the sick, cleans the leprosy and raise the death. My question is if it was a commandement to raise the death. Why is it not ok that people pray that he would raise for the death. So that he could repent?

    Two reasons come to mind. First of all, if God had to raie the dead to give them a second chance to repent, He would have to raise the majority of people who had already died without Christ. How do I know?

    Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it. (Mat 7:14)

    Did you see that? Only a few are saved in comparison to the billions and billions of people who have lived up to our present day. Why are only a few saved? Because they refuse to seek God and to heed the many warnings in Scripture.

    And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment: (Heb 9:27)

    As far as I recall (and correct me if I’m wrong), only believers were rasie from the dead, not unbelievers.

  • aline

    I am really sorry for his passing but i am not sure why we are so focused on him right now instead of ourselves and how to go deeper in our relationship with God. i actually never listened to his sermons but stumbled upon this one. Whether or not he is wrong,i don’t think it’s wise to argue over it nor judge because the Word of God tells us not to. so I am not really sure what’s going on here. on this page, we are supposed to all be christians but here we’re sitting and judging a man on whether or not he was from God. I say let’s focus on our own spiritual state and growth instead of a man who will ultimately be judged by the Lord.

  • aline

    You are disobeying God if you do not warn others against false teachers and their false doctrines. In fact, you don’t love Him or his children. When Jesus asked Peter whether he loved Him, he asked him thrice whether he loved Him and each time He exhorted Him to feed his sheep the right spiritual food and to defend them against false teachers (wolves in sheep’s clothing).

    Jesus commanded you, ” Take heed that no man deceive you.” (Matthew 24:4. But you don’t seem to take heed of his warning.

    For such are false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming themselves into the apostles of Christ. And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light. Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also be transformed as the ministers of righteousness; whose end shall be according to their works. (2 Co 11:13-15)

  • aline

    its not about me heeding any warning. i never even listened to any of his sermons. in fact, i totally disagree with what he “preached” as seen on this page. and believe me, I know what I am talking about because something of the sort(false teaching among other things) happened in a church i used to attend. with that being said,the verse you gave is very correct however i believe that my point lied somewhere else. the fact that you don’t judge doesn’t mean you’re not being careful or not making sure that you’re not being deceived.

  • aline

    but I do get your point…if such false doctrines are not exposed,then thousands of people will be led astray…

  • ek simpatiseer met wyle Kobus van Rensburg se gesin, familie en gemeente. baie dinge word vir hom en ook teen hom gese. die apostel Paulus leer die gelowiges oordeel die wat binne is (die gelowiges) en God oordeel die wat buite is (die ongelowiges)hierdie “oordeel” beteken nie veroordeel nie, maar liewer vermaning, bestraffing en teregwysing. Ek is van mening dat Paulus leer al sou n engel uit die hemel kom en n ander evangelie verkondig as wst hy verkondig het moes hy n vervloeking geag wees. Ek reken vir Kobus is dit te laat, maar sy vrou Annalise, sy seuns en gemeente skuld christene in Suid-Afrika en regoor Die wereld n verskoning omdat hulle n onbybelse leerstelling glo en verkondig en die Here het aan hulle bewys dat Hy nie die dwaling oor “onsterflikheid” ondersteun nie. Kobus het skrifte uit verband geruk om sy teorie oor immortaliteit te staaf. Sy seun Kobus jr het op tv gese dat die aarde ons agterplaas is dws ons gaan nie hemel toe nie maar net hier op aarde bly, terwyl die aportel Petrus tog leer in sy 2de brief hoofstuk 3 dat die teenswoordige hemel en aarde vernietiging in die gesig staar. hierdie is nie oordeel nie maar eerder n wekroep word wakker spirit word ministries en besef die erns van hierdie dwaling. God seen.

  • Joe

    Please let this arguement be laid to rest.
    I am sure you have realized by now that there will be no winners and losers.
    You have talked about it long enough.
    Please focus on things that are profitable.
    The Prophet’s family is less concerned about the comments here and I dont even think that they bother to visit this site. So, wonderful people of God (whether for or against Kobus), let it be ashes to ashes and dust to dust.

  • Joe,

    You could just as well have asked us to tear out a great deal of passages that warn against false teachers out of the Bible. Would you like us to do that? Or shall we be lenient and only tear out this one spoken by Jesus Himself,

    And Jesus answered and said unto them, Take heed that no man deceive you. (Mat 24:4)

    Kobus van Rensburg led many people astray and his family is continuing his legacy.

    We know that his family is not interested in this site. However, we are concerned about the people who’ve been led astray. Are you one of them?

  • mac

    Are u against not dying or the man of God who preached it?is it so wrong a msg 2 preach?didn’t Enoch and Elijah not die?ddnt death cum bcoz adam had sined and ddnt Jesus cum 2 remove sin?does a truth change bcoz someone ddnt get it?

  • mac,

    Kobus did not preach on dying; he preached and believed that he was immortal and would not die.

  • mac

    That’s exactly wat I said read again my msg?what is so unbelievable about the fact tht we hav defeated death wat is so ungodly abt tht??why do we hav 2 rush and criticise without looking in2 it we are so divided as christians we don’t see wat e devil is tryn 2 do instead of fytng him we fyt each other.do u not learn frm e fact tt Jesus was killed bcoz of the same thng u r doing…do u speak 2 God urslf if i may ask??

  • mac

    I would like you to read the whole of hebrews chapter 11 carefuly particularly verse 5 and the last two verses 39 and 40…my brother God dsnt change by the fact that u don’t see the things he promised thus we hav faith even without visibly seeing thz things they are truth!isn’t it the soul of our gospel??to make this clear let me ask u this;do u my brother prophesy?do u raise people from the dead?can u heal the sick?if there is anything you cannot do on what iv mentioned does that mean God cannot do it thru you?does tht mean its heresy if we say you can do these things???????

  • mac,

    Was Kobus van Rensburg raised from the dead or was he translated like Enoch?

  • mac

    So basically I think I’m wasting my time trying to have a christian talk with you bcoz what I’m getting here is that you are just a person trying to drag the name of someone into the mud you are not concerned about what the bible says at all,all I see from you is malice against a paticular person for preaching a word that you refuse to believe in…you are like the Pharisees to you if you don’t understand a particular word then its coming from the devil…try to read and understand the word before you go around posting things on the internet and expose yourself to God for speaking against his anointed servants

  • mac

    My point is Kobus didn’t have to get or to realise imortality for him to preach it he didn’t have to be healed of cancer for him to preach that God can heal cancer bcoz it is a truth in the bible…today I’m not yet with the faith to heal cancer or deliver demon posesed pple but God CAN DO IT and I can tell pple that HE CAN!!that is the gospel its not about you me or Kobus its about Christ and what He can do,do not lead pple astray my brother

  • mac,

    The reason why Kobus van Rensburg’s church members prayed incessantly for his resurrection (and NOTHING happened) was because he taught them that he was immortal. And you dare say it is biblical? Of course God can heal the sick and raise the dead, but you have the audacity to think that every time you pray God must obey and heal the sick and raise the dead. God is not a puppet on a string you can manipulate to do whatever you want Him to do. Kobus van Rensburg was a false prophet who led many people astray and you are obviously one of them.

