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	<title>Comments on: False Teachers and Prophets &#8211; Methods of Operation</title>
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	<description>A Genuine Christian Blog for Genuine Christians</description>
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		<title>By: Amanda</title>
		<link>http://www.discerningtheworld.com/2009/11/03/false-teachers-and-prophets-methods-of-operation/#comment-11655</link>
		<dc:creator>Amanda</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 11 Jun 2010 16:04:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.discerningtheworld.com/?p=6715#comment-11655</guid>
		<description>Barbara Smyth

Why do you call Oom Angus&#039; preaching excellent when he does not preach repentance and faith in Jesus Christ crucified for sinners? Below is &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.discerningtheworld.com/2010/04/19/stand-up-and-be-counted-might-men-conference-2010/#comment-8949&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;my comment on another thread&lt;/a&gt;. It includes Oom Angus&#039; &quot;conversion&quot;. In it you will not find anything about Jesus Christ and forgiveness of sins. You may find his teaching excellent, but on what grounds do you defend it as Christian?
&lt;blockquote&gt;Oom Angus held his first campaign in 1990 in a hall in Ladysmith. The first night 6 people answered the alter call and by the end of the week 50 or 60 people came forward each night. That Saturday he preached at an army base and about 1000 soldiers ‘got serious with God’. This is how Oom Angus describes his preaching in Faith Like Potatoes:

&lt;blockquote&gt;That night set the pattern for the whole campaign. We opened with the music team, who led us in praise and worship. Then I got up and preached. My message was short, punchy, fiery and challenging, about our need to get back to God and a life of holiness. There’s only one way to live our lives for Jesus, and there can be no half-measures: we can’t serve two masters. I’m an evangelist, not a teacher, so although I preach from the Bible I use lots of everyday illustrations, too. I also stride around the stage a lot – I’m a man of the wide open spaces, and I feel too boxed-in in a pulpit!

Then we sang a meditative hymn, “Just as I am”, and I called forward all the people who wanted to serve Jesus Christ with all their hearts. I don’t go in for closed eyes or bowed heads: if anyone wants to serve the Lord, they have to come right out and do it in front of their neighbours and their friends. It takes courage to stand up in front of the whole town and come forward, and I came sown from the stage to meet them, and led them in the sinner’s prayer.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

This is vintage Buchan. Can you spot the problem, Hawk? Where is the Gospel in that? The people did not go forward because of faith in Jesus Christ to repent and receive forgiveness for their sin. They went forward to repent and report for duty to serve Christ and live holy lives. This is not about what Jesus Christ has done for them, but about what they will do for Him. Oom Angus continues:

&lt;blockquote&gt;“Dear Lord Jesus, I acknowledge that I’m a sinner. I repent of my sin, and ask you to come into my life and make a fresh start. I thank you that Jesus died for me on Calvary and rose again for my salvation. Thank you for saving me from depression, fear and sin; thank you for living in me and giving me a brand-new opportunity to live for you. Amen.”&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Jesus Christ did not die on the cross to save us from ‘depression, fear and sin’. He died to take our punishment for breaking the Law and to save us from God’s wrath and judgment. If only Oom Angus would use everyday illustrations from the life of Jesus Christ and preach the Gospel, then people might come to faith in Him and not in their good intentions.

Oom Angus apparently does not see the need to preach Jesus Christ and Him crucified for sinners. Maybe his own conversion story will explain why. Again from Faith Like Potatoes:

&lt;blockquote&gt;There was an air of expectancy in the church. The lay people were sharing their testimonies, and I sat there with my mouth open as I listened to them. For the first time in my life I saw strong men cry as they told how the Lord had taken care of their needs, restored their businesses and done wonderful things in their lives.

One guy was a building contractor. He started weeping as he told how his business had gone down and he had contemplated suicide. Then he found Jesus, and now he had a reason to live. Another man told how his marriage had been breaking up, when the Lord had brought him and his wife together again. Their stories pierced my heart. For years I had had no interest in religion, but these men’s words had the ring of truth. I wanted to be part of this kind of life; I wanted to know more.

