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	<title>Comments on: Faith &amp; Reason Conference &#8211; Sat 15 May 2010</title>
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	<description>A Genuine Christian Blog for Genuine Christians</description>
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		<title>By: Elmarie</title>
		<link>http://www.discerningtheworld.com/2010/05/25/faith-reason-conference-sat-15-may-2010/#comment-17155</link>
		<dc:creator>Elmarie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 01 Aug 2010 18:03:45 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>This is a must listen Podcast from Prof Wiliam Lane Craig 2010/07/28 The New Reformation Debate

If you can please listen to this. Prof Craig is speaking about this Historical Debate that took place 12 May 2010 at the University of Pretoria.Prof. William Lane Craig and Prof. Michael Licona (Christians) and Prof. Sakkie Spangenberg and Prof. Hansie Wolmarans (Non-Christians)

&lt;a href=&quot;http://www.reasonablefaith.org/site/PageServer?pagename=podcasting_main&amp;utm_source=feedburner&amp;utm_medium=feed&amp;utm_campaign=Feed%3A+ReasonableFaithNews+%28Reasonable+Faith+News%29#rf&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Listen to the podcast here The New Reformation Debate &lt;/a&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<span id="co_17155"><p>This is a must listen Podcast from Prof Wiliam Lane Craig 2010/07/28 The New Reformation Debate</p>
<p>If you can please listen to this. Prof Craig is speaking about this Historical Debate that took place 12 May 2010 at the University of Pretoria.Prof. William Lane Craig and Prof. Michael Licona (Christians) and Prof. Sakkie Spangenberg and Prof. Hansie Wolmarans (Non-Christians)</p>
<p><a target="_blank" href="http://www.reasonablefaith.org/site/PageServer?pagename=podcasting_main&amp;utm_source=feedburner&amp;utm_medium=feed&amp;utm_campaign=Feed%3A+ReasonableFaithNews+%28Reasonable+Faith+News%29#rf"  rel="nofollow">Listen to the podcast here The New Reformation Debate </a></p>
</span><div class="comment-toolbar" style="text-align: right"><a href="#comment" onclick="CF_Quote('17155','Elmarie'); return false;" title="Click here to have this comment automatically copied and pasted into your comment box in QUOTE tags - Saves you time having to copy and paste yourself"><img src="http://www.discerningtheworld.com/wp-content/plugins/comment-toolbar/images/quote.png"  border="0" onmouseover="this.src='http://www.discerningtheworld.com/wp-content/plugins/comment-toolbar/images/quote_over.png';" onmouseout="this.src='http://www.discerningtheworld.com/wp-content/plugins/comment-toolbar/images/quote.png';"/></a></div>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Deborah (Discerning the World)</title>
		<link>http://www.discerningtheworld.com/2010/05/25/faith-reason-conference-sat-15-may-2010/#comment-10541</link>
		<dc:creator>Deborah (Discerning the World)</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 01 Jun 2010 12:39:05 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Alan

I have supernatural prophetic powers that enables me to read everything all in one go.  Nah it&#039;s called permission to &#039;read all&#039;  hahah</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<span id="co_10541"><p>Alan</p>
<p>I have supernatural prophetic powers that enables me to read everything all in one go.  Nah it&#8217;s called permission to &#8216;read all&#8217;  hahah</p>
</span><div class="comment-toolbar" style="text-align: right"><a href="#comment" onclick="CF_Quote('10541','Deborah (Discerning the World)'); return false;" title="Click here to have this comment automatically copied and pasted into your comment box in QUOTE tags - Saves you time having to copy and paste yourself"><img src="http://www.discerningtheworld.com/wp-content/plugins/comment-toolbar/images/quote.png"  border="0" onmouseover="this.src='http://www.discerningtheworld.com/wp-content/plugins/comment-toolbar/images/quote_over.png';" onmouseout="this.src='http://www.discerningtheworld.com/wp-content/plugins/comment-toolbar/images/quote.png';"/></a></div>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Alan</title>
		<link>http://www.discerningtheworld.com/2010/05/25/faith-reason-conference-sat-15-may-2010/#comment-10448</link>
		<dc:creator>Alan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 31 May 2010 10:29:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.discerningtheworld.com/?p=8449#comment-10448</guid>
		<description>Deborah