  • mac

    Yes evn the Jews today thnk Jesus led people astray and the pharisees killed those who carried His gospel…God gave pple gifts and power to use evn Paul says the kingdom of God is not in word but in the demonstration of power we dnt want Him to be a pupet bt whatsoevr He told us to do we strive to do we don’t let our fear hold us back as you do…that man preached Christ all his life demonstrated love and taught grace in a manner that not many could and by the power of God many were healed the lame walked the blind saw etc there is nothing evil about that.Listen my brother God says by faith nothing is impossible so don’t let fear stop you from asking God to do the impossible thru you don’t put limitations on God bcoz without faith it is impossible to please God

  • mac,

    Did you know that Satan is also quite capable of giving people gifts? How sure are you that Kobus van Rensburg’s gifts was from God and not Satan?

    Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world. (1 Jn 4:1)

    Would you mind presenting us with the proof (doctors’ and/or hospital records) that the people Kobus van Rensburg allegedly healed were indeed healed?

  • mac

    Just read the next two verses that follow the scripture u gave me and you have your answr…I don’t need records to prove faith

  • mac,

    The next two verses read as follows:

    Hereby know ye the Spirit of God: Every spirit that confesseth that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is of God: And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world. (1 John 4:2-3).

    Even the demons confessed that Jesus Christ came in the flesh. When he appeared before them in the flesh they cried out:

    And, behold, they cried out, saying, What have we to do with thee, Jesus, thou Son of God? art thou come hither to torment us before the time? (Matthew 8:29)

    A confession that Jesus is Lord, whilst you claim to heal sick people, prophesy and do many wonderful wonders and miracles in his Name, means nothing – zilch, Nada.

    Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity. (Matthew 7:21-23)

    Kobus van Rensburg’s teaching on the cloud of witnesses in Hebrews 1 is sheer necromancy.

  • John Andrews UK/Ireland

    mac wrote:

    Just read the next two verses that follow the scripture u gave me and you have your answr…I don’t need records to prove faith

    mac, Thomas is not asking you to prove faith – he is asking for evidence that healings claimed by the KvR ministry are true. But you are saying your faith is believing those things that are unseen (no evidence or records) are actually true? You read the scriptures with “blinded eyes and mind”.

    2 Corinthians 4:18 (NIV)

    18 So we fix our eyes not on what is seen, but on what is unseen, since what is seen is temporary, but what is unseen is eternal.

    You need to accept that the evidence you have been asked for is of things temporary. A cancer or blind eyes healed are of an earthly nature and is not eternal. The thing eternal (salvation) is the unseen part. How do you expect to join a forum with your logic not in gear?

    At least one Pentecostal or charismatic has posted on the internet (cannot find it right now) that despite being a continualist (believes that healing, etc is for today) for 20 years he has yet to see a genuine healing, BUT he lives in hope to see this before he dies. At least he knows that he has seen no evidence and will not be able to produce it.

    mac, you are a sign seeker:

    1 Corinthians 1:22-23 (KJV)

    22 For the Jews require a sign, and the Greeks seek after wisdom:

    23 But we preach Christ crucified, unto the Jews a stumbling block, and unto the Greeks foolishness;

  • Sebastian Dube

    IF WE FUNCTION IN LOVE WE WOULD NOT HAVE THESE CONTRARY SPIRITS.THE LOSS OF KOBUS WAS AT AN APPOINTED TIME AND CANCER WAS THE MEDIUM.HIS GRANDFATHER THE PROFET DIED AT THE SAME AGE.CRITICISM WOULD AMOUNT TO JUDGEMENT.BUT THERE IS ONE SCRIPTURE THAT TELLS ME EVEN THE BAD WHEN THEY ARE PREACHING THE GOSPEL THEY ARE ENLARGING THE HOUSE OF GOD.JESUS REBUKED THE DISCIPLE WHEN THEY COMPLAINED ABOUT A CERTAIN PEOPLE PREACHING IN HIS MAN,AMEN

  • Sebastian Dube,

    There is no need for you to shout or is your caps log stuck?

    We are commanded to judge “all things.”

    1 Corinthians 2:15 Amplified Bible (AMP)

    But the spiritual man tries all things [he [a]examines, investigates, inquires into, questions, and discerns all things], yet is himself to be put on trial and judged by no one [he can read the meaning of everything, but no one can properly discern or appraise or get an insight into him].

    I just love your statement “THERE IS ONE SCRIPTURE THAT TELLS ME EVEN THE BAD WHEN THEY ARE PREACHING THE GOSPEL THEY ARE ENLARGING THE HOUSE OF GOD.” If all people are bad (Romans 3:23), to whom are you referring when you say “even the bad?” This is not about the bad and the so-called good (there are none) who preach one and the same Gospel. It’s about bad people preaching a bad (and another) Gospel. The Gospel of Jesus Christ teaches us that the wages of sin is death (Romans 6:23). Kobus van Rensburg taught his followers that he was immortal and would never die. Which of these Gospels is the true one? Like you, his followers believe that van Rensburg’s (the bad guy’s) Gospel was the true one and not the one of the only Good Guy in the entire universe. (Matthew 19:17). Here are some examples of how Kobus van Rensburg’s false gospel (another Gospel) influenced his followers.

    Jacqueline Christ Mbayiwa Makuvatsine opined on his Facebook page:
    The greatest miracle of our time is about to happen, the Prophet is gonna live aaaaw I cant wait for that moment man, what a Mighty God we serve!

    Qamar Fakhoury agreed:
    Thank you Jesus for this great miracle we are waiting for, it’s happening now in Jesus name, amen.

    The spirit was also strong in Grandson Nyirenda:
    The greatest shocking testimony is about to take place, the true life of Jesus is about to be revealed to them that dont believe in immortality, The Prophet is gonna stand up and all the devils and demons will burn with shock.

    His son Kobus Jr. commented after the funeral.
    He said that his father awakened six times after he was declared clinically dead.

    “I believed he could rise up until his coffin was lowered,”

    These are are all lies and yet you still follow his teachings without any compunction?

    Or maybe God Himself sent these strange doctrines among you so that you may perish?

    And then the lawless one (the antichrist) will be revealed and the Lord Jesus will slay him with the breath of His mouth and bring him to an end by His appearing at His coming. The coming [of the lawless one, the antichrist] is through the activity and working of Satan and will be attended by great power and with all sorts of [pretended] miracles and signs and delusive marvels—[all of them] lying wonders—And by unlimited seduction to evil and with all wicked deception for those who are perishing (going to perdition because they did not welcome the Truth but refused to love it that they might be saved.Therefore God sends upon them a misleading influence, a working of error and a strong delusion to make them believe what is false, In order that all may be judged and condemned who did not believe in [who refused to adhere to, trust in, and rely on] the Truth, but [instead] took pleasure in unrighteousness. (2 Thessalonians 2:8-12. AMP)

  • Sebastian Dube wrote:

    IF WE FUNCTION IN LOVE WE WOULD NOT HAVE THESE CONTRARY SPIRITS.

    You are NOT functioning in love when you allow false doctrine to spread like wild fire. In fact it is hatred and not love – not only in regard to others but also God Himself. Learn what true love is before you make these infamous statements in public. Jesus asked Peter three times whether he loved Him and each time commanded him to tend to and feed his sheep and his lambs. Go and learn how David defended his lambs and sheep against wolves and other wild beasts and you may learn what it means to tend to and feed God’s lambs and sheep. Your kind of love is a false love and serves no one.