“What about you? would you like to accept Jesus Christ as your Lord and Saviour today?” I looked at the speaker and relised that was exactly what I wanted to do. Jill and I walked to the front of the church with many others, and knelt before the Lord. We prayed the sinner’s prayer together, saying sorry for our sins and asking Jesus to rule our hearts, and a miracle happened. Jesus came into our lives.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

This is the pattern that Oom Angus repeats over and over again. People might get saved at the campaigns, but then it is in spite of the preaching and not because of it.&lt;/blockquote&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Barbara Smyth</p>
<p>Why do you call Oom Angus&#8217; preaching excellent when he does not preach repentance and faith in Jesus Christ crucified for sinners? Below is <a href="http://www.discerningtheworld.com/2010/04/19/stand-up-and-be-counted-might-men-conference-2010/#comment-8949"  rel="nofollow">my comment on another thread</a>. It includes Oom Angus&#8217; &#8220;conversion&#8221;. In it you will not find anything about Jesus Christ and forgiveness of sins. You may find his teaching excellent, but on what grounds do you defend it as Christian?</p>
<blockquote><p>Oom Angus held his first campaign in 1990 in a hall in Ladysmith. The first night 6 people answered the alter call and by the end of the week 50 or 60 people came forward each night. That Saturday he preached at an army base and about 1000 soldiers ‘got serious with God’. This is how Oom Angus describes his preaching in Faith Like Potatoes:</p>
<blockquote><p>That night set the pattern for the whole campaign. We opened with the music team, who led us in praise and worship. Then I got up and preached. My message was short, punchy, fiery and challenging, about our need to get back to God and a life of holiness. There’s only one way to live our lives for Jesus, and there can be no half-measures: we can’t serve two masters. I’m an evangelist, not a teacher, so although I preach from the Bible I use lots of everyday illustrations, too. I also stride around the stage a lot – I’m a man of the wide open spaces, and I feel too boxed-in in a pulpit!</p>
<p>Then we sang a meditative hymn, “Just as I am”, and I called forward all the people who wanted to serve Jesus Christ with all their hearts. I don’t go in for closed eyes or bowed heads: if anyone wants to serve the Lord, they have to come right out and do it in front of their neighbours and their friends. It takes courage to stand up in front of the whole town and come forward, and I came sown from the stage to meet them, and led them in the sinner’s prayer.</p></blockquote>
<p>This is vintage Buchan. Can you spot the problem, Hawk? Where is the Gospel in that? The people did not go forward because of faith in Jesus Christ to repent and receive forgiveness for their sin. They went forward to repent and report for duty to serve Christ and live holy lives. This is not about what Jesus Christ has done for them, but about what they will do for Him. Oom Angus continues:</p>
<blockquote><p>“Dear Lord Jesus, I acknowledge that I’m a sinner. I repent of my sin, and ask you to come into my life and make a fresh start. I thank you that Jesus died for me on Calvary and rose again for my salvation. Thank you for saving me from depression, fear and sin; thank you for living in me and giving me a brand-new opportunity to live for you. Amen.”</p></blockquote>
<p>Jesus Christ did not die on the cross to save us from ‘depression, fear and sin’. He died to take our punishment for breaking the Law and to save us from God’s wrath and judgment. If only Oom Angus would use everyday illustrations from the life of Jesus Christ and preach the Gospel, then people might come to faith in Him and not in their good intentions.</p>
<p>Oom Angus apparently does not see the need to preach Jesus Christ and Him crucified for sinners. Maybe his own conversion story will explain why. Again from Faith Like Potatoes:</p>
<blockquote><p>There was an air of expectancy in the church. The lay people were sharing their testimonies, and I sat there with my mouth open as I listened to them. For the first time in my life I saw strong men cry as they told how the Lord had taken care of their needs, restored their businesses and done wonderful things in their lives.</p>
<p>One guy was a building contractor. He started weeping as he told how his business had gone down and he had contemplated suicide. Then he found Jesus, and now he had a reason to live. Another man told how his marriage had been breaking up, when the Lord had brought him and his wife together again. Their stories pierced my heart. For years I had had no interest in religion, but these men’s words had the ring of truth. I wanted to be part of this kind of life; I wanted to know more.</p>
<p>“What about you? would you like to accept Jesus Christ as your Lord and Saviour today?” I looked at the speaker and relised that was exactly what I wanted to do. Jill and I walked to the front of the church with many others, and knelt before the Lord. We prayed the sinner’s prayer together, saying sorry for our sins and asking Jesus to rule our hearts, and a miracle happened. Jesus came into our lives.</p></blockquote>
<p>This is the pattern that Oom Angus repeats over and over again. People might get saved at the campaigns, but then it is in spite of the preaching and not because of it.</p></blockquote>
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		<title>By: Elmarie</title>
		<link>http://www.discerningtheworld.com/2009/11/03/false-teachers-and-prophets-methods-of-operation/#comment-11654</link>
		<dc:creator>Elmarie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 11 Jun 2010 16:01:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.discerningtheworld.com/?p=6715#comment-11654</guid>
		<description>Barbara Smyth

Also read here please. 