Hey, it&#039;s changed! There&#039;s a little guy with a beard! Oh, that&#039;s me. I got so used to seeing that lil&#039; pink guy. ;-)
Hey, how come you reply to some of my posts on other parts of this blog? How does that work? 
Is there like, some way that I can read all the comments all on the same page or something?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<span id="co_10448"><p>Deborah</p>
<p>Hey, it&#8217;s changed! There&#8217;s a little guy with a beard! Oh, that&#8217;s me. I got so used to seeing that lil&#8217; pink guy. ;-)<br />
Hey, how come you reply to some of my posts on other parts of this blog? How does that work?<br />
Is there like, some way that I can read all the comments all on the same page or something?</p>
</span><div class="comment-toolbar" style="text-align: right"><a href="#comment" onclick="CF_Quote('10448','Alan'); return false;" title="Click here to have this comment automatically copied and pasted into your comment box in QUOTE tags - Saves you time having to copy and paste yourself"><img src="http://www.discerningtheworld.com/wp-content/plugins/comment-toolbar/images/quote.png"  border="0" onmouseover="this.src='http://www.discerningtheworld.com/wp-content/plugins/comment-toolbar/images/quote_over.png';" onmouseout="this.src='http://www.discerningtheworld.com/wp-content/plugins/comment-toolbar/images/quote.png';"/></a></div>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Deborah (Discerning the World)</title>
		<link>http://www.discerningtheworld.com/2010/05/25/faith-reason-conference-sat-15-may-2010/#comment-10246</link>
		<dc:creator>Deborah (Discerning the World)</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 28 May 2010 09:47:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.discerningtheworld.com/?p=8449#comment-10246</guid>
		<description>Alan

Yes, I too see a little pink guy lol.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<span id="co_10246"><p>Alan</p>
<p>Yes, I too see a little pink guy lol.</p>
</span><div class="comment-toolbar" style="text-align: right"><a href="#comment" onclick="CF_Quote('10246','Deborah (Discerning the World)'); return false;" title="Click here to have this comment automatically copied and pasted into your comment box in QUOTE tags - Saves you time having to copy and paste yourself"><img src="http://www.discerningtheworld.com/wp-content/plugins/comment-toolbar/images/quote.png"  border="0" onmouseover="this.src='http://www.discerningtheworld.com/wp-content/plugins/comment-toolbar/images/quote_over.png';" onmouseout="this.src='http://www.discerningtheworld.com/wp-content/plugins/comment-toolbar/images/quote.png';"/></a></div>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Alan Heron</title>
		<link>http://www.discerningtheworld.com/2010/05/25/faith-reason-conference-sat-15-may-2010/#comment-10239</link>
		<dc:creator>Alan Heron</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 28 May 2010 08:18:19 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Deborah

I use a Mac, so I emptied the cache by another method, then reloaded the page and it still looks like a li&#039;l pink guy! ;-)

I&#039;m neither an Aussie, nor South African. :-) 
Nor Kiwi neither.
Now I&#039;ve got you thinkin&#039; hard eh?
I was born in southern England. Dad was of Irish and Scottish blood, born in Yorkshire, raised in Belfast. Mum was from Manchester and also had some Scottish ancestry, so I&#039;m a U.K.ian. Haha!
I grew up in New Zealand, married there 1980 and moved to Melbourne 1981. When people ask me what nationality I am, I usually just say English, because that&#039;s my passport, but my kids say I&#039;m a &#039;Heinz&#039;,
which I think is the pot calling the kettle black, because in addition to my checkered background, they have Sonya&#039;s mix thrown in; Hungarian father, Mother; mostly white NZer, with some Maori, and a little bit of Kashmiri Indian, but both my girls were born in &#039;Oz&#039;, so we are the mini UN here! LOL!
World cup Rugby gets confusing though!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<span id="co_10239"><p>Deborah</p>
<p>I use a Mac, so I emptied the cache by another method, then reloaded the page and it still looks like a li&#8217;l pink guy! ;-)</p>
<p>I&#8217;m neither an Aussie, nor South African. :-)<br />
Nor Kiwi neither.<br />
Now I&#8217;ve got you thinkin&#8217; hard eh?<br />
I was born in southern England. Dad was of Irish and Scottish blood, born in Yorkshire, raised in Belfast. Mum was from Manchester and also had some Scottish ancestry, so I&#8217;m a U.K.ian. Haha!<br />
I grew up in New Zealand, married there 1980 and moved to Melbourne 1981. When people ask me what nationality I am, I usually just say English, because that&#8217;s my passport, but my kids say I&#8217;m a &#8216;Heinz&#8217;,<br />
which I think is the pot calling the kettle black, because in addition to my checkered background, they have Sonya&#8217;s mix thrown in; Hungarian father, Mother; mostly white NZer, with some Maori, and a little bit of Kashmiri Indian, but both my girls were born in &#8216;Oz&#8217;, so we are the mini UN here! LOL!<br />
World cup Rugby gets confusing though!</p>
</span><div class="comment-toolbar" style="text-align: right"><a href="#comment" onclick="CF_Quote('10239','Alan Heron'); return false;" title="Click here to have this comment automatically copied and pasted into your comment box in QUOTE tags - Saves you time having to copy and paste yourself"><img src="http://www.discerningtheworld.com/wp-content/plugins/comment-toolbar/images/quote.png"  border="0" onmouseover="this.src='http://www.discerningtheworld.com/wp-content/plugins/comment-toolbar/images/quote_over.png';" onmouseout="this.src='http://www.discerningtheworld.com/wp-content/plugins/comment-toolbar/images/quote.png';"/></a></div>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Deborah (Discerning the World)</title>
		<link>http://www.discerningtheworld.com/2010/05/25/faith-reason-conference-sat-15-may-2010/#comment-10192</link>
		<dc:creator>Deborah (Discerning the World)</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 27 May 2010 16:34:36 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Alan