    You and all the other followers of Kobus van Rensburg love to think that he spoke the truth when he said that he was immortal and wouldn’t die. You don’t spread life when you teach lies; you spread death.

  • Donald

    This page is sponsored by people who don’t understand God at all, people being used by the devil but not realising it at all, I would shut it if I were you because you will lead people astray, Kobus was a man of God, instead of back bitting you brood of vipers preach the gospel and bring the nation to christ. I preach and according to scripture perform miracles and heal that the glory of God be seen. when he preached immortality it was just like what Paul said “I shall not die but live to proclaim the works of God” is not Paul dead right now? you need a bit of understanding before you go about criticising man of God busy looking and trying to snare people with every word that comes from their mouth, you need Jesus in your life who ever is running this discerning the world website. I don’t go to kobus church I am a christian filled with the holy spirit and mightly feared by the devil. make up your mind son of man and repent while you still have time and to all my other folks if you don’t understand the deep things of God i would advise don’t judge or say bad stuff. if kobus was a bad man i don’t care all i know there are testimonies out there of people who didn’t know Christ and wr being troubled by the devil but were given a chance by Jesus through kobus to be partakers of the inheritance of the Kingdom of God.

  • Donald

    I have a friend born blind but sees now after being prayed for by a man of God in africa instant healing he is a living testimony as we speak, I was a Drug addict i used to go out for house braking selling marijuana in the streets of zimbabwe been in the highest level of gangster but God turned me to be a powerful Evangelist as we speak stopped smoking drinking and all the other sinful stuff i did 10 years ago and am happily converted to christianity, so miracles are real and God does do miraculous visible stuff amongst mankind

  • Donald,

    I notice you said ” . . . and am happily converted to Christianity.” Constantine was also converted to Christianity. The question is – what brand of Christianity? I would rather prefer you to be converted to Jesus Christ of the Bible and not Christianity.

  • Donald

    thats fine my friend you seem not to have approved my previous post but how ever you have seen it and it will help you still. christianity is not a basic term my friend its the life you live in christ, the disciples were first called christians at antioch because they were seen to be christ like, christianity becomes the total way of living after receiving Jesus as your personal saviour , I don’t care about constantine if he said he was a christian and did not live it then he wasn’t a christian because christianity is not just a term its living a life in christ saved baptised filled by the Holy Ghost, Im not here to be arguing with you my friend I command demmons bigger than the one controlling you to go back to hell and they listen because of the authority invested in be by the Jesus Christ you heard, if you find time by yourself relook your christian life and make amends

  • Donald,

    You being a self-proclaimed man of God who preaches the Gospel and performs miracle don’t know that is was not Paul who said “I shall not die, but live, and declare the works of the LORD” but King David? (Psalm 118:7).

  • Donald,

    You are not listening. When I asked you to what brand of Christianity you converted, it was to show that there are many so-called Christians today who follow and believe in another Jesus.

    Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity. (Mat 7:21-23)

    You are boasting when you say ” Im not here to be arguing with you my friend I command demmons bigger than the one controlling you to go back to hell and they listen because of the authority invested in be by the Jesus Christ you heard, if you find time by yourself relook your christian life and make amends.”

    Stop boasting, humble yourself and start to believe in the Jesus of the Bible who said “I am lowly in heart (humble).” Your boasting is not of God. It comes from Satan.

    ” . . . be advised my friend,” as you said.

  • Donald

    as much as it is David i refer to Paul who quoted the scripture in romans my friend, and by the way if i discern you calling Kobus a false prophet and trying to judge and all that, i have the right to rebuke that which is not of God and by the way we don’t try to be humble when we see people trying to spread heresy to the world we rebuke, I love you too much to have you mislead your self, the kingdom of God suffers violence and the violent shall take it buy force i see you don’t go in depth to understand what i have been telling you, there is a generation of radicals for christ who will not stand and watch why people are led astray

  • Donald

    All you doing in trying to unveil the truth bla bla is not bringing anyone to christ, be a fellow soul winner with others. I doubt if you have even brought someone to christ with this mentality, Soul winners don’t waste time trying to identify who is a false prophet or not they preach Jesus and people get saved, if the false prophet then tries to prophecy about your live and its not biblical you simply just won’t receive the prophecy. concentrate on enlarging Gods Kingdom than try fault finding, thats what failures do they try find fault in what those who are succeeding are doing Grow up christianity is not about looking shameful and all that its for those that have radical faith in christ and can do everything to get the kingdom of God moving be advised my friend

  • I am more convinced than ever that you are following a false Jesus. The Jesus of the Bible commands you to “take heed that no man deceive you.” (Matthew 24:4). In fact He inspired his prophets, apostles and disciples to write extensively on false teachers, apostles and prophets.

    In the New Testament alone there are 65 verses warning us against false prophets, 93 verses against false teachers and no less than 100 verses against false apostles. You cannot enlarge God’s Kingdom while you remain ignorant and willfully adamant to the dangers of false prophets, teachers and apostles. Jude, the brother of Jesus wrote:

    Beloved, when I gave all diligence to write unto you of the common salvation, it was needful for me to write unto you, and exhort you that ye should earnestly contend for the faith which was once delivered unto the saints. For there are certain men crept in unawares, who were before of old ordained to this condemnation, ungodly men, turning the grace of our God into lasciviousness, and denying the only Lord God, and our Lord Jesus Christ. (Jude 1:3-4)

    The most dangerous way to deny Jesus Christ, is to present another Jesus to people and that’s precisely what Kobus van Rensburg did during his life. He preached another Jesus.

    “…be advised, my friend” as you said.

  • Donald,

    I find it odd that you should warn me about being led astray when you yourself have already been led astray by Kobus van Rensburg.

  • John Andrews UK/Ireland

    Donald wrote to Thomas Lessing:

    Grow up christianity is not about looking shameful and all that its for those that have radical faith in christ and CAN DO EVERYTHING to get the kingdom of God moving be advised my frien

    This is exactly where your problem lies – you think you have license to “do everything”, BUT you are deceived as the Scripture has laid out boundaries that the likes of Kobus van Rensburg ignored by placing himself above God. You are obviously happy to associate with a failed apostle that brought shame to the church through his false teaching. He also appointed himself “an apostle” when he was obviously deceived himself. He has brought the church (which he unfortunately claimed to be a part of) into disrepute.

    2 Peter 2:1-2(NIV)

    But there were also false prophets among the people, just as there will be false teachers among you. They will secretly introduce destructive heresies, even denying the sovereign Lord who bought them bringing swift destruction on themselves. Many will follow their depraved conduct and will bring the way of truth into disrepute.

    Choosing to associate yourself with a false Teacher means that you could be destroyed by your cooperation with his heresies. The end result may be that you end up in hell.

    Matthew 15:14 (NIV)

    Leave them; they are blind guides. If the blind lead the blind, both will fall into a pit.”