Spiritual Deception, Revival and Angus Buchan

Prof. Johan Malan, South Africa (May 2010)

http://www.bibleguidance.co.za/Weekly/117%20BuchanEng.htm</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Barbara Smyth</p>
<p>Also read here please. </p>
<p>Spiritual Deception, Revival and Angus Buchan</p>
<p>Prof. Johan Malan, South Africa (May 2010)</p>
<p><a target="_blank" href="http://www.bibleguidance.co.za/Weekly/117%20BuchanEng.htm"  rel="nofollow">http://www.bibleguidance.co.za/Weekly/117%20BuchanEng.htm</a></p>
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		<title>By: Elmarie</title>
		<link>http://www.discerningtheworld.com/2009/11/03/false-teachers-and-prophets-methods-of-operation/#comment-11653</link>
		<dc:creator>Elmarie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 11 Jun 2010 15:59:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.discerningtheworld.com/?p=6715#comment-11653</guid>
		<description>Barbara Smyth

Please read all the articles about Angus Bucan on this blog.
# Elza Meyer Attacked by Demons, Saved by Son
# Angus Buchan and the Promise Keepers
# Graham Power &amp; Angus Buchan - The Transformation of Africa
# National Initiative for the Reformation of South Africa - NIRSA
# Kathryn Kuhlman - The Interfaith Faith Healer
# Turn2God at the Union Buildings was...
# Stand Up and be Counted - Might Men Conference 2010
# What did YOU think Revival meant?
# The Dominionist Faith of Angus Buchan - Faith Like Potatoes
# Cindy Jacobs - Right Wing Xtian Nazi Communist
# Faith &amp; Reason Conference (10-15 May 2010 - South Africa)
 

and you can also read here http://1joh4.wordpress.com/2010/06/10/angus-buchan-benny-hinn-and-god-tv/

To be able to discern the truth from the lie is very important. 

One does not need healing for Biblical discernment as it is a Gift from God. 

Angus Buchan likes to mention Benny Hinn and Kathryn Kulman  often, and they are also associated with false teachings and some times even demonic teachings.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Barbara Smyth</p>
<p>Please read all the articles about Angus Bucan on this blog.<br />
# Elza Meyer Attacked by Demons, Saved by Son<br />
# Angus Buchan and the Promise Keepers<br />
# Graham Power &amp; Angus Buchan &#8211; The Transformation of Africa<br />
# National Initiative for the Reformation of South Africa &#8211; NIRSA<br />
# Kathryn Kuhlman &#8211; The Interfaith Faith Healer<br />
# Turn2God at the Union Buildings was&#8230;<br />
# Stand Up and be Counted &#8211; Might Men Conference 2010<br />
# What did YOU think Revival meant?<br />
# The Dominionist Faith of Angus Buchan &#8211; Faith Like Potatoes<br />
# Cindy Jacobs &#8211; Right Wing Xtian Nazi Communist<br />
# Faith &amp; Reason Conference (10-15 May 2010 &#8211; South Africa)</p>
<p>and you can also read here <a target="_blank" href="http://1joh4.wordpress.com/2010/06/10/angus-buchan-benny-hinn-and-god-tv/"  rel="nofollow">http://1joh4.wordpress.com/2010/06/10/angus-buchan-benny-hinn-and-god-tv/</a></p>
<p>To be able to discern the truth from the lie is very important. </p>
<p>One does not need healing for Biblical discernment as it is a Gift from God. </p>
<p>Angus Buchan likes to mention Benny Hinn and Kathryn Kulman  often, and they are also associated with false teachings and some times even demonic teachings.</p>
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		<title>By: Barbara Smyth</title>
		<link>http://www.discerningtheworld.com/2009/11/03/false-teachers-and-prophets-methods-of-operation/#comment-11652</link>
		<dc:creator>Barbara Smyth</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 11 Jun 2010 15:13:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.discerningtheworld.com/?p=6715#comment-11652</guid>
		<description>To be honest I find the writing of Jean Joubert to be disturbing.  I am glad to get off this site.  I appreciate your need to live the truth of the scriptures but you have picked on the wrong person in Angus Buchan.  I have read his book - his journey of faith -It is excellent.  I have been at a mission where he has preached the word of God - Excellent  He has the gift of discernment regarding people who come to missions.  He will be able to discern well what you have written.  What is wrong is you are uneasy in an atmosphere where God by His Spirit has the freedom to work.  The Holy Spirit comes into our lives by invitation and also comes upon us like He came upon the disciples in the scriptures.  I hope you receive the healing from God which you need and we all need.  Barbara</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>To be honest I find the writing of Jean Joubert to be disturbing.  I am glad to get off this site.  I appreciate your need to live the truth of the scriptures but you have picked on the wrong person in Angus Buchan.  I have read his book &#8211; his journey of faith -It is excellent.  I have been at a mission where he has preached the word of God &#8211; Excellent  He has the gift of discernment regarding people who come to missions.  He will be able to discern well what you have written.  What is wrong is you are uneasy in an atmosphere where God by His Spirit has the freedom to work.  The Holy Spirit comes into our lives by invitation and also comes upon us like He came upon the disciples in the scriptures.  I hope you receive the healing from God which you need and we all need.  Barbara</p>
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		<title>By: Deborah (Discerning the World)</title>
		<link>http://www.discerningtheworld.com/2009/11/03/false-teachers-and-prophets-methods-of-operation/#comment-1932</link>
		<dc:creator>Deborah (Discerning the World)</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 27 Nov 2009 05:51:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.discerningtheworld.com/?p=6715#comment-1932</guid>
		<description>Elmarie