Are you an South African Aussie or just an Aussie?  lol</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<span id="co_10192"><p>Alan</p>
<p>Are you an South African Aussie or just an Aussie?  lol</p>
</span><div class="comment-toolbar" style="text-align: right"><a href="#comment" onclick="CF_Quote('10192','Deborah (Discerning the World)'); return false;" title="Click here to have this comment automatically copied and pasted into your comment box in QUOTE tags - Saves you time having to copy and paste yourself"><img src="http://www.discerningtheworld.com/wp-content/plugins/comment-toolbar/images/quote.png"  border="0" onmouseover="this.src='http://www.discerningtheworld.com/wp-content/plugins/comment-toolbar/images/quote_over.png';" onmouseout="this.src='http://www.discerningtheworld.com/wp-content/plugins/comment-toolbar/images/quote.png';"/></a></div>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Deborah (Discerning the World)</title>
		<link>http://www.discerningtheworld.com/2010/05/25/faith-reason-conference-sat-15-may-2010/#comment-10190</link>
		<dc:creator>Deborah (Discerning the World)</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 27 May 2010 16:18:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.discerningtheworld.com/?p=8449#comment-10190</guid>
		<description>&quot;We&quot; as in my Parrot and I lol  He plays a major role in my blog. He gently removed my left CTRL button and then later the &#039;end&#039; button on the right side.  At the moment my space bar has been giving me uphill and I have a sneaky suspicion it has to do with a very intelligent animal with grey feathers and a red tail. </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<span id="co_10190"><p>&#8220;We&#8221; as in my Parrot and I lol  He plays a major role in my blog. He gently removed my left CTRL button and then later the &#8216;end&#8217; button on the right side.  At the moment my space bar has been giving me uphill and I have a sneaky suspicion it has to do with a very intelligent animal with grey feathers and a red tail.</p>
</span><div class="comment-toolbar" style="text-align: right"><a href="#comment" onclick="CF_Quote('10190','Deborah (Discerning the World)'); return false;" title="Click here to have this comment automatically copied and pasted into your comment box in QUOTE tags - Saves you time having to copy and paste yourself"><img src="http://www.discerningtheworld.com/wp-content/plugins/comment-toolbar/images/quote.png"  border="0" onmouseover="this.src='http://www.discerningtheworld.com/wp-content/plugins/comment-toolbar/images/quote_over.png';" onmouseout="this.src='http://www.discerningtheworld.com/wp-content/plugins/comment-toolbar/images/quote.png';"/></a></div>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Deborah (Discerning the World)</title>
		<link>http://www.discerningtheworld.com/2010/05/25/faith-reason-conference-sat-15-may-2010/#comment-10188</link>
		<dc:creator>Deborah (Discerning the World)</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 27 May 2010 16:13:58 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Alan