    Be informed by the Scripture – you cannot by deceitful doctrine be a soul winner. A harmful doctrine is often gradual and subtle, but Kobus van Rensburg preached immortality on earth? That is not even subtle……

  • Nez

    Deborah (Discerning the World) wrote:

    Hi Tommy

    You said:

    >> “I met Kobus when he was in the tent, living in a prefab house, with an ancient clapped out old bakkie and his wife making country and western dresses from calico to support the family.It was in the same period that Trevor Yoko was involved in getting the whole Christian schooling thing going here.
    I saw a miracle there when an old man that I knew and that had had a stroke a few weeks previously and was brain damaged was healed. While the community was in worship Kobus called him to the front of the tent did not touch him, just said “Ag Here, genees hom asseblief” and the old man was healed immediately. That was the first time that the old man had ever been in that church….Kobus did not know him from a bar of soap, and neither did anybody in the community. His grandson had brought him there from another town.No falling over, no fireworks, just the Holiness of God filling the whole tent…Believe me I am a skeptic of “godly” healings because I come from the occult and satanism and knew where a lot of them actually came from…so when I got miraculously saved at the Cross, by and through God’s Grace, it carried through with me, but that one healing was real.
    His teaching was pure and scriptural then…”

      — DTW said: “I would dare to say that its possible the healing was not real. Have you read: Can Satan heal? You do not know what became of that man? Did his health get worse later? The reason I believe it was not a genuine healing is because 1) Kobus could not have started out a good minister and then moved onto being a bad minister. 2) That’s like saying you can get saved and preach the gospel truth, but then lose your salvation and stop preaching the truth. 3) You can’t lose your salvation once you are saved, when the Holy Spirit enters you He SEALS you and stays there permanently. So Kobus was false from the beginning, and so was that healing. And I don’t believe his teaching was pure and 100% scriptural either. Kobus started off as a small false preacher who preached on a small scale and as he expanded he became more false as he sought after more power through Toronto and TB Joshua.”

    I think you need to be careful hear about your reasons for believing this man to be a false prophet. I have read through lots of the comments on this blog and I must say outright that I do not believe the teachings on immortality. But you say that Kobus’ healing were not genuine because he couldn’t have started out as a good minister and then turned bad because the Holy Spirit seals believers. Yes the Holy Spirit seals believers and He fills them but if you choose to follow error even when He leads and guides you against it then that is your choice to walk in the wrong direction. There are many who have been true believers and ministers sealed, filled but who have somewhere along their Christian journey strayed from the faith. Because they have strayed, does that mean they weren’t “good” in the first place? Of course not. It means that the devil deceived them along the way and even though the Holy Spirit prompted them against that deception they still yielded to it.

    What evidence to you have that this was or was not the case with Kobus? You talk about this website being about exposing heresies but you make claims and accusations about this man in your statement that you have not proved. I totally agree with the Scriptures you have used to show error in Kobus thinking. You talk about “his lies” and him conning people. That would suggest a deliberate desire to deceive people not a man how was himself deceived and believed error. But yet for these things you say about him more personally, you bring no proof. Can you share the proof that this man deliberately intended to deceive, con and lie to people? As I believe that would make your claims credible.

    What you do not realise is that your 3 points for claiming Kobus to be a false from the beginning (not just false but false from the beginning) are full of errors also. I give the example of Judas – how he walked with Jesus not just him but others too that the Bible says they found Jesus’ words too offensive so they walked away from following Him. But I also draw your attention to the Parable of the sower – which in three of the examples is actually talking about so called “believers”. In one case in particular the Word says (paraphrasing) that the seed feel in rocky ground. Jesus later explains this as those who initially accept the Word into their hearts gladly but then afflications and persecutions come BECAUSE OF THE WORD which causes them to FALL AWAY. that says clearly that they accepted the Word, they may still have been on milk spiritually so to speak but they still accepted the Word. Jesus then explains that they fell away. That suggests that you can become a believer and then fall away from belief in Christ because of the Word – the standard it brings and opposition to that. The idea of once saved always saved is error. You have called out the Teachings of Kobus Van Rensberg (quite rightly) as not being based on the Word. But his teaching specifically against the Word is where you should stay, rather than talking about him as being “False from the beginning” and implying that he was never a “good minister”. These statements cannot be backed up by the Word or by any proof you have provided so far which then suggests that you are judging him personally (i.e. saying he is false and a bad minister) based on your opinion and not fact or evidence or most importantly the Word.

  • Joe

    From 21/12/2013 to 8/09/2014 debating about a dead man. Wow, this site is busy. I said before that there’ll be no winners in this debate and I wasnt wrong. I must say the debate wasnt that fruitful. Grace to you all.

  • Joe,

    Some dead people lieve a legacy, you know, and it kills those who are still alive and oh sooooooo ignorant.

  • Nez,

    Kobus van Rensburg’s ministry was bad from the very outset. He received his anointing from TB Joshua in Lagos, Nigeria who is one of today’s most dangerous false prophets on the planet. Kobus was slain in the spirit by TB who told him to go back to South Africa where he would do the same miracles as he.

    Walking with Jesus the way Judas had done, does not prove that you are saved in the beginning and later fall away. Judas was bad from the very beginning and remained unsaved until his death by suicide.

    Get your facts straight. The parable of the sower refers to the spreading of the gospel and the response of UNBELIEVERS to it – not believers. Those who fall away were the false Christians who thought they were saved.

    Are you going to tell us which of his sermons on the internet and those being repeated on tape in his church by his family, are the ones he delivered at the beginning of his ministry when he was still OK and those he delivered when he fell away? Guess what, all his sermons are the same, right from the beginning and right to the end.

    In any case, pastors and teachers are going to be judged – not by what they had said or done in the beginning of their ministry – by what they had done at the end of their lives.

  • Deborah (Discerning the World)

    Joe

    We are fighting against his false teaching that are STILL to this day, after he is dead, leading people to hell. Do you have a problem with us trying to speak to people and tell that that what they are believing is false and demonically influencing their lives that if they don’t stop and listen to the Holy Spirit’s warnings they are on the road straight to tell? Do you want to see people in hell Joe? Do you want God to hold you responsible for trying to make sure people go to hell, because you want us to stop warning people against Kobus van Rengburg’s legacy?

    There is a winner on this website and that is the WORD OF GOD, Jesus Christ in published form. There are many people that read this website Joe and many have woken up to the truth because we well the truth.

    We are not going to stop because you think we should, that would be listening to Satan.

  • Nez

    Thomas Lessing (Watch and Pray / Waak en Bid) wrote:

    Nez,

    Kobus van Rensburg’s ministry was bad from the very outset. He received his anointing from TB Joshua in Lagos, Nigeria who is one of today’s most dangerous false prophets on the planet. Kobus was slain in the spirit by TB who told him to go back to South Africa where he would do the same miracles as he.

    Walking with Jesus the way Judas had done, does not prove that you are saved in the beginning and later fall away. Judas was bad from the very beginning and remained unsaved until his death by suicide.

    Get your facts straight. The parable of the sower refers to the spreading of the gospel and the response of UNBELIEVERS to it – not believers. Those who fall away were the false Christians who thought they were saved.

    Are you going to tell us which of his sermons on the internet and those being repeated on tape in his church by his family, are the ones he delivered at the beginning of his ministry when he was still OK and those he delivered when he fell away? Guess what, all his sermons are the same, right from the beginning and right to the end.

    In any case, pastors and teachers are going to be judged – not by what they had said or done in the beginning of their ministry – by what they had done at the end of their lives.