That link is under construction?  Got another one to go too?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Elmarie</p>
<p>That link is under construction?  Got another one to go too?</p>
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		<title>By: Elmarie</title>
		<link>http://www.discerningtheworld.com/2009/11/03/false-teachers-and-prophets-methods-of-operation/#comment-1927</link>
		<dc:creator>Elmarie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 26 Nov 2009 17:18:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.discerningtheworld.com/?p=6715#comment-1927</guid>
		<description>Also found a interesting Open Letter to Mr Buchan on website. www.graceunlimited.org
It is a long 50 page letter and you can also listen to a 2 part sermon done by Alan Lester on this. Very interesing.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Also found a interesting Open Letter to Mr Buchan on website. <a target="_blank" href="http://www.graceunlimited.org"  rel="nofollow">http://www.graceunlimited.org</a><br />
It is a long 50 page letter and you can also listen to a 2 part sermon done by Alan Lester on this. Very interesing.</p>
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		<title>By: Elmarie</title>
		<link>http://www.discerningtheworld.com/2009/11/03/false-teachers-and-prophets-methods-of-operation/#comment-1926</link>
		<dc:creator>Elmarie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 26 Nov 2009 17:13:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.discerningtheworld.com/?p=6715#comment-1926</guid>
		<description>Thank you. This is so informative.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thank you. This is so informative.</p>
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		<title>By: Pieter</title>
		<link>http://www.discerningtheworld.com/2009/11/03/false-teachers-and-prophets-methods-of-operation/#comment-1846</link>
		<dc:creator>Pieter</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 12 Nov 2009 11:22:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.discerningtheworld.com/?p=6715#comment-1846</guid>
		<description>Although I have been brought up in the church al my life, I am only recently a converted Christian truly accepting Jesus Christ in my heart and life. I will be the first to admit I am not an expert yet in all of the Word of God, but note the…”yet”. Since Jesus is my light and truth and with the Holy Spirit residing within me I cannot get enough of Gods wonderful Word.  
Why am I even writing here you might ask. Well its simple. See before Jesus became part of my life I was led by man, by what men said and that road led me to becoming a borderline Atheist. Borderline? Yeah God’ grace saved me from ever truly renouncing God.  
Even though I am not an expert as stated above, and does not Judge any of the “false” prophets as mentioned, all I can say is read God’s Word first. Never blindly follow the words of men even if they speak in the authority of Christ. Jesus is the one and only teacher so why not read, learn and follow His words? He gave all we need for salvation within a brilliantly preserved Holy book. Remember your salvation is at stake. Ask the question, if a “man of God” is wrong and you followed him your salvation is lost, but if you chose not to follow him and he was a man of God, but rather followed the Word of God you will not lose your salvation because you did not follow the man. I hope that makes sense. 
In short read your Bible, follow the one true Teacher in Jesus Christ, and if you go to church or belong to some denomination always test a mans word against that of God…</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Although I have been brought up in the church al my life, I am only recently a converted Christian truly accepting Jesus Christ in my heart and life. I will be the first to admit I am not an expert yet in all of the Word of God, but note the…”yet”. Since Jesus is my light and truth and with the Holy Spirit residing within me I cannot get enough of Gods wonderful Word.<br />
Why am I even writing here you might ask. Well its simple. See before Jesus became part of my life I was led by man, by what men said and that road led me to becoming a borderline Atheist. Borderline? Yeah God’ grace saved me from ever truly renouncing God.<br />
Even though I am not an expert as stated above, and does not Judge any of the “false” prophets as mentioned, all I can say is read God’s Word first. Never blindly follow the words of men even if they speak in the authority of Christ. Jesus is the one and only teacher so why not read, learn and follow His words? He gave all we need for salvation within a brilliantly preserved Holy book. Remember your salvation is at stake. Ask the question, if a “man of God” is wrong and you followed him your salvation is lost, but if you chose not to follow him and he was a man of God, but rather followed the Word of God you will not lose your salvation because you did not follow the man. I hope that makes sense.<br />
In short read your Bible, follow the one true Teacher in Jesus Christ, and if you go to church or belong to some denomination always test a mans word against that of God…</p>
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		<title>By: My name is under a stone I hope</title>
		<link>http://www.discerningtheworld.com/2009/11/03/false-teachers-and-prophets-methods-of-operation/#comment-1807</link>
		<dc:creator>My name is under a stone I hope</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 06 Nov 2009 09:01:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.discerningtheworld.com/?p=6715#comment-1807</guid>
		<description>Agree - I too have been struggling with this very problem of how to warn family and friends about these issues - to the point of (regrettably) fretting &amp; angst.  In my circle I am &quot;warned&quot; by people wrapped up in this theology to &quot;not fall away&quot;.  Most are not prepared to study further for themselves much less dig deeper into the word as you do... Many thanks</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Agree &#8211; I too have been struggling with this very problem of how to warn family and friends about these issues &#8211; to the point of (regrettably) fretting &amp; angst.  In my circle I am &#8220;warned&#8221; by people wrapped up in this theology to &#8220;not fall away&#8221;.  Most are not prepared to study further for themselves much less dig deeper into the word as you do&#8230; Many thanks</p>
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		<title>By: Deborah (Discerning the World)</title>
		<link>http://www.discerningtheworld.com/2009/11/03/false-teachers-and-prophets-methods-of-operation/#comment-1801</link>
		<dc:creator>Deborah (Discerning the World)</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 06 Nov 2009 07:12:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.discerningtheworld.com/?p=6715#comment-1801</guid>
		<description>Wow mom4truth thank you!  I&#039;ve always wondered how the movie Faith like Potatoes is viewed by people outside South Africa.  Now there is a movie called Fire Proof as well which many people are finding to be a super dooper movie not realising who producers are the same people that did Angus&#039; faith like potatoes movie.  And that they all fall under the Joel&#039;s army camp.