Really? Press Ctrl+F5 (that will clear anything cached on your side)  Cos I/weeeee can see you.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<span id="co_10188"><p>Alan</p>
<p>Really? Press Ctrl+F5 (that will clear anything cached on your side)  Cos I/weeeee can see you.</p>
</span><div class="comment-toolbar" style="text-align: right"><a href="#comment" onclick="CF_Quote('10188','Deborah (Discerning the World)'); return false;" title="Click here to have this comment automatically copied and pasted into your comment box in QUOTE tags - Saves you time having to copy and paste yourself"><img src="http://www.discerningtheworld.com/wp-content/plugins/comment-toolbar/images/quote.png"  border="0" onmouseover="this.src='http://www.discerningtheworld.com/wp-content/plugins/comment-toolbar/images/quote_over.png';" onmouseout="this.src='http://www.discerningtheworld.com/wp-content/plugins/comment-toolbar/images/quote.png';"/></a></div>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Alan Heron</title>
		<link>http://www.discerningtheworld.com/2010/05/25/faith-reason-conference-sat-15-may-2010/#comment-10186</link>
		<dc:creator>Alan Heron</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 27 May 2010 15:43:44 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>PS; On my computer, I still see the Gravatar icon, not a photo. No biggie, just puzzled. :-)
Alan.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<span id="co_10186"><p>PS; On my computer, I still see the Gravatar icon, not a photo. No biggie, just puzzled. :-)<br />
Alan.</p>
</span><div class="comment-toolbar" style="text-align: right"><a href="#comment" onclick="CF_Quote('10186','Alan Heron'); return false;" title="Click here to have this comment automatically copied and pasted into your comment box in QUOTE tags - Saves you time having to copy and paste yourself"><img src="http://www.discerningtheworld.com/wp-content/plugins/comment-toolbar/images/quote.png"  border="0" onmouseover="this.src='http://www.discerningtheworld.com/wp-content/plugins/comment-toolbar/images/quote_over.png';" onmouseout="this.src='http://www.discerningtheworld.com/wp-content/plugins/comment-toolbar/images/quote.png';"/></a></div>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Alan Heron</title>
		<link>http://www.discerningtheworld.com/2010/05/25/faith-reason-conference-sat-15-may-2010/#comment-10184</link>
		<dc:creator>Alan Heron</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 27 May 2010 15:40:06 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Deborah