    Thomas,

    I will start by saying that I have not followed Kobus at all so I came to this site “fresh” as it were without thought nor feeling about this made either way. As I read what was said though, I was troubled by the delivery of some of the posts against this man. Yes I say AGAINST because as much as we are told to rebuke when error is made, that rebuke should be done in love – just as Christ would with us. It troubled me to see that although rebuke re immortality teachings was necessary, there seemed to be no love or respect in dealing with a man who has passed away. I’m not saying dumb it down or pretend error is okay – no but these things should still be done respectfully. I feel an undertone or attitude of “one up manship/I’m right you’re wrong” or “look I told you so – he died didn’t he”. That is simply distasteful and not really about the love of God and the Kingdom.

    I take your point about Judas walking with Jesus as no indication of accepting the truth but you say that he was bad from the beginning. That is not Biblically accurate. The Bible speaks about him having “unbelief” in his heart. There is a difference between “bad” and “unbelief” and his highlights my issues with this blog.

    You claim that you are trying to call out “false prophets” but you don’t stick to facts. Lots of what I see on this blog is assumption and emotional response to Kobus’ teachings. For example the point I made before – higher up Kobus is described as lying to people/telling lies and even conning people. I said before – these statements suggest that Kobus knowingly and deliberately taught things that were untrue with the intention of deceiving people. As I asked before – where is your proof of this. You want people to read your blog and learn from it but you make statements and are being asked to back up those statements but you have not done so. How do you know that Kobus was not a man who was deceived and started to believe another gospel? My point before and my point now is that if you are going to make statements about someone on a public domain, it is reasonable for you to be expected to back those statements up. I’ve seen no “proof” of Kobus being a “liar” or a “con man”. I see prove that of his teachings about immortality stray far from the Word but that is the measure all statements you make should be measured against – The Word. I’m simply saying I don’t have an issue with call out pastors’/ministers’ teachings if they are erroneous BASED ON THE WORD but that does not then give you the right to make statements about said people that you are not prepared to back up yourselves with “EVIDENCE”. Yes pastors and teachers will be judged but so will you so I would again encourage caution on what you say about people because as much as there is error in Kobus’ teaching, no man knew his heart.

    Finally I would like to comment on your statement about “getting my facts straight” regarding the Parable of the Sower. I would suggest reading it again and asking the Holy Spirit to give you fresh revelation about this text because it is certainly NOT about the unbeliever only. As I said before 3 out of the 4 are believers. If you read Matthew 13: 20 – 23, the language highlights this. Many people assume that only the fourth example is is a believer because he/she is fruitful. But that’s like saying that either all believers are fruitful (which is false) or unless you are fruitful then you are not a believer (also false). Believers should be fruitful but the truth is, there are many who have accepted God into they hearts but who are not fruitful but still very much struggling to stay saved/on milk. Verse 20 is the most revealing because Jesus clearly says that these people receive the Word with joy. How can this be an unbeliever? The text later goes onto say that they stay with it for a while until basically something in the Word stands up against something they have held to then they FALL AWAY. Again I ask, how can an UNBELIEVER fall away? They are already fallen! These verses rather speak about a BELIEVER, someone who was happy to receive the Word, maybe stayed with the whole Christian life for a short while but then fell away. Can you then say that it is not possible for Christians to fall away? Of course it is. 2 Peter 2: 20 -22 also speaks about the grave consequences of this. Why speak on it if it can’t happen? I go back to my original point which was – how do you know Kobus was “bad” from the beginning? People can and do fall away and this should not just be looked at as “well they weren’t true believers in the first place”. That thinking is error and I would suggest you ask the Holy Spirit to guide you into all truth on that too. As for Kobus’ sermons – I have no interest in listening to these but still believe that where a calling out or rebuke is needed this should be done respectfully without the need to bring your own conduct into question. Sadly, I think too many on here have done that with your conduct.

  • Nez wrote:

    Thomas,

    I will start by saying that I have not followed Kobus at all so I came to this site “fresh” as it were without thought nor feeling about this made either way. As I read what was said though, I was troubled by the delivery of some of the posts against this man. Yes I say AGAINST because as much as we are told to rebuke when error is made, that rebuke should be done in love – just as Christ would with us. It troubled me to see that although rebuke re immortality teachings was necessary, there seemed to be no love or respect in dealing with a man who has passed away. I’m not saying dumb it down or pretend error is okay – no but these things should still be done respectfully. I feel an undertone or attitude of “one up manship/I’m right you’re wrong” or “look I told you so – he died didn’t he”. That is simply distasteful and not really about the love of God and the Kingdom.

    Please give me an example of some of the comments that were not written “in love” and then we can talk again.

    Is this speaking the truth in love?

    But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed. As we said before, so say I now again, If any man preach any other gospel unto you than that ye have received, let him be accursed. (Gal 1:8-9)

  • Nez,

    You say 3 out of the 4 in the parable of the sower as believer? Really???

    Barnes writes:

    Mat_13:20, Mat_13:21
    But he that received the seed into stony places – Jesus explains this as denoting those who hear the gospel; who are caught with it as something new or pleasing; who profess to be greatly delighted with it, and who are full of zeal for it. Yet they have no root in themselves. They are not true Christians. Their hearts are not changed. They have not seen their guilt and danger, and the true excellency of Christ. They are not “really” attached to the gospel; and when they are tried and persecution comes, they fall – as the rootless grain withers before the scorching rays of the noonday sun.

    Mat_13:22
    He also that received seed among the thorns – These represent the cares, the anxieties, and the deceitful lure of riches, or the way in which a desire to be rich deceives people. They take the time and attention. They do not leave opportunity to examine the state of the soul. Besides, riches allure, and promise what they do not yield. They promise to make us happy; but, when gained, they do not do it. The soul is not satisfied. There is the same desire to possess more wealth. And to this there is no end “but death.” In doing it there is every temptation to be dishonest, to cheat, to take advantage of others, to oppress others, and to wring their hard earnings from the poor. Every evil passion is therefore cherished by the love of gain; and it is no wonder that the word is choked, and every good feeling destroyed, by this “execrable love of gold.” See the notes at 1Ti_6:7-11. How many, O how many, thus foolishly drown themselves in destruction and perdition! How many more might reach heaven, if it were not for this deep-seated love of that which fills the mind with care, deceives the soul, and finally leaves it naked, and guilty, and lost!

    Only the seed that fell on good soil refers to a person who was lost and then responded favorably to the Gospel to be saved. Nevertheless, the fact is that he told the parable to unbelievers and not believers.

    And the disciples came, and said unto him, Why speakest thou unto them [unbelievers] in parables? He answered and said unto them, Because it is given unto you to know the mysteries of the kingdom of heaven, but to them it is not given. (Matthew 13:10-11)

  • Nez,

    You’re a strange one. You tell us not to rebuke false teachers, but then you do so yourself.

    I see prove that of his teachings about immortality stray far from the Word but that is the measure all statements you make should be measured against – The Word. I’m simply saying I don’t have an issue with call out pastors’/ministers’ teachings if they are erroneous BASED ON THE WORD but that does not then give you the right to make statements about said people that you are not prepared to back up yourselves with “EVIDENCE”.

    You ask us to provide you with evidence and then you proceed to give evidence? How does that work for you?

    Kobus’ doctrine on immortality is diametrically at enmity with the Gospel of Jesus Christ.

    If we are not allowed to rebuke false teachers in public, then they should stop preaching their heresies in public. However, as long as they preach their heresies in public I own myself the right to rebuke them in public.