Angus&#039; ministry was raised by Apostolic Reformation individuals from the USA who came to SA like Mike Bickle and Rick Joyner etc and then in a round about way George Otis Jr who set up the (Spiritual Warfare Dept) for C.Peter Wagner at the New Apostolic Reformation &#039;headquarters&#039;.  George Otis Jr helped Graham Power (South Africa Business man) organise the &#039;Global Day of Prayer&#039; and Graham Power and Angus Buchan are buddies.  There is a church here in South Africa called Moreletta Park (Gemeente) NG Churh (Kerk) who are Apostolic through and through with a touch of Word of Faith and just make things worse Emergent as well.

The first foothold in SA however was John G Lake, William Branham and then the Word of Faith movement stepping in with Rhema Church. Kennith Hagin Ministries offspring.  I am sure there were tons of others who helped build this country up for this point in time.

Anyhow that info is more for South Africans lol.  But just to show you that we have big probs. here in South Africa.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Wow mom4truth thank you!  I&#8217;ve always wondered how the movie Faith like Potatoes is viewed by people outside South Africa.  Now there is a movie called Fire Proof as well which many people are finding to be a super dooper movie not realising who producers are the same people that did Angus&#8217; faith like potatoes movie.  And that they all fall under the Joel&#8217;s army camp.</p>
<p>Angus&#8217; ministry was raised by Apostolic Reformation individuals from the USA who came to SA like Mike Bickle and Rick Joyner etc and then in a round about way George Otis Jr who set up the (Spiritual Warfare Dept) for C.Peter Wagner at the New Apostolic Reformation &#8216;headquarters&#8217;.  George Otis Jr helped Graham Power (South Africa Business man) organise the &#8216;Global Day of Prayer&#8217; and Graham Power and Angus Buchan are buddies.  There is a church here in South Africa called Moreletta Park (Gemeente) NG Churh (Kerk) who are Apostolic through and through with a touch of Word of Faith and just make things worse Emergent as well.</p>
<p>The first foothold in SA however was John G Lake, William Branham and then the Word of Faith movement stepping in with Rhema Church. Kennith Hagin Ministries offspring.  I am sure there were tons of others who helped build this country up for this point in time.</p>
<p>Anyhow that info is more for South Africans lol.  But just to show you that we have big probs. here in South Africa.</p>
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