Yeah, I hear you. My younger daughter (19 in July) has only recently been saved, after some really tough years. I was so tempted to preach to her, or try and teach her, but in the end, I just prayed and asked God to move in her heart and the Lord worked a miracle! She is so different that people all ask her; &quot;What&#039;s different with you?&quot; The hard part is watching her trying to talk to her mother about why she doesn&#039;t like being at the house because of how Sonya is living with this guy now. She says to me; &quot;Mum&#039;s so lost, she has no morals at all.&quot; Yet Emily still loves her mother and tries to be a good witness to her without alienating her. Personally, I believe that Sonya will have to hit the bottom of a very dark hole, before she MIGHT listen for the voice of the Lord again, but I also fear that from her words to me, she may have seared her conscience and be unable to hear, in which case she really IS lost. It is searingly painful to consider such a thing for one who has been &#039;flesh of my flesh&#039;, but I try to follow Paul&#039;s example in 1st Cor. 5:5 and 1st Tim. 1:20 and leave it alone.
I get well-meaning friends who tell me that I have to &quot;come to terms with the situation and I should remain friends with Sonya for the sake of our girls. Y&#039;know, the old love your enemies bit, not that I&#039;m not prepared to do that, but the fact remains that we are also commanded to separate from those who deny Christ, which is in effect what Sonya is doing. I have wrote to her three times, confessing my own faults and failings, but also pleading with her to consider what the Bible has to say about marriage and divorce, and most of all real love and forgiveness, and not to close her ears to what the Holy Spirit is saying to her.
I know that the Lord has told me to take this step, but I will leave it to Him to direct Emily and Kate (my older, married daughter) as to how they should deal with their mother.
I find it hurtful when I get &#039;advice&#039; that goes against what I know the Lord has told me or is telling me, particularly in this situation, but I believe God is teaching me to rely only on Him, which is a great comfort. 
Then there are those people from our old PDL, Seeker-sensitive church, who are critical and tell Sonya I have a &#039;religious spirit&#039;, or I&#039;ve become a fanatical legalist, or even that I&#039;m mentally unhinged. The harsher comments are that I am being mentally, or even spiritually abusive by saying that her actions are sins against God. I apparently have a warped view of God&#039;s love and compassion and should just be gracious to Sonya and her boyfriend. For the record, I have never beaten her, or abused her in such a way as to warrant her fearing me, although I been guilty of neglecting her spiritual well-being, by not being careful to keep myself following the Lord as closely as I should and thereby being a husband as in Ephesians 5.
I&#039;m sharing this here, because I believe in being as transparent as I can be, and I also want you to understand that when I say I know how you feel about folks who don&#039;t listen, or are critical, or are cruel to you, I really do understand all that comes with being faithful to the scriptures and the leading of the Holy Spirit. People who think it&#039;s all milk and honey are kidding themselves. It COSTS to follow the Lord. But then, where else would we go? He has the words of life.
Shalom Deborah, take the words of Numbers 6:24-26 as a blessing from the Lord to you,
in Jesus&#039; name,
Alan.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<span id="co_10184"><p>Deborah</p>
<p>Yeah, I hear you. My younger daughter (19 in July) has only recently been saved, after some really tough years. I was so tempted to preach to her, or try and teach her, but in the end, I just prayed and asked God to move in her heart and the Lord worked a miracle! She is so different that people all ask her; &#8220;What&#8217;s different with you?&#8221; The hard part is watching her trying to talk to her mother about why she doesn&#8217;t like being at the house because of how Sonya is living with this guy now. She says to me; &#8220;Mum&#8217;s so lost, she has no morals at all.&#8221; Yet Emily still loves her mother and tries to be a good witness to her without alienating her. Personally, I believe that Sonya will have to hit the bottom of a very dark hole, before she MIGHT listen for the voice of the Lord again, but I also fear that from her words to me, she may have seared her conscience and be unable to hear, in which case she really IS lost. It is searingly painful to consider such a thing for one who has been &#8216;flesh of my flesh&#8217;, but I try to follow Paul&#8217;s example in 1st Cor. 5:5 and 1st Tim. 1:20 and leave it alone.<br />
I get well-meaning friends who tell me that I have to &#8220;come to terms with the situation and I should remain friends with Sonya for the sake of our girls. Y&#8217;know, the old love your enemies bit, not that I&#8217;m not prepared to do that, but the fact remains that we are also commanded to separate from those who deny Christ, which is in effect what Sonya is doing. I have wrote to her three times, confessing my own faults and failings, but also pleading with her to consider what the Bible has to say about marriage and divorce, and most of all real love and forgiveness, and not to close her ears to what the Holy Spirit is saying to her.<br />
I know that the Lord has told me to take this step, but I will leave it to Him to direct Emily and Kate (my older, married daughter) as to how they should deal with their mother.<br />
I find it hurtful when I get &#8216;advice&#8217; that goes against what I know the Lord has told me or is telling me, particularly in this situation, but I believe God is teaching me to rely only on Him, which is a great comfort.<br />
Then there are those people from our old PDL, Seeker-sensitive church, who are critical and tell Sonya I have a &#8216;religious spirit&#8217;, or I&#8217;ve become a fanatical legalist, or even that I&#8217;m mentally unhinged. The harsher comments are that I am being mentally, or even spiritually abusive by saying that her actions are sins against God. I apparently have a warped view of God&#8217;s love and compassion and should just be gracious to Sonya and her boyfriend. For the record, I have never beaten her, or abused her in such a way as to warrant her fearing me, although I been guilty of neglecting her spiritual well-being, by not being careful to keep myself following the Lord as closely as I should and thereby being a husband as in Ephesians 5.<br />
I&#8217;m sharing this here, because I believe in being as transparent as I can be, and I also want you to understand that when I say I know how you feel about folks who don&#8217;t listen, or are critical, or are cruel to you, I really do understand all that comes with being faithful to the scriptures and the leading of the Holy Spirit. People who think it&#8217;s all milk and honey are kidding themselves. It COSTS to follow the Lord. But then, where else would we go? He has the words of life.<br />
Shalom Deborah, take the words of Numbers 6:24-26 as a blessing from the Lord to you,<br />
in Jesus&#8217; name,<br />
Alan.</p>
</span><div class="comment-toolbar" style="text-align: right"><a href="#comment" onclick="CF_Quote('10184','Alan Heron'); return false;" title="Click here to have this comment automatically copied and pasted into your comment box in QUOTE tags - Saves you time having to copy and paste yourself"><img src="http://www.discerningtheworld.com/wp-content/plugins/comment-toolbar/images/quote.png"  border="0" onmouseover="this.src='http://www.discerningtheworld.com/wp-content/plugins/comment-toolbar/images/quote_over.png';" onmouseout="this.src='http://www.discerningtheworld.com/wp-content/plugins/comment-toolbar/images/quote.png';"/></a></div>]]></content:encoded>
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