    When I say unto the wicked, Thou shalt surely die; and thou givest him not warning, nor speakest to warn the wicked from his wicked way, to save his life; the same wicked man shall die in his iniquity; but his blood will I require at thine hand. Yet if thou warn the wicked, and he turn not from his wickedness, nor from his wicked way, he shall die in his iniquity; but thou hast delivered thy soul. Again, When a righteous man doth turn from his righteousness, and commit iniquity, and I lay a stumblingblock before him, he shall die: because thou hast not given him warning, he shall die in his sin, and his righteousness which he hath done shall not be remembered; but his blood will I require at thine hand. Nevertheless if thou warn the righteous man, that the righteous sin not, and he doth not sin, he shall surely live, because he is warned; also thou hast delivered thy soul. (Eze 3:18-21)

  • Nez wrote:

    I take your point about Judas walking with Jesus as no indication of accepting the truth but you say that he was bad from the beginning. That is not Biblically accurate. The Bible speaks about him having “unbelief” in his heart. There is a difference between “bad” and “unbelief” and his highlights my issues with this blog.

    WHAT!!! Are you serious??? Unbelief is the epitome of badness. It is even much badder than just being bad.

    And when he is come, he will reprove the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment: Of sin, because they believe not on me. (Joh 16:8-9)

  • Nez

    Thomas,

    Okay so firstly not quite sure why you quote Gal 1:8-9. At not point have I disagreed with your comments about Kobus’ teachings on immortality so don’t really see why this Scripture is mentioned. You asked for comments not made in love, I have picked a few:

    comment to Joe 31 Dec
    “you have been misled into a stupor of utter blindness” (i see this as rude and unnecessary)

    Comment to Sarah 29 Dec
    “I just love the way how you express your love with words like “devil worshipper”….” (I see this as sarcastic and again unnecessary)

    Comment to Trishia on 27 Dec
    “You just love to twist the Scripture don’t you?” (Again I see this as sarcastic)…

    …and of course your comment made to me on 17 October “You are a strange one” Let me ask you honestly. Was this comment or any of the other comments I’ve listed (which by the way is not all the comments in the blog just a few examples) “MADE IN LOVE”? I think about how Jesus would teach and deal with people who question things in Christianity and I know He would deal with people with compassion and patience. He wouldn’t be sarcastic, make comments which are rude or condescending, make comments which seem to be about “one up manship/winning an arguement rather than winning a soul” and I know He certainly wouldn’t resort to name calling. There will always be people who disagree with comments you have made but that does not give you the right to be sarcastic or plain and simply rude. I find your comment to me “You are a strange one” rude. period. When address me I ask that you stop the name calling and sarcasm. It’s not respectful and it’s unnecessary. People are less likely to listen to what you have to say when you come across in this fashion – which is probably why people have already commented on some of your conduct. You don’t need to address people in this way, it simply is not Godly.

    Secondly, The parable of the sower. I encouraged you to read and ask the Holy Spirit to give you revelation. I don’t believe there is anything wrong with quoting Barnes but the Holy Spirit is the best, most perfect Teacher and the Word says that He will guide you into all truth (John 16:13). Of verse 20 Barnes says “Yet they have no root. They are not TRUE Christians.” If you see my earlier comment, I expressed the same thing. These people have “no roots”. I mentioned, its like a new believer in Christ. Th WORD says they receive the Word with joy. If this verse refers to an unbeliever then that unbeliever receives the Word with joy and still remains and unbeliever? How can that be? Barnes hits the word on the head – TRUE Christian. There are many, many sadly in the church who have repented of their sins, confessed Christ with their mouth and believed He is Lord in their heart. These people are believers. But many don’t move on from there. Some stay there because of lack of knowledge, lack of faith, laziness, fear etc. The Bible describes these folks ask those who are like a man escaping from a burning house, he himself will be saved but he will suffer loss (1 Cor 3:15). They are saved but not operating as “TRUE” Christians because as much as they have accepted salvation as they start to learn more, the Word of God offends them so they eventually fall away. The example of the seed falling in among the thorns is similar. The Word says that these people “become unfruitful”. This suggests a moving to the state of unfruitfulness. Only a BELIEVER can move to a state of unfruitfulness because an unbeliever constantly lives there. In fact unfruitfulness is the natural state on an unbeliever. They cannot “become unfruitful” it is part of who they are as unbelievers. ONLY a Believer can move from fruitfulness back into unfruitfulness. These may be believers who for example get sucked into the whole prosperity gospel. They have accepted Christ but along their journey they are drawn to the pull of financial gain, popularity, fame and instead of moving forward in God’s plan for their life and being a witness to others, they chase these messages and become unfruitful in the Kingdom. These are believers and Barnes commentary does not take away from that. They are not living the true Christian life as they should but if they were to die, they would make it in – if only just. The fourth description is who we should be and let’s be real – getting their is a process. Most are not THERE from the point they accept salvation. There is a lot of growing up in Christ and allowing the Word to take root that needs to be done.

    Thirdly, I never said NOT too rebuke false teachers, you have misquoted me there. What I did say was to present your argument about someone’s teachings based on the Word which I acknowledged in both of my previous comments that you did specifically around Kobus’ teaching on immortality. At no point have I agreed with this teaching or said you should not have done so. My issue has been your comments and Deborah’s comments about Kobus being a “liar” and conman. Here’s a comment you made:

    Comment to Just a Question 30 Dec

    Camping predicted Jesus would return on certain dates – HE LIED

    Kobus Van Renbsberg said he was immortal – HE LIED

    As I stated before to lie or to con someone is something done with DELIBERATE INTENTION. I am asking you to PROVE that Kobus lied and conned people. You have said it public so now you are being called upon to prove these statements. This is now the third time I have asked you to prove this and no proof that Kobus deliberately and intentional lied to and conned people has been provided so far. This is why I said what I said about being cautious about what you say. These statements strike me as “assumption” and “emotional response”. I am specifically asking for EVIDENCE for these 2 statements. As stated before, you HAVE provided evidence about Kobus’ teachings on immortality based on the Word. You have shown what he said and how that DID NOT line up with the Word. I am asking for you to do the same in regards to him lying and conning people as you have put it. I said previously, how do you know Kobus himself was not deceived by this wayward teaching? you categorically state he is lying, he is a liar, he lied, he conned people etc but you don’r say how you know this so definitively. I want to know also, if that is the case. My point here is that when people teach things that do not line up with the Word, yes we must rebuke but we must leave it there. We don’t add in our own interpretation of what they are doing and why unless we are sure and have proof. The impression that you build of Kobus is one of a man with a plan to deceive the church, a man who worked for the devil (as you keep quoting “Can Satan Heal”, a man tat was “bad” from the beginning who had not intention of promoting Christ. I see a man who claimed to love God and who claimed to want to serve Him. I also see a man who taught a mixture of the true Gospel and mixed up teachings not supported by the Word but I don’t his heart – only God does. So I refuse to comment on his character as a person until I have proof to be able to do so in a clear and honest way. I refuse to make statements about a person as if they were true when in actual fact they are “my OPINION” and if I give my opinion I state this is how I think or feel about something.

    Finally, I do not believe that Judas was not totally unbelieving from the beginning. It is clear that there was some belief in him. He believed . In John 6: 60 – 71 many other disciples leave Jesus because they are offended by the Word He speaks. Judas stays and Simon Peter speaks for the disciples by saying to Jesus that “We believe you are the Christ” He spoke for Judas too even though Jesus then speaks of Judas as a devil knowing it is him who will betray Him. In Matthew 26: 23:25, Judas refers to Jesus as Master so it is clear there is some belief there but total unbelief. Judas’ walk with Christ is more complex than just good or bad. Yes there is unbelief – otherwise Satan would not have been able to enter him but unbelief had sent into Simon Peter also as he denied Christ. People speculate about his intentions when he walked with Jesus and why he betrayed Him but the Bible does not give us full insight on this although we know it ended badly for him. I brought Judas up initially to say that you did not know the intentions of Kobus heart. You speak of him as bad from the beginning but where was his beginning? and what beginning – his beginning in life or the Christian faith? Where is the line crossed from teaching in error about a topic to being a false prophet or being used to heal by Satan. Just out of interest, where do you think Kobus has gone?

  • Nez wrote

    comment to Joe 31 Dec
    “you have been misled into a stupor of utter blindness” (i see this as rude and unnecessary)

    And I suppose you would see this as rude and unnecessary as well.

    Woe unto you, ye blind guides, which say, Whosoever shall swear by the temple, it is nothing; but whosoever shall swear by the gold of the temple, he is a debtor! (Mat 23:16)

    You blind fools! For which is greater, the gold or the temple that has made the gold sacred? (Mat 23:17)

    You blind Pharisee! First clean the inside of the cup and the plate, that the outside also may be clean. (Mat 23:26).

    How is this for a little sarcasm in the Bible?

    And at noon Elijah mocked them, saying, “Cry aloud, for he is a god. Either he is musing, or he is relieving himself, or he is on a journey, or perhaps he is asleep and must be awakened.” (1 Ki 18:27)

    I wish those who unsettle you would emasculate themselves! (Gal 5:12)

    The word for “emasculate is “apokoptō” and means to cut off the private parts. Paul wished they would go much further than just to cut off their foreskins. Now that’s what I call real rude and unnecessary sarcasm, would’nt you?

    I am not going to waste any more time with your wise remarks. Your statement “Finally, I do not believe that Judas was not totally unbelieving from the beginning. It is clear that there was some belief in him. He believed” is one the silliest I have ever heard. Would Judas have gone to heaven if he maintained “some belief?” I suggest that you “emasculate” yourself from this blog. I am convinced that you are one of the blind leading the blind. If Paul could use the word “emasculate” I can too, and if Jesus could use the word “blind” I can too. Are you going to accuse Jesus and Paul of being loveless. Careful now!

  • Nez wrote.

    Finally, I do not believe that Judas was not totally unbelieving from the beginning. It is clear that there was some belief in him. He believed . In John 6: 60 – 71 many other disciples leave Jesus because they are offended by the Word He speaks. Judas stays and Simon Peter speaks for the disciples by saying to Jesus that “We believe you are the Christ” He spoke for Judas too even though Jesus then speaks of Judas as a devil knowing it is him who will betray Him.

    Do you really think an acknowledgement that Jesus is the Christ spells salvation?

    And when he was come to the other side into the country of the Gergesenes, there met him two possessed with devils, coming out of the tombs, exceeding fierce, so that no man might pass by that way. And, behold, they cried out, saying, What have we to do with thee, Jesus, thou Son of God? art thou come hither to torment us before the time? (Matthew 8:28-29)

  • Nez,

    Kobus van Rensburg deliberately conned and lied to his followers. How do I know? He refused to listen to and heed the grave warnings of the 12 apostles of God.

    Beloved, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God, for many false prophets have gone out into the world. By this you know the Spirit of God: every spirit that confesses that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is from God, and every spirit that does not confess Jesus is not from God. This is the spirit of the antichrist, which you heard was coming and now is in the world already. Little children, you are from God and have overcome them, for he who is in you is greater than he who is in the world. They are from the world; therefore they speak from the world, and the world listens to them. We are from God. Whoever knows God listens to us; whoever is not from God does not listen to us. By this we know the Spirit of truth and the spirit of error. (1 Jn 4:1-6).

  • Nez

    Oh dear,

    I see you have taken some of what I have said out of context (Judas ‘ acknowledgement spells salvation?????? WHAT?????) and not answered some of the specific questions I have asked. I would have enjoyed continuing this debate because I believe it is good for believers to do so as we come for many theological and cultural backgrounds but I will not be returning to this site. Here’s the thing, some of the information on Kobus that was provided was clearly explained in reference to it’s opposition to what the Word say. I have disagreed with some of your points (e.g accusations about character without proof), I have maintained respect for you as a fellow believer. You have sadly not done the same with me. I cannot understand why you cannot debate or put your points across without making sarcastic and unnecessary comments. I have seen some of the points you have made previously in the blog and agreed with them but also see how you have delivered them. I see pride in your responses and like I mentioned before a desire for “one up manship/dominiating position”. A man previously commented about spending more time on the streets witnessing to others and you commented back mentioning that yes that ministry is important but so is yours – blogging to tell people the truth. But in between your “truth telling” you belittle and insult, then when this is highlighted, you stand by your position of name calling/making sarcastic and unnecessary comments and then try to use the Word of God to JUSTIFY your name calling and such comments???????? and you call this ministry????

    It doesn’t matter what verses you use to defend your position, the Word DOES NOT back up deliberately and intentionally insulting (fellow believers). Yes people were offended by things Jesus and His disciples said but some of your comments have been personal insults with no relevance to the debate about the Word (just low blows – because that’s what this is to you). You have clearly crossed the line. What then concerns me is that when I do that I know the Holy Spirit convicts me of it. Where there is no conviction, you have to then wonder do you hear or even know the voice of God for yourself? (Just a thought)

    I thank God that I am no longer blind, He has taken me out of blindness, and no matter what you think based on 3 posts – that shoe does not fit! He knows my heart and my intentions of every comment I have written. Anyway, I came to this blog with an open mind, looking to learn. I don’t claim to know it all but I enjoy debating differing views with other believers. But that’s wasted here. I’ve learned that and I’ll know better next time. God Bless.

  • Nez wrote:

    I see you have taken some of what I have said out of context (Judas ‘ acknowledgement spells salvation?????? WHAT?????) and not answered some of the specific questions I have asked.

    You distinctly wrote,

    In John 6: 60 – 71 many other disciples leave Jesus because they are offended by the Word He speaks. Judas stays and Simon Peter speaks for the disciples by saying to Jesus that “We believe you are the Christ” He spoke for Judas too even though Jesus then speaks of Judas as a devil knowing it is him who will betray Him.

    Are you now denying what you said or have you merely conveniently forgotten what you said? Furthermore you said that Judas had “some faith” or “some belief” because he called Him Master. Really???

    Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, [MASTER, MASTER] have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity. (Mat 7:22-23).

    Judas also performed miracles in Jesus’ Name and now he is in hell.

    You came to this blog to learn, you said? Really??? The irony is, you are NOT learning. You are arguing, bickering and being downright stubborn. You are stubbornly defending and protecting Judsas who betrayed Jesus and allegedly was a believer before he became a betrayer. Should I just turn a blind eye to your lies and allow you to influence others who read this blog because they truly want to learn. You do NOT read this blog to learn. Had it been so you would have acknowledged that when I quoted to you from Matthew 13 that Jesus spoke in parables to unbelievers, and yet you still refused to see that Jesus spoke parables to unbelievers and not his disciples.

    And the disciples came, and said unto him, Why speakest thou unto them in parables? He answered and said unto them, Because it is given unto you to know the mysteries of the kingdom of heaven, but to them it is not given. (Mat 13:10-11)

    You accuse me of deliberately insulting commentators on this blog. Isn’t that precisely what you are doing to me? Insulting me? Listen my friend, I don’t care. You can insult me from here to eternity. But what you deliberately forget is that you are insulting Jesus Christ, his Gospel and his prophecies by saying that Judas was initially a believer. Do you really think I am going to allow you to insult Jesus Christ in that way and not say anything about it?

    I speak not of you all: I know whom I have chosen: but that the scripture may be fulfilled, He that eateth bread with me hath lifted up his heel against me. Now I tell you before it come, that, when it is come to pass, ye may believe that I am he. (John 13:18-19)

    God knew before the ancient of times that Judas would never repent and yet you dare say to Jesus, “Listen up Jesus, you are a liar. Judas was a believer and then fell away.” And you dare say you came to this blog to learn? How on earth can you learn from this blog when you refuse to learn even from Jesus Christ? Indeed, He knows your heart and every comment before you have even thought about it or written it. And still you prefer to contradict his Word? I too like debating but then the Word of God should have the last and final say. Not with you. You are wiser and niftier and more knowledgeable than the Holy Spirit who inspired the Word of God. You say: Judas was a believer and Jesus told parables to his disciples because it was not given to them to know and understand things about the Kingdom of God.

    You proved to me that the Word of God means nothing to you when you wrote the following.

    It doesn’t matter what verses you use to defend your position, the Word DOES NOT back up deliberately and intentionally insulting (fellow believers). Yes people were offended by things Jesus and His disciples said but some of your comments have been personal insults with no relevance to the debate about the Word (just low blows – because that’s what this is to you).

    When Jesus and Paul said things and even offended some people, it’s OK but when I say exactly the same things I am insulting you and others? Really??? And by the way, I am not defending myself. I am merely stating facts. If you are blind, you are blind. Period. Your blindness is even more dangerous because you stubbornly and deliberately refuse to see. And that’s precisely why you are ignorant of the fact that Kobus van Rensburg deliberately and intentionally conned and lied to his followers.

    Or do you believe that Jesus is going to be more lenient to false prophets who ignorantly and unintentionally conned people and lied to them? “OK listen up you false prophets. Those of you who deliberately and intentionally conned and lied to people, move to my left where the fires of hell are the hottest. And you, you poor ignorant and unintentionally false prophets who did not deliberately and intentionally con and lie to your followers, please move to my right where the fires of hell are much cooler and tenable.”

    How can the Holy Spirit convict you when you brashly and hardheartedly refuse to listen to Him? – especially when He says:

    I speak not of you all: I know whom I have chosen: but that the scripture may be fulfilled, He that eateth bread with me hath lifted up his heel against me. Now I tell you before it come, that, when it is come to pass, ye may believe that I am he. (John 13:18-19)

    I suppose you will also say: “It doesn’t matter what verses [the Holy Spirit] uses to defend his position, the Word DOES NOT [teach] that Judas was not a believer in the beginning.”

    You are welcome to stay but please learn to obey the Holy Spirit when He tries to teach you things from God’s Word.

  • Nez wrote:

    I have disagreed with some of your points (e.g accusations about character without proof),

    None of us here ever attacked Kobus’ personage or character. We merely evaluated his teaching against the Word of God. The one doing the attacking on personsage and character is none other than YOU.

  • Nez wrote:

    You have sadly not done the same with me. I cannot understand why you cannot debate or put your points across without making sarcastic and unnecessary comments.

    Is quoting from the Word of God to prove you wrong being sarcastic?

  • Nez wrote:

    I see you have taken some of what I have said out of context (Judas ‘ acknowledgement spells salvation?????? WHAT?????) and not answered some of the specific questions I have asked.

    .

    I never said that “Judas’ acknowledgement spells salvation.” I said: “Do you really think an acknowledgement that Jesus is the Christ spells salvation?” It was you who said that Peter made a corporate acknowledgement on behalf of all the other disciples. You may just as well have made your testimony of salvation in behalf of your whole family and therefore every member of your family is now saved.

  • olivia

    Martin Horan wrote:

    TULIP Youth

    is this what GOD have purposed you to do on earth? every man is judged by his master. allow them to be judged by GOD himsself, and not you. remember ‘do not judge so that you won’t be judged.

  • olivia

    Deborah (Discerning the World) wrote:

    Hi Tommy
    You said:
    >> I met Kobus when he was in the tent, living in a prefab house, with an ancient clapped out old bakkie and his wife making country and western dresses from calico to support the family.
    It was in the same period that Trevor Yoko was involved in getting the whole Christian schooling thing going here.
    I saw a miracle there when an old man that I knew and that had had a stroke a few weeks previously and was brain damaged was healed. While the community was in worship Kobus called him to the front of the tent did not touch him, just said “Ag Here, genees hom asseblief” and the old man was healed immediately. That was the first time that the old man had ever been in that church….Kobus did not know him from a bar of soap, and neither did anybody in the community. His grandson had brought him there from another town.
    No falling over, no fireworks, just the Holiness of God filling the whole tent….
    Believe me I am a skeptic of “godly” healings because I come from the occult and satanism and knew where a lot of them actually came from…so when I got miraculously saved at the Cross, by and through God’s Grace, it carried through with me, but that one healing was real.
    His teaching was pure and scriptural then…

    I would dare to say that its possible the healing was not real. Have you read: Can Satan heal? You do not know what became of that man? Did his health get worse later?
    The reason I believe it was not a genuine healing is because 1) Kobus could not have started out a good minister and then moved onto being a bad minister. 2) That’s like saying you can get saved and preach the gospel truth, but then lose your salvation and stop preaching the truth. 3) You can’t lose your salvation once you are saved, when the Holy Spirit enters you He SEALS you and stays there permanently. So Kobus was false from the beginning, and so was that healing. And I don’t believe his teaching was pure and 100% scriptural either. Kobus started off as a small false preacher who preached on a small scale and as he expanded he became more false as he sought after more power through Toronto and TB Joshua.

    hi tommy, do not be mocked. you can be saved today and stil loose your salvation, dear. paul said to Timothy that a man that cannot take care of his household have denied the faith. denying the faith means saying no to what you once said yes to.
    leave Kobus and his work. he is real and geniune.

  • olivia,

    is this what GOD have purposed you to do on earth? every man is judged by his master. allow them to be judged by GOD himsself, and not you. remember ‘do not judge so that you won’t be judged.

    NO, you and I and every Christian are commanded to judge righteously.

    For what have I to do with judging outsiders? Is it not those inside the church whom you are to judge? (1 Corinthians 5:12)

    The spiritual person judges all things, but is himself to be judged by no one. (1 Corinthians 2:15).

    If you don’t judge, you are not spiritual. Want to be spiritual? Then start judging righteously.

  • […] Deborah (Discerning the World) { Sarah My goodness, I've never seen such lovely Christian words come out of one persons mouth in such a long… } – Kobus van Rensburg – The Immortal Conquered by Death – Dec 30, 9:22 AM […]

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